Should groom Siraj and Saini for Australian series

[Cricket_Fan]

Siraj is now in blistering form and we need tall fast bowlers to win the upcoming Australia series. Cant trust Shami with his fitness and Yadav is short and not consistent. Both him and Saini are tall and ability to clock north of 140 KPH which will come good on Australian test pitches. I am inclined to add Gurbani too as he is already reversing the ball but then dont know whether he would be able to do that in Australia with Kookaburras at is pace. But Siraj and Saini should be played in some tests before we go to Australia.

[tweaker]

Siraj should have been in the squad for the England series.

He had played  4 day test with A team & was in good form.

 

[beetle]

I thought shaadi wala thread.

Siraj is in great form.

They should get him in the last two tests.

Rest one of shami ( if he lasts that long) or Umesh.

Edited August 6, 2018 by beetle

[Ankit_sharma03]

yup was going to write the same, they both shud shud be selected for aus tour......hopefully they ll remain fit

its evident that ishant n umesh are avg n will always be 

[R!TTER]

In Aus if you aren't touching 140kmph consistently, you will be cannon fodder even for their backup batters. Swing helps though, but you have to be deadly accurate like Jimmy to have an effect on those roads. If these 2 are't consistently accurate and rapid in some of their spells, they'll suffer the same fate as BK on last tour or Vinay Kumar before him.

[Cricket_Fan]

10 minutes ago, R!TTER said:

In Aus if you aren't touching 140kmph consistently, you will be cannon fodder even for their backup batters. Swing helps though, but you have to be deadly accurate like Jimmy to have an effect on those roads. If these 2 are't consistently accurate and rapid in some of their spells, they'll suffer the same fate as BK on last tour or Vinay Kumar before him.

Nobody can bowl 140 KPH every delivery in Tests.I don't think even Shoaib Akhtar or Brett lee could do that. And Australia favours tall pacers due to the bounce on offer.Both Saini and Siraj are taller and faster than Bhuvi.

[rkt.india]

Also Ankit Rajpoot. he is better bet as he gets that extra bounce that you need on Aus pitches if he can sustain pace in high 130s to low 140s.   i will take any bowler who can bowl 136-142K range consistently with good accuracy and bounce in Australia. Saini is not as tall as Rajpoot but he does get bounce due to his high arm action.  He had troubled Ausseis even in India in a warm on last tour with bounce at Brabourne.

 

Siraj, Saini, Rajpoot.  i feel these are the next in line pacers for test matches.  Combo of Umesh-Shami wont work in Australia.  

[R!TTER]

Just now, Cricket_Fan said:

Nobody can bowl 140 KPH every delivery in Tests.I don't think even Shoaib Akhtar or Brett lee could do that. And Australia favours tall pacers due to the bounce on offer.Both Saini and Siraj are taller and faster than Bhuvi.

Consistently isn't every delivery! Also you're wrong about that one. Starc, Cummins before them Lee, Gillespie have done it in Aus. Not over a season but a test match for sure, we aren't counting their slower bowls btw avg speed.

[R!TTER]

Just now, rkt.india said:

Also Ankit Rajpoot. he is better bet as he gets that extra bounce that you need on Aus pitches if he can sustain pace in high 130s to low 140s.   i will take any bowler who can bowl 136-142K range consistently with good accuracy and bounce in Australia. Saini is not as tall as Rajpoot but he does get bounce due to his high arm action.  He had troubled Ausseis even in India in a warm on last tour with bounce at Brabourne.

 

Siraj, Saini, Rajpoot.  i feel these are the next in line pacers for test matches.  Combo of Umesh-Shami wont work in Australia.  

Their experience might, the other 3 will be cannon fodder. You can't replace your spearheads for debuting fast bowlers in Aus, it hasn't worked ever for any of the e Asian nations.

[Cricket_Fan]

5 minutes ago, R!TTER said:

Their experience might, the other 3 will be cannon fodder. You can't replace your spearheads for debuting fast bowlers in Aus, it hasn't worked ever for any of the e Asian nations.

Australia at their lowest point now and their batsmen are not good against fast bowling especially Test at the moment like their predecessors.So you cannot compare previous history.

[Ankit_sharma03]

8 minutes ago, R!TTER said:

Their experience might, the other 3 will be cannon fodder. You can't replace your spearheads for debuting fast bowlers in Aus, it hasn't worked ever for any of the e Asian nations.

irfan pathn debut in australia 

ishant did well in his 2nd series in australia 

and that was against the mighty aussies, this time we ll get a b grade lineup

[rkt.india]

17 minutes ago, R!TTER said:

Their experience might, the other 3 will be cannon fodder. You can't replace your spearheads for debuting fast bowlers in Aus, it hasn't worked ever for any of the e Asian nations.

Experience count for zilch if you lack skills required for certain conditions. Shami can still do but Australia is the worst place for unfit fast bowlers due the heat.  In Australia, you need either extreme pace aka Starc or Johnson or extreme consistency aka McGrath or Hazlewood that makes a winning combination.  There is no middle ground unless you get very friendly conditions like England got in 2010 and they had 6 feet 7 Tremlett who hunted Australia along with Anderson and Finn who is also tall 6 feet 7.

[beetle]

24 minutes ago, R!TTER said:

Their experience might, the other 3 will be cannon fodder. You can't replace your spearheads for debuting fast bowlers in Aus, it hasn't worked ever for any of the e Asian nations.

Get one in every series.

Get one for the last two tests in England.

One in Australia, third one in when ever is the next series.

Our pacers need to be rotated and rested too.

 

 

[Suhaan]

37 minutes ago, R!TTER said:

Consistently isn't every delivery! Also you're wrong about that one. Starc, Cummins before them Lee, Gillespie have done it in Aus. Not over a season but a test match for sure, we aren't counting their slower bowls btw avg speed.

Are you saying every delivery?I suppose you are not..Lee's average pace was quite high but to claim Lee and Gillespie bowled every delivery of a test match in excess of 140 k is pretty brave 

[Suhaan]

Siraj and Saini should be groomed thats the moral..Umesh and Shami are at their tail end.Shami may break down anytime in Aus..Siraj and Saini along with Rajpoot can make one hell of a bowling line up..we have the arsenal but the selectors need to have something between their ears

[R!TTER]

Just now, Suhaan said:

Are you saying every delivery?I suppose you are not..Lee's average pace was quite high but to claim Lee and Gillespie bowled every delivery of a test match in excess of 140 k is pretty brave 

Do you not read, like the other guy? Consistently doesn't mean every delivery. Pretty sure the guys above will not have avg speeds of even 135kph if they bowl 20 odd overs a day in Aus, unlike England Aus summers are hot!

[R!TTER]

1 hour ago, beetle said:

Get one in every series.

Get one for the last two tests in England.

One in Australia, third one in when ever is the next series.

Our pacers need to be rotated and rested too.

 

 

Sounds like a good strategy but then we have to choose wisely, which ones to pick and where to play them. For instance in Perth we need tearaway quicks, or players who can swing the ball with control. If you don't have either, or just a new ball bowler then Aus is not the place for you to debut.

[rkt.india]

13 minutes ago, R!TTER said:

Do you not read, like the other guy? Consistently doesn't mean every delivery. Pretty sure the guys above will not have avg speeds of even 135kph if they bowl 20 odd overs a day in Aus, unlike England Aus summers are hot!

both guys are pretty quick or has been as quick as Shami, Yadav, Bumrah in recent times etc.  

[R!TTER]

Just now, rkt.india said:

both guys are pretty quick or has been as quick as Shami, Yadav, Bumrah in recent times etc.  

We're talking about Aus here, only the best survive in those harsh conditions. Besides it's also about control and nerves, I don't want any of them to debut in Aus, if they are to be played then ideally they could be tried in the last 2 tests here and given 2 more against WI. If you are expecting miracles from rookie pacers in Aus then you'll be sorely disappointed. Only the best SA pacers in the last 10 years have done consistently well, after 95/96 WIndian loss no other team had even gotten close to winning a series there on the back of pace bowling, till 2008 SA.

[rkt.india]

36 minutes ago, R!TTER said:

We're talking about Aus here, only the best survive in those harsh conditions. Besides it's also about control and nerves, I don't want any of them to debut in Aus, if they are to be played then ideally they could be tried in the last 2 tests here and given 2 more against WI. If you are expecting miracles from rookie pacers in Aus then you'll be sorely disappointed. Only the best SA pacers in the last 10 years have done consistently well, after 95/96 WIndian loss no other team had even gotten close to winning a series there on the back of pace bowling, till 2008 SA.

i am not expecting miracles from them, but they have played a lot of A team cricket overseas and have learnt how to bowl there, which like Shami and Umesh missed.  They have reaped the advantage of several A tours, so, they are more ready than past bowlers were.  The reason i think they wont do any worse than what Shami and Umesh did last time.