Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
Trichromatic

Ishant's avg 32.94, Zak's 32.95

Recommended Posts

6 hours ago, rangeelaraja said:

Zak was a dud as a test bowler for  a good period of time before his county stint - this ruined his avg. He became a good test bowler in the second half of his career

 

Ishant's is pure inconsistency.

Zak was as inconsistent. Zak had just two good years and still was inconsistent. One of the most overrated bowler ever.  Consistency was hardly a problem with Ishant. His problem was lack of wicket taking weapon, not able to swing the ball or bowl right length. Now, he is doing everything right.

Share this post


Link to post
6 hours ago, zen said:

Guys like Srinath and Zak did not enjoy support from other bowlers relatively esp. overseas 

For Zak, overseas record is good. Poor at home where he did have support from spinners. So not having support overseas didn't matter to him and it is not like Ishant had great support overseas. Bumrah has played 2-3 series and yadav has been poor overseas. Shami used to blow hot and cold.

Share this post


Link to post
5 hours ago, rkt.india said:

it is not like Ishant had great support overseas. Bumrah has played 2-3 series and yadav has been poor overseas. Shami used to blow hot and cold.

 

Ishant doing really well in overseas tests has been when he has paired with Bumrah and Shami overseas, starting January 2018.

 

And Bumrah has played 4 series overseas ( not 2 or 3  )

Share this post


Link to post
27 minutes ago, express bowling said:

 

Ishant doing really well in overseas tests has been when he has paired with Bumrah and Shami overseas, starting January 2018.

 

And Bumrah has played 4 series overseas ( not 2 or 3  )

We can say same about Zak. He had Sreesanth, RP and Ishant from mid 2000s.

Share this post


Link to post
6 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

We can say same about Zak. He had Sreesanth, RP and Ishant from mid 2000s.

 

I was not talking about Zak.

 

I think Zak is the most over-rated Indian bowler ever ... and dislike the fact that he usually operated at less than 100%.

Share this post


Link to post

Zak the test bowler is incredibly overrated, Shami is already twice the bowler he could ever be. Mediocre till 2007, had a golden run in 2007-10 and then pathetic  in his final 3 years. Don't want to hate on anyone but enough of glorifying the past just for the sake of it. I was a huge fan of Zak post the 2007 Eng series and had a soft corner for him even when he was in sharp decline post 2011. But have to be reasonable here, we hyped him because of our low standards in fast bowling then. 

 

In ODIs however he was very good. 

Share this post


Link to post
14 hours ago, maniac said:

:bow: backed him even when his average was 38:00. Believed in him :) and people say I jinx 

I aggressively backed him when Faulkner hit him for 30 runs in an over, blamed Dhoni for mishandling him and called him names, got banned for a few months. Beat that. 

Share this post


Link to post
13 hours ago, Vilander said:

and it happens..bloody hell.

 

2 more solid years and the guy might hit under 30.

Lambu is one of the most mentally tough cricketers out there. Subject any other player to ridicule at the scale he faced for so long at a tender age (19-24) and no way will there be such a drastic turnaround, in fact others would wilt but Ishant has become the best version of himself. He seems to have developed a lot of cricket intelligence these last few years, knows his strengths and limitations and operates in the optimum zone. He has made his peace with the fact that a premiere support bowler is of more value than a mediocre alpha, takes humility. Watch how he has ceded space to Shami/Bumrah and is happy to fulfill the (secondary) workhorse role despite him being so senior and so much of improvement in his skills. Best thing is these guys work as a unit, no *ing ego or drama. 

Also a lot of credit to the Aussie legend....

Image result for gillespie coach

Edited by Gollum

Share this post


Link to post

So we now have people on this forum criticising Zak!

 

The bowler who should be credited for starting the real fast bowling generation in India through his consistent performances from 2006-2011. Must have picked close to 175-180 test wickets in that period, was the 2nd best Test pacer in the world behind Steyn in those 5 years. Bowled so many match turning spells in India and outside.

 

He was done by 2011 though. Delayed his retirement by a couple of years. 

Share this post


Link to post
3 hours ago, Gollum said:

I aggressively backed him when Faulkner hit him for 30 runs in an over, blamed Dhoni for mishandling him and called him names, got banned for a few months. Beat that. 

Please look at the thread of the actual game on ICF, you have no clue the hate I endured for team RISS on here :--D

Share this post


Link to post
6 hours ago, Gollum said:

Zak the test bowler is incredibly overrated, Shami is already twice the bowler he could ever be. Mediocre till 2007, had a golden run in 2007-10 and then pathetic  in his final 3 years. Don't want to hate on anyone but enough of glorifying the past just for the sake of it. I was a huge fan of Zak post the 2007 Eng series and had a soft corner for him even when he was in sharp decline post 2011. But have to be reasonable here, we hyped him because of our low standards in fast bowling then. 

 

In ODIs however he was very good. 

Zak was more of an intelligent bowler than a proper fast bowler. He substituted his lack of physical gifts with strategies, but then cricket is a physical sport and not a game of chess, a player who can bowl straight and fast will be more effective than a medium pace bowler with sophisticated guile.

Share this post


Link to post

Listening to experts looks like his bowling improved after he was dropped from IPL tamasha and One day side few years ago. He had more time to focus on his Test bowling and his stint in County cricket also helped him. But it is a great turn around for a bowler who shouldn't played at club level to an effective fast bowler in all conditions.

Share this post


Link to post

Having seen him unable to realize his true potential for almost 10 years after bursting on scene in 07 Oz tour (that spell to Ponting..sigh), i admit I had written him off as nothing better than a workhorse. Even during SA tour last year, i wasnt happy when he replaced Bhuvi. But something changed since that Eng tour, credit to Gillespie, and in this pink ball test he has outshone Shami & Umesh for me. He is bowling consistently full, improved his wrist position & use of seam so getting away movement too, and saw him hit 140-42 ...all in all, he has looked deadly. Just hope he continues in this mode for next 2 years of SENA tour cycle.

Share this post


Link to post
5 hours ago, singhprakash72 said:

Listening to experts looks like his bowling improved after he was dropped from IPL tamasha and One day side few years ago. He had more time to focus on his Test bowling and his stint in County cricket also helped him. But it is a great turn around for a bowler who shouldn't played at club level to an effective fast bowler in all conditions.

That’s very harsh. He started of as a young sensation, had a world of potential. Had some great performances early on but was grossly mismanaged. He started to change his action without anyone monitoring etc. 

 

Even in our 2011 drubbings, he was the only Indian bowler to pick up a fifer in England ( did PK pick one up too? )and in Australia where everyone sucked, he was our fastest bowler. In fact the fastest bowler on both sides iirc on average speed. He was the man of the series prior to that in WI and did a decent job as the 3rd seamer along with Zak and Sree In SA in 2010.

 

From 2014 he has been our most consistent  fast bowler before Shami’s second coming and Bumrah’s debut.

 

As I have said right from the start, he has been underrated. He did fall off on the side a bit and has comeback strong but the world class talent was always there.

Edited by maniac

Share this post


Link to post
13 hours ago, express bowling said:

 

I was not talking about Zak.

 

I think Zak is the most over-rated Indian bowler ever ... and dislike the fact that he usually operated at less than 100%.

 Zak the test bowler maybe a little over rated because he had a very short peak. had a bad start and an average end but for 2-3 years at his peak he was right up there with the best. 
 

However Zak the Odi bowler is very underrated. He was the most reliable bowler at the death and the start of our innings. From 2007-2011 he was our best Odi bowler, probably the best in the world in that period.

 

Dont go by stats because those were the days when 300- 350 started becoming the norm

Share this post


Link to post

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  
×
×
  • Create New...