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vvvslaxman

Pant's inability to rotate strike (Dot ball watch)

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Needs a lot more time at the crease to work on this issue. In domestics he can hit the bowlers very well and doesn't have to worry asmuch. This he will develop with a proper international run. 

 

Rat will change his batting position thrice, drop him for a few months, and then repeat the process

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I think Pant is most suited for opening slot. His match temperament is more suited to tests where he can take his own time and then cut loose later. With field restrictions at the start, he can  give  '30 ball 40 cameos' at the top. I doubt he is a NO:4 material in ODIs.

 

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2 hours ago, rtmohanlal said:

I think Pant is most suited for opening slot. His match temperament is more suited to tests where he can take his own time and then cut loose later. With field restrictions at the start, he can  give  '30 ball 40 cameos' at the top. I doubt he is a NO:4 material in ODIs.

 

I feel the same. pant is not (as of now) a strike rotater. he needs fielders to be inside the circle so that he can over them. we should play him like gilly - middle order in tests and opening in ODIs.

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He needs to get in touch with Dravid. Dravid was someone who couldn't rotate strike in ODIs with fielders in the ring but he improved after 2000. So much that he incorporated that single taking into tests as well. Whenever he found it tough in tests, he would take the single and get off strike. Dravid can help Pant because he was someone who struggled with this issue but managed to overcome it.

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12 hours ago, Moochad said:

Needs a lot more time at the crease to work on this issue. In domestics he can hit the bowlers very well and doesn't have to worry asmuch. This he will develop with a proper international run. 

 

Rat will change his batting position thrice, drop him for a few months, and then repeat the process

Don't forget he'll be hailed an integral part of the "future" plans before being unceremoniously dumped, for you know who :cantstop:

12 hours ago, Rightarmfast said:

He is under the mentor ship of Dhoni, as per official statements. You can’t expect him to do any different. 

That *er is just waiting for his time, I'm sure he knows the selectors & Brat+cheers leader have his back.

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13 hours ago, vvvslaxman said:

Today he faced 10 dot balls in a row against Chase. 11th ball misfield allowed him to get away. This is becoming an issue. He is not a no.4 batsman. When are we going to realize it. He is a no.6 batsman at best. India needs a better no.4 and no.5.  

Maybe give him a proper run before making such judgments? He struggled yesterday which was a one off. Never looked in any troble vs Eng or BD in the WC. He's played a grand total of 9 ODI innings. Just needs to settle down properly and target to play at least 45-50 deliveries in each innings.

 

 

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8 minutes ago, ShoonyaSifar said:

Maybe give him a proper run before making such judgments? He struggled yesterday which was a one off. Never looked in any troble vs Eng or BD in the WC. He's played a grand total of 9 ODI innings. Just needs to settle down properly and target to play at least 45-50 deliveries in each innings.

 

 

Not the first time. It is not about giving chances. It is about ability. Giving more chances won't automatically increase the ability to rotate strike. 

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Have patience, the TM wants him to face more overs and get a big knock under his belt hence playing him at this position. 

Yuvraj never looked like a #4 in the start of his career but cemented his position as one later on ,pant should ideally be batting at #5 or 6 but I dont mind him bat at 4 for a couple of series 

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24 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

Not the first time. It is not about giving chances. It is about ability. Giving more chances won't automatically increase the ability to rotate strike. 

Well, the kind of hitting abilities he has, he can/will compensate for all those 'dot balls'. Plus the guy is all of 21. Let him have a fair run (at least 3 series) before making such grand judgments.

 

Someone who smokes 1200+ runs in 2 seasons of IPL, 1000+ runs in a FC season including a 300, fastest FC and T20 100s by an Indian, winning a crunch tri-series of A sides deserves these kinds of opportunities in an insignificant bilateral series.

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14 hours ago, vvvslaxman said:

Today he faced 10 dot balls in a row against Chase. 11th ball misfield allowed him to get away. This is becoming an issue. He is not a no.4 batsman. When are we going to realize it. He is a no.6 batsman at best. India needs a better no.4 and no.5.  

I think even the TM knows he is not a long term number 4,however it is a gamble worth taking in their eyes

1)If Pant succeeds at no.4,Dhoni can play as a keeper and continue with his mentorship role for a longer period.

2)If Pant fails at no.4 then the task is even easier,we can just claim Pant is not ready yet and needs few years in domestic etc and Dhoni will continue in his role as keeper.

3)Worst case scenario Pant proves he does not need a mentor and another middle order player cement his place in the team-highly unlikely however to be thorough they have a backup plan in Kedhar Jadhav who can be dropped at any time to bring back Dhoni in his "finisher" role. 

Edited by GautiMaan

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4 hours ago, Vijy said:

I feel the same. pant is not (as of now) a strike rotater. he needs fielders to be inside the circle so that he can over them. we should play him like gilly - middle order in tests and opening in ODIs.

yes ... same as  Gilchrist... unlike Gilly he has debuted at 20, so he has enough time . That dumb ass Kohli's methods are the only obstacles in his path to success.  

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What I've observed is he is not a wristy player, nor is he good at maneuvering in the crease to create angles where he can pick the gaps and rotate strike. He either goes hard at the ball or plays defense. Even West Indies batsmen are like this. This is something he needs to work on, if he has to bat at 4 or even 5. Otherwise, he should bat at 7 where he can play his shots. He has time against fast bowlers, that's why he doesnt struggle much defending them or playing shots.

Edited by kubrickian

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3 minutes ago, kubrickian said:

What I've observed is he is not a wristy player, nor is he good at maneuvering in the crease to create angles where he can pick the gaps and rotate strike. He either goes hard at the ball or plays defense. Even West Indies batsmen are like this. This is something he needs to work on, if he has to bat at 4 or even 5. Otherwise, he should bat at 7 where he can play his shots. He has time against fast bowlers, that's why he doesnt struggle much defending them or playing shots.

I don't think he is a no. 4 batsman but still he is too good to bat at 7.They should give chances to him at no. 5 to help him improve his game and get some time to settle. In t20's he is best at 4.

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Pant is definitely batting too high for his techical level, experience and style

He doesnt look to be our No.4, give that slot to Iyer and persist a bit.

 Pant should play 5 or 6.. even 7 depending on the situation.

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8 hours ago, Cricspin said:

Pant is definitely batting too high for his techical level, experience and style

He doesnt look to be our No.4, give that slot to Iyer and persist a bit.

 Pant should play 5 or 6.. even 7 depending on the situation.

Dont see any major technical flaws in him. He may not be technically very sound but i dnt see technical issues. He is good enough to bat at 4....the only reason i feel he shudnt bat at 4 coz we have most talent in batting who cud bat in top 4 but very few who cud bat in 5-7.... Like even dhoni cud have batted in top 4 but very few at that time also cud bat in lower order. Hardik also deserves a promotion but lack of good option in lower middle order will also be an obstacle . 

 

His problem are like of any highly talented youngster who has a huge array of shots- shot selection is the issue which will only improve with time. Guys like rohit n yuvraj had same issue coz they had so many option. His strike rotation will also improve with time. 

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he is too good a test player to get gradually regressed  both in confidence &    performance  because of getting badly managed. The best way  to use him effectively is to make him open the inns in ODI. With field restrictions upfront , he can at the least give these 30 ball 40 cameos.Additional runs from him should be a bonus. This way, he can take the resulting confidence  into tests too.Thus the whole team can benefit.

Dhawan is almost 34. With Pant being randomly used along with Dhawan, that would be a natural  progression.By the time Dhawan gets to 37, Pant   still at 24 would be a more polished batsman  who can play at high level for  at least 12years moving forward .

But whether the dumb ass management would allow him ?? That is the big question.  

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27 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

He is not a no.4. This was a time he had to get set and gradually push on the rate. Not throw the bat around willy nilly.

Any casual observer can tell you that Pant will never be a no.4 batter yet for some reason the braindead management persist in playing him there. Will likely make him lose confidence and and in turn will lose his place in the team. 

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pant should open in ODIs (as I've said in other posts). or he should not be anywhere above 6-7. he is not a middle order strike rotator. he is someone who likes the aerial route, who likes few fielders outside circle, and who needs time to play himself in and then explode. coming in middle order, he seems to have the impulse to either go for rash strokes or block too much.

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15 minutes ago, rtmohanlal said:

should  either open or get out of the ODI team. Other wise spoil him  by making a slogger at: 7  there by affecting his performances in tests too.

yes, he should be given a few matches in the opening slot. if ind wants a middle order keeper batsman, they need to look either at making jadhav/klr (a bad idea) keep or bring in kishan (who is also better at opening than middle order).

Edited by Vijy

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Though his aggressiveness suits opening his shot selection may result in disaster for India. He is been playing the same way since u19 worldcup he was an opener then and thrown his wicket away and got out to a single digit score in U19 WC FINAL. And he did the same in WC SEMI FINAL. Still he didn't change his game. Failing is not wrong but failing in the same way every time by not correcting your mistakes is definitely wrong. 

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6 hours ago, express bowling said:

Need to give Pant a very long rope.

 

He needs to be given lots of opportunities to develop his game.

 

Because his ceiling can be very high and he can be an awesome match-winner if he is able to sort out his 50-over middle order game.

:rofl:

At this stage the long rope will lead to him ending his own career.

Needs to be moved down the order. Not a #4 bat, naive to think otherwise. There is plenty of batting talent in India and we have Pant being pushed to bat at 4

Edited by Sachinism

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Pant is good. He will eventually. Fans are so fickle. 

He would do good as an opener batsman but unfortunately we have many openers.

I know many would not agree but even Rahul should have been given more chances at no 4 in ODIs. Shreyas mad Rahul both should be looked in for the jinxed position.

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