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MS Dhoni mega discussion thread

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2 minutes ago, sourab10forever said:

 

And yeah now there isn't time for experimenting with anyone in place of Dhoni...it's already too late.

 

No, it isn't.   WC still almost 2 years away.  

 

Even if it weren't...... there should be replacements ready for every player..... including Virat Kohli.

 

 

 

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I kind of agree 

Dhoni offers a lot to the team and no single player wud be able to offer that

 

A reliable batsman who guts it out even though currently lacks ability to win u games chasing huge total but atleast he tries.

Role - A 2nd reliable batsman who cud take charge if needed - i see shankar in that role in future 

 

Someone who offer captain help

A senior in team is always helpful , Dhoni was lucky to have seniors at start .....ganguly had gr8 help around him as well. Dhoni's captaincy faced a sip when he had no senior to offer a diff prespective. Kohli does look that good when it comes to ODi captaincy so having to learn from dhoni on field is good for him. 

 

Wicket keeper- His keeping is still top notch, when it comes to stumping he is kind of a fielder who creates chances out of nowere . 

Pant keeping is said to be not at par by dravid n i read from delhi coach or someone else as well 

 

Experience is a gr8 help- His experience is gr8 help to youngsters which has been acknowledged by many juniors time n again. Many idiots call it PR but no wonder they are idiots.  Dhoni has always been a street smart cricketer who LOI basics have been terrific. Look at jharkhand and delhi ranji teams how they have benefitted from dhoni n gambhir's presence 

 

So anyone be pant, samson or kishen who comes to the team will never be able to offer as much as dhoni does and he ll have huge expectation due to dhoni's name which wud be unfair. 

 

 

Now the part about yet to find- well we have to try giving these players a chance ......even if they dnt prove themselves the exposure wud be gr8. Kishen n Pant are very young and exposure to them will help in log run. 

Atleast pant shud be given a chance in SL or NZ series and he is good enough to play as batsman . Even if they get ready till 2019 or not atleast their grooming period shud start from now on . I hope MSK prasad sticks to his words and gives Pant a chance in T20 for starters , dhoni shudnt play in t20 at all 

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6 hours ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

I kind of agree 

Dhoni offers a lot to the team and no single player wud be able to offer that

 

A reliable batsman who guts it out even though currently lacks ability to win u games chasing huge total but atleast he tries.

Role - A 2nd reliable batsman who cud take charge if needed - i see shankar in that role in future 

 

Someone who offer captain help

A senior in team is always helpful , Dhoni was lucky to have seniors at start .....ganguly had gr8 help around him as well. Dhoni's captaincy faced a sip when he had no senior to offer a diff prespective. Kohli does look that good when it comes to ODi captaincy so having to learn from dhoni on field is good for him. 

 

Wicket keeper- His keeping is still top notch, when it comes to stumping he is kind of a fielder who creates chances out of nowere . 

Pant keeping is said to be not at par by dravid n i read from delhi coach or someone else as well 

 

Experience is a gr8 help- His experience is gr8 help to youngsters which has been acknowledged by many juniors time n again. Many idiots call it PR but no wonder they are idiots.  Dhoni has always been a street smart cricketer who LOI basics have been terrific. Look at jharkhand and delhi ranji teams how they have benefitted from dhoni n gambhir's presence 

 

So anyone be pant, samson or kishen who comes to the team will never be able to offer as much as dhoni does and he ll have huge expectation due to dhoni's name which wud be unfair. 

 

 

Now the part about yet to find- well we have to try giving these players a chance ......even if they dnt prove themselves the exposure wud be gr8. Kishen n Pant are very young and exposure to them will help in log run. 

Atleast pant shud be given a chance in SL or NZ series and he is good enough to play as batsman . Even if they get ready till 2019 or not atleast their grooming period shud start from now on . I hope MSK prasad sticks to his words and gives Pant a chance in T20 for starters , dhoni shudnt play in t20 at all 

And Dhoni's keeping was great when he debuted? World cup will be played in England early summer. At that time, spinners will have no real impact.

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If Pant & Kishen have a great domestic season this year, selectors will have to consider them in the team .

 

When they selected Binny the selector were giving the argument that there are no ready made cricketers in the domestic cricket.Then Pandya got the chance & he proved the selectors wrong.

 

Pant should have been selected in the squad in place of Rahane

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1 hour ago, tweaker said:

If Pant & Kishen have a great domestic season this year, selectors will have to consider them in the team .

 

When they selected Binny the selector were giving the argument that there are no ready made cricketers in the domestic cricket.Then Pandya got the chance & he proved the selectors wrong.

 

Pant should have been selected in the squad in place of Rahane

They can score all the runs they want. Won't matter as long as dhoni is still selected. Dhoni is the elefant in the room. 

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If given a opportunity any youngsters can replace any superstar players.

 

The game is too big to be impacted by any individual player.The game always move on.

 

If we have this mentality how are we going to look forward.

 

The board is looking after the popularity of brand"Dhoni". They should judge him as a player.

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6 hours ago, rkt.india said:

And Dhoni's keeping was great when he debuted? World cup will be played in England early summer. At that time, spinners will have no real impact.

one thing we forget in keeping is keeping under pressure 

Karthik n patel are 2 best examples who gets brain fart under pressure while keeping 

 

And in case of dhoni we didnt have any option to, he offered something with bat which no keeper did it in past and parthiv n karthik failed that time. Incase of pant as of now dhoni is doing decent . Had dhoni retired most likely we wud have had to invest in pant no matter how good bad avg his keeping wud have been 

 

Yes pant will improve and he shud be given chances but m all comparing what one individual brings and what his replacement cant at this point. 

Edited by Ankit_sharma03

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2 hours ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

Yes pant will improve and he shud be given chances but m all comparing what one individual brings and what his replacement cant at this point. 

But we are not playing world cup at this point to look what current individual and his replacement brings at this point. Its pointless to expect dhoni's replacement to be better than dhoni in every aspect to be in team.It is just a fan in you which is justifying clearly wrong things happening. Even if we are taking dhoni to wc2019 we must prepare a backup keeper.  We need to prepare a back up keeper for world cup. Pant with one struggling innings seems to be out of favour. Suspicious as it can get. But not surprising, isn't it?

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15 minutes ago, Pollack said:

But we are not playing world cup at this point to look what current individual and his replacement brings at this point. Its pointless to expect dhoni's replacement to be better than dhoni in every aspect to be in team.It is just a fan in you which is justifying clearly wrong things happening. Even if we are taking dhoni to wc2019 we must prepare a backup keeper.  We need to prepare a back up keeper for world cup. Pant with one struggling innings seems to be out of favour. Suspicious as it can get. But not surprising, isn't it?

Read above what i have written u n i aint saying something diff

M also saying give pant a chance, infact i have clearly written dhoni shudnt play t20 he aint good in that format. Give every t20 game to Pant and if he doesnt do well samson or kishen 

Not a fan inside me, he has performed so how can we think of dropping him

Backup has to be prep for every situation even captaincy so i wud like a series in between were rohit his given captaincy 

Even i didnt appreciate pant dropping after one inning, neways he has enough A games now to prove himself and if doesnt score well other will come ahead in the list 

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They also said the same thing about Sachin even when he was just pale shadow on himself.Sachin stopped being useful to the team after 2011 World cup. They should have forced him to retire then.No amount of experience will overcome lack of production.

 

I don't mind Dhoni being in mix for world cup but they should give other players a chance. When Jadeja or Ashwin can be rotated why Dhoni cannot be rotated is beyond me.

 

Prime example of timidity is De Kock who was not part of the test team in 2015 Indian series even after thumping Indian bowlers in ODIs and South Africa paid dearly for it.That guy Dane Vilas is nowhere to be found now.

 

You will never know how good or bad Pant or anybody else if they are not given enough chances.This playing safe attitude will lead team no where.Talented youth will always triumph over ageing stars.

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On 9/11/2017 at 10:27 AM, Laaloo said:

Dhoni has played this perfectly. He MADE sure Pant doesnt get enough games to prove himself.

Bhai, if Pant is so good, let Pant barge in as other 5 batsman. Remember, Gilly did play a few matches with Healy/not as designate keeper, yea ?

Pant needs to be lights out to replace a great of the game and rightly so. this is all stemming form 'player X is Y years old. I do not like Y years old, i want younger, screw performance'. 

Infact i think if Pant does light it up in next IPL, he should be given chance in ODIs and see how it goes- next IPL is still more than a year from the WC of ODIs. 

 

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1 hour ago, Muloghonto said:

Bhai, if Pant is so good, let Pant barge in as other 5 batsman. Remember, Gilly did play a few matches with Healy/not as designate keeper, yea ?

Pant needs to be lights out to replace a great of the game and rightly so. this is all stemming form 'player X is Y years old. I do not like Y years old, i want younger, screw performance'. 

Infact i think if Pant does light it up in next IPL, he should be given chance in ODIs and see how it goes- next IPL is still more than a year from the WC of ODIs. 

 

No need for Pant to be lights out. I think he is an easy drop in replacement and most likely anyone is an upgrade.

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38 minutes ago, Khota said:

No need for Pant to be lights out. I think he is an easy drop in replacement and most likely anyone is an upgrade.

What are you smoking bro...

 

Batting: 

 

Dhoni this year so far has been excellent.

Not much in t20 experience, but still - 33 average and 130+ strike rate.

In IPL he has almost the same record as Pant- almost same average + lower strike rate. (more not outs and less runs, owing to less balls faced and lower batting position).

 

In LOIs, Dhoni has an awesome record this year : 91 average, 85 strike rate, from 13 innings. 


WIcketkeeping:

 Dhoni is a) clearly above adequate for India and b) superior to Pant in keeping at the moment.

 

 

So on what basis, is Pant an easy replacement ? 

Edited by Muloghonto

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Now hypothetical scenario-and despite I don't like Dhoni these days let us just say god forbid he gets injured(not wishing it upon anyone) so people are telling me that we should withdraw from the World Cup because we just don't have anyone capable of keeping in an international game? 

 

For people who suggest Karthik-stay the fk outta here

 

anyways tell me so what has playing SL and WI achieved? 

 

Clearly it is not about Dhoni being "irreplaceable" due to his on field talent or the no alternative excuse.

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10 minutes ago, maniac said:

Now hypothetical scenario-and despite I don't like Dhoni these days let us just say god forbid he gets injured(not wishing it upon anyone) so people are telling me that we should withdraw from the World Cup because we just don't have anyone capable of keeping in an international game? 

 

For people who suggest Karthik-stay the fk outta here

 

anyways tell me so what has playing SL and WI achieved? 

 

Clearly it is not about Dhoni being "irreplaceable" due to his on field talent or the no alternative excuse.

Playing windies got us another record. 100 balls in a odi match and no boundaries because his chamchas want to keep saying that he was "anchoring" the innings. 

Edited by Laaloo

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17 minutes ago, Laaloo said:

Playing windies got us another record. 100 balls in a odi match and no boundaries because his chamchas want to keep saying that he was "anchoring" the innings. 

If you are a fanatic or a chamcha and you vehemently defend a player I can understand(trust me I know a thing or 2 about that)....I have more of a problem with the so called "neutral" fans who come up

with excuses to justify that a 36 year old(atleast on paper) in a specialist position has no backup even remotely close and is irreplaceable because apparently everyone else is either not just good enough based on assumptions. When no one has been tried to replace him even in the most pointless of games. 

 

We can find replacements for the no1 and no2 test bowlers and senior cricketers  even when one of them who has done very well in ICC tournaments...no problem there.

 

Fast bowling when every half decent prospect was tried and we found some one who averages in the 20s but now we have a pool of decent fast bowlers  and lost for choices because guess what we created options.

 

Hell even so much competition in the batting department.

 

but apparently wicketkeeper slot is untouchable? How does that work?

Edited by maniac

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Ashwin/Jadeja- back ups Kuldeep,Chahal,Axar all of a sudden 5 spinners with adequate exposure

 

Fast bowling- Bumrah Bhuvi Shami Yadav and Pandya all 5 good enough to be the top 3 fast bowlers.

 

Batting-Rohit,Dhawan,Rahane(like him or not for now we are stuck with him for the time being),Kohli,Rahul,Jadhav,Pandey and many more in the cusp of selection which means we can pick and choose a top 5 or 6 who have adequate international exposure

 

Keeping-????

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2 hours ago, Muloghonto said:

What are you smoking bro...

 

Batting: 

 

Dhoni this year so far has been excellent.

Not much in t20 experience, but still - 33 average and 130+ strike rate.

In IPL he has almost the same record as Pant- almost same average + lower strike rate. (more not outs and less runs, owing to less balls faced and lower batting position).

 

In LOIs, Dhoni has an awesome record this year : 91 average, 85 strike rate, from 13 innings. 


WIcketkeeping:

 Dhoni is a) clearly above adequate for India and b) superior to Pant in keeping at the moment.

 

 

So on what basis, is Pant an easy replacement ? 

I think you are the one who is smoking.

2017 IPl was the only tournament they played side by side and Pant clealy outperfomred Dhoni. I question the way you look at stats.

I am only going by IPL as that is the only standardized format. Dhoni was not as good as Pant. 

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8 hours ago, Khota said:

I think you are the one who is smoking.

2017 IPl was the only tournament they played side by side and Pant clealy outperfomred Dhoni. I question the way you look at stats.

I am only going by IPL as that is the only standardized format. Dhoni was not as good as Pant. 

1.Dhoni was a way better keeper than Pant.

2. Whichever way you wanna slice it, a guy who is averaging 90+ at 80+ strike rate after dozen recent matches does not deserve to have his place quesitoned.

 

there is no need to Rush Pant when we have an alltime great playing like an alltime great. 

 

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10 minutes ago, Muloghonto said:

1.Dhoni was a way better keeper than Pant.

2. Whichever way you wanna slice it, a guy who is averaging 90+ at 80+ strike rate after dozen recent matches does not deserve to have his place quesitoned.

 

there is no need to Rush Pant when we have an alltime great playing like an alltime great. 

 

1. Keyword you used and I agree is "was".

2. Whichever way you dice it head to head he is inferior to Pant. Not only Pant but Karthick and patel too.

3. Let us get Dravid and Sachin in the team too. They were also all time great.

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10 hours ago, maniac said:

Ashwin/Jadeja- back ups Kuldeep,Chahal,Axar all of a sudden 5 spinners with adequate exposure

 

Fast bowling- Bumrah Bhuvi Shami Yadav and Pandya all 5 good enough to be the top 3 fast bowlers.

 

Batting-Rohit,Dhawan,Rahane(like him or not for now we are stuck with him for the time being),Kohli,Rahul,Jadhav,Pandey and many more in the cusp of selection which means we can pick and choose a top 5 or 6 who have adequate international exposure

 

Keeping-????

 

droni is undestructable , noway he will get injured ..

rayudu is our backup keeper   :hehe:

 

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Quote


Ravi Shastri said, "Dhoni is still the best wicketkeeper in the world and he is the quickest. The break from Test cricket has been great for Dhoni. He is an asset to the Indian team. He is an elder statesman in the dressing room."

 

shastri-dhoni-759.jpg

 

India coach Ravi Shastri considers former India captain and current wicketkeeper Mahendra Singh Dhoni as an asset to the side led by Virat Kohli. Shastri said that Dhoni still remains the best wicketkeeper in the world.

Calling him an elder statesman in the dressing room, Shastri said in an interview to India Today, “Dhoni is still the best wicketkeeper in the world and he is the quickest. The break from Test cricket has been great for Dhoni. He is an asset to the Indian team. He is an elder statesman in the dressing room.”

 

 


 

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On 9/11/2017 at 1:26 PM, sourab10forever said:

The fact that we are even searching for a suitable replacement suggests a few things doesn't it?

 

And yeah now there isn't time for experimenting with anyone in place of Dhoni...it's already too late.

We should have been auditioning Dhoni replacements in T20s since last year already.   Obviously MS would want to keep playing T20s, but if VK is truly ready to handle captaincy in t20s, then there is no reasonable argument you can make for Dhoni's inclusion in a national T20 XI.  He never was that great a T20 batsman, even in his prime.  

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On 9/11/2017 at 9:49 PM, tweaker said:

If Pant & Kishen have a great domestic season this year, selectors will have to consider them in the team .

 

When they selected Binny the selector were giving the argument that there are no ready made cricketers in the domestic cricket.Then Pandya got the chance & he proved the selectors wrong.

 

Pant should have been selected in the squad in place of Rahane

Pandya forced his way into the team on the back of an awesome MVP type domination of the Syed Mushtaq Ali T20 tournament.  Rishabh has followed a similar path, but unfortunately hasn't gotten the same level of opportunities so far.   This needs to change ASAP.   Horrible thing to say, but I almost wish that Dhoni picks up a niggle or so in the 3rd or 4th ODI.   

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Pant is also not helping his case after an Avg A-tour and now 2 low scores in duleep trophy

When dhoni entered the team he came with 2 100s on A tour and karthik n parthiv both failing 

 

Here dhoni is making runs , even though the s/r is low but atleast he is contributing . Pant has lot of chances including Duleeep trophy and NZ-A series he shud grab it with both hands and with watever dhoni is making changes in his game i really think he is going get better with every series 

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18 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

Pant is also not helping his case after an Avg A-tour and now 2 low scores in duleep trophy

When dhoni entered the team he came with 2 100s on A tour and karthik n parthiv both failing 

 

Here dhoni is making runs , even though the s/r is low but atleast he is contributing . Pant has lot of chances including Duleeep trophy and NZ-A series he shud grab it with both hands and with watever dhoni is making changes in his game i really think he is going get better with every series 

It doesn't matter that Pant has had a few failures, and Dhoni has eked out a few runs - the time has come to audition his long-term replacement.   Are you claiming that Dhoni should be picked as keeper even for T20s?

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25 minutes ago, sandeep said:

It doesn't matter that Pant has had a few failures, and Dhoni has eked out a few runs - the time has come to audition his long-term replacement.   Are you claiming that Dhoni should be picked as keeper even for T20s?

I hve been screaming for over an year or more that dhoni shud no were be near t20 setup

I pretty much screamed in every game when pant was made to warm benches in WI and dropped in SL 

 

I hve been saying that guy is good enough to play as batsman only and yes start auditioning other keepers from t20 format atleast . It shud have been started with Samson and now pant n kishen has also emerged they can also be tried

 

But, our opinions dnt matter in real world. Ultimately its selector and team mngmt who will pick the team and if pant keeps having low or avg scores, Samson keeps having poor ranji season how will mngmt and selector get confidence to replace a figure like dhoni. To replace such a player u dnt have to knock the door but break it . Thats y i mentioned dhoni runs on A-tour and his way was easy to replace 2 failures. Its how selection dynamic works. 

 

Take iyers example, we have wanted rohit out and someone like iyer in for a few years , but his lack of perfomances wen it mattered hasnt helped his case . N again rohit sharma is also not someone diff to replace in test cricket 

Edited by Ankit_sharma03

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5 hours ago, Khota said:

1. Keyword you used and I agree is "was".

2. Whichever way you dice it head to head he is inferior to Pant. Not only Pant but Karthick and patel too.

3. Let us get Dravid and Sachin in the team too. They were also all time great.

1. Dhoni was a way better keeper than Pant in the most recent edition of IPL. Ie, he IS better than Pant.

 

2. Why Dravid and Sachin ? I have no problem with Gavaskar back in the team. Unlike you, i don't toss performing players away because of their age. Let Dravid and Sachin average 90+ with 80+ strike rate in LOIs and they too can, of course, come back.

 

Face it, you have no cricketing reason to ask for Pant over Dhoni. Even Gillchrist waited till his late 20s because he was behind a world class keeper, so Pant kiss kheth ki muli haye !

 

 

Edited by Muloghonto

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