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Ankit_sharma03

Evident weaknesses of every teams post few games

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1. Australia 

  • Huge Diff Post Starc n cummins . Coulter nile n Zampa doesnt look that threatening post starc n cummins spell. So teams can plan to play out starc smartly and  then target zampa, NCN, stonis , maxwel

 

2. West indies

  • Carlos who doesnt add much as bowler or batsman 
  • Spin bowling dept - nurse.....pretty useless
  • Extras - they have pace n bounce but that also comes with extras which can be diff in close games

 

3.  England

  • Post archer the bowling isnt that threatening specially on Pattas

 

4. Pakistan

  • short pitch bowling 
  • inconsistency which can be costly when only 4 teams will go forward 
  • Behind on NRR

 

5. New Zealand

  • Lacks killer instict 
  • collapse under presssure. Yesterday they got of jail against Bangladesh but Had it been India or AUS they wud have not let it go easily 

 

6. South africa

  • Injuries
  • Form of every batsman
  • One man bowling attack
  • mentally week 

 

 

No point talking about SL n Afghanistan . India have just played one game so cant say much 

 

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Indian bowling depends too much on bumrah. Yes chahal got wicket but i don't think he will be that effective against other sides. You can say other teams will play bumrah's overs safely. Kuldeep already not at his best. Chahal isn't unplayable. Bhuvi, Hardik can easily be smacked.

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10 minutes ago, Nikola said:

Indian bowling depends too much on bumrah. Yes chahal got wicket but i don't think he will be that effective against other sides. You can say other teams will play bumrah's overs safely. Kuldeep already not at his best. Chahal isn't unplayable. Bhuvi, Hardik can easily be smacked.

I agree on Chahal. He can be a weak link at times. Chahal does well on helpful tracks but he has failed miserably on flat tracks where its hard to hide him on the field and he gets taken to cleaners big time. We have seen Guptill-lookalike taking him to cleaners in South Africa when Chahal could not contain or take wicket and also in many games. 

 

I hope Chahal clicks but when player is attacking he gets intimidated easily. Hopefully he can develop some more deliveries to outsmart the batsman on a flat track who will look to attack him anyhow. There in lies a bonus for him that he always has a chance of a wicket since batsman is going to attack him.He just needs to be a bit more smart when such a moment arise again. 

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1 hour ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

1. Australia 

  • Huge Diff Post Starc n cummins . Coulter nile n Zampa doesnt look that threatening post starc n cummins spell. So teams can plan to play out starc smartly and  then target zampa, NCN, stonis , maxwel

 

Starc needs to be attacked or someone whom players need to approach and play positively and lot of teams can score big runs against Australia. Same with Cummins. Togther, they both make a handy duo who can win Australia the cup, but there in lies the opportunity for many teams to not give them any wicket and bat agains their ego and wait for the bowling changes. Finch can be in real trouble that way and might be put to test to pick and chose the bowlers to bring into attack. 

 

 

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6 minutes ago, Cricketics said:

Starc needs to be attacked or someone whom players need to approach and play positively and lot of teams can score big runs against Australia. Same with Cummins. Togther, they both make a handy duo who can win Australia the cup, but there in lies the opportunity for many teams to not give them any wicket and bat agains their ego and wait for the bowling changes. Finch can be in real trouble that way and might be put to test to pick and chose the bowlers to bring into attack. 

 

 

Starc needs to be attacked by the player who can and acc to situation 

For eg- someone like Rohit can as he has played him well over the years but not someone like pandya, jadhav, russell as they come in situation where 1 wkt down and team is in trouble. Starc has gr8 yorker n short one so these players need to be more careful. 

 

Cummins can be attacked as his pace is less then starc . Better play keep rotating strike against starc and he will give u loose balls . If u attack other 3-4 bowlers the score wud be big enough as 350-400 arent happening nyways . 

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Indian attack is the most balanced IMO - outside of the 5th bowler change the skills vis-a-vis time of the play is pretty even ( with Bumrah in Starc/Cummins/Rabada level obviously but Bhuvi or Shami and kulcha are pretty good).

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33 minutes ago, Cricketics said:

I agree on Chahal. He can be a weak link at times. Chahal does well on helpful tracks but he has failed miserably on flat tracks where its hard to hide him on the field and he gets taken to cleaners big time. We have seen Guptill-lookalike taking him to cleaners in South Africa when Chahal could not contain or take wicket and also in many games. 

 

I hope Chahal clicks but when player is attacking he gets intimidated easily. Hopefully he can develop some more deliveries to outsmart the batsman on a flat track who will look to attack him anyhow. There in lies a bonus for him that he always has a chance of a wicket since batsman is going to attack him.He just needs to be a bit more smart when such a moment arise again. 

Chahal has a technique these days. He did well in chinna ground this year IPL. What Chahal does these days he targets the leg stump not giving any room to free their arms. FOr a rightie ball always comes in an leaves away.  They can still line him up and attack. In Australia he bowled beautifully.  Some of these grounds are not small. You need to hit really well to clear the boundary.

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3 minutes ago, Vilander said:

Indian attack is the most balanced IMO - outside of the 5th bowler change the skills vis-a-vis time of the play is pretty even ( with Bumrah in Starc/Cummins/Rabada level obviously but Bhuvi or Shami and kulcha are pretty good).

Most definitely. We may have bad days. But we are not the team that will have to shut the shop and play defensive after first spell. We can attack right through 50 overs.

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10 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

Most definitely. We may have bad days. But we are not the team that will have to shut the shop and play defensive after first spell. We can attack right through 50 overs.

was expecting much more from Pandya in England - disappointing so far.

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7 minutes ago, Vilander said:

was expecting much more from Pandya in England - disappointing so far.

Since his injury he is not quiet the same. I will be happy if he can nick a wicket or two here to support others.

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32 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

Chahal has a technique these days. He did well in chinna ground this year IPL. What Chahal does these days he targets the leg stump not giving any room to free their arms. FOr a rightie ball always comes in an leaves away.  They can still line him up and attack. In Australia he bowled beautifully.  Some of these grounds are not small. You need to hit really well to clear the boundary.

Hoping he can do similar thing what you are trying to say. Time will decide. In t20, the batsmen doesn't have much time and hence attack more, in 50 overs batsmen can pick and chose which ball to hit since there is less pressure of run are in this format. 

 

Agree about the ground size. They are not small like the ones in NZ, you still got to clear it. 

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We can add more potency to our attack by adding Shami in place of Bhuvi,but then we are the only team in this competition which has a genuine tail

Bhuvi(although i don't think he has that batting ability for odis)is the only one in lower middle order who can score few runs but only at the expense of blunt and mediocre bowling....

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I did not read through all the posts. NZ , Afghanistan and SL - I have not followed much.

 

India - No 4 slot unsettled, no 6 ( or 7, Jadhav) is a dilemma still, One Pacer short in the squad

Bangladesh - No good no 3. Shakib at best is 4. Lack of Quality spinner

England - The name and history in WC is the biggest weakness

Australia - 3 openers in playing 11 making Usman not as effective. Marcus Stoinis is not playing up to potential

WI - Lack of quality spinner. No solid batsman who can pull them out of disasters like 20 for 3 

Pak - Fragile batting after Babar. Lack of Quality spinner. Clueless Captain

SA - too many weaknesses. Rabada is the only strength

 

Edited by Haarkarjeetgaye

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Taklu OP doesn't mention that without Jaddu at number 8 our batting is light. The original 3D player. Lords test, smacking Anderson, demolishing Eng with big hits in tests in India too. Gun aggressive player at Rajkot with triple centuries. 

 

My team for Aus game:

 

Rohit, Gabbar, Kohli, Rahul, Dhoni (kaptan/wkt), Jhadav, Pandya, Jaddu, Shami, Chahal, Bumrah

 

BK is cannon fodder in general in ODIS and kuldeep is mentally disintegrated and Aus demolished him last time. Also an average game against SA and of course he can't bat though somehow he has a FC 100 maybe in gully cricket.  Phielding is average at best.

 

Another idea I had is trial an extra batsman in some easier game and drop one bowler. Jhadav can give us 10 overs mixed with Shankar, bring them out when a wicket falls. Dinesh Mongia days.

 

Rohit, Gabbar, Kohli, Rahul, MAHI, Jhadav, Kartick/Shankar, Pandya, Chahal, Shami, Bumrah

Edited by ViruDilSeKhelo

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On 6/6/2019 at 11:54 PM, Ankit_sharma03 said:

1. Australia 

  • Huge Diff Post Starc n cummins . Coulter nile n Zampa doesnt look that threatening post starc n cummins spell. So teams can plan to play out starc smartly and  then target zampa, NCN, stonis , maxwel

 

To Add cummins can be hit for runs at death as well 

 

On 6/6/2019 at 11:54 PM, Ankit_sharma03 said:

3.  England

  • Post archer the bowling isnt that threatening specially on Pattas

 

Commies were saying Adil rashid has shoulder issues and is having continuous treatment which is also affecting his googly and neither he is in form. So teams can target him knowing he wont bowl much of googly 

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On 6/6/2019 at 3:53 PM, Nikola said:

Indian bowling depends too much on bumrah. Yes chahal got wicket but i don't think he will be that effective against other sides. You can say other teams will play bumrah's overs safely. Kuldeep already not at his best. Chahal isn't unplayable. Bhuvi, Hardik can easily be smacked.

After today's game against Australia, Indian team seems to have fewer weaknesses than any other team. There were some serious doubts about both Sharma and Dhawan's form, both have hit tons . Kuldeep lacked confidence, had a good game today. Other than one 19 runs over, Pandya bowled well and bowled 10 overs. Every one in the team looks in good nick. 

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1 hour ago, First class said:

After today's game against Australia, Indian team seems to have fewer weaknesses than any other team. There were some serious doubts about both Sharma and Dhawan's form, both have hit tons . Kuldeep lacked confidence, had a good game today. Other than one 19 runs over, Pandya bowled well and bowled 10 overs. Every one in the team looks in good nick. 

I don't think Kuldeep had a particularly good game. He bowled mostly against a struggling Warner, a cautious Smith and Khawaja who were looking to tuk-tuk initially. In the last few overs, he got hit by Max and co. More importantly, he and Chahal were selected for their capacity to take wkts and he has only 1 wkt across 2 matches. If someone like BK performed at his level, people would be baying for his blood. Our 4th and 5th bowlers (Kuldeep, Hardik and Jadhav) represent a weakness, although perhaps it will be addressed in the coming games.

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2 hours ago, Vijy said:

More importantly, he and Chahal were selected for their capacity to take wkts and he has only 1 wkt across 2 matches. If someone like BK performed at his level, people would be baying for his blood.

You must've missed the last 3 years then or does 1 game change your opinion of statistically our worst front-line bowler in this squad? The other guy is statistically the best, especially against SENA :bebored:

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16 minutes ago, R!TTER said:

You must've missed the last 3 years then or does 1 game change your opinion of statistically our worst front-line bowler in this squad? The other guy is statistically the best, especially against SENA :bebored:

I don't care particularly about bilaterals when it comes to ODIs and T20s (obviously not applicable to Tests). What matters more to me are the multi-nation tourneys, of which Champions Trophy and WC are examples. In Statsguru, selecting 5+ tournaments, here are the records:

BK:  22 matches, Avg 28.21, ER 4.39

Bumrah: 11 matches, Avg 25.52, ER 4.48

Shami: 11 matches, Avg 20.15, ER 5.32

Ishant: 12 matches, Avg 31.42, ER 5.76

 

IMO, both Shami and BK should be playing since Kuldeep is down on confidence and these pitches give him no purchase. As you can see above, BK has done pretty decently (esp in terms of ER) in multi-nation tourneys. The fact that he may be the worst bowler of this bunch in bilaterals is not particularly important to me personally. What matters is whether he contributes in this WC, and he has begun well.

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I wouldn't put WC in the same bracket as any other 5+ multilateral series, like Asia Cup, including the CT. WC has its own set of challenges & the pressure is unparalleled, we should take one game at a time & decide the combo based on conditions. What if the next pitch is also dry, would Shami be the obviously better choice then? There's also Jadhav's utility which will be questioned if he's not bowling or batting.

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On 6/6/2019 at 4:05 PM, Cricketics said:

I agree on Chahal. He can be a weak link at times. Chahal does well on helpful tracks but he has failed miserably on flat tracks where its hard to hide him on the field and he gets taken to cleaners big time. We have seen Guptill-lookalike taking him to cleaners in South Africa when Chahal could not contain or take wicket and also in many games. 

 

I hope Chahal clicks but when player is attacking he gets intimidated easily. Hopefully he can develop some more deliveries to outsmart the batsman on a flat track who will look to attack him anyhow. There in lies a bonus for him that he always has a chance of a wicket since batsman is going to attack him.He just needs to be a bit more smart when such a moment arise again. 

Must be why he keeps getting Maxwell out.  

 

In non-helpful conditions, in high-scoring games - Chahal > Kuldeep.  Its not close.

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9 hours ago, Vijy said:

I don't care particularly about bilaterals when it comes to ODIs and T20s (obviously not applicable to Tests). What matters more to me are the multi-nation tourneys, of which Champions Trophy and WC are examples. In Statsguru, selecting 5+ tournaments, here are the records:

BK:  22 matches, Avg 28.21, ER 4.39

Bumrah: 11 matches, Avg 25.52, ER 4.48

Shami: 11 matches, Avg 20.15, ER 5.32

Ishant: 12 matches, Avg 31.42, ER 5.76

 

IMO, both Shami and BK should be playing since Kuldeep is down on confidence and these pitches give him no purchase. As you can see above, BK has done pretty decently (esp in terms of ER) in multi-nation tourneys. The fact that he may be the worst bowler of this bunch in bilaterals is not particularly important to me personally. What matters is whether he contributes in this WC, and he has begun well.

but, but, but, his cumulative career numbers!!  

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6 minutes ago, sandeep said:

 

In non-helpful conditions, in high-scoring games - Chahal > Kuldeep.  Its not close.

That looks like the case so far in this wc. But I do feel kuldip even though he looked ordinary at times yesterday, did bowl well in patch with Chahal around those 30th over mark, where he did not let Smith or Warner score big runs or get boundaries. He did bowl short stuff as he could not control the the length at times like it happens with many leggies, but I do feel there is place for Kuldeep against teams like NZ.

 

I would bring Shami against Pakistan, as Pak would probably play spinners better than NZ or England, but I would probably keep both spinners for NZ game. Again, we also have to look at the pitch, but without seeing the pitch, at least this is what I feel. 

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13 minutes ago, Cricketics said:

That looks like the case so far in this wc.

I have observed this through multiple games over the last year or so.  Chahal got the  benefit of playing for RCB in that high-scoring Banglore stadium.  Its helped him handle it a bit better.  Of course, at the end of the day, any spinner can be tonked on a given day.  But I've been saying it for more than a year now - for ODI and T20 cricket, the pecking order is Chahal 1st, Kuldeep 2nd. 

 

 

Back on topic of the thread - I think India's weaknesses have been apparent to us well before the WC started. 

  1. A massive dependence on Hardik Pandya to hit us to defendable scores when batting first.  
  2. A 6th bowler (jadhav) whose effectiveness defies logic
  3. That's about it. 

 

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34 minutes ago, sandeep said:

I have observed this through multiple games over the last year or so.  Chahal got the  benefit of playing for RCB in that high-scoring Banglore stadium.  Its helped him handle it a bit better.  Of course, at the end of the day, any spinner can be tonked on a given day.  But I've been saying it for more than a year now - for ODI and T20 cricket, the pecking order is Chahal 1st, Kuldeep 2nd. 

 

 

Back on topic of the thread - I think India's weaknesses have been apparent to us well before the WC started. 

  1. A massive dependence on Hardik Pandya to hit us to defendable scores when batting first.  
  2. A 6th bowler (jadhav) whose effectiveness defies logic
  3. That's about it. 

 

Valid points. Regarding Jadhav, I do hope he gets to bat ahead of others in a game or two down the line if we have 10 overs remaining and are looking to cross the par score. Just like we sent in Panda, we need to start sending Jadhav earlier just so that the pressure is not all on him when we are chasing at times. I have almost forgotten when I last saw him bat. We know he has played well when given the opportunity but it will be good to see him get to play in a match situation again as he definitely hasn't batted enough in a game situation in recent history. It is not easy to come out swinging every time. 

 

 

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1 hour ago, sandeep said:

I have observed this through multiple games over the last year or so.  Chahal got the  benefit of playing for RCB in that high-scoring Banglore stadium.  Its helped him handle it a bit better.  Of course, at the end of the day, any spinner can be tonked on a given day.  But I've been saying it for more than a year now - for ODI and T20 cricket, the pecking order is Chahal 1st, Kuldeep 2nd.  

 

 

Back on topic of the thread - I think India's weaknesses have been apparent to us well before the WC started. 

  1. A massive dependence on Hardik Pandya to hit us to defendable scores when batting first.  
  2. A 6th bowler (jadhav) whose effectiveness defies logic
  3. That's about it. 

 

We may also have issues with chasing, especially if the start provided by the openers is slow and then one of them gets out.

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1 hour ago, Cricketics said:

Valid points. Regarding Jadhav, I do hope he gets to bat ahead of others in a game or two down the line if we have 10 overs remaining and are looking to cross the par score. Just like we sent in Panda, we need to start sending Jadhav earlier just so that the pressure is not all on him when we are chasing at times. I have almost forgotten when I last saw him bat. We know he has played well when given the opportunity but it will be good to see him get to play in a match situation again as he definitely hasn't batted enough in a game situation in recent history. It is not easy to come out swinging every time. 

 

 

Agree.  He needs time out in the middle.   He'll get it hopefully soon - long enough league stage to get his chances.  Jadhav's batting is underrated, and his bowling is overrated.  India have a 5 over problem with their current XI.  Its a ticking time-bomb.  I know Pandya gave us 9 overs yesterday, and did OK apart from that one big over.  But the team shouldn't plan on more than 5-6 overs from him.  On a day like yesterday if the 4th bowler (kuldeep/Shami) is getting spanked, and Jadhav is getting smoked - that's a problem.   

 

Almost makes me consider a gamble on a Jadeja for Jadhav swap, if we think that Rahul is in good flow, Dhoni and Pandya are doing well,  and the top order is firing as well.   But then I'm superstitious and think that Jadeja is a panauti selection for WCs.  So that's the end of that. 

 

I don't want to overstate it, we are a very solid team that can only lose games 3 ways - early batting collapse of the top order, or falling short about 20 runs with the bat, or conceding 20 runs too few.  I'd expect us to win 8 out of 10 games without breaking a sweat, regardless of conditions or opponent.  Its a weird place to be as an Indian fan.

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1 minute ago, Vijy said:

We may also have issues with chasing, especially if the start provided by the openers is slow and then one of them gets out.

Its great that we won yesterday and all.  But I can't help but respect Australia's fightback.  I wish our team could emulate that never-give-up batting mindset.   Honestly speaking, we are much much worse chasing.  Unless our top order fires, meaning one of them scores a run-a-ball century or better, I wouldn't expect an Indian team to muster a 316 chasing 353. They are much more likely to just fold over.  

 

Of course, Australia made their share of mistakes with the bat too - shouldn't have left it so late to begin with.  But it was an admirable fightback.  

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30 minutes ago, sandeep said:

Its great that we won yesterday and all.  But I can't help but respect Australia's fightback.  I wish our team could emulate that never-give-up batting mindset.   Honestly speaking, we are much much worse chasing.  Unless our top order fires, meaning one of them scores a run-a-ball century or better, I wouldn't expect an Indian team to muster a 316 chasing 353. They are much more likely to just fold over.  

 

Of course, Australia made their share of mistakes with the bat too - shouldn't have left it so late to begin with.  But it was an admirable fightback.  

yes, I was never sure of winning until the last 2-3 overs which just shows how much their resilience has been stamped on all cricket fans.

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On 6/6/2019 at 11:54 PM, Ankit_sharma03 said:

1. Australia 

  • Huge Diff Post Starc n cummins . Coulter nile n Zampa doesnt look that threatening post starc n cummins spell. So teams can plan to play out starc smartly and  then target zampa, NCN, stonis , maxwel

 

2. West indies

  • Carlos who doesnt add much as bowler or batsman 
  • Spin bowling dept - nurse.....pretty useless
  • Extras - they have pace n bounce but that also comes with extras which can be diff in close games

 

3.  England

  • Post archer the bowling isnt that threatening specially on Pattas

 

4. Pakistan

  • short pitch bowling 
  • inconsistency which can be costly when only 4 teams will go forward 
  •  Behind on NRR

 

5. New Zealand

  • Lacks killer instict 
  • collapse under presssure. Yesterday they got of jail against Bangladesh but Had it been India or AUS they wud have not let it go easily 

 

6. South africa

  • Injuries
  • Form of every batsman
  • One man bowling attack
  • mentally week 

  

 

No point talking about SL n Afghanistan . India have just played one game so cant say much 

 

 

  • mentally weak 

eb9.jpg

Edited by velu

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On 6/7/2019 at 2:23 AM, Vilander said:

was expecting much more from Pandya in England - disappointing so far.

I thought he did well in last match except for that one over . Going at 7 rpo is not so bad on that pitch for a 3rd seamer

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With Dhawan gone for few matches ( Most likely Rahul will take his batting spot) .It does seem India's middle order is back to what it was Before the wc and looks fragile again .

 

 

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On 6/6/2019 at 11:54 PM, Ankit_sharma03 said:

1. Australia 

  • Huge Diff Post Starc n cummins . Coulter nile n Zampa doesnt look that threatening post starc n cummins spell. So teams can plan to play out starc smartly and  then target zampa, NCN, stonis , maxwel

 

Apart from Maxwell they lack power hitter in lower order

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Many of the weaknesses mentioned are due to choices that the teams have made. For e.g. Aus have gone for ARs/bowlers who can bat well to do the seam 3rd/4th bowling when they had the option to pick likes of Hazelwood. Similarly, Eng has made some strategic selections too. WI has backed its strengths. Teams like SA are hampered by injuries so could not put its pace attack together. And so on. 

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5 hours ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

Apart from Maxwell they lack power hitter in lower order

Mitch Marsh played some brilliant knocks a few years back in Champions league. He just fell off the radar. They are so similar to us in batting. Top 3+ Pandya in their case Top 3+ Maxwell

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12 minutes ago, maniac said:

Mitch Marsh played some brilliant knocks a few years back in Champions league. He just fell off the radar. They are so similar to us in batting. Top 3+ Pandya in their case Top 3+ Maxwell

but marsh is still a cover.....stonis hasnt been officaly ruled out. They are waiting on stonis fitness like our TM on dhawan 

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7 minutes ago, velu said:

i really cant find any weakness in our playing xi ..

we should be sleep walking to the semis 

let India loose it's first game (hopefully not in knockout) and you will find 100's of weakness then lol.

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33 minutes ago, Nikola said:

let India loose it's first game (hopefully not in knockout) and you will find 100's of weakness then lol.

Middle order is still a problem for India imo .India's top three will have to score heavily evidently in almost all the matches .

 

India's Tail batting avg is must be among the worst in this tournament .

Edited by Stuge

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