Why are we so slow?

[Vk1]

Talking especially about limited overs game.. we hardly seem to bring anything new or out of the box to the game. And neither do we immediately follow things that others initiate successfully. Wrist spinners success has been proven now for 2 years and still we are only coming to terms with it just now. Few years back when the four fielders outside circle was implemented, dhoni realized that part-timers are ineffective only after an year or so. When pinch hitting was a rage, we had a prabhakar or manjrekar to use those overs. When Gilchrist changed wicket keeper definition we still had ratra dighe dahias karthiks etc till dhoni debuted.  We were perhaps the last major team to learn the art of reverse swing. We were only better than Pakistan in realizing the value of fielding. Even srilanka had Murali mahanama Jayasuriya dilshan etc. IPL has been around for 10 years and we still seem to take nothing out of it strategically.  When are we going to initiate something ? Why are we tactically this slow?

[tweaker]

Now also they are not ready to make changes against a team like Windies.Kuldeep should have been the part of our team for last 2 years, but he has just played his 1 st game.

 

The board didn't try out new players which they should have done in this series.Rishabh should get his 1 st game tomorrow.

[WC2011INDIA]

23 minutes ago, Vk1 said:

Talking especially about limited overs game.. we hardly seem to bring anything new or out of the box to the game. And neither do we immediately follow things that others initiate successfully. Wrist spinners success has been proven now for 2 years and still we are only coming to terms with it just now. Few years back when the four fielders outside circle was implemented, dhoni realized that part-timers are ineffective only after an year or so. When pinch hitting was a rage, we had a prabhakar or manjrekar to use those overs. When Gilchrist changed wicket keeper definition we still had ratra dighe dahias karthiks etc till dhoni debuted.  We were perhaps the last major team to learn the art of reverse swing. We were only better than Pakistan in realizing the value of fielding. Even srilanka had Murali mahanama Jayasuriya dilshan etc. IPL has been around for 10 years and we still seem to take nothing out of it strategically.  When are we going to initiate something ? Why are we tactically this slow?

Because this is India. Chalta hai attitude prevails.

[Vijy]

46 minutes ago, Vk1 said:

Talking especially about limited overs game.. we hardly seem to bring anything new or out of the box to the game. And neither do we immediately follow things that others initiate successfully. Wrist spinners success has been proven now for 2 years and still we are only coming to terms with it just now. Few years back when the four fielders outside circle was implemented, dhoni realized that part-timers are ineffective only after an year or so. When pinch hitting was a rage, we had a prabhakar or manjrekar to use those overs. When Gilchrist changed wicket keeper definition we still had ratra dighe dahias karthiks etc till dhoni debuted.  We were perhaps the last major team to learn the art of reverse swing. We were only better than Pakistan in realizing the value of fielding. Even srilanka had Murali mahanama Jayasuriya dilshan etc. IPL has been around for 10 years and we still seem to take nothing out of it strategically.  When are we going to initiate something ? Why are we tactically this slow?

It's because of inherent conservatism - up to mid 2000s, we had quite a few people debuting below 20 such as SRT, Irfan, Ishant, Kohli, Pappu. Some did well, others did not, but they were given the chance based on potential. Nowadays, the selections are much more conservative.

[Khota]

It is time for me to rant/complain.

You cannot have a dumb sheet captain making decisions in the field. A coach with analysts should prepare a game plan and implement it. Captain on the field making decisions is so 20th century.

Look at NFL and learn. Coach has a headset on him and listenting to half a dozen diffeernt coaches making input. They make decisions in real time. Way too much power is given to captains in cricket. Time to move on.

[Vk1]

our team prefers situations like 2011 world cup and 2013 CT where the major teams struggle a bit against spin and we end up out batting subcontinent teams. Anything else and we need strong luck on our side like the full toss being called no-ball against Bangladesh. We seem to be really ill prepared in terms of strategy. World is moving towards machine and deep learning and we still have this 80s thinking mindset. 

[Vijy]

32 minutes ago, Vk1 said:

our team prefers situations like 2011 world cup and 2013 CT where the major teams struggle a bit against spin and we end up out batting subcontinent teams. Anything else and we need strong luck on our side like the full toss being called no-ball against Bangladesh. We seem to be really ill prepared in terms of strategy. World is moving towards machine and deep learning and we still have this 80s thinking mindset. 

what teams are using machine learning to the fullest in cricket? i am not personally aware of any.

[Vk1]

47 minutes ago, Vijy said:

what teams are using machine learning to the fullest in cricket? i am not personally aware of any.

Can't we be the first team to do this? why wait again for someone to do this 

[Vk1]

Switch hit, reverse sweep , dil scoop, ABDs sweep six etc all seen on TV being played by other players. Dhonis helicopter has lost its wings and fetches a single to long on these days. Irks me like anything when sunny keeps reminding us that leg glance was invented by the great ranjith singh. Paddle sweep by sachin is the last innovative shot coming from us that I can remember. Looks like our team and players only follow the classical MCC text book of cricket like a bible despite having so much at their disposal.

 

Edited June 28, 2017 by Vk1

[Scar]

1 hour ago, Vk1 said:

our team prefers situations like 2011 world cup and 2013 CT where the major teams struggle a bit against spin and we end up out batting subcontinent teams. Anything else and we need strong luck on our side like the full toss being called no-ball against Bangladesh. We seem to be really ill prepared in terms of strategy. World is moving towards machine and deep learning and we still have this 80s thinking mindset. 

what sort of baloney is this? The no-ball against Bangladesh? We would have thrashed them even without Rohit, so don't really know what you on about. 

[Vk1]

1 minute ago, Scar said:

what sort of baloney is this? The no-ball against Bangladesh? We would have thrashed them even without Rohit, so don't really know what you on about. 

that was a critical moment in that game. 

[Vk1]

I keep thinking of improvement areas because with the kind of talent pool , resources like acadamies and money that we have we should be dominating the game. We can't be satisfied with semifinal or final appearances and overseas draws.

[Scar]

8 minutes ago, Vk1 said:

that was a critical moment is that game. 

No it was not, even if Rohit was declared out we had many batsman down the order to provide impetus to the innings. They lost by 100+ runs man.Seriously this is the first time I am hearing this from a non-Bangladeshi fan.

 

[Vk1]

1 hour ago, Scar said:

 

Well I too agree that India could have won it despite that no ball. But that match could have become a lot closer if we scored 270 instead of 300+ . Of course Bangladesh may still have choked 8 times out of 10. 

[express bowling]

We are slow  ( regarding introducing new ideas or incorporating recently introduced ideas ) because there are not many analytical brains connected to our top level cricket.

 

And the rare ones we find, like Kumble, are thrown out.

 

Just listen to our ex-cricketers speak..... how much proper analysis do we find ?  Maybe from 1 or 2 newer commentators.

 

 

Edited June 28, 2017 by express bowling

[Ankit_sharma03]

13 minutes ago, express bowling said:

We are slow because there are not many analytical brains connected to our top level cricket.

 

And the rare ones we find, like Kumble, are thrown out.

 

Just listen to our ex-cricketers speak..... how much proper analysis do we find ?  Maybe from 1 or 2 newer commentators.

 

Even our top brains our conservative in many way

Dravid defend 4.8 RR

Dravid ganguly kumble all back rahane in LOI for his so called technique 

They all wanted yuvraj singh back 

 

Its just that as society we dnt accept change well, we accept when there is no other option. 

2 hours ago, Vk1 said:

I keep thinking of improvement areas because with the kind of talent pool , resources like acadamies and money that we have we should be dominating the game. We can't be satisfied with semifinal or final appearances and overseas draws.

Coz We play to avoid defeat , rather then going with the mindset of winning

[Ankit_sharma03]

Another example Tournaments like challenger, Deodhar n Duleep trophy are so poorely organized and the selections are so bizzare ......n these tournaments are such that ur top players play here. 

Aus dominated for yeas coz they had top 6 teams competing each other 

Pak always had good pool coz they few teams , now banks are competing ...so they have lost it

 

I understand India is big country but no reason such tournament cant be organized well so we get tough competition. BCCI has enough money to organize these tournaments abroad on bouncy pitches. Yes we can organize IPL for sure

 

But no.......we dnt want to try something new despite all the resources

[mishra]

17 minutes ago, express bowling said:

We are slow because there are not many analytical brains connected to our top level cricket.

 

And the rare ones we find, like Kumble, are thrown out.

 

Just listen to our ex-cricketers speak..... how much proper analysis do we find ?  Maybe from 1 or 2 newer commentators.

 

 

Because top order knows that after Kohli, There are just boggeys. Hence they take less risks till certain amount of runs are on board. Any match  where our top order fails, our batting depth, infact lack of it will be exposed. Just like what happened in CT Finals

[kosingh]

Things changed after our WC2011 win. A great moment for India, but it also resulted in some negatives. Players become too powerful. We started holding on to old players and old methods a little too long. Just because the players and/or methods worked in the past.

[Vijy]

6 hours ago, sarchasm said:

Precisely. I have been hammering on this point. India now has enough financial wherewithal to go with mass following to not aspire for anything else than complete domination of the game. It's a mental and attitude problem that's stopping our cricketing overlords from taking Indian cricket to a higher plane. BCCI needs to invest in SYSTEMS, TECHNOLOGIES, ACADEMIES, and much much more to professionalize the game in India. The best way to to proceed would be to hire professionals from US leagues to help build institutions and expertise.

With India's finances and population size, if resources were fully utilized/maximized, the country should have become No.1

It is a real shame that, in a sport where only 5-6 real competitors exist, India fails to top it. At least in hockey, from 1920s-1950s, India was No. 1 in the world.