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CommonMan

Foreign players in England squad

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Jofra Archer - West Indies

Ben Stokes - Newzealand

Eoin Morgan - Ireland

Tom Curran - SouthAfrica

Jason Roy - SouthAfrica

 

with so many foreign players in the squad, should this team be called England cricket team ? :thinking:

fcuk kolpak!

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3 minutes ago, CommonMan said:

Jofra Archer - West Indies

Ben Stokes - Newzealand

Eoin Morgan - Ireland

Tom Curran - SouthAfrica

Jason Roy - SouthAfrica

 

with so many foreign players in the squad, should this team be called England cricket team ? :thinking:

fcuk kolpak!

Tom Curran is from Zimbabwe  ?

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Andrew Strauss

Mathew Prior

Kevin Pietersen

Jonathan Trott

Gary Ballance

Keaton Jennings

Michael Lumb

Craig Kieswetter

Dawid Malan

Boyd Rankin 

Sam Robson

Chris Jordan 

Sam Curran

 

Just a few who are not English, but played for England. 

 

 

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45 minutes ago, Norman said:

Andrew Strauss

Mathew Prior

Kevin Pietersen

Jonathan Trott

Gary Ballance

Keaton Jennings

Michael Lumb

Craig Kieswetter

Dawid Malan

Boyd Rankin 

Sam Robson

Chris Jordan 

Sam Curran

 

Just a few who are not English, but played for England. 

 

 

So what makes someone 'English' then?

Edited by Stumped

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6 minutes ago, sandeep said:

Enlighten us why don't you?  Voting for Brexit?:thinking:

I'm looking for his viewpoint on it given his odd list. Not sure where you'd get that assumption, I'm not the one labelling lifelong British citizens as 'not English'.

Edited by Stumped

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38 minutes ago, Stumped said:

I'm looking for his viewpoint on it given his odd list. Not sure where you'd get that assumption, I'm not the one labelling lifelong British citizens as 'not English'.

Is the captain of the English ODI team English?  

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54 minutes ago, sandeep said:

Is the captain of the English ODI team English?  

I'm assuming you're after my personal view. Yes, anyone who plays for England is English even if born abroad. They've lived here for years, become local citizens, been part of the community and our sporting system and most importantly decided they want to live in and represent England.

 

In Morgan's particular case he's a British citizen who's spent a significant (maybe even majority) portion of his life in England. He's been playing cricket here since he was a young teen and has held a life long ambition of representing the country. What other people want to make of that is up to them.

Edited by Stumped

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Boring. Change the record.

 

We may have invented the game but we don't have 1 billion lovers of the game who dream of playing cricket for the national team

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1 minute ago, Stumped said:

Are you after my personal view? Yes, anyone who plays for England is English even if born abroad. They've lived here for years, become local citizens, been part of our sporting system and most importantly decided they want to represent England.

 

In Morgan's particular case he's a British citizen who's spent a significant (maybe even majority) portion of his life in England. He's been playing cricket here since he was a young teen and has held a life long ambition of representing the country. What other people want to make of that is up to them.

Fully agree

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He also leads the national team with dignity and pride. One of the nicest most genuine guys in international cricket 

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5 hours ago, YCCC said:

He also leads the national team with dignity and pride. One of the nicest most genuine guys in international cricket 

Don't get me wrong - I love Morgan, and think he's one of the main reasons England's white ball team are as good as they are.  And I honestly don't care that much about England's 'foreign legion'.  Me and Stumped go way back with our 'banter', and this was simply too easy a layup to pass up.  

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I don't mind, allows opportunities for good players still be involved in the biggest international event which they would have been denied playing for their ex-countries...mainly players from SA and WI.

 

For example I just couldn't see SA picking Jason Roy in their XI with him being white and his playing style. 

 

Edited by chewy

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2 hours ago, Norman said:

May be a few simple criteria like  say "actually born in England.". 

That's not your criteria though when you have someone born in England on your list .

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If they want to play for England and are qualified I don't speak the problem. All these players have called England home for a long time. Some such as Roy and Curran have played all their professional cricket here and learnt the game at English schools and clubs and now choose to have their life, a wife and kids, in England (not mention having family ties to the country through parents). Everything they have in a cricketing sense and in their life outside cricket is from England.

 

You are not tied to where you happened to come out of  your mother's hole. Such an ourdated concept in the modern world where you could be starting a new  life in NZ or America this time tomorrow

Edited by YCCC

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2 hours ago, Vilander said:

India does not have 1 billion cricket followers or aspiring players either.

It has ten times more than us though, at least 

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4 hours ago, Norman said:

Who ? 

You compiled the list so you must know where each was born . You checked didn't you before trying to make your point ?:biggrin:

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15 minutes ago, Tattieboy said:

You compiled the list so you must know where each was born . You checked didn't you before trying to make your point ?:biggrin:

Okay you've lost me. Let me get it right. 

You've quoted me saying that there is someone in my list who is actually born inn England. And I asked who?  Because all the players in my list are not born in England. But still are playing for England. 

Hope you got me. 

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15 minutes ago, Norman said:

Okay you've lost me. Let me get it right. 

You've quoted me saying that there is someone in my list who is actually born inn England. And I asked who?  Because all the players in my list are not born in England. But still are playing for England. 

Hope you got me. 

They are not all born outside England !! Do your research before posting and especially do it when called out on your post .

I will give you a clue , Northampton is in England 

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I don't have a problem with people like Morgan who grew up in England, and are a product of English cricket. But somebody like Archer who plays U-19 for WI, and is groomed by WI cricket suddenly being poached to play for England doesn't sound acceptable

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50 minutes ago, Tattieboy said:

They are not all born outside England !! Do your research before posting and especially do it when called out on your post .

I will give you a clue , Northampton is in England 

Sam Curran's dad is former Zimbabwe Cricketer Ben Curran. When Ben was playing county cricket for Northamptonshire and possibly his wife was there too , Sam was born. That does not make him English as Ben Curran is a Zimbabwean. And tell you what, Sam Curran was brought up in Zimbabwe up until he was 10. 

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Just now, Norman said:

Sam Curran's dad is former Zimbabwe Cricketer Ben Curran. When Ben was playing county cricket for Northamptonshire and possibly his wife was there too , Sam was born. That does not make him English as Ben Curran is a Zimbabwean. And tell you what, Sam Curran was brought up in Zimbabwe up until he was 10. 

If you are going to quote get it right!!! His dad was Kevin . 

What was your quote earlier " actually born in England" !!! 

:hysterical: give up every post is making you more stupid than the last 

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3 minutes ago, Tattieboy said:

If you are going to quote get it right!!! His dad was Kevin . 

What was your quote earlier " actually born in England" !!! 

:hysterical: give up every post is making you more stupid than the last 

Sorry I goofed up about his dad's name. :cantstop:  But doesn't matter anyways. 

 

Okay here it is. Suppose if  Ziva was born in Sydney when Sakshi was staying with Dhoni during the 2015 world cup. Okay ? 

Does that make Ziva an Australian? 

 

May be I should have made it more clearer that one should be "born and raised". But you should have got that. 

 

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2 minutes ago, maniac said:

@Tattieboy don’t you find it offensive that no Scotsman has been poached while an Irishman has been made captain :giggle: . I think that McLeod guy I think  the opener is pretty good but England have embarrassment of riches in that area.

 

Where is the pride 

 

braveheart_a_p.jpg

He is not an opener , he is a failed bowler who know bats 4  ..... I actually sat with his mum and dad when he played his first Scotland U13 game . 

No don't feel offended , all the boys are committed to Scotland and feel they can get test status . We are a squad of home grown talent no Indians or Pakistanis parachuted in for residency .

As a team it's unbelievable the progress we have made in the last few years for an associate country to go toe to toe with this current England team and score 375 and out score them . 

It would be great if India would play us  as we have accomadated hundreds of Test and Ranji players in Scottish cricket over the last 50 years . 

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15 minutes ago, Norman said:

Sorry I goofed up about his dad's name. :cantstop:  But doesn't matter anyways. 

 

Okay here it is. Suppose if  Ziva was born in Sydney when Sakshi was staying with Dhoni during the 2015 world cup. Okay ? 

Does that make Ziva an Australian? 

 

May be I should have made it more clearer that one should be "born and raised". But you should have got that. 

 

Yeah I get it , suddenly " actually born in England " doesn't fit the narrative so you change it .

He and others play for England and no rules are being broken!!.......Deal with it 

oh and by the way ship all those Indians home playing cricket for countries on residency rule first before you start bleating about England and I would have more respect for your view 

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1 minute ago, Tattieboy said:

Yeah I get it , suddenly " actually born in England " doesn't fit the narrative so you change it .

He and others play for England and no rules are being broken!!.......Deal with it 

oh and by the way ship all those Indians home playing cricket for countries on residency rule first before you start bleating about England and I would have more respect for your view 

No rules are broken and yes the players are well within their rights to earn their living and move to greener pastures.

 

I think the OP’s point was that makes the game a little off balance.

 

You can neither stop England or SA,WI players from migrating. 

 

Archer in the WI line up would have added to their team which is light on bowling but has incredible hitters.

 

Stokes and Curran I can understand they moved to England early and not for purely cricketing reasons.

 

But Irish cricket would have benefitted from Morgan. I think they poached another batsman who played a few tests and a  fast bowler too briefly who have since then gone back. 

 

I personally think SA’s racial quota is way way more harmful to cricket than WICB ineptness or English poaching.

 

The players playing for their respective countries would have made cricket better. It is not illegal but just sad. ICC needs to step in. I think in the past didn’t they have a rule that a team can consist of only a certain % of expats? Since then they have removed it I think

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Just now, maniac said:

No rules are broken and yes the players are well within their rights to earn their living and move to greener pastures.

 

I think the OP’s point was that makes the game a little off balance.

 

You can neither stop England or SA,WI players from migrating. 

 

Archer in the WI line up would have added to their team which is light on bowling but has incredible hitters.

 

Stokes and Curran I can understand they moved to England early and not for purely cricketing reasons.

 

But Irish cricket would have benefitted from Morgan. I think they poached another batsman who played a few tests and a  fast bowler too briefly who have since then gone back. 

 

I personally think SA’s racial quota is way way more harmful to cricket than WICB ineptness or English poaching.

 

The players playing for their respective countries would have made cricket better. It is not illegal but just sad. ICC needs to step in. I think in the past didn’t they have a rule that a team can consist of only a certain % of expats? Since then they have removed it I think

In the past Scottish and Irish players who were attached to English counties were refused permission to play for their countries. 

A few Scottish players have played for England because there was a difference between Test and Associate teams . They never played each other , now that gap is closing .

When Morgan made the decision he wanted to play for England he was very young and no one foreseen Ireland becoming a Test Nation . Morgan has had very little to do with Irish cricket . 

As long as the rules are not broken that's fine by me , what the rules are is a different story but international cricket needs to expand not retract 

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Ironically, Indians and Chinese are among the largest communities with “foreign” citizenships 

 

I would expect British Indians, Australians Indians, NZ Indians, SA Indians, etc., to support their respective home teams (country of their major citizenship), who are test playing nations. Ind can be their 2nd team

 

Many of these countries could allow duel citizenships so that brings flexibility as well on whom to support/ play for

Edited by zen

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