Stop Comparing our youngsters to WI youngsters in terms of power game, those guys are genetically better for that role

[Ankit_sharma03]

56 minutes ago, Real McCoy said:

Genetic theory is bullshit. We had Kapil Dev, Yuvraj Singh, MS Dhoni, Raina, Sehwag who were all power hitters. The same argument was made when India was lacking fast bowling now this.

These are few names if u start taking their that list wud be endless

Raina doesnt hit that big sixes and he had timing as well

Yuvi , kapil, dhoni can be termed under power hitter.

Sehwag was again more of a boundary hitter. 

 

About fast bowler u need to read the op again properly. Ur misreading as that i have written that we are bad.....whereas i hve mentioned that they are better then us even whole world which doesnt make us or anyone bad

[Stan AF]

The average west indian player can smack the ball harder than the average indian player. That much is true. We have maybe 1 or 2 powerhitters who can smack sixers for fun (rohit & pant and maybeKL Rahul )but windies players top to bottom all can smack sixes for fun. And this is without Gayle/Russell etc.

[Ankit_sharma03]

5 minutes ago, Stan AF said:

The average west indian player can smack the ball harder than the average indian player. That much is true.

 

Which is what im saying, that is their strength but that doesnt make us bad....they just are better then rest of world in that aspect

 

[Ankit_sharma03]

2 hours ago, GautiMaan said:

There is no need to complicate things,just fill the lineup with high SR batsmen doesnt matter if someone is power hitter,timer,sweeper etc

However you need to optimize their roles per their strengths,ex Rohit Sharma is someone who can clear the ropes easily in the middle order whereas someone like Shaw might be bettter suited to use the PP overs,this kind of flexibile thinking is whats missing

In our 2007 campaign somehow these things came together but after that we began to approach t20s like ODIs

No rohit wont work in middle

• Some player like to set pace of the game rather then be dicatated by pace of the game....in middle u hve to run acc to pace set
• Rohit like new ball
• Rohit takes time to set in 

 

Opening is perfect for him, middle order never worked for him

[Stan AF]

15 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

Which is what im saying, that is their strength but that doesnt make us bad....they just are better then rest of world in that aspect

 

But it is a match winning aspect.

[nevada]

I think it is the mental aspect of the game that needs to change. Our top order always look to play a long innings and don't seem to go on the attack from ball one ever. Punish the bad balls at-least, don't pat them back harmlessly. You can't tuk tuk in the first 6 overs and still expect to come out ahead against teams like WI. 

Edited December 9, 2019 by nevada

[rageaddict]

The difference is simple.  Power hitting is a common trait among Windies Batters,  but same power hitting is a rare trait among Indian batters. 

 

Dhoni might be a so called Power Hitter from India,  but If 40 runs are required from the last 3 overs in a T20 International match you would rather have Darren Sammy arrive at the crease over Dhoni. Yeah even a bits and pieces Cricketer/Batsman like Sammy provides more value than the Indian Power Hitter Dhoni.

 

This is the same reason why recent arrivals Afghans  easily whitewash Bangaldesh in a T20 Series. The Bangladeshs cannot match the firepower of Afghan batting line-up. 

[GautiMaan]

2 hours ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

No rohit wont work in middle

• Some player like to set pace of the game rather then be dicatated by pace of the game....in middle u hve to run acc to pace set
• Rohit like new ball
• Rohit takes time to set in 

 

Opening is perfect for him, middle order never worked for him

He was pretty succesful with Mumbai Indians in the middle order,infact even in 2007 he played some crucial knocks for us.He struggled with pacing in ODIs,in t20s it would not be an issue

This idea of getting set should be discarded in t20s by the time Rohit,Dhawan,Kohli get set half the innings would be over

[Real McCoy]

2 hours ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

These are few names if u start taking their that list wud be endless

Raina doesnt hit that big sixes and he had timing as well

Yuvi , kapil, dhoni can be termed under power hitter.

Sehwag was again more of a boundary hitter. 

 

About fast bowler u need to read the op again properly. Ur misreading as that i have written that we are bad.....whereas i hve mentioned that they are better then us even whole world which doesnt make us or anyone bad

You are doing the same. I'm not saying WI cricketers are not more powerful than Indians. But I'm against the genetic theory. Lots of WI players are stronger because of their diet not genetics. You can find more stronger people if you go to the villages in India. Its all because of natural diet. And Sehwag dealing in boundaries doesn't mean that he is not a power hitter. He has hit out of the park sixes. You need power to do that not just timing like Kohli. Raina has upper body strength mainly through training harder. Its very difficult to get under the ball in subcontinent conditions and you need power to hit sixes against spinners. He has hit sixes that were not timed well. You are underestimating Indians here.

[Ankit_sharma03]

2 hours ago, Stan AF said:

But it is a match winning aspect.

yes it is and we are getting better

Rahul, iyer, pant, Pandya is massive improvement 

[Ankit_sharma03]

3 minutes ago, Real McCoy said:

You are doing the same. I'm not saying WI cricketers are not more powerful than Indians. But I'm against the genetic theory. Lots of WI players are stronger because of their diet not genetics.

Its not only about diet 

Look at gillespie he was a vegan ...i think even morkel was 

Srinath was vegetarian n he was bloody quick 

 

We dont have height n build like those players

3 minutes ago, Real McCoy said:

You can find more stronger people if you go to the villages in India. Its all because of natural diet. And Sehwag dealing in boundaries doesn't mean that he is not a power hitter. He has hit out of the park sixes. You need power to do that not just timing like Kohli. Raina has upper body strength mainly through training harder. Its very difficult to get under the ball in subcontinent conditions and you need power to hit sixes against spinners. He has hit sixes that were not timed well.

Those were top order batsman u need diff power to hit the ball when ball is old and u hve no time to get in

No doubt those guys had power but not of gayle, russell , pollard level 

3 minutes ago, Real McCoy said:

 

You are underestimating Indians here.

Erre how am in underestmating us

m saying they are better n best in world...now even if we are 2nd how is underestimating

On avg those guys are better power hitter 

In current line up also we can name Pandya, dube or lets say pant but unka list khatam nhin hota

 

 

[Ankit_sharma03]

9 minutes ago, GautiMaan said:

He was pretty succesful with Mumbai Indians in the middle order,infact even in 2007 he played some crucial knocks for us.He struggled with pacing in ODIs,in t20s it would not be an issue

This idea of getting set should be discarded in t20s by the time Rohit,Dhawan,Kohli get set half the innings would be over

IPL is a diff ball game u can target 2-3 weak bowlers 

N if he bats at 4 iyer even goes down 

 

Why shud the idea of getting set be discarded....u cant win by cameos...top order will always have to score more. Some start late but pick up like no one.Kohli n rohit start late but then they pick they become beast as just kohli showed. u cant throw in all youngsters ....experience is a huge thing in Wcs

If they take time they also offer consistency.....u need to have diff kind of players. 

[Ankit_sharma03]

7 hours ago, rkt.india said:

You are forgetting pant is a wk. Pooran, hetmeyer are specialist batsmen. You can't compare special bats to a wk and Pant is a big bottle for Indian standards.

and look at they way hetmeyer is backed despite not scoring in last year or so

Pant is always under the pump from TM , media n janta 

[Real McCoy]

13 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

Its not only about diet 

Look at gillespie he was a vegan ...i think even morkel was 

Srinath was vegetarian n he was bloody quick 

 

We dont have height n build like those players

Those were top order batsman u need diff power to hit the ball when ball is old and u hve no time to get in

No doubt those guys had power but not of gayle, russell , pollard level 

Erre how am in underestmating us

m saying they are better n best in world...now even if we are 2nd how is underestimating

On avg those guys are better power hitter 

In current line up also we can name Pandya, dube or lets say pant but unka list khatam nhin hota

 

 

Diet is the most important when growing up. Gillespie and Morkel were not vegans growing up. Gillespie became vegan after retiring. Again you must have spent a lot of time in padosi forums. Diet doesn't just involve meat. It also includes whole grain, dairy products. If you look at ancient India, you will find how much grains we used to consume. Meat has replaced those grains for protein nowadays. In villages these grains are still produced but may not be in future. Even in the carribean, you will notice people are not stronger as they used to be.

[express bowling]

India have lots of big hitters now. The fact that it is due to a combination of timing and power, make us more versatile than most WI sloggers.

 

Hardik

Pant

Rohit

Dube

Rahul

Umesh

Jadeja

 

All can hit big 6s for fun.

 

Sundar 

Shaw

Iyer

Axar

 

Have all improved their big hitting ability a lot.

 

Kohli plays very powerful shots along the ground.

 

We don't need to worry.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited December 10, 2019 by express bowling

[express bowling]

13 hours ago, javier26 said:

https://www.espncricinfo.com/series/8604/scorecard/951371/india-vs-west-indies-2nd-semi-final-world-t20-2015-16

 

Already played against Bumrah,  4 overs 42 runs. 

 

Bumrah is very quality bowler but these WI batsmen also have a lot of experience in playing all around the World in Leagues. 

 

Huge difference between Bumrah of early 2016 and late 2019.

[Ankit_sharma03]

1 minute ago, express bowling said:

 We don't need to worry.

 

Agreed we dont need to worry as we have come a long way in terms of this aspect and this comparison to those guys shud end 

This aspect will get better as with every new batch that comes which is what happened with our fast bowling- as years went by we had more options n we improved their skill same will happen with hitters 

[express bowling]

54 minutes ago, rageaddict said:

 

Dhoni might be a so called Power Hitter from India,  but If 40 runs are required from the last 3 overs in a T20 International match you would rather have Darren Sammy arrive at the crease over Dhoni. Yeah even a bits and pieces Cricketer/Batsman like Sammy provides more value than the Indian Power Hitter Dhoni.

 

 

That is the old Dhoni who cannot move or see properly.

 

Dhoni of 2005 to 2013 was an awesome hitter.

[express bowling]

2 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

Agreed we dont need to worry as we have come a long way in terms of this aspect and this comparison to those guys shud end 

This aspect will get better as with every new batch that comes which is what happened with our fast bowling- as years went by we had more options n we improved their skill same will happen with hitters 

 

Indian fast bowlers are bowling fast now.

 

Indian batsmen are hitting big now.

 

And this has been brought about by a combination of improved power, fitness, techniques, diet etc.

 

The end result is all that matters.

 

 

[Real McCoy]

7 minutes ago, express bowling said:

India have lots of big hitters now. The fact that it is due to a combination of timing and power, make us more versatile than most WI sloggers.

 

Hardik

Pant

Rohit

Dube

Umesh

Jadeja

 

All can hit big 6s for fun.

 

Sundar 

Shaw

Iyer

Axar

 

Have all improved their big hitting ability a lot.

 

Kohli plays very powerful shots along the ground.

 

We don't need to worry.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Really?