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Shubman Gill is a World Cup 2019 prospect, should be picked for England tour

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1 minute ago, Cricketics said:

Pandya was seen as a hitter and hence he got into both ODI and t20 side, someone who could also bowl. 

 

Shubman clearly does not have such talent to hit big like Pandya. So IPl suits perfectly for Pandya as he can showcase his talent which he did earlier and India was looking for a finisher for both ODI’s and t20 and he was best person that time.

 

Shubman’s role will be for number 3, or number 4 most likely, the way he plays, the rotation game. 

4 batting slots are taken...1,2,3 and 6(Dhoni) so

roles are open at 4 and 5...even 5 is interchangeable with Dhoni so that leaves 4 or 6

 

You need to be multidimensional in that

role and hence players who are being tried there Rahane,Rahul,Pandey,Jadhav are all good at both FC level and maybe bar Jadhav have shown quick scoring skills in the IPL.

 

once again Gill has all the tools but he has to show case pressure skills and also maybe quick

scoring ability via IPL....like it or not IPL gives you the limelight.

 

Gill’s only advantage is he is young and has a huge upside but without even proving anything neither at IPL or FC he can’t jump way ahead of the pecking order....pretty sure FC has a lot of guys churning out runs at 4 and 5 and to move ahead of them he needs to score a lot of  runs there for starters and obviously because of his age he will standout just like Pant...to get quicker attention he would have to own it in the IPL...period like it or not IPL is a benchmark as the examples I have quoted.

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Playing Musa and Shaheen is not even in the same ball park as playing Anderson and Philander in a T20 game leave alone Starc and Rabada simple.

 

Gill needs to be fast tracked via decent performances in A tours and IPL....period.

 

This innings and tournament  has made him a hot prospect.,,,doesn’t get him a free ticket into the Indian side where a lof people have toiled for years to get in queue ...some move ahead of others because of being in the right place and grabbing opportunities be it IPL or a standout FC season.

Edited by maniac

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2 minutes ago, sarchasm said:

What makes me think? It's not my thought alone. Pretty much every cricketer who has played at this level has said just how much of a step up first class cricket is from U19 club level standard. Including Dravid. But aside from experiences of these former and current cricketers, we also have examples of U19 cricketers over the years who have struggled to hack it at first class level. Someone as talented as KL Rahul, who's 10 times the batsman Gill at this age, took his time to find his bearings in Ranji.

 

 

No this is not how it works today. If you are good or look special you sbould be fast tracked, be it a bowler or a batsman.  People like you will send bowler like Nagarkoti or Mavi play in FC cricket for next 3-4 years while Ishant Sharma gets picked in ODI side to fk us up over and over again.

 

Many won’t learn much while if given a chance at top level, they can succeed.

 

Ever watched grandslam Tennis tournament? Ever heard of wild cards? 17-18 year old straight from high school, or challenger level college player gets thrown into first round being a US or Australian born playing home slam, after they had lost to 600th ranked player. What happens next?  We see this same player beating top 100 level player in first round of a grandslam.

 

Moral of the story - After grinding out all year in in challenger level and losing to 600th to 800th ranked players, the guy suddenly becomes grandslam contender in matter of momths. Why? Because some players change their game and learn fast as they play against top players. 

 

The above is story about Nick Kyrgios or many such players in mens tennis today. 

 

 

Indian sportsmen habe lacked and stayed behind in many sports like Tennis because we do not have such wildcard system in most of our sports to promote our youngsters as we do not host many such events. 

 

Cricket is the only sport we are dominant in, and giving wildcards to the brightest in Cricket in our country is not wrong. Many of them can turn out special. 

 

 

 

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Just now, Cricketics said:

 

No this is not how it works today. If you are good or look special you sbould be fast tracked, be it a bowler or a batsman.  People like you will send bowler like Nagarkoti or Mavi play in FC cricket for next 3-4 years while Ishant Sharma gets picked in ODI side to fk us up over and over again.

 

Many won’t learn much while if given a chance at top level, they can succeed.

 

Ever watched grandslam Tennis tournament? Ever heard of wild cards? 17-18 year old straight from high school, or challenger level college player gets thrown into first round being a US or Australian born playing home slam, after they had lost to 600th ranked player. What happens next?  We see this same player beating top 100 level player in first round of a grandslam.

 

Moral of the story - After grinding out all year in in challenger level and losing to 600th to 800th ranked players, the guy suddenly becomes grandslam contender in matter of momths. Why? Because some players change their game and learn fast as they play against top players. 

 

The above is story about Nick Kyrgios or many such players in mens tennis today. 

 

 

Indian sportsmen habe lacked and stayed behind in many sports like Tennis because we do not have such wildcard system in most of our sports to promote our youngsters as we do not host many such events. 

 

Cricket is the only sport we are dominant in, and giving wildcards to the brightest in Cricket in our country is not wrong. Many of them can turn out special. 

 

 

 

So wild card only for Gill? There are plenty of wildcards that can be thrown into the side lol.

 

People were asking for Pant because he did well in U19,FC and IPL-checked 3 boxes

 

 H.Pandya- because we needed a fastbowling allrounder and he did well on A tours and IPl

 

K.Pandya and Sundar- because we need a batting allounder/ spinner and they did well in IPL.

 

Gill has only done well in U19 WC and has a good start to FC career but as I said he has a lot of eye balls on him now but not yet the next level where they can take a punt on him....you are getting confused between the word “fast track”

someone into the scheme of things  or give someone the “India Cap”

right away.  Gill has earned a lot more  “opportunities” to prove himself not the “opportunity” to start representing the country yet.

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@Cricketics based on your “wild card” theory who should get a shot first K.Pandya as we need a lower order hitting allrounder as shown in IPL?

 

Vijay Shankar good batsman+allrounder with good FC records and can bat at 5 if needed and did well in IPL.

 

or Shubman Gill based on u-19 performance?

 

Mavi and Nagarkoti 2 young u-19s hitting 145ks

 

which one should get their turn first? You can’t play all rookies at once right?

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27 minutes ago, maniac said:

@Cricketics based on your “wild card” theory who should get a shot first K.Pandya as we need a lower order hitting allrounder as shown in IPL?

 

Vijay Shankar good batsman+allrounder with good FC records and can bat at 5 if needed and did well in IPL.

 

or Shubman Gill based on u-19 performance?

 

Mavi and Nagarkoti 2 young u-19s hitting 145ks

 

which one should get their turn first? You can’t play all rookies at once right? 

 

Changes I would make to Indian odi team for next series when playing those BS series in Lanka would be to rest Kohli and drop Rahane, Karthik, Axar and bring Rahul, Nitish, Krunal and Shubman. I basically will use Krunal or Nitish instead of Axar in the team.

 

pant comes for Dhawan as opener.  In t20, he comes in for Dhoni ans still used as opener.

 

I will pick Vijay Shankar for test tour to England.

 

I would also rest Shami And Bhuvi for Saini and either of Nagarkoti or Mavi in the LAnka series.

 

Give chances and rotate players around from series to series. 

 

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I would fast track him, Shaw, Mavi and Nagarkotti to the india-A team. Whoever shows promise can be brought to the Indian team. They will get a chance to compete with someone like Vijay Shankar or Saini then we'll know who's better and pick them to the Indian team based on the format of course.

Edited by The Dark Horse

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Once the word is out that if you play well in the u19 WC then you get a red carpet welcome into the national team even without any first class experience, then there will be tremendous corruption during the team selections in the subsequent u19 WC tournaments. 

 

Everyone will look at it as the equivalent to royal fast track road into the Indian team. 

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17 minutes ago, saik said:

Shubman if picked can fit into the no.4 slot.But there is already a big fight for that spot from Dk,Iyer,Manish and Rahane. He won't be picked unless these players fail.

 

Ultimately, he will be a more dependable No.4 than these four, if he can maintain his focus.  His potential ceiling in ODIs is higher than these guys too.

Edited by express bowling

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39 minutes ago, saik said:

Shubman if picked can fit into the no.4 slot.But there is already a big fight for that spot from Dk,Iyer,Manish and Rahane. He won't be picked unless these players fail.

These two guys along with kedar are not meant for odi cricket and are substandard to build a powerful odi side.

 

Guys like iyer hooda gill pant needs to be tried...not much of time left before wc.

 

Kohli also played at no 4 in wc11 around very experienced batting line up. And he was just 1.5 yr old in international cricket.

 

Cant gill re-emulate that ? Or may be pant

 

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3 minutes ago, SUMO said:

These two guys along with kedar are not meant for odi cricket and are substandard to build a powerful odi side.

 

Guys like iyer hooda gill pant needs to be tried...not much of time left before wc.

 

Kohli also played at no 4 in wc11 around very experienced batting line up. And he was just 1.5 yr old in international cricket.

 

Cant gill re-emulate that ? Or may be pant

 

The SA ODI series should clear out the really substandard players

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11 hours ago, Cricketics said:

Shubman Gill must be picked for the ODI series in England which will be take placr right before the 5 match test series.

This guy is special and can be fast tracked.

You never know, he might be playing 2019 world cup in the same country where he makes his debut if picked.

Everyone has seen enough of him now in this tournament and its time to take this big call.

Fasttrack Gill
 

Not surprised to see such a thread on ICF. Bit surprised a bit by who started it. 

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27 minutes ago, sandeep said:

Not surprised to see such a thread on ICF. Bit surprised a bit by who started it. 

The calmness under pressur he is showing in the game deserves attention. Nonone asking him to be deafted for Test in England, but ODI’s he can be tried. We have seen many young players around the world given chance.

 

This guy played everything down the ground in last two games until the last few overs.

 

He is special. Too mature for his age.

 

 

 

 

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1 minute ago, Cricketics said:

The calmness under pressur he is showing in the game deserves attention. Nonone asking him to be deafted for Test in England, but ODI’s he can be tried. We have seen many young players around the world given chance.

 

This guy played everything down the ground in last two games until the last few overs.

 

He is special. Too mature for his age.

 

 

 

 

Never hype batsmen. But i can see this guy is special. Risk free shots like Kohli. Touch of arrogance, confidence with his pull shots.  Picks the length so quickly.  Not like Indian line up is loaded with indispensable players. Pandya made his debut at 21 right?

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People really are getting carried away.

Quality player, but there's a jump from age group cricket to domestic cricket. Then from domestic cricket to A tours. Then A tours to International.

Give the lad some time to properly polish himself off as a batsman

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1 minute ago, Sachinism said:

People really are getting carried away.

Quality player, but there's a jump from age group cricket to domestic cricket. Then from domestic cricket to A tours. Then A tours to International.

Give the lad some time to properly polish himself off as a batsman

By that time it happens he will be around 23. In my view it is too late. 

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9 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

By that time it happens he will be around 23. In my view it is too late. 

The other side is you get him in too early and spoil him.

There's still aspects of his game that need working on. Him playing domestic cricket for 2 years isn't doing to hamper his career.

Players like Chand, Zol, Bawne, Sarfaraz have all kinda fallen by the sidelines. I just don't think the step up is as straight forward as people are making it seem

 

Edited by Sachinism

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Just now, Sachinism said:

The other side is you get him in too early and spoil him.

There's still aspects of his game that need working on. Him playing domestic cricket for 2 years isn't doing to hamper his career.

 

Not everyone will go that way.  We should not have one thumb rule and apply to all players. We may regret it. He can be part of a Test team. He bats at 3 right. He will keep  Pujara on his heels. India doesn't have a back up for no.3 now. If Pujara completely goes off the boil we have to force someone to bat at 3.

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24 minutes ago, Cricketics said:

The calmness under pressur he is showing in the game deserves attention. Nonone asking him to be deafted for Test in England, but ODI’s he can be tried. We have seen many young players around the world given chance.

 

This guy played everything down the ground in last two games until the last few overs.

 

He is special. Too mature for his age.

 

 

 

 

Indian debut caps aren't given out just like that.  Its driven based on vacancies in the team and specific role-player needs.   Why shouldn't a Shreyas Iyer get an extended run, which he has earned by putting in years of hard yards at the domestic level and proven performances at the A tour level?  Gill doesn't even turn his arm over - you could have an argument if he was a Krunal Pandya type player, which the current ODI XI needs at the moment.   

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23 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

Never hype batsmen. But i can see this guy is special. Risk free shots like Kohli. Touch of arrogance, confidence with his pull shots.  Picks the length so quickly.  Not like Indian line up is loaded with indispensable players. Pandya made his debut at 21 right?

Its not about hypinng. I never bought Shaw hype or many other past under 19 players like Arman Jaffer etc. But in the last 11 years of this ICF history I have only said twice that an India under 19 guy must be fast tracked to the Indian team - Kohli and now Shubman.

Never said the same about Vijay Zol, Jaffer  or Unmukt etc, because they looked good but unlike Kohli or Shubman. 

 

I have been following him and many under 19 players from over a year through instagram and stuff and have posted clips of many under 19 players on ICF through throuh under 19 journey. Gill has always been the stand out for me along with the bowler Chahar who did not get picked for Under 19 world cup but played for Rajasthan’s state recently.

 

 

 

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4 minutes ago, sandeep said:

Indian debut caps aren't given out just like that.  Its driven based on vacancies in the team and specific role-player needs.   Why shouldn't a Shreyas Iyer get an extended run, which he has earned by putting in years of hard yards at the domestic level and proven performances at the A tour level?  Gill doesn't even turn his arm over - you could have an argument if he was a Krunal Pandya type player, which the current ODI XI needs at the moment.   

Agree there should be a merit but at times there could be exception for a player or two. It doesn’t happen every tournament. Once in 4-5 years there is no harm in throwing a wildcard. Read my post above where I quoted vvslaxman just now.

 

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11 minutes ago, Cricketics said:

Its not about hypinng. I never bought Shaw hype or many other past under 19 players like Arman Jaffer etc. But in the last 11 years of this ICF history I have only said twice that an India under 19 guy must be fast tracked to the Indian team - Kohli and now Shubman.

Never said the same about Vijay Zol, Jaffer  or Unmukt etc, because they looked good but unlike Kohli or Shubman. 

 

I have been following him and many under 19 players from over a year through instagram and stuff and have posted clips of many under 19 players on ICF through throuh under 19 journey. Gill has always been the stand out for me along with the bowler Chahar who did not get picked for Under 19 world cup but played for Rajasthan’s state recently.

 

 

 

 

" #ShubmanGill is the most dedicated boy I've seen in my coaching career," Rahul Dravid  We are not alone. You play 500 balls when you are 3? That is dedication. Same way Kohli saving his team when his father was dead was an indication of his dedication. 

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8 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

 

" #ShubmanGill is the most dedicated boy I've seen in my coaching career," Rahul Dravid  We are not alone. You play 500 balls when you are 3? That is dedication. Same way Kohli saving his team when his father was dead was an indication of his dedication. 

i dont believe this 500 balls at 3. how can one play 500 balls at 3 years of age?

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1 minute ago, rkt.india said:

i dont believe this 500 balls at 3. how can one play 500 balls at 3 years of age?

I am not sure. Interview by his father said that. So we have to go back in time and validate his claim :)  Even if it is 100 balls. i would say this guy was into cricket way early. He is almost like a veteran at this age.   You could see that in all the games he played. 

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10 hours ago, sarchasm said:

Yes, now let's see if he can carry on like that for 2 seasons at the VERY least. Then he'd have earned the right to be in conversation.

He was already picked for Indian A side ....but since, he was injured he couldn't play it....

It's rarely happens in Indian cricket that you play only 2 ranji matches and you are picked for A side...

Looks like selectors think he is special...

 

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31 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

 

" #ShubmanGill is the most dedicated boy I've seen in my coaching career," Rahul Dravid  We are not alone. You play 500 balls when you are 3? That is dedication. Same way Kohli saving his team when his father was dead was an indication of his dedication. 

While there will be lot of other fake stuff which will come out that he used to play 400 balls etc or used to run around Punjab at 4 years age, it should be all ignored and what should be more focus is how good a player he looks when playing FC cricket or any cricket for that matter.

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12 minutes ago, gakgupta said:

He was already picked for Indian A side ....but since, he was injured he couldn't play it....

It's rarely happens in Indian cricket that you play only 2 ranji matches and you are picked for A side...

Looks like selectors think he is special...

 

Good. We should not be so rigid like English cricketers. Even they blood youngsters these days. India's top players made their debut at the age of 21 or before. Sunny 21. Patudi was captain at 21. Kapil 21. Dravid 22 Laxman 21 Ganguly 20 Tendulkar 16. Why are we so resistant to the idea of pushing a 19 year old that too in this era.

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1 minute ago, express bowling said:

There is a tri-series coming up against SL and Bangladesh 

 

Their bowling attack is no better than many of our state teams.

 

Gill needs to play domestic cricket and this tri-series would give him similar experience.

 

Can be tried in this tri-series as a No.4.

Yes,agreed.

 

Being fastbtracked means lot more opportunities should open up  for you to get into the national side....eg,more A tours,series against weak oppositions, more opportunities to showcase in the IPL like opening the innings etc 

 

doesnt mean he should directly be on the England tour as some are suggesting :laugh:

 

The plan should be to give all these opportunities to aim for atleast 2019 WC,will he grab this or not is totally on him....if he is not given these opportunities than the admins and selectors should be punished severely 

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7 minutes ago, maniac said:

Yes,agreed.

 

Being fastbtracked means lot more opportunities should open up  for you to get into the national side....eg,more A tours,series against weak oppositions, more opportunities to showcase in the IPL like opening the innings etc 

 

doesnt mean he should directly be on the England tour as some are suggesting :laugh:

 

The plan should be to give all these opportunities to aim for atleast 2019 WC,will he grab this or not is totally on him....if he is not given these opportunities than the admins and selectors should be punished severely 

But our seniors should make way. lol They don't take rest against SL, WI .  Guys like Pandey, Jadhav should step up their game. Or else people are waiting to take their place.

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1 minute ago, vvvslaxman said:

But our seniors should make way. lol They don't take rest against SL, WI .  Guys like Pandey, Jadhav should step up their game. Or else people are waiting to take their place.

Had he said Kuldeep over Ashwin and Jadeja in Aus would have made more sense :laugh:

 

on dry surfaces with variable bounce guys like Jadeja with their accuracy night out bowl the conventional spinners like Lyon and Ashwin....had he made that case that would make more sense...he lost me when he said Jadejas batting and bowling over Ashwin in Australia.

 

yes I might go with Kuldeep over Ashwin in Australia 

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21 minutes ago, express bowling said:

There is a tri-series coming up against SL and Bangladesh 

 

Their bowling attack is no better than many of our state teams.

 

Gill needs to play domestic cricket and this tri-series would give him similar experience.

 

Can be tried in this tri-series as a No.4.

And what should Shreyas Iyer do?  Maybe make some Vadaa Pao and serve it to Mr. Next of Indian cricket. 

 

 

Sorry to be a bit harsh, but expected better from a poster like you buddy. 

Edited by sandeep

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Just now, sandeep said:

And what should Shreyas Iyer do?  Maybe make some Vadaa Pao and serve it to Mr. Next of Indian cricket.   

Why can’t both play against weak teams???....I will say it with a heavy heart I don’t want to see another easy 200 for the taking from Rohit against Bang-Srl, Dhoni’s finishing ability,Kohli master class or Dhawans attacking knocks against those teams.

 

try all youngsters against them

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6 minutes ago, sandeep said:

And what should Shreyas Iyer do?  Maybe make some Vadaa Pao and serve it to Mr. Next of Indian cricket. 

 

 

Sorry to be a bit harsh, but expected better from a poster like you buddy. 

 

I don't see the purpose of Kohli playing against weak Bangladesh and SL.    All format players like Kohli, Bumrah, Bhuvi and Pandya need to be rested against weak teams.

 

Iyer should bat at 3.

 

Don't be so emotional about mundane things.

 

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12 minutes ago, maniac said:

Why can’t both play against weak teams???....I will say it with a heavy heart I don’t want to see another easy 200 for the taking from Rohit against Bang-Srl, Dhoni’s finishing ability,Kohli master class or Dhawans attacking knocks against those teams.

 

try all youngsters against them

 

A senior captain is needed ... so Rohit should play.

 

6 or 7 youngsters can be tried ... that would be a good mix.

 

 

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