Dhoni should bat at number 4 or not be played

[Cricketics]

1 minute ago, putrevus said:

Do you think Dhoni has in him to repair innings at 20/2 when facing new ball in first 5 overs.Dhoni even in his prime never had  that skill.

 

To bat at no 4 you need a very special player who has ability to repair the innings if needed or provide impetus to great start.

 

Dhoni like Sachin is hanging on too long he might be still a good wicket keeper to spinners but he is total liability in chasing big scores or on flat wickets.

 

They need to blood a youngster and give him a chance so he has some experience before world cup but selectors are proving to be morons.

 

I don't blame Iyer he may or maynot be good but you cannot write him off based on one series or one match.

Yes, Dhoni has it in him and hence he keeps scorig 30-40s. His strike rate is not great to be a t20 star or finisher in 50 overs but still good for number 4 player.

 

Frankly, we need someone who can stay. You don’t wsnt two new players batting in 35-40th over. Its hard for them to rebuild and this how collapse start. 

 

Dhoni/Kohli usually make sure either of them stay till the end or close to end, which will help the team reach big scores.

 

He can score runs as he is still scoring but the moment you ask him accelerate from ball 1, he won’t be able to do that since thats not his strength.

 

Dhoni at 4 is perfect for world cup since we have made up our mind that Pandya is long term and we will need good middle order plyers to ensure we don’t have collapse since we will be carruing passengers like Pandya down the order.

 

[Cricketics]

4 minutes ago, TNAmarkFromIndia said:

He doesn't play run a ball at No. 4. He plays at a run every 2 balls. Then he more often than not doesn't play a long innings at the top order and in the process achieves nothing except for killing the momentum of the team.

 

He's better off in the lower middle order.

Kohli doesn’t score at 100 strike rate too but picks it up after batting 20-30 balls. Dhoni will do the same.

 

Howver, if Dhoni comes late, his game isn’t that great to pick his strike rate up late in the innings and most likely he will get out 14 of17 balls caught on the boundary. Hence the earlier he bats, the better or he shouldn’t be picked.

[maniac]

Just now, rkt.india said:

Our problem isn't Dhoni or even Pandya but 4 and 5. They are bigger worries. Until we get these spots with good batsmen, we will always struggle in these situations like today. It's not easy to just come in starting hitting.

Why isn’t Pandya a problem...his bowling is not good enough to give you 10 overs regularly and his batting is not reliable enough in crunch situations....:so the only expectations  from him is to hope his slogs will come off once in a while at the death?

[rkt.india]

4 minutes ago, Cricketics said:

Yes, Dhoni has it in him and hence he keeps scorig 30-40s. His strike rate is not great to be a t20 star or finisher in 50 overs but still good for number 4 player.

 

Frankly, we need someone who can stay. You don’t wsnt two new players batting in 35-40th over. Its hard for them to rebuild and this how collapse start. 

 

Dhoni/Kohli usually make sure either of them stay till the end or close to end, which will help the team reach big scores.

 

He can score runs as he is still scoring but the moment you ask him accelerate from ball 1, he won’t be able to do that since thats not his strength.

 

Dhoni at 4 is perfect for world cup since we have made up our mind that Pandya is long term and we will need good middle order plyers to ensure we don’t have collapse since we will be carruing passengers like Pandya down the order.

 

Scoring 30-40 doesn't mean anything. Even tendulkar 50s when he retired. But our problem is We have not let anyone settled at 4,5. Only top 3 regularly plays at their numbers. Rest all have not batted at one particular position for long. 

[Cricketics]

11 minutes ago, maniac said:

Let me try to answer that by not catching the Rohit  bait

 

while I did agree above with you based on the current options available Dhoni is fine for the kind of situations you mentioned but that is due to lack of other options pretty much.

 

Iyer can be groomed in that spot or atleast given an extended run or even Rahul or even someone else.

 

My question to you is why should we be flexible to accommodate to a strengths of a player, shouldn’t it be the other way around to play the best player for each position? 

 

 

Because Dhoni is most likely to play thr world cup and in ODI’s every player batting in middle order around number 4 or 5 often has played at different positions. Its not same as bringing an opener to the middle order. Not too much changed are required. 

[Tattieboy]

27 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

How about batting at 8 or 9?

How about 12?

[putrevus]

Just now, Cricketics said:

Yes, Dhoni has it in him and hence he keeps scorig 30-40s. His strike rate is not great to be a t20 star or finisher in 50 overs but still good for number 4 player.

 

Frankly, we need someone who can stay. You don’t wsnt two new players batting in 35-40th over. Its hard for them to rebuild and this how collapse start. 

 

Dhoni/Kohli usually make sure either of them stay till the end or close to end, which will help the team reach big scores.

 

He can score runs as he is still scoring but the moment you ask him accelerate from ball 1, he won’t be able to do that since thats not his strength.

 

Dhoni at 4 is perfect for world cup since we have made up our mind that Pandya is long term and we will need good middle order plyers to ensure we don’t have collapse since we will be carruing passengers like Pandya down the order.

 

I disagree , there is reason why Dhoni was never slotted at no 4,he simply does not have technique to handle no4, other than being pinch hitter early in his career, he has rarely batted at no 4, I also thought he was good no 4 for last world cup but not now.

 

Now a days he kills the momentum due to his inability to rotate strike and we have greatest rotator of strike at no3, he will ruin Kohli's momentum.

[rkt.india]

3 minutes ago, maniac said:

Why isn’t Pandya a problem...his bowling is not good enough to give you 10 overs regularly and his batting is not reliable enough in crunch situations....:so the only expectations  from him is to hope his slogs will come off once in a while at the death?

No batsman can be reliable at 7 or consistently deliver in slog overs. Regarding bowling, how many batting alrounder can give ten overs? Stokes has an ER of 6+, bowling average of 38

[Cricketics]

1 minute ago, rkt.india said:

Scoring 30-40 doesn't mean anything. Even tendulkar 50s when he retired. But our problem is We have not let anyone settled at 4,5. Only top 3 regularly plays at their numbers. Rest all have not batted at one particular position for long. 

Rahul could have gotten chance but he got injured and when he was available, Rahane and co got chances wjo actually scored.

 

So management can’t always be blamed.

Rahane had like 7-8 fiftis in in 11 innings recently.

 

Its time to just tive the slot to someone for log. Be it Rahul or Dhoni, but someone should get a long run.

[Yoda-esque]

He shouldnt play anymore

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk

[maniac]

Just now, Cricketics said:

Because Dhoni is most likely to play thr world cup and in ODI’s every player batting in middle order around number 4 or 5 often has played at different positions. Its not same as bringing an opener to the middle order. Not too much changed are required. 

Iyer and Rahul are in the scheme of things already...wouldn’t be easy to give them an extended run at 4? And then bring in someone like Pant and hope he fulfills the role as a lower order hitter that Dhoni is failing at?

 

Why should Dhoni screw the chance of a young batsmen as well like he is screwing a young keeper?

 

Having said that if this is the Same team that is send to WC 2019, then yes Dhoni at 4 is the andhon mein kaana raja option.

[rkt.india]

1 minute ago, Cricketics said:

Rahul could have gotten chance but he got injured and when he was available, Rahane and co got chances wjo actually scored.

 

So management can’t always be blamed.

Rahane had like 7-8 fiftis in in 11 innings recently.

 

Its time to just tive the slot to someone for log. Be it Rahul or Dhoni, but someone should get a long run.

Rahul got dropped after just 3 games at 4. He wasn't injured. They were not patient with him.

[bihutoli]

I would also lean towards the should not be played option

[jalebi_bhai]

Both Rahane and Iyer are top order batsmen in LOIs. Playing them in the middle order is akin to trying to fit square pegs in round holes. Neither are very good at rotating strike which is a basic skill you need at numbers 4 and 5. Even Dhoni isn't very good at rotating strike anymore. Pandya is hit or miss. Very underwhelming.

[prasen82]

4 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

Our problem isn't Dhoni or even Pandya but 4 and 5. They are bigger worries. Until we get these spots with good batsmen, we will always struggle in these situations like today. It's not easy to just come in starting hitting.

Agree to this . We need a 5 and 6 batsman who can bat at around 120 strike rate. We need pandya because he is a freak . You never know when you need the freaky innings and i dont think any team has a number 7 allrounder who is great . Point in comparison Morris. So we might need to give pandya as much exposure as we can unless we feel we have a better freak player than him.in retrospect I feel even krunal or Vijay might struggle now. We should have been in experimentation a year back . Now is too late.

 

For 5,6 my gut says choose between shubman, rahul, iyer and raina . Prolly raina needs to come now . I wouldn't be surprised if raina is not in scheme of things in next series. 

 

 

[maniac]

2 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

No batsman can be reliable at 7 or consistently deliver in slog overs. Regarding bowling, how many batting alrounder can give ten overs? Stokes has an ER of 6+, bowling average of 38

There is nothing called a specialist 7 batsman position....if you are batting at 7 means you are a bowling allrounder

 

Stokes bats at 5 and 4 even and is relied upon in crunch situations to score big.

[TNAmarkFromIndia]

7 minutes ago, Cricketics said:

Kohli doesn’t score at 100 strike rate too but picks it up after batting 20-30 balls. Dhoni will do the same.

I don't think you've seen Dhoni play at No. 4. He is vastly different from Kohli who keeps the scoreboard ticking early on. Dhoni neither runs the ones and twos nor scores boundaries. It is already bad enough lower down the order but when he bats at 4 he takes even more of his own sweet time.

[rkt.india]

1 minute ago, jalebi_bhai said:

Both Rahane and Iyer are top order batsmen in LOIs. Playing them in the middle order is akin to trying to fit square pegs in round holes. Neither are very good at rotating strike which is a basic skill you need at numbers 4 and 5. Even Dhoni isn't very good at rotating strike anymore. Pandya is hit or miss. Very underwhelming.

Pandya should be given the chance at 5 for a considerable period and not just odd game. Iyer is no #5. Can bring krunal at 7.

[rkt.india]

2 minutes ago, maniac said:

There is nothing called a specialist 7 batsman position....if you are batting at 7 means you are a bowling allrounder

 

Stokes bats at 5 and 4 even and is relied upon in crunch situations to score big.

But stokes too hasn't done anything great despite batting at top 5. #7 will always be hot and miss. Even Pandya's good knocks came in when he batted up or he got to play more overs after a collapse.

[Cricketics]

4 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

SRahul got dropped after just 3 games at 4. He wasn't injured. They were not patient with him.

 

Yes they could have shown patience with him but many players get dropped like that

 

Sometimes series results are on the line and captain has to try different things.

 

Just look at now, people want Iyer dropped even though he hasn’t had proper chances, probably way less than Rahul.

 

Of course Rahul is a better player but you see how impatient people are actually. They are the ones who demand too many changes afterfew failures and then thy crib about not giving long runs to a player.