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TOP 5 all rounders of all time


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Agree with the OP. Imran's stats are inflated. What nobody has mentioned here are the dubious umpiring decisions for Pakistani players. I mean check the 7 wicket haul of Aqib Javed, I think about 4 wickets were not outs. If Imran were to play today, his stats would go awry hugely. But if Kapil were to play with the current Indian team, his stats would be hugely improved because he will have bowling partners like Umesh, Shami and batsmen like Kohli and all supporting him!

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5 minutes ago, Rightarmfast said:

Did you consider that Richards didnt have to play against the most dangerous bowlers of his time, which were west Indians, but Kapil had to play against them?

The rest of the test nation bowlers were medium pace trundlers?

 

Are you seriously advocating Kapil Dev was a more destructive batsman than Viv Richards?

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On 5/20/2017 at 2:57 PM, Jimmy Cliff said:

Sobers, Kallis, Imran, Miller, Botham. Honorable mention to Aubrey Faulkner, Mike Procter, Kapil, Hadlee, Greig, Flintoff, Cairns, Pollock, Goddard, Barlow, Mushtaq Mohammad, Richie Benaud and Alan Davidson who might just be the most under-rated cricketer of all time.

Would agree with this.

 

For OP, I think most people agree that Kapil's batting >> Imran's batting. Kapil was naturally talented batsman and more aggressive, while Imran was a plodder. Difference in their batting was like the difference between Lara and Steve Waugh's batting. 

 

However, Imran was a much better bowler. Yes, he must have done a lot of tampering, but can't really gauge how much impact that really had on his bowling figures. Still, I think he was a better bowler than Kapil. 

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1 hour ago, Texan said:

Would agree with this.

 

For OP, I think most people agree that Kapil's batting >> Imran's batting. Kapil was naturally talented batsman and more aggressive, while Imran was a plodder. Difference in their batting was like the difference between Lara and Steve Waugh's batting. 

 

However, Imran was a much better bowler. Yes, he must have done a lot of tampering, but can't really gauge how much impact that really had on his bowling figures. Still, I think he was a better bowler than Kapil. 

To know as to how much effect has tampering had on Imran's bowling stats  you need to go thru his series wise bowling averages. A 29-30 avg:ing bowler in the 70s  all of a sudden started avg:ing in 11-15  & 15-20 range from 81 onwards. So odd & strange to find such a career track. And it just  coincides with his admission of tampering in a county match in 81.  

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@rtmohanlal while I agree Kapil was better batsman than Imran. Kapil was nowhere near the league of Viv so don't even go there. We have to give it to Imran for totally changing his action and becoming a genuine pace bowler from medium pacer. Kapil after 1984 knee surgery became a pale version of himself and as he started playing more odi cricket he lost his bite in his outswinger and that contributed greatly in his increased average and SR.

 

Kapil has better home record than away record and his record in England is horrible for a swing bowler.I am one of the biggest fan of Kaps but Imran was better bowler who could win more matches. Kapil like Botham never had a chance to grow as player because of the immense workload he had to carry starting from his first test. where as both Hadlee and Imran took time to mature and had lot of time to refine their skills.

 

Imran or Wasim or Waqar had their stats enhanced a little by ball tampering and home umpiring but they were definitely far superior bowlers than any Indian bowler and they had butter fingered fielder who gave them minimal support.

 

 

As far allrounders I would take Botham after Sobers on pure talent and at their peak. There was nothing that these two gentlemen could not do on cricket field.

 

         

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Ball tamperers, fixers and chuckers should automatically be disqualified from these lists, phateechar khan wouldn't even make the top 10 and here you put him in at no. 5

 

Kallis, Sobers, Kapil, Botham, Hadlee, Flintoff are the top all rounders in test cricket

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8 hours ago, kira said:

Ball tamperers, fixers and chuckers should automatically be disqualified from these lists, phateechar khan wouldn't even make the top 10 and here you put him in at no. 5

 

Kallis, Sobers, Kapil, Botham, Hadlee, Flintoff are the top all rounders in test cricket

It is heartening to see some one apart from me clearly  penalising Imran by completely avoiding from your list.I put him at 5 just on an assumption that his tampering methods  would have inflated his avg: not by huge margins .But it seems that you are assuming that  such

unfair  tactics had huge effects in both formats. Not blaming you either because that case also can't be entirely neglected. Several posters here though fully agree with 'Imran tampered' are a bit hesitant to move away from that strong traditional belief, it seems. 

Testimonies of himself, several contemporary cricket personalities,several opposition players & even several of  his own country players strongly indicates to him resorting to these unfair tactics whose effects on his stats  can't be neglected as  'very little' either.

No short ways.... i am for thoroughly penalising for such illegal tactics .

 

Edited by rtmohanlal
small updation
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12 hours ago, putrevus said:

@rtmohanlal while I agree Kapil was better batsman than Imran. Kapil was nowhere near the league of Viv so don't even go there. We have to give it to Imran for totally changing his action and becoming a genuine pace bowler from medium pacer. Kapil after 1984 knee surgery became a pale version of himself and as he started playing more odi cricket he lost his bite in his outswinger and that contributed greatly in his increased average and SR.

 

Kapil has better home record than away record and his record in England is horrible for a swing bowler.I am one of the biggest fan of Kaps but Imran was better bowler who could win more matches. Kapil like Botham never had a chance to grow as player because of the immense workload he had to carry starting from his first test. where as both Hadlee and Imran took time to mature and had lot of time to refine their skills.

 

Imran or Wasim or Waqar had their stats enhanced a little by ball tampering and home umpiring but they were definitely far superior bowlers than any Indian bowler and they had butter fingered fielder who gave them minimal support.

 

 

As far allrounders I would take Botham after Sobers on pure talent and at their peak. There was nothing that these two gentlemen could not do on cricket field.

 

         

Dont think the illegal methods used by Imran inflated his stats just by a little. I totally believe that in all home matches, the bias in the umpiring too has inflated their nos. 

Having said that, no doubt Imran was a better bowler than Kapil. But I honestly dont think he was such a threat as a bowler. 

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Some people still believe that tampering had only minor positive effects in Imran's end career stats & that he would have still become nearly as effective with his 'fastness' alone.Such people should go thru the history of cricket .There are several names who were/are as fast,faster & almost as fast as Imran who ended up at the most as 'very good' category bowlers only.

The likes of Jeoff Thomson, Craig Mcdermott,Brett Lee,Merv Hughes,Mike Whittney,Mitchell Jhonson,Jason Gillespie,Chetan Sharma,Javagal Sreenath,Atul Wassan,Sreesanth, Umesh Yadav,Ravindra Pushpakumara, Champaka Ramanayake,Dilhara Fernando,Mohammed Sami,Shoaib Akhtar,Mohammed Zahid,Patrick Patterson, Winston Benjamin, Kemar Roach,Franklyn Rose,Mervyn Dhillon,Fanie Devilliers,Nanty Hayward,Ntini

Devon Malcolm,Paul Jarvis, Neal Fraser etc etc  were/are  as fast or faster than or  almost as fast as Imran who ended up at the most as 'very good' category bowlers only. Simlarly we can trace out a lot more names.These bowlers are testimony to the fact that out & out pace does not guarantee 'greatness'. When we take the case of such bowlers & relate that to Imran's 'unfair tactics' & read them as a whole can we realise the extends that ball tampering can  make in differences. 

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Dont think the illegal methods used by Imran inflated his stats just by a little. I totally believe that in all home matches, the bias in the umpiring too has inflated their nos. 

Having said that, no doubt Imran was a better bowler than Kapil. But I honestly dont think he was such a threat as a bowler. 

 

Keep crying fast bowling 'expert'. Love it :hysterical:

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mirchi lag gayi? :P

 

Nope. I love seeing a guy like you crying about Imran everyday :hysterical:

 

You are the one with a mirch up your rear end. Bitter & jealous.

 

You seem to be obsessed. When is your book on fast bowling being published? :hysterical: mr fast bowling 'expert'. Lol

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9 minutes ago, cric_fan said:

 

Nope. I love seeing a guy like you crying about Imran everyday :hysterical:

 

You are the one with a mirch up your rear end. Bitter & jealous.

 

You seem to be obsessed. When is your book on fast bowling being published? :hysterical: mr fast bowling 'expert'. Lol

Right after imran's on ball tampering and cheating :)

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