Should BCCI send the Indian team to CT or No?

[sandeep]

4 minutes ago, goose said:

Clearly this vote is a bad deal for India. Putting my allegiance to India to one side is this better or worse for the sport and in particular test cricket which is under severe threat.?

Forgot to add - Big 3 model actually created a special fund for test cricket.  New "reforms" eliminated the test cricket fund - ask Giles Clarke where the money got re-distributed to.  

[horizonspeaks]

6 minutes ago, sandeep said:

MM, I'm with you on the larger issue - but I don't agree that pulling out of CT really helps India's cause.  Threatening it does, actually pulling out does not.  Not at this late juncture, where we can't come up with a competing cricket event which potentially had Indian participation plus a bunch of players poached off of the other teams.   Its not realistic.  It would be just an emotional move with little or no actual benefit to BCCI.  

I don't think there are any other ways left for BCCI to threaten ICC. ICC is basically banking on CoA and Manohar to bail them out and let ask India to participate. Once BCCI backs from trophy, counter offers will be coming.

[Ultimate_Game]

24 minutes ago, Malcolm Merlyn said:

 

Edited the poll.

Still incorrect IMO  The first option says "Yes: Stop being arrogant and send the team" thus assuming that "NO" means you are arrogant. As I mentioned earlier, it's not arrogance but cold hard facts and capitalism which dictates the biggest revenue generator gets a chunk of revenue commensurate to its contribution  

[Malcolm Merlyn]

35 minutes ago, sandeep said:

MM, I'm with you on the larger issue - but I don't agree that pulling out of CT really helps India's cause.  Threatening it does, actually pulling out does not.  Not at this late juncture, where we can't come up with a competing cricket event which potentially had Indian participation plus a bunch of players poached off of the other teams.   Its not realistic.  It would be just an emotional move with little or no actual benefit to BCCI.  

 

Pulling out is the only option. The final vote in ICC AGM is in June.If we pull out then it may well stop the smaller boards from voting in favour of this. Even now we can poach the uncontracted WI players and Kolpak players and the likes of Mc Cullum etc and make a world 11 and play matches with India.

[cowboysfan]

Not only should we not send the team but we should drop bilateral series against all the minnows ho voted against us,once we bring them back in line we should go after the ECB and CA.

[Cricketics]

1 hour ago, Malcolm Merlyn said:

Stop thinking like a fan. You have never seen the lower levels of cricket in India.How cricketers used to survive and how BCCI has used the money to uplift them.The BCCI worked years to work to a position where the White boards couldnot treat them with disdain.Think what would have happened to Bhajji in 2008 or Sachin in 2001 if BCCI didnt have its power.The ICC wants to take away that power so that ECB and CA can rule again.

 

Read some cricketing history TICS.Its not possible for me to educate you on this.Just for starters, ICC was a very poor board before Dalmiya took over.Since 2002 India is contributing atleast 50% of ICC revenues.Before that Cricket was very poor sport.The rise of India as a economic power and the cricket market in it has caused the ICC to earn this much revenue.

 

The vote is what it is because ICC has been cutting BCCI's share and giving it to the other boards to buy the votes. Today only Zimbabwe was promised a extra 19mn USD.Where will this 19mn come from?whose share?

 

Once BCCI doesnt participate,the revenues will fall by atleast 50% if not more.Will see then how ICC buys these votes.

 

 

The money demanded by BCCI is rightfully theirs. 20% share for someone who brings 80% revenue is perfectly fair.You have to fight the unjust and not accept it.Fighting unjust isnt being a cry baby, its about preserving your dignity.

 

I dont mind BCCI pulling out of CT or other ICC events if this preserves Indian Cricket in the long term.

Eveyonr wants the full share like I have said earlier. But if we aren't getting right now, doesn't mean we can not send the team. Thats not the long term solution.

 

You fail to understand that no one is asking  to stop the BCCI from asking the money, just that not sending the team will not help us or the game. It is not the solution. Thats all

[Malcolm Merlyn]

Eveyonr wants the full share like I have said earlier. But if we aren't getting right now, doesn't mean we can not send the team. Thats not the long term solution.

 

You fail to understand that no one is asking  to stop the BCCI from asking the money, just that not sending the team will not help us or the game. It is not the solution. Thats all

 

 

And once the vote is passed in June how do you think India will get its share?

[Cricketics]

1 hour ago, Ultimate_Game said:

@Cricketicsyour poll options are incorrect. Both option assume it's BCC and Indian fans' "arrogance". No, it's not. Fact is India generates nearly 75-80% of the global cricketing revenue and as such would expect returns based on the same given India has the largest Infrastructure to maintain and as such would need the revenue it was asking for. After all the revenue needs to support cricketing infrastructure across a vast country with 1.3 billion people! Not an easy or cheap thing to do.

We deserve our money, have said this many times. But not sending team will not help at all, like people feel. It is not going to fix things or make us earn what we need or settle this issue or will be good for the game.

 

Thats all

[Cricketics]

1 minute ago, Malcolm Merlyn said:

 

 

And once the vote is passed in June how do you think India will get its share?

How you think we will get money if we do not participate in champions trophy? You think ICC will come begging on our door steps with full share of what we want? Our players pike Pant not getting to play in an ICC event, will that be fair?

 

 

Look at the players perspective.

 

Our young players like Bumrah, Pant deserve to play in an  ICC tournament like this.

 

[Cricketics]

37 minutes ago, Ultimate_Game said:

Still incorrect IMO  The first option says "Yes: Stop being arrogant and send the team" thus assuming that "NO" means you are arrogant. As I mentioned earlier, it's not arrogance but cold hard facts and capitalism which dictates the biggest revenue generator gets a chunk of revenue commensurate to its contribution  

Thats my choice. If you are not sending, basically you are being atrogant.

 

Arrogant doesn't necessarily means a bad word, bowlers and bats are arrogant too when they are on field.  Don't think negatively to that word.

 

 

[Cricketics]

2 hours ago, Muloghonto said:

As North American sports show, there is plenty of money to be made by league style games. If NHL can fill out an arena of 20K people for 41 game home season spanning six months, IPL will also have no problem. 
If anything, it will further entrench IPL as people's loyalties will further entrench into franchise loyalties, same way how we have North American franchise loyalty bases.

 

There is money to be made but we can't stop international cricket of India.  Opting out from ICC tournament is not the way to do it.

 

Of course I follow NFL and NHL and I know we fan make this IPL bigger and better with time but I don't care for that that much as I want India playing more internatioanl cricket, just like how i have seen cricket growing up.

 

 

Bumrah and players like Pant would have gotten a chance to play in their first ever ICC tournament. They deserved it every bit, we are kind of robbing that experience for them.

 

 

[Cricketics]

2 hours ago, sandeep said:

Disagree.  Season can easily be a couple of weeks longer right now - and its not about ground attendance - its about net TV revenues.  Grounds do not need to sell out for IPL to be profitable.  Ratings are obscenely high.   Market interest has to be sufficiently high and widespread to support team expansion - India's geography and demography means that this is not an issue at all.   All leagues start out with small number of teams.  Look at Baseball, NFL in the US - read up on their history.   As long as the Indian economy is growing, IPL expansion is a slam-dunk.  And the incremental cost of adding teams is peanuts - we already have stadiums to spare all over the country.  16 teams by 2030 - I'm willing to bet you thousands of dollars on that eventuality.  

It can, like I mentioned we have long NHL and NFL season and BCCi can surely make IPL bigger and better but do we need it?

 

Don't you want more international cricket than just t20s of IPL?

 

Don't you rather watch India play than watch IPL t20s?

 

Pulling out means we are robbing players like Pant, Bumrah etc from playing their first ever ICC tournament.

 

This is bad, not good for Indian cricket.

 

 

 

[horizonspeaks]

2 minutes ago, Cricketics said:

It can, like I mentioned we have long NHL and NFL season and BCCi can surely make IPL bigger and better but do we need it?

 

Don't you want more international cricket than just t20s of IPL?

 

Don't you rather watch India play than watch IPL t20s?

 

Pulling out means we are robbing players like Pant, Bumrah etc from playing their first ever ICC tournament.

 

This is bad, not good for Indian cricket.

 

 

 

 

Think of Patriots QB Tom Brady. Never played for his country. Never participated in an international tournament. But he's not robbed of anything. 

[Cricketics]

3 minutes ago, horizonspeaks said:

Think of Patriots QB Tom Brady. Never played for his country. Never participated in an international tournament. But he's not robbed of anything. 

They grew up like that knowing American football is just American thing.

 

Cricket isn't.

 

Anyways, don't you think ICC tournament is more important than watching IPL?

 

Don't you enjoy when Indian team plays than watching your favorite IPL team?

 

I am a big Delhi Daredevils fan but will rather watch India play than Delhi honestly.

 

 

[Ultimate_Game]

31 minutes ago, Cricketics said:

Thats my choice. If you are not sending, basically you are being atrogant.

 

Arrogant doesn't necessarily means a bad word, bowlers and bats are arrogant too when they are on field.  Don't think negatively to that word.

 

 

Arrogant means you are doing something out of pride or coz of your ego. In this case BCCI and fans are opting to go a certain route coz of valid reasons, i.e. the biggest revenue generator should get a proportionate share of the pie and not get its revenue reduced by more than 50%! This is not arrogance but standing for your right.

[Cricketics]

2 minutes ago, Ultimate_Game said:

Arrogant means you are doing something out of pride or coz of your ego. In this case BCCI and fans are opting to go a certain route coz of valid reasons, i.e. the biggest revenue generator should get a proportionate share of the pie and not get its revenue reduced by more than 50%! This is not arrogance but standing for your right.

It is also ego thing that we are richer than others and that game can't continue if we don't participate. That is "ego" and "arrogance" to me.

 

 

[Ultimate_Game]

45 minutes ago, Cricketics said:

We deserve our money, have said this many times. But not sending team will not help at all, like people feel. It is not going to fix things or make us earn what we need or settle this issue or will be good for the game.

 

Thats all

Once you bend over, it won't be easy to get the money back. I say stand up, throw scraps at other boards (WI, SL, Zim, B'desh) in terms of home series and once you have them in your corner, go after Eng, Aus and NZ. At the end of the day goras will stick together no matter what and India better understand that once and for all.

[Texan]

We should go to the CT. That should not be held ransom to this discussion about revenue share. Trust me here - even if we get a higher share of the revenue share, it is not like that increase in share is either:

1. Going to improve the quality of our cricket by manifolds OR
2. Going to increase revenue share of the Government by much that will result in an improved quality of life or contribute to improvement in other sports.

 

What is going to happen is that BCCI office bearers will pocket the additional revenue and make themselves richer.

 

Anyway, irrespective of whether it benefits us or not, increased revenue share can be a battle we continue to fight, but keeping tournaments like CT ransom to that should not be an option. We should immediately name the team and send it to the ICC. There are many ways to meet increased revenue targets for the BCCI than just trying to haggle with the ICC.

[Ultimate_Game]

6 minutes ago, Cricketics said:

It is also ego thing that we are richer than others and that game can't continue if we don't participate. That is "ego" and "arrogance" to me.

 

 

Why is it ego and arrogonace? Isn't it common sense that India gets profit based on the revenue it generates. Let's say A contributes $75, B contributes $15 and C contribues $10 for a venture or an investment worth $100. Now after a year the return is $1000 and A gets $400, B gets $310 and C gets $290. If A asks for more money in line with his investment, is A being "arrogant" or "egotist"? After all A still made money but not what he deserved. That's the issue in nutshell.

 

If India generates 75-80% of the revenue, I expect profit on similar lines. I can understand a few million dollars here and there but to cut India's revenue by 50% is robbery and India should stand its ground and put up a fight. No arrogance or ego here based on my understanding of these two terms. I call it fighting for what's fair and right.

[Cricketics]

3 minutes ago, Ultimate_Game said:

Once you bend over, it won't be easy to get the money back. I say stand up, throw scraps at other boards (WI, SL, Zim, B'desh) in terms of home series and once you have them in your corner, go after Eng, Aus and NZ. At the end of the day goras will stick together no matter what and India better understand that once and for all.

I lived and grew up in a country where I don't have this thinking like you do right now "goras will stick together". We clearly have culture difference and hence you think different and I do different.

 

I am not judging you and saying that you are wrong and I am right, just that I do not agree with that sentiments  "goras sticking togethe" thing.