Poor squad and team selections have cost us the ODI series in England

[express bowling]

1 )  Choosing too many short medium-fast bowlers and probably instructing the lone fast bowler to bowl at a reduced pace  --

I had pointed it out repeatedly ...  too many short medium pacers don't work in international cricket. Most teams use one medium-paced swing bowler these days ... but too many do not work.

Our pace attack looked very ordinary.  Not a single specialist bowler chosen who can hit the deck hard and get bounce and seam movement. No variety at all.  I found this fact amazing.


2 )  Choosing Raina for his ability to bowl 2 or 3  overs per match  --  

He has not been chosen in ODIs for a long time because his current ability / form is not good for this format.  To choose him as a batsman because we need a 6th bowler is again poor logic.


3 )  Dhoni --

He is the super duper star who apparently can't be dropped based on non-cricketing reasons. But he is losing his hitting power day by day along with his confidence to try hitting big shots.  But still hanging on to his spot despite a very low SR for a finisher, of only 84,  in the last 3 years.

He batted long in both the 2nd and 3rd ODIs  but managed pathetic strike rates of 63 in both the matches



4 )  Not allowing Rahul to settle down at No.4 and dropping him arbitrarily  --  

I beleive this guy has the game to solve a part of our middle-order problems.  A fabulous hitter who can hit the big shots with ease against both pacers and spinners.  But is also a classical batsmen who does not have to slog to achieve the aforesaid.

 

 

5 )  Playing an unfit Bhuvi in the last ODI --

 

 

P.S --  a )   Rahane, Rayudu and Pandey are our back-up middle order batters in ODIs according to our batting coach, Bangar.  So, future selection faux pas are already planned.    


b )   Rohit's slow, often super slow,  starts is also a big problem but this topic is about selection issues ... and he has not come to the stage where he merits dropping.
 

Edited July 18, 2018 by express bowling

[sensible-indian]

Who could be our pace attack? 

 

Bhuvi, Bumrah and Pandya look so weak. 

 

Bumrah is solid but the other two are serious hit or miss. Bhuvi may be playing with injury this series but he is so unidimensional in general. 

 

What would be your pace attack keeping the team balance in mind? 

 

Pandya be included or we go back to 5 proper bowlers? 

Edited July 17, 2018 by sensible-indian

[express bowling]

10 minutes ago, sensible-indian said:

Who could be our pace attack? 

 

Bhuvi, Bumrah and Pandya look so weak. 

 

Bumrah is solid but the other two are serious hit or miss. Bhuvi may be playing with injury this series but he is so unidimensional in general. 

 

What would be your pace attack keeping the team balance in mind? 

 

Pandya be included or we go back to 5 proper bowlers? 

 

Ideally, I would try the group below as specialist pacers in ODIs.

 

Bumrah, Bhuvi, Shami, Rajpoot, Khaleel and Prasidh.  (  But Shami's fitness to play ODIs regularly in not known. )

 

Rotate the group with so many matches going on.

 

We would like to find a partner for Bumrah who has the potential to take wickets upfront  as well as bowl at the death while maintaining decent ER   ...  One of Rajpoot, Khaleel or Prasidh may provide the answer.   

 

 

Edited July 17, 2018 by express bowling

[Ankit_sharma03]

11 minutes ago, express bowling said:

2 )  Choosing Raina for his ability to bowl 2 or 3  overs per match  --  

He has not been chosen in ODIs for a long time because his current ability / form is not good for this format.  To choose him as a batsman because we need a 6th bowler is again poor logic.
 

This is what most ppl are not getting, how our selectors n team mngmt think that why they get shocked time n again with selection

They are safe n fattu so they look for experienced player...coz they feel safe

Had Zak not been retired even he wud have come back for left arm variety 

 

Raina was selected for being experienced 1st and then they start to themselves he can field n bowl to.............he didnt bowl much from 2015 Wc....not been used in IPL . All of sudden he is a 6th bowling option for our selectors n team mnmgt

 

Unhe exp player chahiye logic apne aap dhundh lenge. 

The original players was also someone experienced like Raydu.........uske case men kaha tha 6th bowling option

 

Their criteria is just experience fir wo tried n tested failure hi kyun na ho

[sensible-indian]

1 minute ago, express bowling said:

 

Ideally, I would try the group below as specialist pacers in ODIs.

 

Bumrah, Bhuvi, Shami, Rajpoot, Khaleel and Prasidh.  (  But Shami's fitness to play ODIs regularly in not known. )

 

Rotate the group with so many matches going on.

 

We would like to find a partner for Bumrah who has the potential to take wickets upfront  as well as bowl at the death while maintaining decent ER   ...  One of Rajpoot, Khaleel or Prasidh may provide the answer.   

 

 

Does Prasidh or Khaleel hav any domestic performance? 

 

Rajpoot can be great upfront but needs to work on his death bowling. I really love watching him bowl. 

[Ankit_sharma03]

17 minutes ago, sensible-indian said:

Who could be our pace attack? 

Ill Look at

Bhuvi, bumrah , shami are main 3

Rajpoot the 4th one 

5th a left armer among - Sran, khaleel , Kulwant ( sran n khaleel are lil more polished at this time)

 

Umesh n shardul will come after them in pecking order 

 

But this wud be my pool 

 

About- Mavi, prasidh , nagarkotti - i wud love to fast track a fast bowler but LOI conditions have become to batting freindly specially in england ....so a lil bit of experience n polished skills is also important specially in WC under pressure

Edited July 17, 2018 by Ankit_sharma03

[Ankit_sharma03]

1 minute ago, sensible-indian said:

Does Prasidh or Khaleel hav any domestic performance? 

 

Rajpoot can be great upfront but needs to work on his death bowling. I really love watching him bowl. 

1-2 seasons ago i saw rajpoot in IPL game , what impressed me about him was when he was going for runs ...he still didnt look panicked n looked to have plan. Such bowlers have the right atitude for LOI . Also he looks someone who could put on lid on scoring and keep chipping away with wickets in middle 

[express bowling]

4 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

 

Their criteria is just experience fir wo tried n tested failure hi kyun na ho

 

 

Sad but true.

[express bowling]

10 minutes ago, sensible-indian said:

Does Prasidh or Khaleel hav any doestic performance? 

 

Yes, they do.

 

Both did very well in this year's 50-over Vijay Hazare Trophy.  Khaleel performed really well in the 20 over SMA Trophy too.

 

This lead to the both of them being picked for our 50-over A team touring England a few days back.  Khaleel was a top performer there too. Prasidh impressed in the IPL.

 

Both are tall quick bowlers with death bowling skills.  Prasidh is good upfront too with ability to swing the ball ... whereas Khaleel is better at the death while providing a left-arm option.

 

 

Quote

Rajpoot can be great upfront but needs to work on his death bowling. I really love watching him bowl. 

 

Rajpoot's death bowling has been good for over 15 months now. 

Edited July 17, 2018 by express bowling

[sensible-indian]

7 minutes ago, express bowling said:

 

Yes, they do.

 

Both did very well in this year's 50-over Vijay Hazare Trophy.  Khaleel performed really well in the 20 over SMA Trophy too.

 

This lead to the both of them being picked for our 50-over A team touring England a few days back.  Khaleel was a top performer there too. Prasidh impressed in the IPL.

 

Both are tall quick bowlers with death bowling skills.  Prasidh is good upfront too with ability to swing the ball ... whereas Khaleel is better at the death while providing a left-arm option.

 

 

 

Rajpoot's death bowling has been good for over 15 months now. 

Thanks for the detailed post.

 

Reg Rajpoot.... Really? In ipl, he looked like fish out of water and was banging it in most of the times at the death. 

 

 

Edited July 17, 2018 by sensible-indian

[coffee_rules]

Pandya is a ODI failure, he failed even in India. He is good for T20s. We need to go back to batsmen who can bowl a bit. Even Jadhav is valuable than Pandya. Go back to 7+4 as Dhoni is also useless. We need to drop Dhoni all together. Ask him to retire respectfully.

 

Rohit, Dhawan, Kohli, Rahul, Iyer, Pant, Jadhav/Pandey, Bhuvi, Bumrah, KulCha

 

Get Rohit to roll his arms.

[putrevus]

2 hours ago, express bowling said:

1 )  Choosing too many short medium-fast bowlers and probably instructing the lone fast bowler to bowl at a reduced pace  --

I had pointed it out repeatedly ...  too many short medium pacers don't work in international cricket. Most teams use one medium-paced swing bowler these days ... but too many do not work.

Our pace attack looked very ordinary.  Not a single specialist bowler chosen who can hit the deck hard and get bounce and seam movement. No variety at all.  I found this fact amazing.


2 )  Choosing Raina for his ability to bowl 2 or 3  overs per match  --  

He has not been chosen in ODIs for a long time because his current ability / form is not good for this format.  To choose him as a batsman because we need a 6th bowler is again poor logic.


3 )  Dhoni --

He is the super duper star who apparently can't be dropped based on non-cricketing reasons. But he is losing his hitting power day by day along with his confidence to try hitting big shots.  But still hanging on to his spot despite a very low SR for a finisher, of only 84,  in the last 3 years.

He batted long in both the 2nd and 3rd ODIs  but managed pathetic strike rates of 63 in both the matches



4 )  Not allowing Rahul to settle down at No.4 and dropping him arbitrarily  --  

I beleive this guy has the game to solve a part of our middle-order problems.  A fabulous hitter who can hit the big shots with ease against both pacers and spinners.  But is also a classical batsmen who does not have to slog to achieve the aforesaid.

 

 

5 )  Playing an unfit Bhuvi in the last ODI --

 

 

P.S --  a )   Rahane, Rayudu and Pandey are our back-up middle order batters in ODIs according to our batting coach, Bangar.  So, future selection fax paus are already planned.    


b )   Rohit's slow, often super slow,  starts is also a big problem but this topic is about selection issues ... and he has not come to the stage where he merits dropping.
 

I don't think it is just  selection.Talent is not there, we are seeing lot of top order batsmen but not many middle order players.

 

I have not seen not many bashers like England have even in domestic setup or IPL.Where are the express fast bowlers, other than under 19 squad members I have not seen any fast bowlers.You need wicket taking bowlers not  bowlers like Bhuvi who simply has no ability to take wickets in Lois.

 

You need batsmen who can start bashing from ball one and still be semi consistent.Rahul is only guy who can complain about lack of chances.

 

Rohit sure is  slow to start but he along with Dhawan and Kohli is keeping this outdated and imbalanced team relevant. Pandya is a more miss than hit , I feel Afridi is more consistent than him.What the hell is Pandya what exactly does he add to this team.

 

There are 5 players and Bumrah who have justified their selection. Bhuvi is last one I want to see in crunch match, he will fail.

 

Rahul needs to do what Bairstow is doing make himself undroppable for that he needs to score big but at no4 albeit very limited chances he has not done well.

 

Kohli has fallen off his loft heights when chasing also, he is gone missing in high scoring chases.But such chase need more than one batsmen to show up.

Edited July 17, 2018 by putrevus

[Global.Baba]

2 hours ago, express bowling said:

 

Ideally, I would try the group below as specialist pacers in ODIs.

 

Bumrah, Bhuvi, Shami, Rajpoot, Khaleel and Prasidh.  (  But Shami's fitness to play ODIs regularly in not known. )

 

Rotate the group with so many matches going on.

 

We would like to find a partner for Bumrah who has the potential to take wickets upfront  as well as bowl at the death while maintaining decent ER   ...  One of Rajpoot, Khaleel or Prasidh may provide the answer.   

 

 

What is your take on Pandya at this stage of his career. 2 years in.

 

Would we be better playing a full time seamer like Chahar or Thakur with some batting ability.

 

They both can slog and Thakur looks innocuous but whenever he has played has shown the ability to pick up wickets by fluke nevertheless and is not too bad at the death. Chahar not counting IPL is apparently a big hitter and can be useful in swinging conditions.

 

Pandya should bat higher and learn to take more responsibility or we need a proper batsman who can bowl. Maybe treat Sundar or Krunal as proper batsman and hope they can get in some overs. Sundar has shown some ability.

 

Pandya is becoming too hit or miss these days.

[jusarrived]

8 minutes ago, putrevus said:

I don't think it is just  selection.Talent is not there, we are seeing lot of top order batsmen but not many middle order players.

 

I have not seen not many bashers like England have even in domestic setup or IPL.Where are the express fast bowlers, other than under 19 squad members I have not seen any fast bowlers.You need wicket taking bowlers not  bowlers like Bhuvi who simply has no ability to take wickets in Lois.

 

You need batsmen who can start bashing from ball one and still be semi consistent.Rahul is only guy who can complain about lack of chances.

 

Rohit sure is  slow to start but he along with Dhawan and Kohli is keeping this outdated and imbalanced team relevant. Pandya is a more miss than hit , I feel Afridi is more consistent than him.What the hell is Pandya what exactly does he add to this team.

 

There are 5 players and Bumrah who have justified their selection. Bhuvi is last one I want to see in crunch match, he will fail.

 

Rahul needs to do what Bairstow is doing make himself undroppable for that he needs to score big but at no4 albeit very limited chances he has not done well.

 

Kohli has fallen off his loft heights when chasing also, he is gone missing in high scoring chases.But such chase need more than one batsmen to show up.

I am going to repeat this again like I have done for past 2-3 years .

The reason for that is , opening has become ridiculously easy . Easy to pile up runs and boost stats , am sure there are good middle order bats but if you filter through top scorers list you wont find them anymore . Flat pitches and power plays have ensured that the Top3 will on a average play 30+ overs now . your 4,5,6 even in domestic sides dont get opportunites to score 50s let alone a 100 , they may have played some brilliant knocks which could be a 20 ball 40 or a 70 ball 50 winning matches for the team in pressure situations , but if you are going to select the squad based on stats these knocks will not be captured . We simply need to have different standards picking players for middle order . Every one wants Shubnam , Prithvi etc now . Where are you going to fit them in ? if these guys are really special then they replace Dhawan/Rohit ,same for KL rahul . if you need a middle order batsmen , bring in Rana/Hooda/Suryashekar etc , but unfortunately hardly any middle order bat is in the selectors radar .

[putrevus]

47 minutes ago, jusarrived said:

I am going to repeat this again like I have done for past 2-3 years .

The reason for that is , opening has become ridiculously easy . Easy to pile up runs and boost stats , am sure there are good middle order bats but if you filter through top scorers list you wont find them anymore . Flat pitches and power plays have ensured that the Top3 will on a average play 30+ overs now . your 4,5,6 even in domestic sides dont get opportunites to score 50s let alone a 100 , they may have played some brilliant knocks which could be a 20 ball 40 or a 70 ball 50 winning matches for the team in pressure situations , but if you are going to select the squad based on stats these knocks will not be captured . We simply need to have different standards picking players for middle order . Every one wants Shubnam , Prithvi etc now . Where are you going to fit them in ? if these guys are really special then they replace Dhawan/Rohit ,same for KL rahul . if you need a middle order batsmen , bring in Rana/Hooda/Suryashekar etc , but unfortunately hardly any middle order bat is in the selectors radar .

It has always been top order batsmen who settled in lower middle order roles as their careers progressed. You need a batsman who can walk in 20/3 and able to hit a century and also ability to use long handle when score is 250/3.Yuvi and Raina along with Dhoni did it well for last decade.We need to find new ones but Rana and co are not the answers, I have seen them I don't see anything special there.

[Ankit_sharma03]

1 hour ago, coffee_rules said:

Pandya is a ODI failure, he failed even in India. He is good for T20s. We need to go back to batsmen who can bowl a bit. Even Jadhav is valuable than Pandya. Go back to 7+4 as Dhoni is also useless. We need to drop Dhoni all together. Ask him to retire respectfully.

 

Rohit, Dhawan, Kohli, Rahul, Iyer, Pant, Jadhav/Pandey, Bhuvi, Bumrah, KulCha

 

Get Rohit to roll his arms.

7+4 wnt work now , part timers are gone out of buss coz middle overs have only 4 fielder outside circle......

with that bowling ull be looking at 400 most games

[Deleted_User_1]

I keep hearing about these phaaasshhttt bowlers, where the Phuck are they?

[Adi_91]

21 minutes ago, dandaroy said:

I keep hearing about these phaaasshhttt bowlers, where the Phuck are they?

I don’t think the current selectors and Captain have any plan in fast tracking them in the team by giving them chances. 

[Vilander]

I think Eng basically.

 

Batted better

Bowled better

Fielded better..

 

other than that India was pretty good in the series...

[rkt.india]

5 hours ago, coffee_rules said:

Pandya is a ODI failure, he failed even in India. He is good for T20s. We need to go back to batsmen who can bowl a bit. Even Jadhav is valuable than Pandya. Go back to 7+4 as Dhoni is also useless. We need to drop Dhoni all together. Ask him to retire respectfully.

 

Rohit, Dhawan, Kohli, Rahul, Iyer, Pant, Jadhav/Pandey, Bhuvi, Bumrah, KulCha

 

Get Rohit to roll his arms.

Averaging 30 with an SR of 115 isn't called failing cat #7.