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Ind vs Pak Pre-Match Discussion (WC19)

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Game is at Old Trafford on 06/16.  Concerns/Questions:

 

  • ICC Tournament Champion Dhawan is unavailable
  • Opener and #4 slot
  • Inclusion of Shami as a part of a 4 pronged pace attack 

 

Ind could try the following:

 

Rohit

Rahul 

Kohli 

Dhoni 

Pandya

2 from DK/Jadhav/Jadeja

Bhuvi

Shami

Chahal

Bumrah

 

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2 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

Opener- Rahul

No.4- shankar

 

Shankar came in as 1st choice for No.4 and we shud stick with our plan-A, IF a top side like India panics and changes their plan-a without it being failed....well that show self doubt for no reason

Kohli had said that #4 was not decided even after the squad was announced so I do not know where you got plan A from. Discussing the utility of a player does not equate to plans 

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10 minutes ago, zen said:

Kohli had said that #4 was not decided even after the squad was announced so I do not know where you got plan A from. Discussing the utility of a player does not equate to plans 

MSK prasad said Shankar was going to be choice for no.4 and KL was just going as backup opener. Karthik has been termed as finishers now by TM for some time now. Who else do u think was their choice for no.4 ???

KL had to bat at no.4 in warmup coz shankar was injured and he score runs. 

 

https://www.crictracker.com/world-cup-2019-msk-prasad-names-team-indias-no-4-batsman-for-the-tournament/

 

and btw going by the reports shankar was suppose to bat at 4 today and rahul open

Edited by Ankit_sharma03

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1 hour ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

MSK prasad said Shankar was going to be choice for no.4 and KL was just going as backup opener. Karthik has been termed as finishers now by TM for some time now. Who else do u think was their choice for no.4 ???

KL had to bat at no.4 in warmup coz shankar was injured and he score runs. 

 

https://www.crictracker.com/world-cup-2019-msk-prasad-names-team-indias-no-4-batsman-for-the-tournament/

 

and btw going by the reports shankar was suppose to bat at 4 today and rahul open

I clearly mentioned - "Kohli had said that #4 was not decided even after the squad was announced  ...."

 

http://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/26554052/who-bats-where-world-cup-decision-later-virat-kohli

 

 

"India captain Virat Kohli agrees that Vijay Shankar offers balance to the Indian batting order, but has not committed to the Tamil Nadu allrounder batting at No. 4.

 

On Monday, after announcing India's World Cup squad, MSK Prasad, the chairman of selectors, said that Vijay was identified as the No. 4.

 

However, Kohli agreed with Prasad only to the extent that Vijay was a "three-dimensional" player and a better choice compared to the other options and combinations that India had tried out in the past."

 

 

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First and Foremost thing we should keep in mind ,whichever team wins ...It's the cricket who is the real winner in the end ( आखिर कार जीत क्रिकेट की ही होती है ।)

Edited by Stuge

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1 minute ago, zen said:

I clearly mentioned - "Kohli had said that #4 was not decided even after the squad was announced  ...."

 

http://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/26554052/who-bats-where-world-cup-decision-later-virat-kohli

 

 

"India captain Virat Kohli agrees that Vijay Shankar offers balance to the Indian batting order, but has not committed to the Tamil Nadu allrounder batting at No. 4.

 

On Monday, after announcing India's World Cup squad, MSK Prasad, the chairman of selectors, said that Vijay was identified as the No. 4.

 

However, Kohli agreed with Prasad only to the extent that Vijay was a "three-dimensional" player and a better choice compared to the other options and combinations that India had tried out in the past."

 

 

i still wanna then who ? coz they labelled karthik finisher long ago and rightly so 

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8 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

i still wanna then who ? coz they labelled karthik finisher long ago and rightly so 

In the warm-up game vs. BD, KL, who got a low score vs NZ, still batted at 4, while Shankar was slotted at 5 (failed miserably with both bat and ball)

Edited by zen

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1 hour ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

Opener- Rahul

No.4- shankar

 

Shankar came in as 1st choice for No.4 and we shud stick with our plan-A, IF a top side like India panics and changes their plan-a without it being failed....well that show self doubt for no reason

Very well put. 

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Whoever wins toss bat's first. India can chase 275 pak could chase 260. Score 300 batting first and game is yours. If track has some help then Shankar's addition as bowler also helps. Kuldeep is struggling and I wonder if jaddu will get a game to strengthen batting given new opener with shankar and kedar haven't spent any time in middle. 

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48 minutes ago, zen said:

In the warm-up game vs. BD, KL, who got a low score vs NZ, still batted at 4, while Shankar was slotted at 5 (failed miserably with both bat and ball)

KL batted at 4 coz shankr got injured before the game ...shankar didnt play Nz he played Bang game where he failed. Kohli clearly saidin last 1 yr KL is a backup opener and MSK said that to at team selection

 

Failed in warmup so.........warmup means jackshit and young players will fail. What matters is he has quality. Our openers failed to in both warmup games not just one and people were going crazy what happend in main games

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57 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

KL batted at 4 coz shankr got injured before the game ...shankar didnt play Nz he played Bang game where he failed. Kohli clearly saidin last 1 yr KL is a backup opener and MSK said that to at team selection

What went during the warm-ups is common knowledge. The point is that when Shankar returned for the BD games, he was slotted at #5 despite KL failing in the previous game. Which is contrary to the belief that Shankar is an automatic #4 slot 

 

Quote

Failed in warmup so.........warmup means jackshit and young players will fail. What matters is he has quality. Our openers failed to in both warmup games not just one and people were going crazy what happend in main games

The openers have a good overall track record while Shankar has looked clueless more often than not 

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I accept there might be a few stoppages for showers but all I ask for is a result. Been looking forward to this since I found out about my successful attempt in the ballot this time last year but deep down knew it was too good to be true and that rain would probably ruin it 

 

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28 minutes ago, zen said:

What went during the warm-ups is common knowledge. The point is that when Shankar returned for the BD games, he was slotted at #5 despite KL failing in the previous game. Which is contrary to the belief that Shankar is an automatic #4 slot 

 

Coz warmup are just about giving everyone practice so order are changed sometimes ....has happened before to

28 minutes ago, zen said:

 

The openers have a good overall track record while Shankar has looked clueless more often than not 

The last two series he played for india he did well. When did he look clueless ??? Ipl ??? 

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30 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

 

Coz warmup are just about giving everyone practice so order are changed sometimes ....has happened before to

In this case, KL was the preferred one

 

Quote

The last two series he played for india he did well. When did he look clueless ??? Ipl ??? 

In some matches including in IPL. Now if you plan to post on not judging IPL/T20 performances, I have posted a "guide" on what to and can be judged as well  

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Tough game as they save their best for India. This is the moment that defines their heroes. They will bring their A+ game to the field. They will have adrenaline rush for first few overs and then training takes over. Take them lightly and India loses but I don't see that happening. 

 

These are the must batsman for India:

Rahul

Sharma

Kohli

Jadhav

 

Must Bowlers for India:

Shami

Bhuvi

Bumrah

Pandya

Chahal

The above bowlers need to bowl all 50 overs.

 

Dhoni - WK

 

I will go with Karthik as the eleventh player because of the big game temprament he has.

 

Tight game but India wins.

 

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England should have batted first and they could have won easily, they tried too much and then ended up making it difficult for themselves. They still got to 330. Had they stuck to conventional knowledge and batted first, they would have easily walked over Pak.

 

WI will give it to them, they came with an out of the blue game plan. But teams like WI are always exception to the rule. You never know what they bring in.

 

Aus once they got a great start they started to look at 380- 400, Had they stuck to the Target of 330, they would have got it and  won even more comfortably without even the minor hiccups.

 

Afghanistan too played very safe cricket in the warmup.

 

Enough case study to say stick to basics. Don’t over do or over experiment and Pakistan should be there for the taking.

 

 

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Amir is the only factor India needs to take care of, other bowlers including Wahab leak lots of runs. Batting first or chasing, If India does not give more than 1 wicket in Amir's first spell, game is over for Pakistan. This should be India's strategy.

 

1-Don;t lose more than one wicket in Amir's first spell, runs don;t matter. Indian batting line is strong enough to catch up RR later. 

2-same as # 1.

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39 minutes ago, maniac said:

England should have batted first and they could have won easily, they tried too much and then ended up making it difficult for themselves. They still got to 330. Had they stuck to conventional knowledge and batted first, they would have easily walked over Pak.

 

WI will give it to them, they came with an out of the blue game plan. But teams like WI are always exception to the rule. You never know what they bring in.

 

Aus once they got a great start they started to look at 380- 400, Had they stuck to the Target of 330, they would have got it and  won even more comfortably without even the minor hiccups.

 

Afghanistan too played very safe cricket in the warmup.

 

Enough case study to say stick to basics. Don’t over do or over experiment and Pakistan should be there for the taking.

 

 

Poor Pakistan is just there for the taking for other teams. Proves Afridi point that Pak is the one with big hearts

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4 minutes ago, Aiden said:

Poor Pakistan is just there for the taking for other teams. Proves Afridi point that Pak is the one with big hearts

I am not being condescending. Pakistan and WI you can never take them lightly but at the same time you can’t over think them either. I mean to say Strong teams have to play just normal  conventional cricket and these teams will lose the plot themselves. 

 

Once in a while someone will come up with a mercurial performance. You can’t plan for those. If it happens it happens.  All I was saying is just play natural game and first choice against them rather than thinking 100 strategies. I know it is easier said than done but the point is you cannot or don’t need to plan too much ahead for a team like Pakistan

 

 

Edited by maniac

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I would say the toss is a crucial factor, especially for Pakistan. India might change their balance looking at the opposition or the conditions. However, if its a flat pitch I expect both wristys playing again

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2 hours ago, Lannister said:

This is my team. 

 

KL

Rohit

Kohli

Shankar

Dhongi baba

Pandya

DK

Kumar

Kuldeeo

Chahal

Bumrah

 

All 3 pacers is a must for this game. 

Jadhav is useless , no need for a 6th bowler, I will go with the above team on Sunday. We lose ..we lose,, this will be our SF team. May be replace Jadeja for DK (Same batting, fielding, but better 6th bowler than Jadhav). In PANDYA we should trust as a bowler who could bat as a bonus.

Edited by coffee_rules

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2 hours ago, Aiden said:

Poor Pakistan is just there for the taking for other teams. Proves Afridi point that Pak is the one with big hearts

Imran once wanted to settle Kashmir issue over a game of cricket. Your captains have tendencies to talk over the top, for your sake stop listening to them. 

Before I forget recently your current captain claimed all teams scared of Pakistan. 

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While most of us here want Shami in place of Kuldip , do not be surprised if they go with 2 spinners.  For me their batting backbone is top 4 ,out of which apart from Hafeez, top 3 seem to have prepared more to play pace than spin. If we check their performance Vs spin ,it may not be better than pace. Secondly even in yesterday,s green pitch there was not much swing. Downside is that Hafeez &Shoib play spin well. But if Pak scores 300+ it only if top 3 performs big.I am getting a feeling they will go Shankar + 2 wristys

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My XI. I am going safety first with kartik to see off the new ball and get at least 40. Can capitalise later and rohit rahul pair Makes me anxious of being 2 down. Rahul doing well in the middle order right now. Shankar we have no real idea if he is okay or club player so i won't risk it. He looked like a club player in ipl. 

 

Rohit, kartik, kohli, Rahul, dhoni, jhadav,  pandya, jaddu, shami, chahal, bumrah 

 

Shami was odi number 1 bowler for a while and strike bowler for sure any time in innings. Jaddu to ensure batting at 8 and economical bowling, fielding great. Kuldeep hasn't looked like a strike bowler even against non asian teams which makes the choice easier and clearly inferior in batting fielding to jaddu by a big margin. 

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If it's overcast/green wicket go with Shami, if it's a flat track go with 2 wristys. But my pick against Pak will always be fast bowlers ahead of spinners.. 

 

Rohit

Rahul

Kohli

Dhoni

Jadhav

DK

Pandya

Bhuvi

Shami

Chahal

Bumraah

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2 hours ago, coffee_rules said:

Jadhav is useless , no need for a 6th bowler, I will go with the above team on Sunday. We lose ..we lose,, this will be our SF team. May be replace Jadeja for DK (Same batting, fielding, but better 6th bowler than Jadhav). In PANDYA we should trust as a bowler who could bat as a bonus.

I know it's hard to remember but Jadhav's main utility is his batting. He is better than DK and that phoney Jadeja. We need him now, especially with Dhawan out. 

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32 minutes ago, prudent_kreeda said:

While most of us here want Shami in place of Kuldip , do not be surprised if they go with 2 spinners.  For me their batting backbone is top 4 ,out of which apart from Hafeez, top 3 seem to have prepared more to play pace than spin. If we check their performance Vs spin ,it may not be better than pace. Secondly even in yesterday,s green pitch there was not much swing. Downside is that Hafeez &Shoib play spin well. But if Pak scores 300+ it only if top 3 performs big.I am getting a feeling they will go Shankar + 2 wristys

Imam as an opener avg 55+ with Sr of 80. He already is a match winner for India. Let him do what he does puts middle order under pressure and we get wickets. Am sure riaz and hasan can't replicate batting performance. 

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27 minutes ago, Pollack said:

What pre-match discussion? Weather prediction shows it's a washout. :facepalm: Hopefully English weather lives up to it's nature - unpredictable and we get a game.

Which site you checked weather is clearing up by Fri evening. Sunday couple of short showers possible in 2nd half.

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7 minutes ago, prudent_kreeda said:

Which site you checked weather is clearing up by Fri evening. Sunday couple of short showers possible in 2nd half.

70% chances of rain today, 60% tomorrow, 70% on Sunday and with lack of covers if it rains for even two days, ground will become a pond.  It has already receive enough pounding.  Even soil wont absorb water quickly.

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