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Gollum

Death threats, beatings trigger mass exodus of migrants from Kashmir

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It is the third day in the union territory of Jammu and Kashmir, and thousands of migrant labourers from Bihar are fleeing the Valley after facing threats from local Kashmiris

Quote

Outside the Tourist Reception Centre in Srinagar, 56-year-old Surinder Mahato desperately waits for a bus to take him to Jammu from where he will have to make a long journey to his village in Motihari, Bihar. Clutching Rs 462 in his hand, the bus fare between Srinagar and Jammu, he has been told that the bus service will resume later in the day.

It is the third day in the union territory of Jammu and Kashmir, and thousands of migrant labourers from Bihar are fleeing Kashmir Valley after facing threats from local Kashmiris. The previous night a few of them landed up at Mahato’s room and asked him to leave. “They were hurling abuses at me and asked me to leave; they said they will kill me otherwise,” he said. On August 7, till 11.15 am, 40 buses had already left for Jammu. On August 6 also, thousands of them left for Jammu. In the absence of transport, many of them had to walk for hours to reach the railway station on the outskirts of Srinagar.

Mahato has been coming to Kashmir for 25 years. Most migrants like Mahato works as daily-wage labourers here. They prefer Kashmir because of its cooler summer-time climate. On an average they earn between Rs 500-600 per day. “If I work in Punjab, I am able to save less and send about eight thousand rupees per month. From Kashmir I can send almost double that amount,” says Abdul Ghaffar, a labourer from Bihar’s Supaul district. He doesn’t know if he can return to Kashmir now. He claimed that from Supaul alone, about one lakh labourers have been coming to Kashmir every year to work.

Several migrants who were waiting for the bus said their payments were stuck and they had to leave without their wages. On August 6, 25-year-old Aslam, another labourer from Bihar, was beaten up by a few locals in the HMT area in Srinagar. “They took away my bag and said: Bhaago Bihari idhar se (Run away from here, Bihari),” he said. His employer owes him several thousand rupees as wages. But scared about their safety, Aslam and many of his other friends chose to leave without collecting their earnings. Anil, another migrant labourer, said he was threatened as well. “One Kashmiri came to me the previous night and said if I see you tomorrow, I will beat you up and burn you with kerosene oil,” he said. Chote Lal, who was trying to return to Gorakhpur in Uttar Pradesh said some people threw stones on their dwelling and threatened him and others to run away, failing which they will be cut into pieces.

As they waited for their turn, two Kashmiris stopped to hear them speak. One of them looked at the labourers and shouted: “Sabka saath, sabka vikaas.”

LINK

Kashmir3.jpg

Abdul Ghaffar from Supaul District In Bihar

 

 

Doesn't matter...Hindus, Muslims, Sikhs, non-Kashmiri migrant laborers being abused, beaten, threatened, forced to flee the valley. Peak Kashmiriyat, of course no libtard or gaddar cunt will even acknowledge this, only Kashmiri Muslims are victims for them. 

Jammu, Ladakh will stay peaceful and enjoy the fruits of development. Doesn't look like the valley bastards will co-operate, our forces need to put them in line, be ruthless.

Edited by Gollum

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Source is the magazine 'Open', author is Rahul Pandita who has credibility. Check his tweets, all the lies of these mofo libtards exposed, all that fear mongering and hyperbole by usual cabal :facepalm:. If anything it is the non-Kashmiri migrants who are facing a tough time, but no one will talk about them lesser humans. 

 

As per Rahul Pandita, only partial restrictions, situation almost normal and otherwise well under control.

https://twitter.com/rahulpandita

Edited by Gollum

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Without stability , 'migrants' won't stay put.  They'll flee to Punjab or go back home.   The demographic change that one expects isn't going be walk in the park where the 'natives' are being hostile. You need better on the ground police to tackle this..Army can only do so much.  Instead of people moving in, thousands have fled Kashmir. It is obviously a work in progress that will take years or decade

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Bhai, remember one thing, the hardliners want Kashmir to be nizaam - e-mustafa(a caliphate) for them only their and only their lives and authority matters, don't care about kp, shias Sunni, bodh, or any non kashmiri migrants, I read in a thread on twitter that, their was as many as Six mass exodus of kp's from valley from 1000 C.E to current 1992 ,and yet these chewts have balls to call us unethical when all we are doing is  trying to assimilate and give them their rights, we simply don't want their land, just want to give them better future, nobody wants their land or ladies, that's what separates us from them, we can never stoop to their level, we don't want to displace them, jammu is OK with it, laddakh ,hell even north Kashmir, but ye hai kuch us pedophile ki aulaade jinko 10-10 saal ki bachchiyo ko raundane main maza aata hai, for them women is a thing of pleasure, not a partner, tamiz insaan ke bachcho ko sikhayi jaati hai, su war ke nhi, he will only eat shyte and like disgust no matter what u serve him. 

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The best revenge would be to develop Ladakh and Jammu to such an extent ki yeh Kashmiri apne muh dikhane layak nahi rahe. Don't care how much funds are diverted I want those 2 places to be the most developed parts of the country after 10 years. Maybe then the Kashmiris will learn their lessons, maybe not but still historical injustice meted out to Jammu/Ladakh by valley's Sunni Muslims (and Congress) needs to be corrected. They have never given us problems, have fought against Srinagar's tyranny, in fact Dogras are some of the most patriotic people I have seen. Hope Modi stops bending over backwards to please the valley, apne aap unhe line mein aane do. 

Edited by Gollum

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40 minutes ago, Gollum said:

The best revenge would be to develop Ladakh and Jammu to such an extent ki yeh Kashmiri apne muh dikhane layak nahi rahe. Don't care how much funds are diverted I want those 2 places to be the most developed parts of the country after 10 years.

You can bet that's the plan of the current government as well.  That's the only way we can move the needle in J&K. Developing Jammu will create not just a new economically and politically empowered political elite, but also serve as a bright example of what Kashmiris can be, if they give up on their delusion of ethno-religious supremacy.   

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Imo, just like how secular fools says, India was a paradise before 2014, and thus making every crime afterwards attributed to Modi. Similar expect everything in J/K to be questioned. In long term, it's good as there is more accountability.....

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1 hour ago, Gollum said:

Any KP on ICF? Or someone from Jammu/Ladkah? Needn't be current residents of the state....will be interesting to hear their views and happy emotions. 

I have a few Jamwal friends and everyone is elated about it. Their only issue is that they wanted Jammu to be made a separate state. 

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2 minutes ago, Stradlater said:

I have a few Jamwal friends and everyone is elated about it. Their only issue is that they wanted Jammu to be made a separate state. 

Dogras?

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The migrant workers are facing a lot of problems who want to return. Yesterday I was watching news & a 7 month pregnant lady along with her family was waiting for a vehicle to take them to Jammu from Srinagar. They were waiting since Tuesday night & the food, water which they carried along was finished. I truly hope the govt. helps them in their safe return.

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4 hours ago, Gollum said:

Any KP on ICF? Or someone from Jammu/Ladkah? Needn't be current residents of the state....will be interesting to hear their views and happy emotions. 

My Paternal Family is based in Jammu City Region ( Migrated from Muzaffarabad, POK 1947)

 

Maternal Family is based in Kathua Region. 

 

Also Have relatives in Udhampur and Pooch. Have friends in Samba,  Hiranagar etc. 

 

Born and brought up outside J & K  but I have the State Subject Certificate which was the Residentship Document to inherit and buy property in the State. Now the Certificate is obsolete as even outsiders can buy property in the state .

 

Abhi article hatne ke baad toh Ekdum blackout ho gaya tha but abhi Pichle 2 din se thoda thoda phone lag raha hai. We were only excited to know the mood of the relatives and family friends back home as they were living in isolation from entire World . Now it may come off as a surprise but our relatives and friends are actually not too excited or performing Bhangras as some outsiders might think,  maybe because they are actually well-off people having huge land both agricultural as well as residential , running successful business or holding decent  Sarkaari Jobs while enjoying various government subsidies at the same time. Now contrary to the popular perception of J & K being some backward state  ,  let me tell you that J & K especially the Jammu Region is not some Bihar, Orissa,  Jharkhand or Chattisgarh which is languishing in poverty due to an article maintaining it's special status.  During my annual vacations to Jammu,  I have never witnessed even a fraction of poverty that I have seen outside the state. Yes there are not many modern day Industries , Tech IT hubs like there are in other cities but the Government  provides so many subsides,  cuts , facilities and other benefits to the common public I don't think there is any other state where the citizens are treated like royalties.  No Property Tax , Bijli,  Paani, Ration ki facilities,  limited population,  all Government jobs reserved for the locals , many people own huge land/propety and endless subsidies.  Bacho ko dusri state main padne bhejna hai,  bhej do aur sarkar se paisa claim kar lo and then there are endless opportunities to work all over India,. Just in 2015/2016 the Modi government approved a 2000 Crore package for Displaced families of POK and even our family received a decent sum inspite of being well off so the perks never stop coming . Unlike the Kashmiri Pandits, the people of Jammu have never faced militancy or were forced to flee their homes.  So now am talking about these people,  they are Non-Muslims very Pro -India but at the same they enjoy the benefits that they have been receiving. Offcourse they are not going to protest or join hands with Kashmiri militants but right now there are many who are not very excited with the removal of the article.  It's mostly outsiders who don't have a dog in this fight that are rejoicing over the removal which is seen as India showing the middle finger to Pakistan and stamping it's authority over Kashmir. Some are concerned with government jobs being taken over by outsiders in the future ,  problems of overcrowding etc.  Development may or may not happen,  it's no guarantee. If development indeed happens then a few decades later everyone will be glad for the step that the Government has taken today but currently a lot of people are concerned about the short term benefits as all the subsidies and facilities that they have been enjoying due to Special status are about to end very soon. 

 

Ladakhis - the only region  where all people are celebrating the move as the region has been the most isolated and ignored in J & K.  Infact, 20 Years ago when I lived in Jammu for a brief period  all  I knew was that there is Jammu here and Kashmir up North . Ladakh Kya tha Kaha tha kisko malum.  I have never been there but those who have seen both regions admit that Jammu is like a First World Region in comparison to Ladakh. In the last decade,  a lot of Ladakhi students have been coming over to Jammu for studies. They mingle around their own  in groups and can be easily identified due to their oriental features.  The Ladakhi students have quotas in various  colleges and institutions  of Jammu and are provided scholarships by the Government.

 

Kashmiri Pandits - All of them are over the moon. Because they know that  as the only Hindu group they can never return back to Kashmir and live among the Muslims in the  current demograhic composition.  But if somehow Hindus from other states settle in Kashmir then they can live along with them if the numbers are enough to counter the Muslim majority. For Pandits this was the only way possible to return back to their roots and now they have the opportunity. 

 

Jammu Dogras - Dogras / Dogra Rajputs are the most influential people of Jammu and many among them have welcomed the decision. Yeh dogras ke paas Jammu main Bahut land hai , toh Yeh soch rahe hai thoda investment hoga , bahar se public aaega  toh property ka rates bhi badega aur job opportunities bhi improve hoga. 

 

Kashmiri Muslims - Biggest chewtiyas of all. Still obsessed with Quran,  Islam,  Sharia,  Pakistan and Azaadi.  They could have had the best of both Worlds , on one hand their state would enjoy the special status granted by the Indian Government in exchange for their loyalties and on other hand they have access to equal rights all over the country. But nahi bahot masti tha g@@@d main,  ab na ghar ke rahe na ghaat ke.  Azaadi bhi nahi Mili aur kaafiro ke saath Kashmir bhi share Karna pad gaya. 

Edited by rageaddict

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I think, things are coming out. Deficit for state Government is very high. GoI did not divulge that.

GoI was spending 14000+ per person in J&K compared to 4000+ per person in rest of India

It was spending 2200 per person in J&K on infra compared to 3000+rest of India. All the while they turned Laddah into Buddhist minority and I am certain that Muftis would have planted nurseries to change the demography

Edited by mishra

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41 minutes ago, mishra said:

I think, things are coming out. Deficit for state Government is very high. GoI did not divulge that.

GoI was spending 14000+ per person in J&K compared to 4000+ per person in rest of India

It was spending 2200 per person in J&K on infra compared to 3000+rest of India. All the while they turned Laddah into Buddhist minority and I am certain that Muftis would have planted nurseries to change the demography

Absolutely right, Buddhists have been made a minority in their own land by Islamic zealots. Also note how Rohingyas were accommodated in Hindu Jammu by NC/Congress, but not in Muslim Kashmir/Kargil

Challenge moves to change the demography of Ladakh

Quote

There are all-out efforts by anti-national elements to change the demography of Ladakh in Jammu and Kashmir. It would be instructive to first get a background on the region’s topography. The terrain is sandy, lacks oxygen and is generally inhospitable.

Ladakh is divided into two districts, Leh and Kargil. While Leh is Buddhist-dominated, Shia Muslims are the largest population in Kargil. The area is not overly populated, given the rough terrain. There are roughly 1.15 lakh Shias and about 1.35 lakh Buddhists in this area. Hindus, Sikhs and others constitute about 10,000 of the population. Women outnumber men when it comes to numbers. The Shias in the region are followers of Imam Ayatollah Khomeini. There are a number of foreign Islamic NGOs who are active in the area and there is regular and substantial funding of local Shias.

In the Buddhist areas, the tradition of sending one son to become a lama (monk) continues. In some families, girls are also sent for baptism.

The history of Islam reaching Ladakh goes back roughly to 1000-1100 AD. But the religion started to make its presence felt in the 16th century, when the King of Ladakh Raja Namgyal got stuck in Skardu, faced with blinding snowfall. Waiting for the snow to melt, he became a guest of the local Nawab of Skardu for a few months.

Such a long stay obviously meant matrimonial alliances. The Raja returned with the daughter of the Nawab as his wife and a few women slaves as dowry. For the first time, a mosque came up on the banks of the Sindhu river and another at the central Leh market.

Since then, Islam has grown by leaps and bounds in the region. Today, there are all-out attempts to convert Buddhists to Islam using vast amounts of foreign funding. Except for a couple of towns, there is dire poverty in the region, making it a fertile ground for conversion through allurement.

Post-Independence, awareness levels among the Buddhists has gone up. In 1989, they launched an agitation against Kashmiri Muslims which went on for two years, but given the close ties between the two communities, the stir petered out.

In 1992, Shia Muslims and Buddhists reached an accord that Muslim boys would not marry or run away with Buddhist girls. But this agreement proved to be temporary. Between 1992 and 2000, 24 girls were abducted in Leh district and till 1995, 45 Buddhist girls had been abducted in Kargil. These are all figures provided by the police.

Thanks to the state government, there is also a surreptitious attempt to take over jobs and land in the region, in addition to seats in engineering and medical courses. In Ladakh, Muslims are much better placed than Buddhists and occupy virtually all important positions in the region. Its impact was most evident during the Kargil War when Pakistani intruders were provided shelter and Indian Army deliberately misguided, leading to unnecessary casualties on the Indian side.

Things have reached such a pass that these high officials turn a blind eye to any cases of conversion, voluntary or enforced, of Buddhists to Islam. But when it is the other way round, meaning if a Buddhist man marries a Muslim girl, he is subjected to all sorts of harassment by the state machinery. In other words, there is a clear mandate to convert as many Buddhists as possible to Islam so as to change the demographic character of the region.

In Kargil, there are reports of 50-plus conversions of this kind in recent times, leading to an agreement between the Buddhist Sangh and the Ladakh Islamic Sangh not to bless any more inter-religion marriages. Sadly, the latter have not stuck to their bargain.

The modus operandi to effect such conversions is quite simple. The police administration goes out of its way to provide protection to the Muslim boy who has married a Buddhist girl, harass the girl’s family and prepare marriage documents in such a way that if the case reaches a court of law, the girl has no option but to admit that the marriage is legal. This way, the whole process of allurement and marriage is foolproof.

The Buddhists are absolutely right in demanding that the state government introduce anti-conversion laws as they exist in Madhya Pradesh and Arunachal Pradesh. Unless stern steps are taken, the Buddhist population in the Ladakh region stands seriously imperilled.

It is also instructive to remind readers that while Kargil is dominated by the Shias, there is a smattering of Sunni Muslims there as well and there is no love lost between the two groups.

But the fanatics are reassured that the rest of India is not too concerned about what is happening in a remote part of the country. If the Buddhist population is coming down, be it so. The Ladakh Buddhist Sangh has published a list of 45 conversions, all of which have long narratives and sordid backgrounds.

There is also immediate need for the police to identify and curb activities of extremist Muslim organisations who have made converting Buddhists their main agenda. The record of the police, mostly dominated by local Shia Muslims, has thus far been to look the other way when a conversion case is registered. Unless the government pays heed to this troubling and recurring feature in this sensitive border state, the consequences in the long run could be terrible.

 
 

Conversions to Islam: Ladakh Buddhist Association blames JK govt

LINK

 

So many cases of religious/cultural/demographic invasion by Islamists in the Buddhist area, 7 decades of secularism. I don't really believe in this Shia/Sunni nonsense, they will always unite to destroy dharmic religions. 
 

Edited by Gollum

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^ Bhai, In Kasmir, apart from Terrorists who were directly involved in gun battle, How Many Muslims who committed crimes against non Muslims are in prison.

People only see terrorism. People dont see what local Government was doing in various other categories to meet its objectives of Muslim country.  Threatening, Killing, conversion, changing culture, education, propganda was being done systematically and if you fall or get caught by Military or centres system, you were rewarded by state government.

Edited by mishra

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15 hours ago, rageaddict said:

My Paternal Family is based in Jammu City Region ( Migrated from Muzaffarabad, POK 1947)

 

Maternal Family is based in Kathua Region. 

 

Also Have relatives in Udhampur and Pooch. Have friends in Samba,  Hiranagar etc. 

 

Born and brought up outside J & K  but I have the State Subject Certificate which was the Residentship Document to inherit and buy property in the State. Now the Certificate is obsolete as even outsiders can buy property in the state .

 

Abhi article hatne ke baad toh Ekdum blackout ho gaya tha but abhi Pichle 2 din se thoda thoda phone lag raha hai. We were only excited to know the mood of the relatives and family friends back home as they were living in isolation from entire World . Now it may come off as a surprise but our relatives and friends are actually not too excited or performing Bhangras as some outsiders might think,  maybe because they are actually well-off people having huge land both agricultural as well as residential , running successful business or holding decent  Sarkaari Jobs while enjoying various government subsidies at the same time. Now contrary to the popular perception of J & K being some backward state  ,  let me tell you that J & K especially the Jammu Region is not some Bihar, Orissa,  Jharkhand or Chattisgarh which is languishing in poverty due to an article maintaining it's special status.  During my annual vacations to Jammu,  I have never witnessed even a fraction of poverty that I have seen outside the state. Yes there are not many modern day Industries , Tech IT hubs like there are in other cities but the Government  provides so many subsides,  cuts , facilities and other benefits to the common public I don't think there is any other state where the citizens are treated like royalties.  No Property Tax , Bijli,  Paani, Ration ki facilities,  limited population,  all Government jobs reserved for the locals , many people own huge land/propety and endless subsidies.  Bacho ko dusri state main padne bhejna hai,  bhej do aur sarkar se paisa claim kar lo and then there are endless opportunities to work all over India,. Just in 2015/2016 the Modi government approved a 2000 Crore package for Displaced families of POK and even our family received a decent sum inspite of being well off so the perks never stop coming . Unlike the Kashmiri Pandits, the people of Jammu have never faced militancy or were forced to flee their homes.  So now am talking about these people,  they are Non-Muslims very Pro -India but at the same they enjoy the benefits that they have been receiving. Offcourse they are not going to protest or join hands with Kashmiri militants but right now there are many who are not very excited with the removal of the article.  It's mostly outsiders who don't have a dog in this fight that are rejoicing over the removal which is seen as India showing the middle finger to Pakistan and stamping it's authority over Kashmir. Some are concerned with government jobs being taken over by outsiders in the future ,  problems of overcrowding etc.  Development may or may not happen,  it's no guarantee. If development indeed happens then a few decades later everyone will be glad for the step that the Government has taken today but currently a lot of people are concerned about the short term benefits as all the subsidies and facilities that they have been enjoying due to Special status are about to end very soon. 

 

Ladakhis - the only region  where all people are celebrating the move as the region has been the most isolated and ignored in J & K.  Infact, 20 Years ago when I lived in Jammu for a brief period  all  I knew was that there is Jammu here and Kashmir up North . Ladakh Kya tha Kaha tha kisko malum.  I have never been there but those who have seen both regions admit that Jammu is like a First World Region in comparison to Ladakh. In the last decade,  a lot of Ladakhi students have been coming over to Jammu for studies. They mingle around their own  in groups and can be easily identified due to their oriental features.  The Ladakhi students have quotas in various  colleges and institutions  of Jammu and are provided scholarships by the Government.

 

Kashmiri Pandits - All of them are over the moon. Because they know that  as the only Hindu group they can never return back to Kashmir and live among the Muslims in the  current demograhic composition.  But if somehow Hindus from other states settle in Kashmir then they can live along with them if the numbers are enough to counter the Muslim majority. For Pandits this was the only way possible to return back to their roots and now they have the opportunity. 

 

Jammu Dogras - Dogras / Dogra Rajputs are the most influential people of Jammu and many among them have welcomed the decision. Yeh dogras ke paas Jammu main Bahut land hai , toh Yeh soch rahe hai thoda investment hoga , bahar se public aaega  toh property ka rates bhi badega aur job opportunities bhi improve hoga. 

 

Kashmiri Muslims - Biggest chewtiyas of all. Still obsessed with Quran,  Islam,  Sharia,  Pakistan and Azaadi.  They could have had the best of both Worlds , on one hand their state would enjoy the special status granted by the Indian Government in exchange for their loyalties and on other hand they have access to equal rights all over the country. But nahi bahot masti tha g@@@d main,  ab na ghar ke rahe na ghaat ke.  Azaadi bhi nahi Mili aur kaafiro ke saath Kashmir bhi share Karna pad gaya. 

Watched some interview of Jammu Dogra leader a while back and they weren't too keen on demolishing 370/35A a while back. Were afraid quote that the 6 footers from Punjab/Haryana will take over and the upcoming generations won't forgive them for this decision'.  However, the majority of the recent interviews suggest otherwise.

 

Btw, thought you were sniffed out to be the resident 'pakistani' imposter by ICF posters via the Pakistani sniffer detection algorithm 

Edited by Epic

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1 hour ago, Gollum said:

Absolutely right, Buddhists have been made a minority in their own land by Islamic zealots. Also note how Rohingyas were accommodated in Hindu Jammu by NC/Congress, but not in Muslim Kashmir/Kargil

Challenge moves to change the demography of Ladakh

Conversions to Islam: Ladakh Buddhist Association blames JK govt

LINK

 

So many cases of religious/cultural/demographic invasion by Islamists in the Buddhist area, 7 decades of secularism. I don't really believe in this Shia/Sunni nonsense, they will always unite to destroy dharmic religions. 
 

 

I want to know if there are any Muslim conversions to Dharmic Religions through "Preaching" in significant numbers in India? 

 

If not, then why not? 

 

Islam has so many evil things as religion. If these conversions are still taking place, it means only this that the population has not been made aware of the evil side of Islam. 

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54 minutes ago, Alam_dar said:

 

I want to know if there are any Muslim conversions to Dharmic Religions through "Preaching" in significant numbers in India? 

 

If not, then why not? 

 

Islam has so many evil things as religion. If these conversions are still taking place, it means only this that the population has not been made aware of the evil side of Islam. 

There is no concept of conversion in Hindu Dharma because people are free to believe in what they chose to... and also historically hindu conversions never happened through coercion or by the sword. If someone wants to believe in the hindu way in life and follow the culture it is up to them.. no one is going to provide them with an official statement that they are converted.

 

Muslims and christian missionaries have been using this weakness of faith by manipulating mass numbers of people to convert to Abrahamic religions. This has got to stop.

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12 minutes ago, Epic said:

Why would migrants venture into 'dangerous' Kashmir when Jammu offers better prospects and security. 

they will work in Jammu now and they wil remember how they were treated in the valley too

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13 minutes ago, Vilander said:

@Gollum i thought you left the site no? 

Permanently retired from cricket sub-forum as I wrote that day....can't stay away from big news such as this week's, I did continue to post about tennis in the sports sub-forum after the SF. 

Quote

No anger, no sadness. Just indifference, I am so done with team India.....fallen out of love with these mental midgets after the nth consecutive ICC KO choke. RSA, Eng test losses hurt and this is the final nail in the coffin. If I sparingly spend time on ICF it will be in the sports or chit-chat forum. I don't want to spout my analysis, feelings etc and waste my time on the cricket sub-forum. 

 

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7 minutes ago, Gollum said:

Permanently retired from cricket sub-forum as I wrote that day....can't stay away from big news such as this week's, I did continue to post about tennis in the sports sub-forum after the SF. 

 

Wait. Joke is circulating that Modi is doing Mondays of Sravan Month. Lets see what gets anounced on next Monday

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17 hours ago, rageaddict said:

My Paternal Family is based in Jammu City Region ( Migrated from Muzaffarabad, POK 1947)

 

Maternal Family is based in Kathua Region. 

 

Also Have relatives in Udhampur and Pooch. Have friends in Samba,  Hiranagar etc. 

 

Born and brought up outside J & K  but I have the State Subject Certificate which was the Residentship Document to inherit and buy property in the State. Now the Certificate is obsolete as even outsiders can buy property in the state .

 

Abhi article hatne ke baad toh Ekdum blackout ho gaya tha but abhi Pichle 2 din se thoda thoda phone lag raha hai. We were only excited to know the mood of the relatives and family friends back home as they were living in isolation from entire World . Now it may come off as a surprise but our relatives and friends are actually not too excited or performing Bhangras as some outsiders might think,  maybe because they are actually well-off people having huge land both agricultural as well as residential , running successful business or holding decent  Sarkaari Jobs while enjoying various government subsidies at the same time. Now contrary to the popular perception of J & K being some backward state  ,  let me tell you that J & K especially the Jammu Region is not some Bihar, Orissa,  Jharkhand or Chattisgarh which is languishing in poverty due to an article maintaining it's special status.  During my annual vacations to Jammu,  I have never witnessed even a fraction of poverty that I have seen outside the state. Yes there are not many modern day Industries , Tech IT hubs like there are in other cities but the Government  provides so many subsides,  cuts , facilities and other benefits to the common public I don't think there is any other state where the citizens are treated like royalties.  No Property Tax , Bijli,  Paani, Ration ki facilities,  limited population,  all Government jobs reserved for the locals , many people own huge land/propety and endless subsidies.  Bacho ko dusri state main padne bhejna hai,  bhej do aur sarkar se paisa claim kar lo and then there are endless opportunities to work all over India,. Just in 2015/2016 the Modi government approved a 2000 Crore package for Displaced families of POK and even our family received a decent sum inspite of being well off so the perks never stop coming . Unlike the Kashmiri Pandits, the people of Jammu have never faced militancy or were forced to flee their homes.  So now am talking about these people,  they are Non-Muslims very Pro -India but at the same they enjoy the benefits that they have been receiving. Offcourse they are not going to protest or join hands with Kashmiri militants but right now there are many who are not very excited with the removal of the article.  It's mostly outsiders who don't have a dog in this fight that are rejoicing over the removal which is seen as India showing the middle finger to Pakistan and stamping it's authority over Kashmir. Some are concerned with government jobs being taken over by outsiders in the future ,  problems of overcrowding etc.  Development may or may not happen,  it's no guarantee. If development indeed happens then a few decades later everyone will be glad for the step that the Government has taken today but currently a lot of people are concerned about the short term benefits as all the subsidies and facilities that they have been enjoying due to Special status are about to end very soon. 

 

Ladakhis - the only region  where all people are celebrating the move as the region has been the most isolated and ignored in J & K.  Infact, 20 Years ago when I lived in Jammu for a brief period  all  I knew was that there is Jammu here and Kashmir up North . Ladakh Kya tha Kaha tha kisko malum.  I have never been there but those who have seen both regions admit that Jammu is like a First World Region in comparison to Ladakh. In the last decade,  a lot of Ladakhi students have been coming over to Jammu for studies. They mingle around their own  in groups and can be easily identified due to their oriental features.  The Ladakhi students have quotas in various  colleges and institutions  of Jammu and are provided scholarships by the Government.

 

Kashmiri Pandits - All of them are over the moon. Because they know that  as the only Hindu group they can never return back to Kashmir and live among the Muslims in the  current demograhic composition.  But if somehow Hindus from other states settle in Kashmir then they can live along with them if the numbers are enough to counter the Muslim majority. For Pandits this was the only way possible to return back to their roots and now they have the opportunity. 

 

Jammu Dogras - Dogras / Dogra Rajputs are the most influential people of Jammu and many among them have welcomed the decision. Yeh dogras ke paas Jammu main Bahut land hai , toh Yeh soch rahe hai thoda investment hoga , bahar se public aaega  toh property ka rates bhi badega aur job opportunities bhi improve hoga. 

 

Kashmiri Muslims - Biggest chewtiyas of all. Still obsessed with Quran,  Islam,  Sharia,  Pakistan and Azaadi.  They could have had the best of both Worlds , on one hand their state would enjoy the special status granted by the Indian Government in exchange for their loyalties and on other hand they have access to equal rights all over the country. But nahi bahot masti tha g@@@d main,  ab na ghar ke rahe na ghaat ke.  Azaadi bhi nahi Mili aur kaafiro ke saath Kashmir bhi share Karna pad gaya. 

What about Muslims in Jammu and Shias in kargil? Are they completely opposed to this move. Kashmiri Muslims from the valley are a lost cause and they will never willingly accede to India but im interested in what the other Muslims if the region think. Hindus, Sikhs and Buddhists clearly prefer India I guess. 

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Game set match.

https://www.news18.com/news/india/j-number-of-detenues-goes-up-to-45-2265021.html

 

First time, only first time, the so called separatist will actually understand what prison means. No more guest house but send them to a real prison under Shri Shri Yogi ji. In the list its Bar Association president.

 

if he himself is a millitant separatist. How the hell any lawyer would have faught for innocent Hindus and Laddakhis. How the hell any serious lawyer would have ever put GoI and peoples cases properly in Kashmir HC. All these years a fake drama and fake cases were being peddled in Kashmir HC while at the same time 75 thousand Pandit families were leaving their home because they would be killed and their girls raped or converted.

 

PS: I know, lawyers are biggest goons in India. I hope GoI does screening of every lawyer from valley as law has changed and they need to take some sort of transition tests.

Edited by mishra

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5 minutes ago, mishra said:

Game set match.

https://www.news18.com/news/india/j-number-of-detenues-goes-up-to-45-2265021.html

 

First time, only first time, the so called separatist will actually understand what prison means. No more guest house but send them to a real prison under Shri Shri Yogi ji. In the list its Bar Association president.

 

if he himself is a millitant separatist. How the hell any lawyer would have faught for innocent Hindus and Laddakhis. How the hell any serious lawyer would have ever put GoI and peoples cases properly in Kashmir HC. All these years a fake drama and fake cases were being peddled in Kashmir HC while at the same time 75 thousand Pandit families were leaving their home because they would be killed and their girls raped or converted.

 

PS: I know, lawyers are biggest goons in India

Agra is also famous for its pagalkhana...locals told me it is Asia's oldest mental asylum. Unka free mein ilaaj bhi karaya jaye, full shock treatment ke saath, paisa hum bharenge. 

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12 minutes ago, Gollum said:

Agra is also famous for its pagalkhana...locals told me it is Asia's oldest mental asylum. Unka free mein ilaaj bhi karaya jaye, full shock treatment ke saath, paisa hum bharenge. 

:phehe: Now, when you say it, I can just standup and clap for this 370 moove's meticulous planning and secrecy by BJP leaders . Choose Agra. :isalute:

Edited by mishra

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3 hours ago, Alam_dar said:

 

I want to know if there are any Muslim conversions to Dharmic Religions through "Preaching" in significant numbers in India? 

 

If not, then why not? 

Fundamental difference between Islam/Christianity and Dharmic religions. We don't proselytize, there may be minor exceptions but it is not something we actively seek to do. 

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2 hours ago, Gollum said:

Fundamental difference between Islam/Christianity and Dharmic religions. We don't proselytize, there may be minor exceptions but it is not something we actively seek to do. 

Ok, I have to study, but I already have my doubts about this claim, while it simply goes against the Human Nature. 

In fact I read how India changed to Buddhism, and then again from Buddhism to Hinduism due to many movements after the common era. Similarly, Hinduism spread in other eash asian countries too. 

 

Ok, I found it again. It is from Encyclopedia Britanica:

 

The spread of Hinduism in Southeast Asia and the Pacific

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5 hours ago, beetle said:

Migrant labour should just move to jammu or ladakh.

Let landlords in kashmir pull up their salwar and get ready to do some farm work.

 

Just for Note : I have seen quite a few Kashmiri labour's working in Uttarakhand building roads etc.

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8 minutes ago, Alam_dar said:

Ok, I have to study, but I already have my doubts about this claim, while it simply goes against the Human Nature. 

In fact I read how India changed to Buddhism, and then again from Buddhism to Hinduism due to many movements after the common era. Similarly, Hinduism spread in other eash asian countries too. 

 

Ok, I found it again. It is from Encyclopedia Britanica:

 

The spread of Hinduism in Southeast Asia and the Pacific

You asked 'in India?', along with phrases like 'are', 'still taking place'.

I said NO.

Now you are saying you have doubts about my answer and then talking about ancient history (4th century?) when it wasn't India as we know it today. 

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31 minutes ago, Alam_dar said:

Ok, I have to study, but I already have my doubts about this claim, while it simply goes against the Human Nature. 

In fact I read how India changed to Buddhism, and then again from Buddhism to Hinduism due to many movements after the common era. Similarly, Hinduism spread in other eash asian countries too. 

 

Ok, I found it again. It is from Encyclopedia Britanica:

 

The spread of Hinduism in Southeast Asia and the Pacific

No Hinduism doesn’t teach to spread it. It was assumed that everyone is Hindu no matter who they worship.

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5 hours ago, KeyboardWarrior said:

Struggling to find a person in Kashmir who sides with India today - Indian reporter

NDTV https://web.facebook.com/watch/?v=655966091547788

 

Other channels have found many and shown live. Deep in villages, oldiies were complaining that even if government meets 70-80% of what Shah promised in parliament, it will be good.

 

BTW, such reporting from NDTV is expected as NIA and ED who have been investigating ndtv promoters, have finally taken some action for Roy was going to Kenya

https://m.timesofindia.com/india/roys-stopped-from-flying-out-at-airport-ndtv-says-subversion-of-media-freedom/amp_articleshow/70613203.cms

Edited by mishra

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Not PC but I am enjoying the clampdown in Kashmir, hope it continues and we break their spirit. For too long they (majority honestly) have been partners to enemy's nefarious designs. Sincerely hope we are ruthless now, if the dogs can't behave we can sure as hell train them. 70+ years of entitlement, freeloading, radical extremist Islamism and feeling of superiority....that will take quite some teaching. Nizam-E-Mustafa my ass.

Edited by Gollum

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46 minutes ago, Gollum said:

Not PC but I am enjoying the clampdown in Kashmir, hope it continues and we break their spirit. For too long they (majority honestly) have been partners to enemy's nefarious designs. Sincerely hope we are ruthless now, if the dogs can't behave we can sure as hell train them. 70+ years of entitlement, freeloading, radical extremist Islamism and feeling of superiority....that will take quite some teaching. Nizam-E-Mustafa my ass.

Its a necessary evil, one that doesn't sit well with me.  But is necessary.  But more than the clampdown, the Indian govt and authorities need to manage the next few months with some deft handling.  The a370 change comes with new opportunities and new threats.

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20 hours ago, sandeep said:

Its a necessary evil, one that doesn't sit well with me.  But is necessary.  But more than the clampdown, the Indian govt and authorities need to manage the next few months with some deft handling.  The a370 change comes with new opportunities and new threats.

Security forces learnt their lessons post the violence during Amarnath land transfer saga in 2008. If that wasn't enough the mayhem post terrorist Burhan Wani's death should have sealed the deal. No more taking chances, clampdown is better than bloodshed, we have an extremely panicky, frustrated Pakistan military/govt this time who will be eager to bring the valley to international spotlight. This has been a work in progress, they did the same post AQ jihadi Zakir Musa's encounter and not one life was lost, tourism peaked....all for the greater good. 

Edited by Gollum

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There wAs some stats published on ToI. Once Burhan Wani was gunned down, stone pelters managed to injure nearly 1500 CRPF guys between 5th july and 22nd July2016. Thats how intense the Kashmir Government led the campaign against our security forces.  Number of stone pelting incidents were around 350. 

Here is the story

https://www.m.timesofindia.com/india/almost-90-of-stone-pelting-incidents-after-jk-move-were-in-srinagar/amp_articleshow/70823786.cms

i want to ask one question to Mufti Abdullahs Yechuris and Rauls, NYT, bbcs and rest

How many terrorist sympathiser involved in those incidents have been put behind bars.

If I am to guess, Ans will be zero. Most arrested would have been released without charge.

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