China is Indias biggest enemy. They are doing everything possible to harm and undermine India

[Muloghonto]

6 hours ago, narenpande1 said:

 And dimwit - prove that chinese icbm tech is better than ours or stfu.

How about the fact that they are far more advanced than us in ICMB range. This is common knowledge.

6 hours ago, narenpande1 said:

 

yes we can’t string together 3 9 % years because we can’t demolish towns upon towns and lay a red carpet for overseas manufacturing without a political backlash and common man revolt. No democracy can dimwit.

Ofcourse I know that's the reason. But the point stands- we are more like 50 years behind China due to these kind of factors. 

 

6 hours ago, narenpande1 said:

do you have first hand experience of their jet engines ? Are they combat proven ? Hell no, so shut the F up. 

No more or no less combat proven than ours, kiddo. 

6 hours ago, narenpande1 said:

 

A space station is ridiculously expensive to build. It is not about capability but ISROs budget. China is atleast 10 years away from a successful mars orbital mission. 

Nonsense. 

6 hours ago, narenpande1 said:

 

You must be a real thick head in geopolitical understanding. A puny Philippines can do nothing. India is the only long term economic power weight that dna match and exceed China this century.

Key word : Can. Until we are in the same ball park, we are not required. simple. 

6 hours ago, narenpande1 said:

 

chinas nominal gdp in 2006 is same as ours at the start of 2018. That’s 12 years, let’s say 15 years or even 20 years to make a dimwit like you happy. 50 years ? You must be a real thick head brainwashed dude

Its going to take us 50 years to make up that ground, you moron, because as you said, we are not going to demolish entire villages and pop up factories in 2 months over it. 

6 hours ago, narenpande1 said:

 

 

If the US does not need us, they would not be courting us. 

 

For any nation to succeed in a geopolitical battle strong allies and economy is a must.

the former USSR was a military monster, they could smash the current china 10 times over for fun. Yet they were brought to their knees by smart US geopolitical play.

 

china stands all alone by itself. Most of the west wants to see China go down. 

 

They can shut the import tap when push comes to shove. They shut the oil import tap from USSR and destroyed it.

 

it is for India to play its geopolitical cards well, and lay a platform for 2 decades of

7.5 % to 8 % growth and Watch China stagnate in its excess production capacity for which there are no takers. 

more vacuous Indian chest thumping nonsense.

 

[narenpande1]

20 minutes ago, Muloghonto said:

How about the fact that they are far more advanced than us in ICMB range. This is common knowledge.

Ofcourse I know that's the reason. But the point stands- we are more like 50 years behind China due to these kind of factors. 

 

No more or no less combat proven than ours, kiddo. 

Nonsense. 

Key word : Can. Until we are in the same ball park, we are not required. simple. 

Its going to take us 50 years to make up that ground, you moron, because as you said, we are not going to demolish entire villages and pop up factories in 2 months over it. 

more vacuous Indian chest thumping nonsense.

 

 Hey hare  brain  please explain the math how matching China’s 2006 Nominal GDP in 2018 makes us 50 years behind instead of 12 years.

 

yes Chinese jet engines are not more combat proven but they are more capable because a hare brain like you with access to an electronic gadget says so

Edited January 29, 2018 by narenpande1

[Muloghonto]

25 minutes ago, narenpande1 said:

 Hey hare  brain  please explain the math how matching China’s 2006 Nominal GDP in 2018 makes us 50 years behind instead of 12 years.

 

yes Chinese jet engines are not more combat proven but they are more capable because a hare brain like you with access to an electronic gadget says so

Because you moron, its going to take us 50 years to make up that differential,because as you admitted, India is not demolishing villages and putting factories up there in 3 weeks.

 

Chinese jets are more capable, because their stuff is more advanced than ours. They make jets far better than we do and more advanced stuff.

 

Your posts in this topic are nothing more than wishful thinking Indian jingoistic nonsense.

 

 

[narenpande1]

46 minutes ago, Muloghonto said:

Because you moron, its going to take us 50 years to make up that differential,because as you admitted, India is not demolishing villages and putting factories up there in 3 weeks.

 

Chinese jets are more capable, because their stuff is more advanced than ours. They make jets far better than we do and more advanced stuff.

 

Your posts in this topic are nothing more than wishful thinking Indian jingoistic nonsense.

 

 

And your posts are rants without facts. 

 

A fairer argument would be India is about 15 years behind economically and maybe 30 years behind infrastructure wise. But you are too arrogant to make it. 

[Muloghonto]

17 minutes ago, narenpande1 said:

And your posts are rants without facts. 

 

A fairer argument would be India is about 15 years behind economically and maybe 30 years behind infrastructure wise. But you are too arrogant to make it. 

Fact : China has better ICMBs than us. They've had it for 20 years. Their longest range ICBM can go 10k Kms. Ours can't.

 

Fact : China makes 25 times the number of fighter jets India does, with in-house engine manufacturing, while India can only build outdated engines on license to manufacture. Kaveri engine is a failure. LCA does not have a native engine.

 

Fact : China has a 5th generation fighter that is flying. Our 5th generation fighter is still on a drawing board.

 

Fact : The methods used by China to expedite their economic growth is not usable by India and it will take India 2-3x the time to do so. 

 

 

Get off your jingoism to realize how far back we are, because its people like you, who lead to debacles like 1963, overrating our ability and under-preparing our chances. 

But then again, you want nuclear posturing, which is all I need to know about your maturity level. 

[narenpande1]

28 minutes ago, Muloghonto said:

Fact : China has better ICMBs than us. They've had it for 20 years. Their longest range ICBM can go 10k Kms. Ours can't.

 

Fact : China makes 25 times the number of fighter jets India does, with in-house engine manufacturing, while India can only build outdated engines on license to manufacture. Kaveri engine is a failure. LCA does not have a native engine.

 

Fact : China has a 5th generation fighter that is flying. Our 5th generation fighter is still on a drawing board.

 

Fact : The methods used by China to expedite their economic growth is not usable by India and it will take India 2-3x the time to do so. 

 

 

Get off your jingoism to realize how far back we are, because its people like you, who lead to debacles like 1963, overrating our ability and under-preparing our chances. 

But then again, you want nuclear posturing, which is all I need to know about your maturity level. 

 

1) Having a longer distance ICBM does not mean better ICBM, you dimwit. If that is the benchmark North Korea should be a world leader as well. It is about the accuracy and ability to carry multiple heavy weight warheads. You should have the common sense to know that a nation that has the technology to do a complicated ultra precision mission like the  Mars mission which only 3 nations  USSR< USA<EU ( none of whom have succeeded in their first try )  with a paltry budget can surely send a ballistic missile with 10K range. Your retarded logic is like saying Japan does not have nuclear know how and capability because they have not detonated a device yet.

 

India does not face threat from ANY COUNTRY outside the Agni V range. Why should they test a missile with 10K range and create tension and doubts about its intent ?? Common sense ?

 

2) Chinese planes are unproven $hit. Even Pak is preferring most 35 year old F16s over the JF17 chinese junk. The best Chinese planes are still the SU30's from the Russians and reverse engineered MIG variants. Go look up.

 

3) China can fly a 5th generation plane or 7th generation plane. Nobody buys its quality. If Chinese planes were any good, there would be plenty of third world country who have an airforce and would have bought Chinese fighter jets. 

 

4) A little bit of Math for you, you  lesser one - India was a 400B dollar economy in 1998, India is a 2.5T dollar economy today.

A 6 fold increase in 20 years. India is undergoing way too many reforms now compared to then, workforce numbers are way higher now compared to then. With the same trajectory, India would be close to being a 15T economy in 2038. China today is a 11.5T dollar economy. Go figure...

 

 

We are not a war mongering rogue country like China. It is not about overrating our capability - it is about talking facts and sense, which is not your cup of tea apparently.

 

 

Edited January 29, 2018 by narenpande1

[Muloghonto]

4 hours ago, narenpande1 said:

 

1) Having a longer distance ICBM does not mean better ICBM, you dimwit. If that is the benchmark North Korea should be a world leader as well. It is about the accuracy and ability to carry multiple heavy weight warheads. You should have the common sense to know that a nation that has the technology to do a complicated ultra precision mission like the  Mars mission which only 3 nations  USSR< USA<EU ( none of whom have succeeded in their first try )  with a paltry budget can surely send a ballistic missile with 10K range. Your retarded logic is like saying Japan does not have nuclear know how and capability because they have not detonated a device yet.

China has MIRV ICMBs and have had them for much longer than us. Precision has nothing to do with fuel density required to make a missile go 10K. India does not have that yet. 

4 hours ago, narenpande1 said:

 

India does not face threat from ANY COUNTRY outside the Agni V range. Why should they test a missile with 10K range and create tension and doubts about its intent ?? Common sense ?

Just a round-about way of saying India lacks the capability. No test = no capability. 

 

4 hours ago, narenpande1 said:

2) Chinese planes are unproven $hit. Even Pak is preferring most 35 year old F16s over the JF17 chinese junk. The best Chinese planes are still the SU30's from the Russians and reverse engineered MIG variants. Go look up.

Indian planes are unproven $hit too. 

 

4 hours ago, narenpande1 said:

3) China can fly a 5th generation plane or 7th generation plane. Nobody buys its quality. If Chinese planes were any good, there would be plenty of third world country who have an airforce and would have bought Chinese fighter jets. 

Still, makes them way, way better than India. They do have a few buyers. India has zero. 

 

4 hours ago, narenpande1 said:

4) A little bit of Math for you, you  lesser one - India was a 400B dollar economy in 1998, India is a 2.5T dollar economy today.

A 6 fold increase in 20 years. India is undergoing way too many reforms now compared to then, workforce numbers are way higher now compared to then. With the same trajectory, India would be close to being a 15T economy in 2038. China today is a 11.5T dollar economy. Go figure...

 

 

We are not a war mongering rogue country like China. It is not about overrating our capability - it is about talking facts and sense, which is not your cup of tea apparently.

 

 

Facts show that we are far, far behind China and that we need the western powers way more than they need us.

[narenpande1]

9 hours ago, Muloghonto said:

China has MIRV ICMBs and have had them for much longer than us. Precision has nothing to do with fuel density required to make a missile go 10K. India does not have that yet. 

Just a round-about way of saying India lacks the capability. No test = no capability. 

 

Indian planes are unproven $hit too. 

 

Still, makes them way, way better than India. They do have a few buyers. India has zero. 

 

Facts show that we are far, far behind China and that we need the western powers way more than they need us.

 

Hare brain, China’s $hit jets  have no takers except Pakistan, who too is forced to take it because of F16 export to Pak has been banned. Pak would pay an arm and leg to buy that 80s F16 over China’s

“5th gen “junk.

 

you can keep howling how far behind China, India is  ( repeat far 100 times ) if it makes your lemon sized brain any better, but the facts on the ground are India is as big an economy today as China was 12 years back and if India grows at the same rate of the last 20 years where it grew from 400B to 2.5 Trillion, it will be a 15 T economy in 20 years, 3.1 T bigger than China today. If you have any credibility disprove my hard facts and numbers  other wise STFU and move on.

[Muloghonto]

44 minutes ago, narenpande1 said:

 

Hare brain, China’s $hit jets  have no takers except Pakistan, who too is forced to take it because of F16 export to Pak has been banned. Pak would pay an arm and leg to buy that 80s F16 over China’s

“5th gen “junk.

There's a saying- 'andhey me kanha raaja'. Sure. China's jets have no takers except Pakistan. India's jets have no takers, period. 1 is bigger than 0.  Compare India to China when India can find a single taker for the LCA and makes more than one start-stop spluttering fighter project.  China builds an entire FLEET of various combat jets and has done so for YEARS. 

 

India's 'home-grown military prowess' is ahead of China only in the naval department. And that too, will fast diminish due to their superior industrial prowess- both quantitatively and qualitatively. In Air, its no contest, India is an inferior manufacturer in every which way to China.

 

China isn't selling its 5th gen fighter either. The mere fact that they can make it and India cannot, makes their fighter jet program way more advanced than India's. 

And as I noted, they are far more experienced at making aircraft engines than we are. 

Quote

 

you can keep howling how far behind China, India is  ( repeat far 100 times ) if it makes your lemon sized brain any better, but the facts on the ground are India is as big an economy today as China was 12 years back and if India grows at the same rate of the last 20 years where it grew from 400B to 2.5 Trillion, it will be a 15 T economy in 20 years, 3.1 T bigger than China today. If you have any credibility disprove my hard facts and numbers  other wise STFU and move on.

India as big as China was 12 years ago still makes India a distant loser to China TODAY. 

And the gap, in terms of real dollar value, is increasing, not decreasing. 

And at the current rate, genius, China's economy in 20 years will top 35T dollars. 

Doesn't change the fact that India will still be a little brother to China in 20 years, unless something very unexpected happens, which is a very low probability. 

 

Edited January 30, 2018 by Muloghonto

[Nikhil_cric]

Without going into economics which I believe is something powerful nations use as a mask to cover their realist policies, it's the nature of the Han Chinese that is the key to understanding China. The Han believe that they are the centre of human civilisation and look at others as necessarily inferior and barbarians. There's a reason why nobody in its history - the Mongols, the Manchus, even colonial powers could never really get legitimacy from the public because only Han Chinese from inner China would ever be accepted by the public. Even ideology is an eyewash when it comes to the Chinese . They are a true Machiavelli an state in a way that even colonial powers and the US could never because they don't have to justify their policies in terms of liberal and democratic principles nor do they have to deal with domestic dissent being a totalitarian state. 

[Temujin Khaghan]

other than the OP

 

anyone else think Chinese are very rude?

 

I have met people from many Asian countries, I usually found that Japanese, SE Asian to be humble most of the time. Pakistanis are prejudiced once they know you are Indian, but Chinese are excessively rude. They dont have manners, very unclean. 

[Muloghonto]

4 minutes ago, Temujin Khaghan said:

other than the OP

 

anyone else think Chinese are very rude?

 

I have met people from many Asian countries, I usually found that Japanese, SE Asian to be humble most of the time. Pakistanis are prejudiced once they know you are Indian, but Chinese are excessively rude. They dont have manners, very unclean. 

Yep. Rudest people on the planet even without cause.

I live in a city full of fresh-of-the-boat Chinese. And when I take the bus, I've given up asking old Chinese people waiting there (at bus stops that has multiple buses stop), if a certain bus has gone by just before I got there or not. Most people will respond normally. All immigrants who are bad at English smile and shake their heads....old Chinese people ? They will stare right ahead and ignore you..like you don't exist. A few times, I've asked and the Chinese person kept on staring ahead towards the street. So I asked again and they sighed, took 3 steps away from me and kept on staring at the street.

This level of rudeness, is pretty shocking actually.

[Temujin Khaghan]

But I hear people in HongKong are much better than the mainland Chinese people. It seems they hate mainland Chinese people for their uncouth behaviour and bad standards of cleanliness. Since HK has been taken back by China, a lot of mainland Chinese people immigrated to HK giving the denizens of HK much heartburn. 

 

 

[narenpande1]

2 hours ago, Muloghonto said:

Yep. Rudest people on the planet even without cause.

I live in a city full of fresh-of-the-boat Chinese. And when I take the bus, I've given up asking old Chinese people waiting there (at bus stops that has multiple buses stop), if a certain bus has gone by just before I got there or not. Most people will respond normally. All immigrants who are bad at English smile and shake their heads....old Chinese people ? They will stare right ahead and ignore you..like you don't exist. A few times, I've asked and the Chinese person kept on staring ahead towards the street. So I asked again and they sighed, took 3 steps away from me and kept on staring at the street.

This level of rudeness, is pretty shocking actually.

 

You are absolutely correct.

 

I have been to Japan only once, but spent a good 7 days there and was totally blown away by the politeness and courtesy of the common people and extremely friendly attitude.

 

You will not find people talking on phones in the Japanese subway at all. They are extremely quiet and courteous. On my trip from Tokyo to Osaka and back to Tokyo, the passengers ahead of me in the train took my permission on both the occasions if they could recline their chairs. 

 

You would not find such extraordinary politeness anywhere in the world. It is the best of oriental culture. Koreans are much much better than Chinese but Japs are in a different league.

 

Mainland Chinese are immorally greedy uncouth, dishonest and deceptive. On an avg they are far more impolite than people in metropolitan cities in India who sometimes go out of their way to help.

 

[narenpande1]

3 hours ago, Muloghonto said:

There's a saying- 'andhey me kanha raaja'. Sure. China's jets have no takers except Pakistan. India's jets have no takers, period. 1 is bigger than 0.  Compare India to China when India can find a single taker for the LCA and makes more than one start-stop spluttering fighter project.  China builds an entire FLEET of various combat jets and has done so for YEARS. 

 

India's 'home-grown military prowess' is ahead of China only in the naval department. And that too, will fast diminish due to their superior industrial prowess- both quantitatively and qualitatively. In Air, its no contest, India is an inferior manufacturer in every which way to China.

 

China isn't selling its 5th gen fighter either. The mere fact that they can make it and India cannot, makes their fighter jet program way more advanced than India's. 

And as I noted, they are far more experienced at making aircraft engines than we are. 

India as big as China was 12 years ago still makes India a distant loser to China TODAY. 

And the gap, in terms of real dollar value, is increasing, not decreasing. 

And at the current rate, genius, China's economy in 20 years will top 35T dollars. 

Doesn't change the fact that India will still be a little brother to China in 20 years, unless something very unexpected happens, which is a very low probability. 

 

 

It is far less certain now that China can continue to grow at decent rates. Even the most patriotic Chinese govt officials feel so. 

Even after artificially control and forced manipulation to meet 6 % plus  growth every year  in these times, the Chinese feel they are just killing them selves with more debt to meet an artificial  number that is being revised down every year.

Also china in a decade is to face a decline in workforce - whereas India will be still halfway peaking.

Yes, China currently has a much larger base than India so incremental gdp growth is still higher. But India will close the gap in the next 15 years by half. 

Unlike China, India’s infrastructure is still woeful and building this over the next 2 decades through govt spending and private partnerships is going to add atleast 2 % to the GDP growth over a long period of time.

 

china has already used that card, India is yet to. We just need to remove all hurdles to land acquisition. It has become much better than 10 years back and we are getting there. Although it cannot ever happen at China’s rate because we cannot kick people out at short notice.

[narenpande1]

As far as military technology goes - everything that tiny tiny Israel makes is world class and far better than what China makes. We need to take Israeli help to bolster our homegrown capabilties and form More 50-50 partnerships. 

We have deep pockets to spend 60-70B dollars a year, Israelis have access to the best American technology and their homegrown technology is world beating too and they have enormous experience.

also Israel due to America - will never ever share their best technology with China but give it to us all. They genuinely love us and we must take all the help we can. Not a single country has helped us as much during war times as Israel. 

 

their home grown drones, radars, surface to air missiles are far superior to what China has and we have bought billions of dollars of this hardware from them. 

 

We we need to negotiate more transfer of technology deals so that short funded  DRDO gets a solid base. 

[Turning_track]

Can somebody explain to me the Chinese logic of building so many cities/towns which is currently known as GHOST CITIES?
Was it made to house millions of Chinese for near future or was it a failed initiative by CPC?

PS: I'm a novice regarding economic policies.

[narenpande1]

Many reasons. China has built excess supply side capacity ( production ). And need to build to put to work Billions of tons of cement production and millions of tons of steel production .. all to meet GDP targets, also to decongest major cities.

 

Picture this mind numbing statistic - China consumed more cement in 3 years than US did in entire 20th century !!!!!!!

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2015/03/24/how-china-used-more-cement-in-3-years-than-the-u-s-did-in-the-entire-20th-century/?utm_term=.332b251cdd78

 

this is an extraordinary economic model of supply excesses  and “ bad ultra high growth “ that will blow up in China’s face.

 

This is the reason why China has been aggressively promoting their deceptive belt and road initiative to export excess capacity under an altruistic garb to prevent its hundreds of thousands of factories.

 

a failure of belt and road initiative would be devastating for China’s economy 

 

[Muloghonto]

4 hours ago, narenpande1 said:

As far as military technology goes - everything that tiny tiny Israel makes is world class and far better than what China makes. We need to take Israeli help to bolster our homegrown capabilties and form More 50-50 partnerships. 

We have deep pockets to spend 60-70B dollars a year, Israelis have access to the best American technology and their homegrown technology is world beating too and they have enormous experience.

also Israel due to America - will never ever share their best technology with China but give it to us all. They genuinely love us and we must take all the help we can. Not a single country has helped us as much during war times as Israel. 

 

their home grown drones, radars, surface to air missiles are far superior to what China has and we have bought billions of dollars of this hardware from them. 

 

We we need to negotiate more transfer of technology deals so that short funded  DRDO gets a solid base. 

LOL

Spend 60-70B on the army while having the world's biggest jhopar-pattis and malnourished people. 

This is why there's the saying that the difference between a nationalist and a patriot is night and day.

 

[narenpande1]

^ gandhi was a patriot too, and surrounded by two Revisionist states eyeing India’s land , his naked parading and fasts and dharnas would not move terrorist Pakistan or ruthless China from trying to wrest India’s land.

 

We cannot help it, our neighbourhood is what it is, it’s not like we are in Scandinavia.