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Yadav's 71-4 or Kumar's 55-0? What would you rather have in ODIs?

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1 hour ago, Vilander said:

Shami failed today, Y

Bro .... Shami bowled in good areas today, with pace and seam movement, despite a break.

 

Wickets did not come today but he he always ends up with good  wicket per match ratios  if he plays 5 or 6 games.           : )  

Edited by express bowling

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43 minutes ago, express bowling said:

 

Our pace bowling universe is not limited to Umesh and Bhuvi

 

Lots of new exciting talent coming up

 

Why not try some of them

Yes. And I don't have a problem with trying new pacers. Problem is when people keep drumming up "Bhuvi is useless on flat tracks" to justify Umesh's spot in the team. Umesh is equally bad on flat tracks. 

 

Would like to see Bumrah given a chance. 

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I actually think Yadav bowled pretty well in the second and third spell ,in the first spell he bowled the wrong length,on this patta you need to be consistent with your length.i was disappointed with shami tbh,these two need to be given another go in the last odi

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Can't really understand why this guy Umesh is still  in the one day team??.He has played 71 one dayers of mediocrity.An econ: of 5.94 is  worst even by Indian pace bowling standards.In one dayers  despite econ: being more important, he is mediocre in over all bowl avg: too.Today also  all his wkts came when the Aussies started to hit out after 37 overs or so.As usual he conceeded his expensive quota of runs .Would have been lot better if India left out him  for ever from  one dayers.With the series deceided, a new player could have been tested.     

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1 hour ago, rtmohanlal said:

Can't really understand why this guy Umesh is still  in the one day team??.He has played 71 one dayers of mediocrity.An econ: of 5.94 is  worst even by Indian pace bowling standards.In one dayers  despite econ: being more important, he is mediocre in over all bowl avg: too.Today also  all his wkts came when the Aussies started to hit out after 37 overs or so.As usual he conceeded his expensive quota of runs .Would have been lot better if India left out him  for ever from  one dayers.With the series deceided, a new player could have been tested.     

Umesh Yadav and Ajinkya Rahane both are in the same boat - just not good enough to belong in India's starting XI in ODIs.  

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57 minutes ago, SecondSlip said:

Umesh Yadav is a tried and tested failure in LOIs. 

 

I don't see any difference between him and padosi Wahab Riaz 

yadav isn't a failure in odi. U either take wkts or ur economical. Yadav is good at wkt taking. He is not our top 3 bowler and can be replaced in future but can't call him a failure

71 games and 102 wits, that cant be a failure .

Bhuvi is 74 games and 79 wkts, 

 

(lack of wkt taking ability wasn't that ur prob with ashwin n jadeja , now if someone takes wkts he is a failure)

 

If bhuvi outscores umesh in eco, umesh outscores bhuvi in wkt taking ability. 

 

Umesh is good enough to be in squad at this point, certainly shudnt be the 1st choice . Failure are ishant, vinay , dinda

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6 hours ago, New guy said:

Bks 3 for 9 or 5 fer

 

Yadavs wickets came after a 231 run partnership

 

When bk was in the team the opposition did not cross 300 once this series

 

When yadav bowled team scored 334

thats a bit unfair

 

bangalore was the flatest of the decks.

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5 hours ago, Lannister said:

He went wicket-less in 4-5 matches in just about 2 series. That's awful by any standards. Look I am not defending Yadav here, because he's just as equally bad as Kumar and both should be shown the door as for LOIs are concerned. 

We have made this word such an joke , showing someone door. No u cant

What starc and rabadda do we have, we have good and heavy bench strength but at this point these guys are good. 

Bhuvi has been one of the most improved bowler and umesh atlas keeps chipping away with wkts

 

Now for me its what a player offers

Bhuvi is a reliable bowler for all 10 overs and now has started to contribute with bat more to. Bhuvi, shami n bumrah make a terrific pair as they all can bowl in any situation and they also keep it tight. All 3 are gr8 at death which can change games in last 10 overs. 

 

Umesh always bowls in 2 phases in a game, one spell wood be disastor other the fact opposite which doesn't make him bad. He is a terrific fielder. He isn't a bad backup bowler.

 

Let others earn their place and perform to keep before showing someone good the door. 

 

 

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and on the Umesh yadav debate

 

not easy for Umesh coming off the bench on the Chinnaswamy stadium which is a batting paradise.

 

The pitches for the first two ODIs were very bowler friendly. 

 

The way i see it both Bhuvi and Umesh have their place. England will suit Bhuvi and his swing bowling. Who knows who will be on song among the pacers come WC 2019. Idea is to have a strong deck and pick your best inform bowlers.

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bhuvi better in 1st 10 and last 10 , umesh needs to keep picking wkts otherwise there is no comparison, but yadav has been  up there among pacers in odi over the last few years

 

Overall figures
Player Span Mat Inns Overs Mdns Runs WktsDescending BBI Ave Econ SR 4 5  
MA Starc (AUS) 2014-2017 49 49 414.1 26 1961 97 6/28 20.21 4.73 25.6 5 2 investigate this query
TA Boult (NZ) 2014-2017 43 43 399.3 28 2008 84 6/33 23.90 5.02 28.5 4 2 investigate this query
CR Woakes (ENG) 2014-2017 54 53 430.4 25 2400 79 6/47 30.37 5.57 32.7 8 1 investigate this query
UT Yadav (INDIA) 2014-2017 43 41 337.5 14 1982 72 4/31 27.52 5.86 28.1 4 0 investigate this query
Mashrafe Mortaza (BDESH) 2014-2017 46 46 383.4 21 1864 67 4/29 27.82 4.85 34.3 1 0 investigate this query
Dawlat Zadran (AFG) 2014-2017 46 44 349.2 22 1843 65 4/22 28.35 5.27 32.2 3 0 investigate this query
K Rabada (SA) 2015-2017 40 39 334.1 20 1710 65 6/16 26.30 5.11 30.8 3 1 investigate this query
JR Hazlewood (AUS) 2014-2017 36 35 316.2 22 1480 63 6/52 23.49 4.67 30.1 1 3 investigate this query
M Morkel (SA) 2014-2017 39 37 311.3 13 1636 62 5/21 26.38 5.25 30.1 1 1 investigate this query
JO Holder (WI) 2014-2017 50 49 401.0 22 2216 61 5/27 36.32 5.52 39.4 2 1 investigate this query
JP Faulkner (AUS) 2014-2017 44 43 342.4 7 1844 60 4/32 30.73 5.38 34.2 2 0 investigate this query
MJ Henry (NZ) 2014-2017 31 29 263.5 12 1503 57 5/30 26.36 5.69 27.7 3 2 investigate this query
DW Steyn (SA) 2014-2016 37 37 315.4 17 1657 57 4/34 29.07 5.24 33.2 1 0 investigate this query
LE Plunkett (ENG) 2015-2017 32 31 263.5 5 1527 55 5/52 27.76 5.78 28.7 3 1 investigate this query
TG Southee (NZ) 2014-2017 41 40 354.2 19 2006 55 7/33 36.47 5.66 38.6 0 1 investigate this query
Wahab Riaz (PAK) 2014-2017 40 40 333.3 7 1941 54 4/45 35.94 5.82 37.0 4 0

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14 hours ago, gattaca said:

But few fans are just blind to understand that. One of the reasons he is successful in test. He just can't stick to his lines for 6 consecutive deliveries. The penalty you pay in tests is less if you slide to leg stump line. 

Yadav has shown signs of improvement in test matches and gotten close to top 20 ranking. But let's not get ahead of ourselves by calling him 'successful'. Still averages 36 and needs to prove a thing or two. 

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13 hours ago, Texan said:

 Umesh is equally bad on flat tracks. 

In ODIs, I would agree.

 

In test matches, some pitch + ground + SG ball combo aid reverse swing.  In those conditions Umesh is quite good ... like Delhi 15, Hyderabad 17, Pune 17.  And those conditions are rather frequently seen in test matches in India. 

 

Shami and Umesh are currently our 2 best reverse swing bowlers.

 

Quote

Would like to see Bumrah given a chance. 

 

I have been writing about trying Bumrah in tests for a long time.

 

He combines accuracy with pace, bounce, seam movement and ability to set-up batters. 

 

Should be tried out to see what he does.

Edited by express bowling

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13 hours ago, express bowling said:

Bro .... Shami bowled in good areas today, with pace and seam movement, despite a break.

 

Wickets did not come today but he he always ends up with good  wicket per match ratios  if he plays 5 or 6 games.           : )  

If only Shami can learn to bowl those fast yorkers consistently at the death - he would be unstoppable in ODIs. He always bowls a great line and length upfront. When fit and in rhythm, he is our best and most destructive fast bowler. And rarely enough for an Indian pacer, has an intelligent brain to go with his skills.

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14 hours ago, sandeep said:

Umesh Yadav and Ajinkya Rahane both are in the same boat - just not good enough to belong in India's starting XI in ODIs.  

Rahane at least is a world class test player. But Umesh???  I think this is a major handicap with Indian system.Allowing mediocre players to go  on  playing with out testing talented youngsters.How come Ishant Sharma, Umesh, Pujara play so many matches

till now?? So strange.To have tested  new talented youngsters mid way  would have been the correct thing to do.Any way  mediocrity is being allowed to continue for such lengthy periods.Then what big matter if it is  the case with new comers??. At the least such huge monetary benefits would have got shared with quite a few players than going as a whole  into the hands of  these undeserving players.After all  at least  testing new comers  at the place of  proven mediocre players is the proper method to follow.

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1 hour ago, rtmohanlal said:

Rahane at least is a world class test player. But Umesh???  I think this is a major handicap with Indian system.Allowing mediocre players to go  on  playing with out testing talented youngsters.How come Ishant Sharma, Umesh, Pujara play so many matches

till now?? So strange.To have tested  new talented youngsters mid way  would have been the correct thing to do.Any way  mediocrity is being allowed to continue for such lengthy periods.Then what big matter if it is  the case with new comers??. At the least such huge monetary benefits would have got shared with quite a few players than going as a whole  into the hands of  these undeserving players.After all  at least  testing new comers  at the place of  proven mediocre players is the proper method to follow.

I don't think you have watched much of Umesh in test cricket in the last 15 months or so.  A massively improved bowler from his days as a spraygun.   Think of him as a faster, better version of workhorse, ahead of Ishant.   And one that can deploy reverse-swing to deadly effect when available.   

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2 hours ago, sarchasm said:

16 extra runs or 4 wickets? Hmmm, this is a toughie

its a toughie ...but for retards.

imagine a match if aus are 71-4 in 10 overs or 55-0 in 10 overs.....

no brainer.......if they are 55-0 they can make 350 and if they are 71-4 they barely would make 250 as 1or 2 wickets more then all collapse......

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3 hours ago, sandeep said:

I don't think you have watched much of Umesh in test cricket in the last 15 months or so.  A massively improved bowler from his days as a spraygun.   Think of him as a faster, better version of workhorse, ahead of Ishant.   And one that can deploy reverse-swing to deadly effect when available.   

just compare his spell in dharamshala vs aus  to that of 4 years before.....he has massively improved

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11 minutes ago, LORD_analyst said:

its a toughie ...but for retards.

imagine a match if aus are 71-4 in 10 overs or 55-0 in 10 overs.....

no brainer.......if they are 55-0 they can make 350 and if they are 71-4 they barely would make 250 as 1or 2 wickets more then all collapse......

Lmao, the retarded person is the one who ignores that yadavs wicket was AFTER the opposition had scored 231 for 0.

 

the retarded person is the one who forgot that when bk bowled aussies did not cross 300 once

The retarded person is the one who did not see that india won every match bk played recently and lost when yadav played

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57 minutes ago, New guy said:

the retarded person is the one who forgot that when bk bowled aussies did not cross 300 once

wicket were taken heavily by kuldeep and chahal in that matches..today spinners got spanked

but i do agree that umesh didnt got wickets in his first spell

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10 hours ago, putrevus said:

This type of pitch is where these fast bowlers need to show some spunk.Shami has a long way to go before he becomes an ace for all  conditions.

If exclude last over, Shami bowled very well. Even in the power play, he was very good and he was playing an ODI after a long gap. Cant expect him to just come in start taking wickets

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On 9/28/2017 at 10:22 PM, Vilander said:

its just that he isnt. But again we can only disgree on it for now. till next test series. 

60% of bhuvis wickets are with an older ball. Dude has played 20 matches and averages 26. Kohli himself says he bowls a heavy ball now.and is faster. He has learned to seam,reverse and bowl a.mean shory ball.

 

So yes, you can keep saying how useless he is on flat pitches ( earlier things said about him - he is not a death bowler, cannot bowl yorkers, top batsmen will never get out to him with his pace) while he keeps proving you wrong. Day before, even after pitch flatted out, he created the most chances. You keep on putting him down while he maintains that average wherever he plays, home or away

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23 minutes ago, Lannister said:

What a turnaround :hatsoff:. I am never going to speak ill of him again.

I easily mistook him for one of Dhoni's chamchas, but he's a rare breed who doesn't want things to go easy. 

He himself realized that once kohli took over, his days were numbered unless he increased his pace and became more attacking. He has the same hunger kohli has for runs. I am just happy kohli also realized this and didn't write him off

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33 minutes ago, Lannister said:

What a turnaround :hatsoff:. I am never going to speak ill of him again.

I easily mistook him for one of Dhoni's chamchas, but he's a rare breed who doesn't want things to go easy. 

Bhuvi is hard worker, absolutely no doubt that clown ex captain was holding him back for whatever reason, no coincidence bhuvi flourished the moment ex captain retired.

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20 hours ago, Trichromatic said:

:phehe::phehe:

:p: dhoni the great in Bangladesh 2015 openly criticized bhuvi in pc by calling him a smart bowler who is bowling to survive in other words a selfish 

Can't find a clip but in one off odi vs srilanka bhuvi was trying to bowl inswing to lefthander but was not getting it right and bowled two consecutive wides the great mahi immediately shouted something like this "abbey bhuvi tu swing-wing chhhod sirf siddhey daal"

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