Crunch Test Match in South Africa. Pick your bottom 5 of the XI

[sandeep]

Big game on an away tour.   Minimal help on the wicket for spin - in terms of grip or turn.   But not a total green-top seamer's paradise either.  What is the best combination for Team India assuming full fitness and availability.  Top 5 batsmen and wicket-keeper are an obvious assumption - Vijay, Rahul, ChePu, Kohli, Rahane, Saha.  Obviously Saha's not batting #6 - he's at 7.  

 

Now the question is - who bats at 6?  Do you slot Ashwin here?   Do you get Pandya into the mix in place of, or in addition to Ashwin, to give the batting additional depth?  

 

Do you gamble on including Kuldeep Yadav's wrist spin?  

 

Shami and Umesh are likely safe picks, especially Shami if fit.  Do you pick Bhuvi as the 3rd seamer over Ishant, if Pandya is already in the XI?   

 

And what about Sir Sri Sri Jadeja??  He's underrated as a test bowler.  And by no means, an obvious exclusion.   Has proven to keep things tight on one end, and bowls a lot of economical overs quickly, reducing the pressure on the captain and the rest of the bowling attack in terms of over rates and such.  He does this away from home as well, even when the ball isn't turning much.   And has started to show a useful quiver of variations in terms of varying arm angles, trajectories, bowling speeds, which don't rely on the surface.   

Don't forget his batting either - has scored more runs and 50s than Saha or even some of the top-order batsmen.  Scored a pivotal half-century in England which gave us a chance to win a rare test in England.   

 

 

Pick you 5 bowlers/all-rounders.  The team you want to see.   Explain your reasons for including or dropping the guys you do.   You may also post the combination that you think the team will go with - if that's different from the combination you want.

 

For Bonus points, pick the other players you'd like to see on the touring squad.   Would you be happy to see the tailunted Rohit as the spare batsman?  Would you want to take Parthiv Patel along as a 3rd opener / reserve 'keeper?   Would you want to see Karun Nair,  Shreyas Iyer etc taken along for the tour?   

 

 

 

 

 

[sandeep]

Forgot to post my selection:

 

#6 Ashwin

#7 Saha

#8 Jadeja

#9 Bhuvi

#10 Shami

#11 Umesh

#12 Pandya

 

I would bench Pandya unless its an out and out green-top that has meaningful help for pace bowling.  And have Cooldeep wait in the wings.  At least to start with.  Give Ash and Jaddu at least a test or 2 in 'unhelpful conditions'.  As useful as Pandya is, I still think Ash and Jaddu are more likely to take wickets than him - especially in the last 2 days of the test.  Its not as if Ash and Jaddu have gotten multiple opportunities to win the match for their team with big totals backing them up.  Yes, Ash got that one chance in SA in the previous tour, and blew it.  But you gotta give your lead bowlers a few more chances before you write them off.      

[kubrickian]

If they have to pick a batsman at 6, Dhawan should be picked ahead of Rohit. Dhawan played some good knocks in overseas tours but didnt do well consistently as an opener and also did well in ODIs in foreign conditions. Perhaps he is not suited to bat as an opener in tests in foreign conditions as you need to be more circumspect against the new ball. He could do well batting lower down the order where there wont be so much swing. Just some food for thought.

 

In case of a spinner, Kuldeep should get a look ahead of Jaddu and Ashwin. Jaddu and Ashwin failed to do much in the previous overseas tours. Kuldeep might just be the type of bowler who could do well given he is a wrist spinner and puts lot more revs on the ball and could get some purchase on the harder wickets in SA and Aus. Worth a try.

 

Hardik should play as he lends balance to the side. He will be lot more effective as a bowler in SA.

 

Team should be 

 

Vijay

KL Rahul

Pujara

Kohli

Rahane

Dhawan

Saha

Hardik

Kuldeep

Shami

Umesh

 

In case of a bowler over batsman, Bhuvi in place of Dhawan. Extra batsman could be needed in SA as tail doesnt wag for too long there. 

Edited August 14, 2017 by kubrickian

[sandeep]

14 minutes ago, kubrickian said:

If they have to pick a batsman at 6, Dhawan should be picked ahead of Rohit. Dhawan played some good knocks in overseas tours but didnt do well consistently as an opener and also did well in ODIs in foreign conditions. Perhaps he is not suited to bat as an opener in tests in foreign conditions as you need to be more circumspect against the new ball. He could do well batting lower down the order where there wont be so much swing. Just some food for thought.

 

In case of a spinner, Kuldeep should get a look ahead of Jaddu and Ashwin. Jaddu and Ashwin failed to do much in the previous overseas tours. Kuldeep might just be the type of bowler who could do well given he is a wrist spinner and puts lot more revs on the ball and could get some purchase on the harder wickets in SA and Aus. Worth a try.

 

Hardik should play as he lends balance to the side. He will be lot more effective as a bowler in SA.

 

Team should be 

 

Vijay

KL Rahul

Pujara

Kohli

Rahane

Dhawan

Saha

Hardik

Kuldeep

Shami

Umesh

 

In case of a bowler over batsman, Bhuvi in place of Dhawan. Extra batsman could be needed in SA as tail doesnt wag for too long there. 

Just wow.  Kuldeep and Hardik as the 3rd and 4th bowlers?   With no part-time bowling capacity in the top 7, that's a very defensive minded selection.   Almost Bangladeshi style.   When you select an XI aiming for a draw, you invariably lose.   

 

Pandya has done well with the bat, but has never bowled more than 5-6 overs at a stretch.  You're going to ask him to bowl potentially 25 overs or more in an innings?   Kuldeep is so inexperienced at the test level, and Yadav is consistently inconsistent.  Don't want to be harsh on you, but this is a horrible test XI.   

[Sooda]

Agree that Unless it's a genuinely pacy wicket I don't think Hardik should play. 

 

Vijay, Rahul, Pujara, Virat, Rahane, Ashwin, Saha, Jadeja, Bhuvneshwar, Shami, Umesh

 

Ishant, Aniket (for a left arm option, depends a bit on how he fares for A team), Kuldeep, Shikar, Rohit, Hardik

 

 

 

Edited August 14, 2017 by Sooda

[Tibarn]

We won't win test matches in SA based on our lower order batting, IMO. The last 5 should be selected on ability to take 20 wickets.  That means 4 out of: Shami/Umesh/Bhuvi/Pandya/Ishant 

and

1 out of Ashwin/Jadeja/Kuldeep/Jayant based on whoever is best suited to actually chip in wickets and maintain control at 1 end for the pacers to be rotated. 

 

[Sooda]

Back up keeper is a good  call, not sure we should rely on Lokesh if God forbid something happens to Saha... So maybe Extra pacer in Aniket is unnecessary...

[kubrickian]

2 minutes ago, sandeep said:

Just wow.  Kuldeep and Hardik as the 3rd and 4th bowlers?   With no part-time bowling capacity in the top 7, that's a very defensive minded selection.   Almost Bangladeshi style.   When you select an XI aiming for a draw, you invariably lose.   

 

Pandya has done well with the bat, but has never bowled more than 5-6 overs at a stretch.  You're going to ask him to bowl potentially 25 overs or more in an innings?   Kuldeep is so inexperienced at the test level, and Yadav is consistently inconsistent.  Don't want to be harsh on you, but this is a horrible test XI.   

Kuldeep will likely do much better than Ash or Jaddu in SA in my book. They are going to pick a spinner anyway, so might as well be him.

 

If you are looking to go for 5 bowlers, then one batsman could be dropped. As I mentioned, Bhuvi for Dhawan in that case. Hardik should play in the side as he will add more balance and I expect he will be a genuine wicket taking option in SA. 

[King Tendulkar]

People selecting Kuldeep over years of superb service by ashwin , jeez really

 

[kubrickian]

Just now, King Tendulkar said:

People selecting Kuldeep over years of superb service by ashwin , jeez really

 

Team is not selected based on service and past record. You select a team based on conditions and opposition. 

[King Tendulkar]

Vijay 

Raul 

pujara

kohli

rahane

ashwin

saha

pandya

bk

umesh

shami 

 

risky having a 6 like ashwin but with pandya at 8 sod it . The bowling attack will be 5 pronged and gun

[King Tendulkar]

Just now, kubrickian said:

Team is not selected based on service and past record. You select a team based on conditions and opposition. 

Been great last year or so . Very good in current series 

[King Tendulkar]

Ashwin test form been awesome . Let's not let his odi form confuse matter 

 

also his batting his very good 

[kubrickian]

39 minutes ago, sandeep said:

Forgot to post my selection:

 

#6 Ashwin

#7 Saha

#8 Jadeja

#9 Bhuvi

#10 Shami

#11 Umesh

#12 Pandya

 

I would bench Pandya unless its an out and out green-top that has meaningful help for pace bowling.  And have Cooldeep wait in the wings.  At least to start with.  Give Ash and Jaddu at least a test or 2 in 'unhelpful conditions'.  As useful as Pandya is, I still think Ash and Jaddu are more likely to take wickets than him - especially in the last 2 days of the test.  Its not as if Ash and Jaddu have gotten multiple opportunities to win the match for their team with big totals backing them up.  Yes, Ash got that one chance in SA in the previous tour, and blew it.  But you gotta give your lead bowlers a few more chances before you write them off.      

2 spinners in South Africa ?  Are you kidding me ?

 

Ashwin and Jaddu wont score too many runs in those conditions. Batting lower down the order in SC is completely different from batting in those conditions because seamers get lot more help there. So even their batting wont be a factor when it comes to selecting them.

[putrevus]

Ashwin has to be first name among spinners until he proves he cannot take any wickets.He is goo enough to bat at no 6 , if pitch is not a green top  I would gamble jadeja over Pandya. Jadeja is making it incredibly hard to drop him anywhere, even in last test it was jadeja who picked up wickets in first innings.

[Ankit_sharma03]

41 minutes ago, kubrickian said:

 

Vijay

KL Rahul

Pujara

Kohli

Rahane

Dhawan

Saha

Hardik

Kuldeep

Shami

Umesh

Sooo much batting, that to just to Accomodate dhawan who failed badly last time there

[Vilander]

guys i'd imagine no1 and no2 bowlers in the world if available for a particular team would probably play..  incase you did not make the connection.

[velu]

pandya

ash

bhuvi

shami

umesh

[Ankit_sharma03]

I dnt like naming certainties . For starters we ll go with Ashwin n Saha

Now SA bowling is the best against Lower order IMO, so i have no faith in Saha n m also worried about ashwin to 

 

We ll have to take right backs up as well

Saha- Parthiv ( he has to be taken a left hander n better batsman )

Pandya - Shankar ( now pandya is a better bowler and shankar better batsman , play them acc to condition . Shankar bowling in SA conditions can get plundered n pandya batting can get exposed )

 

Now kuldeep vs jadeja- I dnt think taking 3 spinners is right to Sa, So jadeja misses out for me . Ill take a wkt taking bowler in kuldeep 

 

Bhuvi will also be for starter so his batting can help, but again i see Sa bowling running through our lower order so thats y Kepper n all rounder position becomes IMP

 

Nair vs rohit vs Iyer- Will choose Nair . I find him a better player of pace then iyer , iyer looks a far superior n destructive player of spin bowling. Nair is good but really needs to tighten his game. Rohit well he will go eventually 

 

My bottom 5

6. Pandya/Shankar ( acc to condition)

7. Saha/ Patel (If saha fails with bat )

8. Ashwin/ kuldeep ( if ashwin fails with the ball)

9. Shami 

10. umesh/ishant ( umesh is pretty certain but he can loose the plot anytime)

11. Bhuvi/Aniket.C/thakur/ ishant or any newbie 

 

 

Bowlers shudnt be selected acc to their batting skill, their 1st job is to take wkt. If our batting fails we are already doomed 

[philcric]

All bowlers are in form, and any combination and personnel has its merits.

 

Personally, I'd always prefer going with 5 bowling options for 2 reasons ..

1) Long term health of bowling unit as fast bowling is physically taxing. I would want them to bowl as well (and fast) in the 4th test as they do in the 1st test of the series.

2) Within each test, the bowlers will have a better chance to give it all in all their spells, as there are 5 of them to share the load.

 

To start with the long overseas season, I'd go with 3 best pacers + Pandya + 1 best spinner. It'd be great if that best spinner is Ash, as that would give very good depth to the batting. I would tinker with the bowling combination depending on how it's performing.

 

So, my starting bottom 5 would be ..

#7 Ash

#8 Pandya

#9 Bhuvi

#10 Shami

#11 Umesh

 

But will keep fine tuning the combo till we get it right.