Please drop Pandya to maintain Test cricket’s sanctity.

[express bowling]

2 minutes ago, SK_IH said:

what? can you elaborate

 

Just now, express bowling said:

 

If we are playing tests on a pitch or in conditions where playing 2 spinners is not possible ... and we are playing just 4 specialist bowlers ...  this means the lone spinner won't bowl more than 20 overs because of the pitch etc. ...  so the 3 specialist pacers will have to bowl 70 overs ... so, their pace and intensity would come down.  The 4th pacer comes in here to share thee workload ...  but we can rarely play a specialist 5th bowler (  unless 2 such bowlers can bat too )  as we don't want our weak batting to weaken too much.  Pandya is just the best choice available as of today for this role.

 

[Khota]

20 minutes ago, express bowling said:

 

No modern test captain would agree.

That is a opinion, not a fact.

[Khota]

7 minutes ago, express bowling said:

 

If we are playing tests on a pitch or in conditions where playing 2 spinners is not possible ... and we are playing just 4 specialist bowlers ...  this means the lone spinner won't bowl more than 20 overs because of the pitch etc. ...  so the 3 specialist pacers will have to bowl 70 overs ... so, their pace and intensity would come down.  The 4th pacer comes in here to share thee workload ...  but we can rarely play a specialist 5th bowler (  unless 2 such bowlers can bat too )  as we don't want our weak batting to weaken too much.  Pandya is just the best choice available as of today for this role.

Instead of Pandya if Kuldeep or jadeja were playing that could have crushed England. Pandya was a safety valve for them.

[express bowling]

7 minutes ago, Khota said:

Instead of Pandya if Kuldeep or jadeja were playing that could have crushed England. Pandya was a safety valve for them.

 

How many teams play 2 spinners in England  ?

 

 

[express bowling]

9 minutes ago, Khota said:

That is a opinion, not a fact.

 

Just look at usual team compositions of different teams  in tests outside Asia these days.   You will get your answer.

 

My opinion is immaterial.

[Khota]

4 minutes ago, express bowling said:

 

How many teams play 2 spinners in England  ?

 

 

How many team has two good spinners as India does?

 

Sports are not that complicated. Every modern thinking coach looks at the other team, their tapes and spends hours dissecting it with analysts. Then he looks a t mismatches and tries to create a mismatch in every situation to gain every little advantage.

 

England players dont see high quality spin and two good spinners provide a mismatch for India. As a minimum try it.

[Khota]

4 minutes ago, express bowling said:

 

Just look at usual team compositions of different teams  in tests outside Asia these days.   You will get your answer.

 

My opinion is immaterial.

Neither does mine carry any weight.

[R!TTER]

Just now, express bowling said:

 

Just look at usual team compositions of different teams  in tests outside Asia these days.   You will get your answer.

 

My opinion is immaterial.

Yes it is, because by going with your logic WI should've played in extra spinner in India 3 decades back, as well as SA in 2k albeit a series tainted by match fixing.

 

You play your best bowlers, the 2 or 3 of the best we have are spinner. To answer your other non sequitur - we played 2 spinner in England 2002, Leeds of all places!

[SK_IH]

33 minutes ago, express bowling said:

 

 

 play a cricketer to reduce work load of bowlers can be reason for cricketers who are proper batsman, not Hardik Pandya 

i ll play capable 5th bowler instaed and try and get them all out in 75 overs 

Edited August 8, 2018 by SK_IH

[express bowling]

51 minutes ago, Khota said:

How many team has two good spinners as India does?

 

Sports are not that complicated. Every modern thinking coach looks at the other team, their tapes and spends hours dissecting it with analysts. Then he looks a t mismatches and tries to create a mismatch in every situation to gain every little advantage.

 

England players dont see high quality spin and two good spinners provide a mismatch for India. As a minimum try it.

 

Good spinner Jadeja averages 46 in tests outside Asia and 47 in tests in England.  So, lots of people might think twice before playing him as the 2nd spinner on pacer friendly tracks.

 

Next test pitch may aid spinners and Jadeja may play then and succeed too.  Same with any later tests.

 

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/player/234675.html?class=1;filter=advanced;home_or_away=2;opposition=1;opposition=2;opposition=3;opposition=5;orderby=default;template=results;type=bowling

Edited August 8, 2018 by express bowling

[Khota]

3 minutes ago, express bowling said:

 

Good spinner Jadeja averages 46 in tests outside Asia and 47 in tests in England.  So, lots of people might think twice before playing him as the 2nd spinner on pacer friendly tracks.

 

Next test pitch may aid spinners and Jadeja may play then and succeed too.  Same with any later tests.

Then go for Kuldeep. This is where a good analyst armed with new metrics/analytics can make a pick. BCCI not spending the money on that is a mistake.

[Khota]

This rest thing is getting ridiculous. Pandya is providing rest. This was never a criteria ever before in history of cicket. Pandya supporters are getting desparate.

[R!TTER]

Just now, express bowling said:

 

Good spinner Jadeja averages 46 in tests outside Asia and 47 in tests in England.  So, lots of people might think twice before playing him as the 2nd spinner on pacer friendly tracks.

 

Next test pitch may aid spinners and Jadeja may play then and succeed too.  Same with any later tests.

This is the other good spinners' stats in SA, Aus, Eng before this 2018

[Ankit_sharma03]

7 minutes ago, Khota said:

This rest thing is getting ridiculous. Pandya is providing rest. This was never a criteria ever before in history of cicket. Pandya supporters are getting desparate.

Yes it has 

kohli did it in 2015 SL and we won the series (1st test we played with speailist bowler n lost) , dhoni did it in england when we won in lords (then we bought back rohit as specilist batsman n lost it)

 

 

 

“We have got Stuart Binny because his bowling gives us balance. His batting at number six will help us too. We will look at the wicket tomorrow. But I feel that even if you don’t have five full-time bowlers, the fifth has to be one who can bowl 10-15 overs. It is very helpful in certain situations.- Kohli 

 

Link - https://indianexpress.com/article/sports/cricket/stuart-binnys-bowling-gives-us-the-balance-virat-kohli/

Edited August 8, 2018 by Ankit_sharma03

[sandeep]

14 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

Yes it has 

kohli did it in 2015 SL and we won the series (1st test we played with speailist bowler n lost) , dhoni did it in england when we won in lords (then we bought back rohit as specilist batsman n lost it)

 

 

 

“We have got Stuart Binny because his bowling gives us balance. His batting at number six will help us too. We will look at the wicket tomorrow. But I feel that even if you don’t have five full-time bowlers, the fifth has to be one who can bowl 10-15 overs. It is very helpful in certain situations.- Kohli 

 

Link - https://indianexpress.com/article/sports/cricket/stuart-binnys-bowling-gives-us-the-balance-virat-kohli/

And Sanjay Bangar when we won the test series in England in 2007.  

 

Just because we have lacked decent options historically to fill this role, doesn't mean that the role is not viable.  

[express bowling]

7 hours ago, R!TTER said:

Yes it is,

 

Yours is too.  We are nothing.  Only the people making the decisions matter.  Don't fool yourself.  We are discussing only because we like it.

 

 

Quote

because by going with your logic WI should've played in extra spinner in India 3 decades back, as well as SA in 2k albeit a series tainted by match fixing.

 

You play your best bowlers, the 2 or 3 of the best we have are spinner. To answer your other non sequitur - we played 2 spinner in England 2002, Leeds of all places!

 

West Indies did play Roger Harper in India.

 

Wrong logic above.

 

Our strength in tests in SENA countries is not spin bowling.

 

Indian spinners in  SENA countries from 1990.  Poor performance.

 

Overall figures

Player	Span	Mat	Inns	Overs	Mdns	Runs	Wkts	BBI	BBM	Ave	Econ	SR	5	10
A Kumble	1990-2008	35	67	1886.1	394	5224	141	8/141	12/279	37.04	2.76	80.2	5	1
Harbhajan Singh	1998-2011	19	34	799.2	108	2476	62	7/120	7/102	39.93	3.09	77.3	3	0
R Ashwin	2011-2018	12	20	540.4	83	1694	38	4/62	7/121	44.57	3.13	85.3	0	0
RA Jadeja	2013-2014	7	12	307.2	57	831	18	6/138	6/154	46.16	2.70	102.4	1	0
SLV Raju	1990-1996	10	17	429.0	124	936	20	3/11	5/132	46.80	2.18	128.7	0	0
SR Tendulkar	1990-2012	63	51	226.5	22	856	18	2/7	2/15	47.55	3.77	75.6	0	0
ND Hirwani	1990-1990	6	10	322.0	69	895	15	4/174	5/226	59.66	2.77	128.8	0	0

 

 

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/stats/index.html?bowling_pacespin=2;class=1;filter=advanced;home_or_away=2;opposition=1;opposition=2;opposition=3;opposition=5;orderby=bowling_average;qualmin1=10;qualval1=wickets;spanmax1=08+Aug+2018;spanmin1=01+Jan+1990;spanval1=span;team=6;template=results;type=bowling

 

 

West Indian pacers in tests in India from 1976 to 1989.  It was still their strength and superb.

 

 

 

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Overall figures

Player	Span	Mat	Inns	Overs	Mdns	Runs	Wkts	BBI	BBM	Ave	Econ	SR	5	10
CA Walsh	1987-1988	4	7	137.1	24	437	26	5/54	9/94	16.80	3.18	31.6	2	0
MA Holding	1983-1983	6	11	223.4	43	663	30	5/102	6/88	22.10	2.96	44.7	1	0
WW Daniel	1983-1983	3	6	98.0	12	332	14	5/39	6/50	23.71	3.38	42.0	1	0
MD Marshall	1978-1983	9	15	299.0	70	886	36	6/37	9/102	24.61	2.96	49.8	2	0
BP Patterson	1987-1988	4	7	117.1	14	456	17	5/24	8/124	26.82	3.89	41.3	2	0
ST Clarke	1978-1979	5	8	233.5	39	711	21	5/126	6/121	33.85	3.04	66.8	1	0
N Phillip	1978-1979	6	9	193.2	38	650	19	4/48	7/85	34.21	3.36	61.0	0	0
WW Davis	1983-1988	10	18	290.4	29	952	27	4/76	5/96	35.25	3.27	64.5	0	0

 

 

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/stats/index.html?class=1;filter=advanced;home_or_away=2;opposition=6;orderby=bowling_average;qualmin1=10;qualval1=wickets;spanmax1=31+Dec+1989;spanmin1=01+Jan+1976;spanval1=span;team=4;template=results;type=bowling

 

 

South African bowlers in Asia from 1992 to 2009.  Their pacers were still their strength and superb.

 

 

Overall figures

Player	Span	Mat	Inns	Overs	Mdns	Runs	Wkts	BBI	BBM	Ave	Econ	SR	5	10
BN Schultz	1993-1997	4	6	139.1	39	384	21	5/48	9/106	18.28	2.75	39.7	2	0
AA Donald	1993-2000	9	16	291.0	82	732	36	5/69	7/69	20.33	2.51	48.5	1	0
WJ Cronje	1993-2000	11	15	136.5	54	285	13	3/23	5/49	21.92	2.08	63.1	0	0
SM Pollock	1997-2006	15	27	528.3	158	1315	53	6/78	7/101	24.81	2.48	59.8	2	0
DW Steyn	2006-2008	7	12	202.2	21	817	32	5/23	8/114	25.53	4.03	37.9	3	0
PL Harris	2007-2008	5	8	242.0	58	656	20	5/73	7/131	32.80	2.71	72.6	1	0
M Hayward	2000-2004	5	10	129.4	21	434	13	3/81	4/82	33.38	3.34	59.8	0	0
PR Adams	1996-2003	10	16	287.3	53	1031	30	7/128	8/139	34.36	3.58	57.5	2	0
L Klusener	1996-2004	10	15	200.4	36	626	18	8/64	8/139	34.77	3.11	66.8	1	0
N Boje	2000-2006	9	15	405.1	76	1205	32	5/62	7/93	37.65	2.97	75.9	3	0
JH Kallis	1997-2008	17	26	286.2	79	760	20	3/30	3/43	38.00	2.65	85.9	0	0
M Ntini	2000-2008	14	24	431.3	69	1379	36	4/84	6/62	38.30	3.19	71.9	0	0
PL Symcox	1993-1997	9	16	259.3	56	787	18	3/8	4/95	43.72	3.03	86.5	0	0

 

 

 

 

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/stats/index.html?class=1;filter=advanced;home_or_away=2;opposition=6;opposition=7;opposition=8;orderby=bowling_average;qualmin1=10;qualval1=wickets;spanmax1=31+Dec+2009;spanmin1=01+Jan+1990;spanval1=span;team=3;template=results;type=bowling

Edited August 8, 2018 by express bowling

[putrevus]

2 hours ago, SK_IH said:

Meanwhile Indian Bowling coach has this to offer :

tou BC kyon khila rahe ho isko 

If this is view point of the coach then Pandya has no chance of growing . That statement shows what the management think of him as a bowler.

 

If Pandya bowling is so weak that coach thinks it is better for team if he does not bowl then he should not be in the team. Don't give this nonsense he score more than anyone other Kohli.

[R!TTER]

Just now, sandeep said:

And Sanjay Bangar when we won the test series in England in 2007.  

 

Just because we have lacked decent options historically to fill this role, doesn't mean that the role is not viable.  

Sanjay Bangar in 2007, are you drunk 

 

And weren't for criticizing that no name Vijay Shankar duplicate yesterday? Not to mention he still has better stats than the next Dev 

[putrevus]

20 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

Yes it has 

kohli did it in 2015 SL and we won the series (1st test we played with speailist bowler n lost) , dhoni did it in england when we won in lords (then we bought back rohit as specilist batsman n lost it)

 

 

 

“We have got Stuart Binny because his bowling gives us balance. His batting at number six will help us too. We will look at the wicket tomorrow. But I feel that even if you don’t have five full-time bowlers, the fifth has to be one who can bowl 10-15 overs. It is very helpful in certain situations.- Kohli 

 

Link - https://indianexpress.com/article/sports/cricket/stuart-binnys-bowling-gives-us-the-balance-virat-kohli/

Binny played 6 matches before being discarded for good as , they realized he adds no value to the team.I don't see how Pandya is different from Binny. I would take Binny over Pandya in England.

[express bowling]

40 minutes ago, SK_IH said:

 play a cricketer to reduce work load of bowlers can be reason for cricketers who are proper batsman, not Hardik Pandya 

i ll play capable 5th bowler instaed and try and get them all out in 75 overs 

 

Since the opinion is equally divided on this among both fans and experts ... I am willing to respect opinions on both sides.