Jos Butler vs MS Dhoni

[Tattieboy]

2 minutes ago, maniac said:

Those are butlers current stats...he has sustained that average and strike rate for a while now and if I remember correctly 3 or 4 out of his 5 100s are the fastest 100s scored by an Englishman...he is real good.

 

As a pure keeper I personally think Dhoni is better this might be clouded by the fact that Butler is not considered for test matches.

I agree he is good,  I am going to wait till he is finished to see how good 

[Ankit_sharma03]

5 minutes ago, maniac said:

@velu @Ankit_sharma03 @sscomp32 

 

Ur views

 

Obv butler currently

Current dhoni cant even be compared to old dhoni.

[speedheat]

3 minutes ago, Tattieboy said:

As i keep saying judge stats at the end instead of picking individual performances to back up a theory 

This is irrelevant to topic as Anna said current dhoni or butler??? word CURRENT is important here as current dhoni is as good as first half of your username

[Tattieboy]

Oooops I backed Dhoni so I am a troll 

[maniac]

1 minute ago, rtmohanlal said:

MS Dhoni by a country mile

reasons

Dhoni has almost completed his full cycle of cricketing career.Butler has not even finished 1/3rd of his career

Dhoni leads Butler by almost 13 runs in avg:,Butler leads Dhoni convincingly in str: rate though.But Dhoni's stats need to  analysed based on almost a  decade back yardstick of tougher batting conditions though.

Then come the most important facts that tilts it completely in favour of Dhoni. Dhoni has been a big match player,a great chaser & finisher, a great aggressor towards the end of an inns all rolled into one. To add to that he has been an expert in rotating the strike with tailenders  in chasing and finishing matches. And has been good in alien conditions too.

 

And in tests Dhoni has convincingly better record. And he has been a brilliant captain too.

No one is denying that from a total body of work Dhoni is a little ahead.

 

However Butler’s knock against the Aussie attack yesterday and also his kncoks in the UAE(which is equivalent of a knock on English conditions for a SC batsman), to maintain that average at that strike rate is pretty impressive.

 

Currently absolutely it is Butler hands down.

[Tattieboy]

4 minutes ago, speedheat said:

This is irrelevant to topic as Anna said current dhoni or butler??? word CURRENT is important here as current dhoni is as good as first half of your username

Judging someone at the height of his career against someone who should be retired from internationals is just stupid 

 

[maniac]

1 minute ago, Tattieboy said:

Judging someone at the height of his career against someone who should be retired from internationals is just stupid 

 

Th comparison is to show how modern cricket by a no.6 has evolved...lunging,consolidating is passé 

[Tattieboy]

1 minute ago, maniac said:

Th comparison is to show how modern cricket by a no.6 has evolved...lunging,consolidating is passé 

Every generation of cricketers has evolved.  I appreciate both as cricketers.  I marvelled at Dhoni innings in the past as I marvelled at Jos's  two days ago . 

[speedheat]

7 minutes ago, Tattieboy said:

Judging someone at the height of his career against someone who should be retired from internationals is just stupid 

 

Op meant the current form and modern cricket, dhoni haven't retired yet so nothing stupid about it

[maniac]

1 minute ago, Tattieboy said:

Every generation of cricketers has evolved.  I appreciate both as cricketers.  I marvelled at Dhoni innings in the past as I marvelled at Jos's  two days ago . 

Adam Gilchrist adapted to T20s like a fish to water....Sachin kept evolving and changing his game with changing times and situations....Dhoni has not kept up....if it was Dhoni in that situation against Starc,Cummins and Hazelwood we would see a innings like 55*(85).

 

As I already said total body of work and keeping Dhoni might have a case but he has no business being in the scheme of things now....you need a Butler,De kock type player.

[Tattieboy]

2 minutes ago, speedheat said:

Op meant the current form and modern cricket, dhoni haven't retired yet so nothing stupid about it

NO he hasn't but he shouldn't still be in ODI team 

[maniac]

1 minute ago, Tattieboy said:

NO he hasn't but he shouldn't still be in ODI team 

You are saying Dhoni shouldn’t be or should be in the odi team?

[Tattieboy]

Just now, maniac said:

You are saying Dhoni shouldn’t be or should be in the odi team?

Should not 

[maniac]

Just now, Tattieboy said:

Should not 

Thank you! That’s the point I was trying to make....the game has evolved. Dhoni is 3 years too late.

[putrevus]

They both are different players, Butler has more shots in his repertoire where as Dhoni is more stable.At moment Butler might be the best WK is shorter formats.He is just devastating and that is their loss to Pakistan in CT is more surprising. They bat so deep and bowling is more than adequate.

[Tattieboy]

1 minute ago, maniac said:

Thank you! That’s the point I was trying to make....the game has evolved. Dhoni is 3 years too late.

That's my whole point too, it's unfair judging Jos and Dhoni today.  

He had his time and from a neutral point of view he was great for cricket but as you say if you don't evolve then you stagnate or go backwards 

[maniac]

3 minutes ago, putrevus said:

They both are different players, Butler has more shots in his repertoire where as Dhoni is more stable.At moment Butler might be the best WK is shorter formats.He is just devastating and that is their loss to Pakistan in CT is more surprising. They bat so deep and bowling is more than adequate.

We don’t need a stable player....our top 3 or even 4 are all proper batsman who have both attacking and defensive games...we need more of a butler type player to take advantage of the starts than a “stabilizer”.

[velu]

1 hour ago, maniac said:

Whom would you pick currently?

 

The guy plays his game regardless of the situation and the innings against Australia in the 3rd ODI was one of the best counter attacking knocks I have seen.

 

Keeping MSD is better from what I have seen of Butler but batting,Butler is ahead.

 

you guys are saying the samething about dhoni as well

infcat dhoni plays the same game regardless of the format as well  

[Laaloo]

12 minutes ago, putrevus said:

They both are different players, Butler has more shots in his repertoire where as Dhoni is more stable.At moment Butler might be the best WK is shorter formats.He is just devastating and that is their loss to Pakistan in CT is more surprising. They bat so deep and bowling is more than adequate.

Their bowling is full or trundlers and moeen Ali and Rashid Ali are mediocre. Their batting is really good though.

[velu]

1 hour ago, maniac said:

To be honest I have seen Dhoni play the Butler kind of knocks in his prime but he takes this finisher thing too seriously.

 

 

 

thats called responsibility