Who was the better batsmen in tests between Zaheer Abbas and Gundappa Vishwanath?

[Harsh Thakor]

Rarely in the history of the game have 2 great batsmen been so close to each other in stature.Zaheer Abbas and Gundappa Vishwanath were the ultimate stylists of their day and age giving the art of batting it's prose or poetry.They were simply the epitome of artistry and elegance reminiscent of a musician or painter.,literally sculpting their innings.Their strokes had the beauty of a lotus blooming.

Zaheer was the marginally more complete , classical and stylish.Vishy was the more creative and talented.Zaheer was better against spin,Vishy better against pace.Zaheer was more effective on the flat tracks,Vishy better on the fast or bad ones.Zaheer had a better penchant for making mammoth scores,Vishy was the better batsmen in a crisis.

Statistically Zaheer had a better batting average of 44.79 ,but Vishwanath was more prolific scoring 6080 runs and much more successful against the premier team of their day,the West Indies,Vishwanath scored 4 centuries at an average above 50 against them while Zaheer scored no century and averaged only 17.In Australia considering the opposition Zaheer fared better averaging over 57 in 1976-77 facing the likes of Lillee,including scoring a century.Vishy averaged over 50 in 1977-78 but against a 2nd string attack,with only Thomson a genuine great.In England Zaheer was definitely a notch ahead scoring 2 double centuries,but again it was Vishy who was better in crisis situations like at Lords in 1979 and at the Oval and Old Trafford in 1982.At home what gave the edge to Zaheer were his scores against India which were Bradmanesque.Pertinent that both Zaheer and Vishy never scored a test hundred in a losing cause.

.The Vishy against West Indies in 1974-75 and 1978-79 would have been more an asset to a side than Zaheer Abbas.However the Zaheer Abbas against England in 1971 and arguably 1974 as well as against India at home in 1978-79 and 1982-83 would have have been a more eligible candidate than Vishy.In Australia it was virtually a draw .

With a gun on my head by less than a a whisker I would choose Gundappa Vishwanath over Zaheer Abbas.My main criteria was Vishy's consistency in a crisis,on bad wickets and against sheer pace.

Edited February 12, 2019 by Harsh Thakor

[Straight Drive]

Equally great.

 

Vishy though would miss out on all time 11 of India but Zaheer makes all time 11 for Pak. That is only because Pakistan did not have too many good batsmen as India did.

 

India:

 

Sunny

Sehwag

Dravid

Sachin

Kohli

VVS 

 

 

 

 

[Khota]

Zaheer was crap compared to Vishwanath. Zaheer is another case of a bat inflating his stats against spinners with biased umpires and dead pitches at home. Absolutely useless against pace. Zaheer is in line with other Pakistani perpetuated myth like their pace attack. And this is coming from someone who likes Pakistani players.

[Vilander]

Zaheer faced Indian bowling 

Vishwanath never got that lucky.

[MechEng]

With a gun on your head, answer this question - Are you a machine or a man?

[zen]

On an Indian forum, why would you vote for Zaheer if both him and Vishy are equally great  .... People would only vote for Zaheer if he is clearly ahead (and he is not) 
 

[Khota]

18 minutes ago, Pace90 said:

Plus he was Pakistani , so no competition. 

Him being Pakistani has no bearing on anything. Scoring double century against Indian spin attack in Pakistan vs scoring a century against Australia on debut is difference of day and night.

[Harsh Thakor]

13 hours ago, Vilander said:

Zaheer faced Indian bowling 

Vishwanath never got that lucky.

Never forget Zaheer's 2 double centuries in England in 1971 and 1974 as well as his century facing Lillee at Adelaide in 1976-77 .He averaged over 57 on the 1967-77 Australian tour and over 56 on the 1981-82 Australian tour facing the best Australian bowling..Gavaskar,Viv Richards .Chappell brothers or even Tendulkar have not scored 2 double centuries in test in England.Thus Abbas better than Vishy in England and Australia.

[Harsh Thakor]

14 hours ago, Khota said:

Zaheer was crap compared to Vishwanath. Zaheer is another case of a bat inflating his stats against spinners with biased umpires and dead pitches at home. Absolutely useless against pace. Zaheer is in line with other Pakistani perpetuated myth like their pace attack. And this is coming from someone who likes Pakistani players.

Tow classic double centuries in England which the likes of Viv Richards,Gavaskar and Tendulkar oir Greg Chappell have not done.Averaged over 55 in a series in Australia twice against top pace of Lillee. in 1976-77 and 1981-82..Scored  9 fifties in Australia facing the likes of Dennis Lillee.Scored a classic 91 in WSC game vesrus West Indies in 1978.Not at his best aginst pace but still has a better record than Vishy in England and Australia.

[Harsh Thakor]

22 hours ago, Straight Drive said:

Equally great.

 

Vishy though would miss out on all time 11 of India but Zaheer makes all time 11 for Pak. That is only because Pakistan did not have too many good batsmen as India did.

 

India:

 

Sunny

Sehwag

Dravid

Sachin

Kohli

VVS 

 

 

 

 

great answer.Vishy against pace,Zaheer against spin.Vishy better on bad wickets,Zaheer better on batting tracks.Vishy the better match-winner or batsmen in a crisis?

[rkt.india]

48 minutes ago, Harsh Thakor said:

Tow classic double centuries in England which the likes of Viv Richards,Gavaskar and Tendulkar oir Greg Chappell have not done.Averaged over 55 in a series in Australia twice against top pace of Lillee. in 1976-77 and 1981-82..Scored  9 fifties in Australia facing the likes of Dennis Lillee.Scored a classic 91 in WSC game vesrus West Indies in 1978.Not at his best aginst pace but still has a better record than Vishy in England and Australia.

Lillie had lost pace after 1975 due to his back injury.  He was not the express bowler anymore that he used to be before 75.  

[ShoonyaSifar]

56 minutes ago, Harsh Thakor said:

Tow classic double centuries in England which the likes of Viv Richards,Gavaskar and Tendulkar oir Greg Chappell have not done.Averaged over 55 in a series in Australia twice against top pace of Lillee. in 1976-77 and 1981-82..Scored  9 fifties in Australia facing the likes of Dennis Lillee.Scored a classic 91 in WSC game vesrus West Indies in 1978.Not at his best aginst pace but still has a better record than Vishy in England and Australia.

I was not even born when he played those knocks but how can a knock played on a 600 plays 500 pitch be termed a classic? Would understand if he had scored at run a ball, like Sehwag scored his 300 on a flat Chepauk road vs SA.

[Harsh Thakor]

30 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

Lillie had lost pace after 1975 due to his back injury.  He was not the express bowler anymore that he used to be before 75.  

still a great bowler-an even better one after 1976

 

 

[Harsh Thakor]

21 minutes ago, ShoonyaSifar said:

I was not even born when he played those knocks but how can a knock played on a 600 plays 500 pitch be termed a classic? Would understand if he had scored at run a ball, like Sehwag scored his 300 on a flat Chepauk road vs SA.

Both were technical masterpieces.Edgbaston 274 morally won the match above all for Pakistan.

[ShoonyaSifar]

As someone who started following cricket from late 80s, a lot of the romanticism and nostalgia about past greats comes due to County cricket and Packer series. So many folklores which do not quite match the numbers many a times. Yes, scorecards alone do not give you the complete picture about knocks but on a longer horizon, they they do give us some idea especially arguments which are made to run down achievements of the 90s and current generation of cricketers.

[Khota]

3 hours ago, Harsh Thakor said:

Tow classic double centuries in England which the likes of Viv Richards,Gavaskar and Tendulkar oir Greg Chappell have not done.Averaged over 55 in a series in Australia twice against top pace of Lillee. in 1976-77 and 1981-82..Scored  9 fifties in Australia facing the likes of Dennis Lillee.Scored a classic 91 in WSC game vesrus West Indies in 1978.Not at his best aginst pace but still has a better record than Vishy in England and Australia.

I can understand England because he played county all the time. I don't know if you have watched him in person but the poor soul was getting beat by every other delivery by Kapil Dev. Could not handle swing at all. Once again his highest totals came against Indian spinners in dead pitches of Pakistan. What I saw of him was not very impressive. I will have to dig the scorecard against Australia to have a proper context but my initial reaction is still the same. Vishy was class and Zaheer was not.

[Khota]

@Harsh Thakor I think there is lot of confusion in this thread. I have stated before multiple times cricket does not know how to do averages. It is immature and juvenile on part of any expert who comes and states cricket averages. That truly shows their lack of knowledge of game and stats. Till cricket puts context and weightage to opposition bowling these averages in cricket mean nothing. They are just useless. Like I said I have seen him play and he was clueless against Kapil.

[Number]

Wasn't Vishwanath better than Sachin Gavaskar in the other thread.

Here you are comparing him with Zaheer Abbas.

[Deleted_User_1]

Tere bakwas mujhe de de Thakor!!

[rkt.india]

15 hours ago, Khota said:

@Harsh Thakor I think there is lot of confusion in this thread. I have stated before multiple times cricket does not know how to do averages. It is immature and juvenile on part of any expert who comes and states cricket averages. That truly shows their lack of knowledge of game and stats. Till cricket puts context and weightage to opposition bowling these averages in cricket mean nothing. They are just useless. Like I said I have seen him play and he was clueless against Kapil.

SRT was also at times clueless against Anderson.