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Nikola

Indian bowling in Odis for Worldcup - Weak?

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Okay first of all i want to tell that this is just my thinking you guys can comment on what you guys think.

 

Indian bowling in odis looks weak to me for worldcup.

 

Let's look at bowlers we will most likely see in playing xi for worldcup.

 

- Pandya (avg 40.35)

- Bhuvi (avg 38.85)

- Bumrah (avg 22.50)

- Kuldeep (avg 19.35)

- Chahal (avg 23.86)

 

Okay these stats might not tell much truth so let's get more deep.

 

I am gonna focus on bhuvi (who will be lead bowler). Many here will know what pandya can do with ball. For chahal i feel he is hyped bowler right now and will not be that effective in worldcup.

 

Bhuvneshwar Kumar's Stats (87 matches)

 

Avg vs Top 4 countries.

 

  • Australia (12 matches) - 64.37 
  • England (14 matches) - 53.50
  • South Africa (13 matches) - 52.92
  • New Zealand (8 matches) - 48.00

 

Okay many people will get angry on me for showing this but he has been trundler who uses tricks to get few batsman out here and there. In this era of batsman he won't get green pitches in odis like he gets in test cricket. I agree he is handy batsman at times but do we really need that batting this much that we don't care about his bowling? When was last time he ran through side in his career? I can't remember any.

 

Hardik Pandya is pretty avg bowler and surely can't play when you have trundler like bhuvi already in side. He might be useful in t20s where you can be wicketless and still be okay but here he will have to bowl all 10 overs for worldcup.

 

Yuzvendra Chahal is to be fair okay bowler but at times can be easily slogged. If you are quality batsman you won't have alot troubles playing him. He can have a good time in few match but i am not sure if he can have big impact when needed most.

 

Jasprit Bumrah & Kuldeep Yadav are only two bowlers who give me some confidence that they can pick wickets against any side but you can still play kuldeep if you are good batsman while other might have issue against him. Bumrah will have to work on fitness and no ball issues.

 

Worldcup Experience - None of these bowler have worldcup experience. Yeah bhuvi has played 1 match in worldcup against minnow side but i am talking about playing whole worldcup. Will depend if we want to go with one experienced bowler from last worldcup or go with fresh attack.

 

Who we can look at? Well we can either youngster (might be too late now) or someone like shami/umesh for worldcup squad. I have no doubt that one of the two will be in worldcup squad but i am not sure if they will play in xi.

Edited by Nikola

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We don't necessarily need Bhuvi in ODIs as he is useful when conditions favor him much like how many of our spinners are in India ....  Bhuvi is good for Tests in Eng, SA, etc., and T20s 

 

Assuming that it will be a 15 member squad

 

Batsmen and WK: Kohli, Rohit, Dhawan, Rahul, Dhoni (will be there), Karthik and Pant

ARs: Hardik and Krunal

Pace Bowlers: Bumrah, and 3 from Shami (can pick up wkts), Yadav, Khaleel, Saini, Rajpoot, etc. 

Spinners: Kuldeep and Chahal / Sunder / Gowtham

 

 

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If we can include a new pacer, who can take wickets upfront and is a decent end-overs bowler ... we would be ok.

 

Not easy to find.

 

Khaleel has potential ... but he must get to play actual games.

 

This Shardul experiment is unnecessarily blocking a spot in every format. Either play him or drop him.

 

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2 minutes ago, GautiMaan said:

We won in 2011 by stacking the batting.That strength sadly has been lost.

Aussies won 2015 for the exact same reasons. Its evident we are no longer looking at developing any new player for next world cup. Maybe the thought is we are too close to developing someone new but we arent winning with the team they have selected. 

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Yes, it does look weak we have only one genuine wicket taker in bumra in English conditions, we need rejuvenated bhuvi back asap one who bowls in the 140+kph and lethal at the death with pin point yorkers, still has time he can work but that doesn't happen we can go back to shami, he averages 25 in Odis and was instrumental in 2015 WC.

Khaleel is superb addition ads variety to the attack, he can be a perfect 1st change  bowler, his left arm pace and aggression will help us to break through  long partnership in middle overs, handy in the death as well.

Also a 6 th bowler is lacking, somebody like k gowtham or k pandya can do that job 

In england I would go with 3 fastbowler one spin and pace bowling ar and one spinner 

1. Bhuvi

2. Bumrah

3. Khaleel

4. Pandya

5. Cooldeep

6. Krunal 

 

 

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11 minutes ago, speedheat said:

Yes, it does look weak we have only one genuine wicket taker in bumra in English conditions, we need rejuvenated bhuvi back asap one who bowls in the 140+kph and lethal at the death with pin point yorkers, still has time he can work but that doesn't happen we can go back to shami, he averages 25 in Odis and was instrumental in 2015 WC.

Khaleel is superb addition ads variety to the attack, he can be a perfect 1st change  bowler, his left arm pace and aggression will help us to break through  long partnership in middle overs, handy in the death as well.

Also a 6 th bowler is lacking, somebody like k gowtham or k pandya can do that job 

In england I would go with 3 fastbowler one spin and pace bowling ar and one spinner 

1. Bhuvi

2. Bumrah

3. Khaleel

4. Pandya

5. Cooldeep

6. Krunal 

 

 

Our team management need to try Khaleel in actual matches.  Some foresight is needed here instead of reverting back to Shardul.

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7 minutes ago, express bowling said:

 

Our team management need to try Khaleel in actual matches.  Some foresight is needed here instead of reverting back to Shardul.

Atleast they dropped the headband wearer Kaul

Dropping Shardul might not be easy due to Mumbai lobby

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4 minutes ago, express bowling said:

 

Our team management need to try Khaleel in actual matches.  Some foresight is needed here instead of reverting back to Shardul.

Express bhai knowing the history of this tm and their reliance on experience chances of khaleel playing in the 11 ahead of thakoor are very very thin.

At the moment m just hoping somebody in tm with bright brain  comes out with the idea of playing left arm pace for veriety. :pray: 

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In top fitness, bowling is our strength. The currently weaker link Bhuvi for instance was jolly good in CT. Even if he's off color, Shami & Yadav have staked their claim in the odi team. Bumrah & the 2 wristies pick themselves thus far. Only Pandya or the fifth bowler is a question mark, so not a bad scheme of things in any world.

 

I think people have forgotten our bowling struggles of the past and are keen on permanently tweaking this unit while the main problem is batting, top order heavy and that too loses the plot when a hint of seam/swing is available.

 

We always went with 4 bowlers earlier, although 2 new balls changed the universe. This 6th bowling option is frankly hard to find, if 5 bowlers can't finish 50 overs the 6th one is as much of a gamble.

Edited by Clarke

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Shami has to be in the scheme of things and hopefully a left arm pacer like khaleel strikes gold before the wc. 

I am tempted to play gopal instead of chahal. In some conditions we have to sit out one spinner most likely chahal and play in an extra seamer so need sone good backup seamers unlike mugs like shardul 

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Middle order batting is more concerning. It’s likely to be Rahul, Rayudu, Pandey, Dhoni, Karthik, Jadhav that’ll go into the squad. That’s a middle order, but I’m afraid the selectors are not looking beyond these 6 till the WC

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our problem is 3rd seamer.  Pandya is not a third seamer. i would rater play a spinning alrounder and a specialist 3rd seamer. even if we have to drop Pandya from ODIs or he bats in top 6 playing as 6th bowler and Krunal at 7, one of Kuldeep or Chahar and then 3 main seamers, preferably Bumrah, Khaleel, BK/Saini keep in mind England.

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There are too many gaps to fill .

1. 6th Bowling option :- As the top 4 batsmen do not bowl at all , this is a big headache .Its not that if 5 bowlers cannot do the job , this 6th guy will do. Its more to do with having a back up plan if any of the 5 bowlers get injured during play. How you cover that up ?

2. No good fit so far for 6th position :- To have some cushion in batting ,management wants to try a pure batsmrn who bowls a few .  Only guy who seems to have done some bowling is Kedar. But he is poor in fielding, suspect against quality pace , poor runner and bowling too crappy type.  Other options - not tested enough and do not seem to have any ready option as such.

3. Fevicol MSD:-  Has looked way past his best. Can't score against genuine quicks , Do not have shots to hit big if wide yorkers are delivered off the off stump.Poor against Left arm spin. 

He knows he will get out if he goes for attacking play. So to look decent he will play very % cricket and go on getting singles and odd 2s. This always leads to pulling down RR and puts pressure on others to hit out. Its so unfortunate such an astute mind cannot make out how he is damaging india one day team composition.

Atleast he can be in 15 , play odd 1-2 matches in World cup and be a brain sitting on bench and passing on his wisdom every over .   

4. No settled middle order: -  Even after 3 years of experimentation we do not know who are our middle order batsmen. There is a facination to go for older players again & again.  Selecting Ambati at this stage was really bad move. You are adding another slow mover and passenger to the team.  Nothing to show against quality pace .

5. New comers not grabbing chances :-  Even when some newcomers were included they did not grab the opportunity. KL , Iyer, Pant . None played one great innings from middle order.  Current showing in test matches also by them is disappointing.  KL looks to be better option but not getting a good run at one place . 

I would still say if both Bhuvi &  Bhumra are fit , bowling looks decent . Batting is horrible from no.4 onwards .  Based on current showing if top 3 fail, india cannot win even 2 matches out 10 if a decent amount of runs needed to be scored . 

 

 

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1 hour ago, rkt.india said:

Rohit

Dhawan

Rahul

Kohli

Dhoni

Hardik

Krunal/ Sundar

BK/Saini

Kuldeep/chahal

Khaleel

Bumrah

 

My preferred ODI XI till world cup.

 

This would be my preferred 11 and batting order too ... apart from Dhoni.

 

I guess you have included him because he is bound to be there.

 

If we can keep on playing this team without unnecessary experimentation ... our chances would improve a lot in the World Cup.

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16 hours ago, express bowling said:

 

This would be my preferred 11 and batting order too ... apart from Dhoni.

 

I guess you have included him because he is bound to be there.

 

If we can keep on playing this team without unnecessary experimentation ... our chances would improve a lot in the World Cup.

Dhoni is a certainty unless his back injury resurfaces so no use excluding him

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23 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

Dhoni is a certainty unless his back injury resurfaces so no use excluding him

Why can’t selectors see beyond Dhoni he is finished struggled in the Odi series yet he is a permanent member for next year why?

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I still believe we have got batting talent to manage to win worldcup. For bowling i believe pandya + bhuvi + chahal (all are avg bowlers in odi's and this might be big issue)

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Bumrah, Kuldeep & Chahal are good. 
Pandya & Jadhav/Krunal are good enough to make up the 5th bowler. 
Bhuvneshwar is the real issue. We can't have a specialist bowler averaging close to 40 with the ball. 

Khaleel & Siraj should be given ODI debuts soon. One of them can displace Bhuvi. 

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Bumrah and Kuldeep strike bowlers.

Bhuvaneshwar needs to work on his pace and not rely on his line and length alone.

 

Chahal has good spin. But he needs to work on tighter lines.

Hardik pandya must be made to bowl 6 balls on the same spot and stop spraying around.

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