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What next for Vijay Shankar?

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I would keep him in the loop as a backup option. If he improves his game, he can be considered. 

 

After the debacle in the WC, he is not going to be batting in the top 4 - likes of Agarwal, Gill, etc., could get a look in. Pant-Pandya could be slotted at 5-6. Jadeja, 30 yrs old and just two yrs older than Shankar, may get more preferences for someone batting at 7 and 8. Then there are upcoming players like Sundar, Abhishek, Rana, etc., as well. 

Edited by zen

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1 hour ago, TNAmarkFromIndia said:

Are people really hyping him based on a couple of innings in IPL? As if the tournament hasn't had it's fair share of one-season wonders before.

Yes, IPL can be very misleading. Even Rayudu got in after a fantastic IPL in 2018. Dhoni was able to prolong his stay in the Indian team thanks to IPL exploits.

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1 hour ago, Khota said:

No one should be ruled out or ruled in. A smart coach who knows what he is doing will tell that all slots are open and will generate competition for all of them.

+1... He provides a bowling option 

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Needs to work on his batting allot, needs a major overhaul on his mental game, team cannot afford the likes of KL Rahul VJ Shankar etc who are meek and lack mental toughness to survive Intl cricket.

Edited by Sean Bradley

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His luck ran out. Never looked international class and never had any domestic or IPL numbers to be a first choice pick in WC squad. Because our team management panicked due to Pandya's injury during Asia Cup, he got his lucky break. Now back to the grind of domestic cricket for him. Can't blame anyone else but himself. Not even a 50 after 12 int'l innings (across 21 matches) reflects poorly on him.

 

Next WC is in India, better to groom Shreyas Gopal as an all rounder. An attack of Kuldeep, Jadeja and Gopal could be deadly on home pitches.

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Both Kohli and Rohit have high regards for his batting style. He hasn't got to exhibit much of it during his limited stint in Intl cricket..

The last Kohli mentioned about him was that he looks solid when he is out in the middle, but got out to a beauty from Roach. Which means it is likely that he  will come back into the squad for the next tour.. more so because he has the backing from the captain and vice captain

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30 minutes ago, bowl_out said:

Both Kohli and Rohit have high regards for his batting style. He hasn't got to exhibit much of it during his limited stint in Intl cricket..

The last Kohli mentioned about him was that he looks solid when he is out in the middle, but got out to a beauty from Roach. Which means it is likely that he  will come back into the squad for the next tour.. more so because he has the backing from the captain and vice captain

Kohli is a very poor judge of players and says things just to please people or to justify his silly decisions, somthing he has learnt well from Dhoni. Remember he said great things about Rahane and Rayudu as ODI number 4 and both were out of favour within 3 months of those statements.

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5 hours ago, vvvslaxman said:

He was in as a temporary replacement. Now India has no choice but to prepare for 2023. They can't continue with this "experience crap".

Important for Selectors &TM to consider is his bowling useful in WC23 in Indian conditions or in flat wickets? If not then he cannot be our no.4 for WC23 as a pure batter. We will much better options than him. Hope they do not make the mistake of considering for 2-3 years & then deciding his bowling not good enough in SC conditions.

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1 hour ago, TheWall said:

Should stick to IPL...

Has not done anything in IPL too. He is not suited for even ODIs forget t20. Well built but power of chahal in his shots. Even Rahane generates more force into his slogs than VJ. Should stick to tests and try to break into Indian test team if ever. It would be unfair to say he doesn't have talent as batsman. He has but looks like mental midget.

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22 hours ago, The Dark Horse said:

He's a must in tests. But really has to improve his mental strength if he has to achieve anything.

He's not a must in tests. Yes he can break into tests with some determination. Go back to domestics and score big hundreds and 200s. Keep him away from LOIs. 

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On 7/16/2019 at 3:16 AM, The Dark Horse said:

He's a must in tests. But really has to improve his mental strength if he has to achieve anything.

by no means is he a must. of the top 6 slots, 5 are more or less nailed in: Pant, Kohli, Chepu, 2 openers. this leaves 6 and 7. Regardless of whether we play abroad or home, I'd rather have Jaddu at 7. he is avg 40+ with the bat both home and away since jan 2016, he can hold an end up with tight bowling, and is a brilliant fielder. this leaves only one position in the top 7 that is free. shankar will be competing with likes of vihari (who also bowls a bit) and gill (arguably a much more complete batsman) for that position.

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Needs to work on fitness... lose weight and bulk up .. work on core ... increase 10 kms in pace become 135kmh bowler ... and then comeback ..

hes got a slower one , needs a bouncer cutter ... he’s got natural swing .

 

needs to to develop a square game , a mid wicket game and singles ... should look up to stokes ... 

 

he is very very crucial for Indian cricket , Indian cricket doesn’t have medium batting all rounders. With this work he can fill in slot 4 which we all want him to do ...

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16 hours ago, Vijy said:

by no means is he a must. of the top 6 slots, 5 are more or less nailed in: Pant, Kohli, Chepu, 2 openers. this leaves 6 and 7. Regardless of whether we play abroad or home, I'd rather have Jaddu at 7. he is avg 40+ with the bat both home and away since jan 2016, he can hold an end up with tight bowling, and is a brilliant fielder. this leaves only one position in the top 7 that is free. shankar will be competing with likes of vihari (who also bowls a bit) and gill (arguably a much more complete batsman) for that position.

Gill is not ready at the moment and has technical flaws against moving ball as we saw in NewZealand series. Vihari has a huge short ball problem and his spin will only work in India. Shankar has batted really well in Newzealand and was able to negotiate the swing. Also his bowling will come good in SENA conditions.

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16 minutes ago, Cricket_Fan said:

Gill is not ready at the moment and has technical flaws against moving ball as we saw in NewZealand series. Vihari has a huge short ball problem and his spin will only work in India. Shankar has batted really well in Newzealand and was able to negotiate the swing. Also his bowling will come good in SENA conditions.

lol Technical problem against moving ball. Rohit/Dhawan/Rahul masters of moving ball? Even Kohli took a couple of seasons to fix the issue. 

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21 minutes ago, Cricket_Fan said:

Gill is not ready at the moment and has technical flaws against moving ball as we saw in NewZealand series. Vihari has a huge short ball problem and his spin will only work in India. Shankar has batted really well in Newzealand and was able to negotiate the swing. Also his bowling will come good in SENA conditions.

Gill is very good against the moving ball. In NewZealand he failed because of nervousness,otherwise he was middling the ball better than other players.

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He should just play domeatic, IPL and retire after..when he has enough money.. Can't see him being a good fit for Tests, ODI or T20I.. just doesnt look the part mentally or technically.

Edited by Cricspin

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56 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

lol Technical problem against moving ball. Rohit/Dhawan/Rahul masters of moving ball? Even Kohli took a couple of seasons to fix the issue. 

Are Rohit/Dhawan/Rahul  good in Test cricket?

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1 hour ago, vaul said:

Gill is very good against the moving ball. In NewZealand he failed because of nervousness,otherwise he was middling the ball better than other players.

Middling the ball is not exactly a measure of how good you are against moving ball. That might tell you about your timing. You should have less gap between bat and pad and should know where your offstump is to leave balls on their merit. From what i saw in Kiwi series, Gill has some gap between his bat and pad and was not sure where his offstump was.

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18 minutes ago, Cricket_Fan said:

Are Rohit/Dhawan/Rahul  good in Test cricket?

Rahul was the opener for  a while. Mayank has just come in. He hasn't played in "moving conditions" either. We never know. From what i see Gill has higher probability of succeeding against moving ball as he plays late. Prithvi shaw on the other hand caught behind 4 or 5 times in the IPL outside the off stump even in India. Imagine him in moving conditions.

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7 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

Rahul was the opener for  a while. Mayank has just come in. He hasn't played in "moving conditions" either. We never know. From what i see Gill has higher probability of succeeding against moving ball as he plays late. Prithvi shaw on the other hand caught behind 4 or 5 times in the IPL outside the off stump even in India. Imagine him in moving conditions.

Exactly. I trust Gill to succeed more than Shaw and Pant. He looks a sound batsman, probably failed in NZ due to the pressure of a big stage.. We have 4 years to groom him to be the core of middle order in ODI. 

 

That said, I think Shankar is good for the ODI middle order too.. He got needlessly hyped up as 3D and fast tracked to WC squad that set him up for failure.. He didn't massively fail.. Played one bat shot, got one brilliant delivery.. He has looked solid otherwise.

 

I'd play Gill at 3, Pandey/Iyer at 4 and Shankar at 5 to start off the WI series... How they perform over the next few months will determine further course of action. 

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41 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

Rahul was the opener for  a while. Mayank has just come in. He hasn't played in "moving conditions" either. We never know. From what i see Gill has higher probability of succeeding against moving ball as he plays late. Prithvi shaw on the other hand caught behind 4 or 5 times in the IPL outside the off stump even in India. Imagine him in moving conditions.

And he failed massively in SENA. I share the same opinion about Prithvi Shaw.

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18 minutes ago, Cricket_Fan said:

And he failed massively in SENA. I share the same opinion about Prithvi Shaw.

Playing against moving ball will come in experience. Tendulkar got out to Andreson 9 times. Kohli got out to him repeatedly before fixing it in the next series. You don't get "moving conditions" in India.

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1 hour ago, Cricket_Fan said:

Middling the ball is not exactly a measure of how good you are against moving ball. That might tell you about your timing. You should have less gap between bat and pad and should know where your offstump is to leave balls on their merit. From what i saw in Kiwi series, Gill has some gap between his bat and pad and was not sure where his offstump was.

Middling the ball is most important criteria indeed.Poor middling ability indicates higher tendency to edge the ball.I have never seen Gill getting caught in slips.As far as gap between bat and pad is concerned,it merely indicate footwork and tendency to play away from body.Gill usually play very close to body and has excellent footwork for both short-pitch and balls pitched up.

In first game he wanted to score on a ball which was meant to be defended.Earlier he blacked such deliveries but eagerness to score lead to his wicket.

He got out in second game because he was early into shot and ball came bit slower,so he was in awkward position.

Therefore poor shot selection,most probably due to nervousness led to his failure.Most importantly no one backed him.

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19 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

Playing against moving ball will come in experience. Tendulkar got out to Andreson 9 times. Kohli got out to him repeatedly before fixing it in the next series. You don't get "moving conditions" in India.

Tendulkar got out to Anderson on his fag end of his career when he was declining.

For Gill, It might or might not come with experience .But at the moment, he doesn't have it and Vijay Shankar has it. That's all I am saying.

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3 minutes ago, Cricket_Fan said:

Tendulkar got out to Anderson on his fag end of his career when he was declining.

For Gill, It might or might not come with experience .But at the moment, he doesn't have it and Vijay Shankar has it. That's all I am saying.

How does Vijay have it? HE also edged in the match against West Indies when the ball decked back in. Besides Gill is a pedigree batsman who scores big. Shankar is not even the best batsman from his own state. 

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6 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

How does Vijay have it? HE also edged in the match against West Indies when the ball decked back in. Besides Gill is a pedigree batsman who scores big. Shankar is not even the best batsman from his own state. 

Because he played well in Newzealand series. He negotiated the moving ball better than most of our batsmen on that day and looked compact. Gill has not showed anything at senior level yet. I don't give much relevance to runs scored in Ranji unless that can be replicated on A tours. We all know how Mr 300 Nair turned out to be.

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On 7/18/2019 at 9:53 AM, Cricket_Fan said:

Gill is not ready at the moment and has technical flaws against moving ball as we saw in NewZealand series. Vihari has a huge short ball problem and his spin will only work in India. Shankar has batted really well in Newzealand and was able to negotiate the swing. Also his bowling will come good in SENA conditions.

every player has weaknesses. even if we assume that shankar is some kind of dravid-level or SRT-level technician (which he most certainly is not), he has glaring mental weaknesses that have arisen more than once. less said about his so-called bowling the better. the only pitches on which it will be useful is the green mambas, but such pitches are becoming rarer. shankar's physique is also unconvincing to me - seems like the guy who will break down often.

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You can keep him as backup for Pandya , that's it. He does not qualify in any side based on either batting or bowling alone which should be a key requirement for all-rounders unless he is somebody like Stokes or Shakib who are pretty decent in both disciplines. You surely can't place him at 4-5 when Agarwal, Gill, Iyer, Pandey are much more qualified for those positions.

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On 7/18/2019 at 7:23 PM, Cricket_Fan said:

Gill is not ready at the moment and has technical flaws against moving ball as we saw in NewZealand series. Vihari has a huge short ball problem and his spin will only work in India. Shankar has batted really well in Newzealand and was able to negotiate the swing. Also his bowling will come good in SENA conditions.

This was the reason he was picked but unfortunately, he wasn't in the team when such a situation came up. 

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