Vijay finishes with average of 17, Rahul averaged 7

[Gollum]

And if we are in a position of strength in this match thank Vijay and to a lesser extent Rahul. They saw off a dangerous passage of play yesterday, Vijay played out the 1st session today blunting the new ball and made others' job a tad easier. 127 balls against new ball on this pitch is indeed the highlight of the Indian innings, also a chanceless innings while he was there. We want this Vijay in Eng. The previous innings he was playing uncharacteristically, may be the intent talk forced him to have a jab at many deliveries he could have left alone. 

 

Why we need the leaver Vijay in Eng is because Broad-Anderson are ruthless with the new ball. Eng aren't as good as SA between 30-80 overs but with the new ball they are lethal, force you to play every single delivery. No wonder so many times they have rolled opposition for sub 100 scores in challenging conditions. If they get a sniff of Kohli-Rahane before 20 overs they may run through our line up, SA wasted the new ball many times this series and Eng never do that. If we won Lord's 2014 it is because Vijay and Pujara played over 30 overs between them and Vijay got a 95(247) in the 3rd innings. We need both Vijay and Pujara in top 3 to make conditions easier for Kohli-Rahane. 

[Gollum]

@Cricketics Haseeb Hameed was brought up in UK, for English openers India is a relatively easier place to play because openers have an easier job here. Throwing Shaw as an opener in Eng against Broad-Anderson could be career ending, scars may remain for eternity. 

 

Karthik did well in Eng in 2007, 11 years have passed. Dhawan is any day a better bet than at least the current versions of Karthik, Shaw etc. He needs to be our 3rd opener there and play the 3rd test if things go awry. 

[Cricketics]

1 minute ago, Gollum said:

@Cricketics Haseeb Hameed was brought up in UK, for English openers India is a relatively easier place to play because openers have an easier job here. Throwing Shaw as an opener in Eng against Broad-Anderson could be career ending, scars may remain for eternity. 

 

Karthik did well in Eng in 2007, 11 years have passed. Dhawan is any day a better bet than at least the current versions of Karthik, Shaw etc. He needs to be our 3rd opener there and play the 3rd test if things go awry. 

Playing one or two test, won't leave any scars. The players will only learn from their mistakes and it will make them better players. We can do the same with Iyer, like playing Iyer at 6 if needed when playing 4 pacers. We must somehow give chance to these players somewhere overseas. Can't continue to keep playing same players every time even if they are failing regularly. That is my whole point. 

 

 

Karthik is a temporary option if Vijay is failing regularly on that tour. That is also just temporary if needed, better than playing PP like he opened against Engalnd at home. 

I am not even a fan of Karthik, just throwing our options during different times of the series and according to the situation. I hope Pant tours with Saha. 

 

 

[sensible-indian]

Lol this thread is hilarious.

[sensible-indian]

Classic case of stats without context.

[Trichromatic]

5 minutes ago, sensible-indian said:

Classic case of stats without context.

Some of which isn't even real.

[putrevus]

Problem with Vijay is he has not converted his starts and when playing with just 5 batsmen you cannot have people getting starts and then getting out.

 

Players can be out of form for whole series it happens to best of them but what do they do when they are in form in important. Kohli has had two very bad series one in England and other against Australia.

Edited January 26, 2018 by putrevus

[Gollum]

Looking at how their openers played today, hats off to Vijay and Rahul.

[Straight Drive]

Average of 17 and 7 is pathetic for specialist batsmen, whoever they are and it includes Chet as well. Even all rounders are expected to average 25. They have to show better performance. 

[Gollum]

They may average less but have more heart and spine than the coward SA top order. How many blows Vijay took with the brand new cherry only to smile back....asli mard. Elgar isn't fit to shines his boots. We dropped the coward thrice and made him a hero.

[Trichromatic]

16 minutes ago, Straight Drive said:

Average of 17 and 7 is pathetic for specialist batsmen, whoever they are and it includes Chet as well. Even all rounders are expected to average 25. They have to show better performance. 

Overall average of top 6 batsmen from both sides has been 20 in this series.

[Cricketics]

21 minutes ago, Gollum said:

Looking at how their openers played today, hats off to Vijay and Rahul.

They batted well today but Vijay’s overall average for the series which included four other innings is a concern.

 

So we are talking about two different things.

 

We must look to try someone if we our openers fail in first two tests in England.

 

No harm in giving one player a chance in the middle of a series.  No one is asking to drop someone at the start of the series.

 

I think four innings is a sufficient time on a new tour.

 

[putrevus]

1 minute ago, Trichromatic said:

Overall average of top 6 batsmen from both sides has been 20 in this series.

So what SA is not a great team by any stretch so their batting does not surprise me , it is inept batting by openers along with Rohit sharma is the reason why India has lost this series.

[vvvslaxman]

This is a bowler series. Vijay survived more balls than the most. His effective blunting is the reason why tail could cash in on old ball.Bad time to criticize Vijay. His impeccable concentration judgement was a sight to behold. We should never lose sight of the context. With zero practice and no time to recover from jet lag he played at least 2 decent innings in bowler friendly conditions.

[Vilander]

he batted what 130 balls. got hit what 30 times..means nothing here, match abandoned. Poor guy.

[vvvslaxman]

Hackman and all the available openers would not have survived more than a few overs. Forgot Mukund? His confidence shot forever. M Vijay is an important integral component like Rahane overseas. 

[Straight Drive]

1 hour ago, Trichromatic said:

Overall average of top 6 batsmen from both sides has been 20 in this series.

 6 runs average for specialist batsman is horribly under par. 21 too is bad.  These averages cannot be justified at all.

[maniac]

2 hours ago, Cricketics said:

He had reached close to 44. He is too solid a batsman to give it away like this. I am disappointed from him on this tour, not because of his failures since many failed and not just him, but more for some of the shots he played as he is never like this usually. 

 

He is known to take his time.

 

 

You were disappointed in him for quiet some time now even before the series wonder why???

 

[maniac]

@Cricketics this is technically Vijay’s first international series failure and even then he has done better than other openers.

 

Rahul is the future.

 

Both need to be given one more go but yes Vijay’s position is not as secure as it was before.

 

Rahul has age on his side and deserves few more chances.

 

Dhawan well he is a proven failure so you can bring a young guy like Shaw etc in his slot.

 

You can’t go in with 3 new openers on a tough tour....so not sure what you are implying here.

[SLICKR392]

I really like Rahul, but he needs to turn up!