Shubman Gill is a World Cup 2019 prospect, should be picked for England tour

[maniac]

1 minute ago, Austin 3:!6 said:

TBH Kohli didnt look as impressive as Gill in the U19 WC

Talking about Unmukt’s batting style similar to Kohli in internationals...infact apples to apples Unmukt looked better at u19 level than Kohli but when it came to playing international level quality bowling  huge gulf in quality 

[maniac]

1 minute ago, Cricketics said:

IPl will not give us any idea. It will only slowly improve Gill’s or Shaw’s hitting ability but IPl won’t give us or selectors any idea as these youngsters are bound to have average seaon with limited chances which they will get after couple of cameo scores.

 

t20 doesn’t gice you much time to score runs and for under19 players itd extra hard, hence Kohli, Pant, Unmukt, and pretty much 90 percent of young batsmen struggled in the IPl in first few seasons.

 

 

Our idea has been given to us.

 

He needs to be fast tracked.

 

You think playing against Starc and Rabada or Shami is the same as Shaheen and Musa?

 

At this point as we said it is very evident that Gill is the real deal obviously but let’s not jump the gun yet.

 

top of the order 1,2 and 3 Be It IPL gives plenty of idea about a young batsmen’s ability 

[Cricketics]

5 minutes ago, maniac said:

You think playing against Starc and Rabada or Shami is the same as Shaheen and Musa?

 

At this point as we said it is very evident that Gill is the real deal obviously but let’s not jump the gun yet.

 

top of the order 1,2 and 3 Be It IPL gives plenty of idea about a young batsmen’s ability 

No but playing any bowler around 85-87 miles per hour like Shahren od Pak gives you enough indication that he can play at too level once given enough chance.

 

Kohli wasn’t facing Brett Lee in under 29 world cup. He was playing too bowlers of other countries at under 19 level and gradually he picked his game once he was given chance.

 

 

IPL doesn’t give any idea as far as 50 over game is concerned. The time for a batsman is too less and in particular for a you gster its harder to come out in 12th over and start scoring at 140rr from 2nd ball.

 

This is why it will never show what he is capable of doing in 50 overs. It will only improve his hitting ability and give him experience which will help him 2 seasons from now in his overall game.

 

 

 

[maniac]

Just now, Cricketics said:

No but playing any bowler around 85-87 miles per hour like Shahren od Pak gives you enough indication that he can play at too level once given enough chance.

 

Kohli wasn’t facing Brett Lee in under 29 world cup. He was playing too bowlers of other countries at under 19 level and gradually he picked his game once he was given chance.

 

 

IPL doesn’t give any idea as far as 50 over game is concerned. The time for a batsman is too less and in particular for a you gster its harder to come out in 12th over and start scoring at 140rr from 2nd ball.

 

This is why it will never show what he is capable of doing in 50 overs. It will only improve his hitting ability and give him experience which will help him 2 seasons from now in his overall game.

 

 

 

You are just going in circles...didn’t i say he was the real deal? 

 

But you cannot select someone directly based on u-19 performance.

 

I agree he needs to be fast tracked....I don’t believe in this bs of playing 2 full fc seasons etc but still need to see what he can do against international experienced bowlers be it IPL or A team. Where am I not being able to get through to you? 

[Cricketics]

5 minutes ago, maniac said:

You are just going in circles...didn’t i say he was the real deal? 

 

But you cannot select someone directly based on u-19 performance.

 

I agree he needs to be fast tracked....I don’t believe in this bs of playing 2 full fc seasons etc but still need to see what he can do against international experienced bowlers be it IPL or A team. Where am I not being able to get through to you? 

And you don’t want to accept and keep going in circles about how you want to see how he does in IPl when that has nothing to do how he will do in a 50 over format.

 

 

If he fils in IpL after battinf 3-4 times, then by your logic he should not be picked since he might not have impressed.

 

 

Come on, t20 IPL is a different beast and you can’t succeed in that. Some might but that doesn’t mean they will do well in 50 overs and some who fail there, might still do well in 50 overs.

 

 

Two different formats requiring massively two different mind set when playing.

 

 

 

[maniac]

1 minute ago, Cricketics said:

And you don’t want to accept and keep going in circles about how you want to see how he does in IPl when that has nothing to do how he will do in a 50 over format.

 

 

If he fils in IpL after battinf 3-4 times, then by your logic he should not be picked since he might not have impressed.

 

 

Come on, t20 IPL is a different beast and you can’t succeed in that. Some might but that doesn’t mean they will do well in 50 overs and some who fail there, might still do well in 50 overs.

 

 

Two different formats requiring massively two different mind set when playing.

 

 

 

I said IPL will give an “idea” how he can handle “international quality bowling” 

 

he is way above his peers absolutely. There is a difference between being fast tracked and already selecting him based on u-19 wc.

 

tell me this if Philander and Anderson who bowl 10ks slower than Pakistani kids would it be easier or more difficult to bat for the u-19 batsmen?

 

Again for the benefit if you missed my earlier points Samson,Pant,Kohli in debut season all showed they can hang with the big boys,I don’t see why Gill can’t...he doesn’t have to smash 100s in IPL,all he has to show is ability to

play international quality bowling.

 

For Odis he needs maybe 1 A tour or play against a visiting team.

 

He is the real deal  but he needs to show a little more....you think he deserves a slot above Samson,Pant etc based on u19 WC? 

 

He might be ready by then..got all the tools...but we need to see a little bit more.

[Cricketics]

5 minutes ago, maniac said:

 

He is the real deal  but he needs to show a little more....you think he deserves a slot above Samson,Pant etc based on u19 WC? 

 

Why not.

There is iyer waiting for Test matches too who is amassing runs but many want to see Shaw since he is young.

 

Similarly, if he is picked ahead of Samson, then not a big deal to me. He is younger than them and fast tracking such guy who is in the zone is no harm.

 

Ideally both Pant and Shubman should be in the team. But I won’t leave out Shubman just because Pant hasn’t been given chance. I am tempted to play him right away.

 

 

 

 

[Khota]

he needs to pay his dues. There is a huge learning curve for all of them.

[Vk1]

He scored 100 in 90 balls with just 7 fours. Michael Bevanesque batting in middle overs. Proper  odi batsman he is!!

[prudent_kreeda]

1 hour ago, Cricketics said:

He is better t20 player than nost in the world.

 

 

We are talking about 50 overs, and Gill can be the answer to the middle order query of India

 

50 minutes ago, maniac said:

I said IPL will give an “idea” how he can handle “international quality bowling” 

 

he is way above his peers absolutely. There is a difference between being fast tracked and already selecting him based on u-19 wc.

 

tell me this if Philander and Anderson who bowl 10ks slower than Pakistani kids would it be easier or more difficult to bat for the u-19 batsmen?

 

Again for the benefit if you missed my earlier points Samson,Pant,Kohli in debut season all showed they can hang with the big boys,I don’t see why Gill can’t...he doesn’t have to smash 100s in IPL,all he has to show is ability to

play international quality bowling.

 

For Odis he needs maybe 1 A tour or play against a visiting team.

 

He is the real deal  but he needs to show a little more....you think he deserves a slot above Samson,Pant etc based on u19 WC? 

 

He might be ready by then..got all the tools...but we need to see a little bit more.

    For 50 overs he the best bet at 4 . Just get him in at 4 . Period !

    He should not be included in T20 looking at his present game. 

    

    You do not need   

[BeautifulGame]

1 hour ago, maniac said:

 

Again for the benefit if you missed my earlier points Samson,Pant,Kohli in debut season all showed they can hang with the big boys,I don’t see why Gill can’t...he doesn’t have to smash 100s in IPL,all he has to show is ability to

play international quality bowling.

Kolhi was awful in his first IPL season actually.

[rkt.india]

1 hour ago, maniac said:

Talking about Unmukt’s batting style similar to Kohli in internationals...infact apples to apples Unmukt looked better at u19 level than Kohli but when it came to playing international level quality bowling  huge gulf in quality 

Even Kohli struggled early on but he worked hard and came back. He had quite a bad start in IPL and ODIs, got dropped, worked hard and came back. Unmukt didn't get pick immediately. Who knows if got picked, his progress was hastened.

[Cricketics]

3 minutes ago, sarchasm said:

Kohli earned his corn after 2 seasons of hard grind in Ranji. What is it about this club level 'world cup' that makes you guys ejaculate prematurely? I have witnessed similar sentiments for every new name on the block and they get a rude reality check in Ranji. Maybe if Gill were talented enough to own his opponents in domestics, much like Shaw and Pant, he will earn the hype. Right now, he's just bashed club level cricketers. That's not enough.

No one telling to bring Shubman to Test cricket. Its about bringing him to ODI’s.

 

If he faces English fast bowlers in England, it will only help him and might make him a better player and might make him settle down in English comditons earlier than expected by many.

 

Plus batting with Kohli in ODI’s will only help him learn and improve his game faster. Sometimes you got to give chance to a player in at least an ODI format instead of throwing them in just t20 format where its harder to start right away due to the crazy runrate requirements of the game.

 

 

 

 

[rkt.india]

8 minutes ago, sarchasm said:

Kohli earned his corn after 2 seasons of hard grind in Ranji. What is it about this club level 'world cup' that makes you guys ejaculate prematurely? I have witnessed similar sentiments for every new name on the block and they get a rude reality check in Ranji. Maybe if Gill were talented enough to own his opponents in domestics, much like Shaw and Pant, he will earn the hype. Right now, he's just bashed club level cricketers. That's not enough.

Gill has already started doing that in Ranji as he made his late debut this season due to an injury. 100 and a 50 in two FC games he played till now.

[Cricketics]

1 minute ago, sarchasm said:

Not test cricket, and not ODIs either. He simply has ZERO credentials aside from making forummers like you wet themselves - for now.

What makes you think all bowlers in our Ranji are all better than some of these under19 bowlers. Most of them might be but some of these opposition bowlers are pretty good. He scored against bowlers who were bowling in high 80s with pretty good line and length. Sometims you don’t find those in your home domestic cricket against good Ranji sides.

 

Even tailenders score runs to the domestic bowlers at times.

 

You can at times score plenty of runs like Mukund yet suck in international cricket until you are exposed to some tough international cricket.

 

Here is our chance to provide that opportunity to the best under 19 player. We must.

 

If he fails, who cares. Its fine, many players fail. If he succeeds, its good for Indian Cricket.

 

[maniac]

Just now, Cricketics said:

What makes you think all bowlers in our Ranji are all better than some of these under19 bowlers. Most of them might be but some of these opposition bowlers are pretty good. He scored against bowlers who were bowling in high 80s with pretty good line and length. Sometims you don’t find those in your home domestic cricket against good Ranji sides.

 

Even tailenders score runs to the domestic bowlers at times.

 

You can at times score plenty of runs like Mukund yet suck in international cricket until you are exposed to some tough international cricket.

 

Here is our chance to provide that opportunity to the best under 19 player. We must.

 

If he fails, who cares. Its fine, many players fail. If he succeeds, its good for Indian Cricket.

 

That is exactly the point what is the guarantee that this will translate into smacking Starc etc from day 1 in a odi game....he is the best among his peers no doubt, but atleast he needs to show some proof that he can play an actual international quality attack be it in an A game or dare I say again IPL....as I said IPL is not for his T20 or hitting abilities but his quality against international proven bowlers.

 

We just saw the overall quality of the pak and Bangladesh team, to make the transition he needs to prove one more step.

 

I don’t believe he needs to play 2-3 fc seasons...play him some a games,sample him in the IPL or pretty much anything that shows he can transition to the highest level.

 

You said Samson doesn’t deserve a chance over him based on what??? Samson has shown skills to play quality bowling so how did Gill

jump the pecking order...trust me 2-3 good

innings against good decent international attacks and absolutely can be fast tracked 

[Cricketics]

1 minute ago, maniac said:

 

You said Samson doesn’t deserve a chance over him based on what??? Samson has shown skills to play quality bowling so how did Gill

jump the pecking order...trust me 2-3 good

innings against good decent international attacks and absolutely can be fast tracked 

Don’t make up words. No one said Samson doesn’t deserve a chance. You asked if bee should be picked ahead of Samson who is deserving and I said why not. Doesn’t mean Samson doesn’t deserve a chance.

 

I said here is an opportunity to groom a youngster into an Indian line up for the future.

 

 

[maniac]

Just now, Cricketics said:

Don’t make up words. No one said Samson doesn’t deserve a chance. You asked if bee should be picked ahead of Samson who is deserving and I said why not. Doesn’t mean Samson doesn’t deserve a chance.

 

I said here is an opportunity to groom a youngster into an Indian line up for the future.

 

 

I agree with the grooming aspect lol and I already said he is a real deal,my issue is with people asking him to be the no.4 no.5 even before showing us anything if he can play actual quality bowling.

 

my bet would be he will do well but can’t predict anything....remember duckett, looked like a million bucks,scored even a 200 in list A against a touring pak side,scored 2 back to back 50s in Bangladesh vs Bangladesh which can be a little

challenging...had all shots looks to have a lot of

time to play his shots,looked the real deal but where is he now? 

 

He has  all the qualities absolutely....he is the one we should watch with excitement but not as to be part of the side “yet”...,keyword “yet”

[maniac]

@Cricketics we are on the same page..,incredible talent....infact I think I opened the thread same time as you...but to be picked for England he has to perform interim... -and interim we only have ipl and fc to judge him...FC won’t tell us a lot...the only time he will

olay international cricket is in the interim unless there is an A tour...that was my point....god forbid  if he flops in both? You still want him for England tour?

[Cricketics]

Just now, maniac said:

@Cricketics we are on the same page..,incredible talent....infact I think I opened the thread same time as you...but to be picked for England he has to perform interim... -and interim we only have ipl and fc to judge him...FC won’t tell us a lot...the only time he will

olay international cricket is in the interim unless there is an A tour...that was my point....god forbid  if he flops in both? You still want him for England tour?

He will most likely play in Vijay Hazare and will get few tons there or at least big scores.