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maniac

A question about Hindu Sindhis

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During the partition, Bengal and Punjab were divided on communal lines.

 

The Kashmiri Pandits getting displaced gets significant attention, maybe not as much as it should but it still gets talked about.

 

How about the Hindu Sindhis though? Their entire region went to Pakistan. Wouldn’t they be the most displaced group in India?

 

There is obviously USA (Ulhasnagar Sindhi association) :giggle: and areas like Sindhi colony in Hyderabad but I believe and feel free to correct me   this wasn’t any rehabilitative step by the govt. more like a group of Sindhi businessmen settling down in that area.

 

However surprisingly most Sindhis I have seen be it in the media like Hirani and other Bollywood types or the ones who are my friends seem to be super liberal in their political views and very secular. Now look secular has become a bad word, there is nothing wrong in being secular but I am talking about being secular in the pseudo kind of way.
 

Shouldn’t they be a little more bitter about what happened to their community?

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1 hour ago, maniac said:

During the partition, Bengal and Punjab were divided on communal lines.

 

The Kashmiri Pandits getting displaced gets significant attention, maybe not as much as it should but it still gets talked about.

 

How about the Hindu Sindhis though? Their entire region went to Pakistan. Wouldn’t they be the most displaced group in India?

 

There is obviously USA (Ulhasnagar Sindhi association) :giggle: and areas like Sindhi colony in Hyderabad but I believe and feel free to correct me   this wasn’t any rehabilitative step by the govt. more like a group of Sindhi businessmen settling down in that area.

 

However surprisingly most Sindhis I have seen be it in the media like Hirani and other Bollywood types or the ones who are my friends seem to be super liberal in their political views and very secular. Now look secular has become a bad word, there is nothing wrong in being secular but I am talking about being secular in the pseudo kind of way.
 

Shouldn’t they be a little more bitter about what happened to their community?

Mate I know a Kashmiri pandit girl living in New Delhi. Her parents who were doctors in Kashmir Valley fled in the middle of the night when the genocide was happening and now she herself is posting anti CAA and NRC posts on social media. Forget bitter this is the height of irony. So let’s not even talk about Sindhis. The youth in India is a lost cause.

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1 hour ago, maniac said:

During the partition, Bengal and Punjab were divided on communal lines.

 

The Kashmiri Pandits getting displaced gets significant attention, maybe not as much as it should but it still gets talked about.

 

How about the Hindu Sindhis though? Their entire region went to Pakistan. Wouldn’t they be the most displaced group in India?

 

There is obviously USA (Ulhasnagar Sindhi association) :giggle: and areas like Sindhi colony in Hyderabad but I believe and feel free to correct me   this wasn’t any rehabilitative step by the govt. more like a group of Sindhi businessmen settling down in that area.

 

However surprisingly most Sindhis I have seen be it in the media like Hirani and other Bollywood types or the ones who are my friends seem to be super liberal in their political views and very secular. Now look secular has become a bad word, there is nothing wrong in being secular but I am talking about being secular in the pseudo kind of way.
 

Shouldn’t they be a little more bitter about what happened to their community?

 

Not true actually. Most settled in Gujarat and Mumbai at the time of partition  due to proximity from Karachi/Sindh.

 

Also linguistically Kutchhi language in Gujarat is almost identical to Sindhi so they migrated comfortably in bordering Gujarat regions. Being a trader community many Sindhis moved to Mumbai.

 

Actually Hindu Sindhis are among the most dynamic business community in India like the Gujarati Jains.

 

They have emigrated far in wide to Hong Kong, East Africa and the Gulf region through the 60s and 70s in large numbers 

 

Edited by rangeelaraja

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48 minutes ago, rangeelaraja said:

 

Not true actually. Most settled in Gujarat and Mumbai at the time of partition  due to proximity from Karachi/Sindh.

 

Also linguistically Kutchhi language in Gujarat is almost identical to Sindhi so they migrated comfortably in bordering Gujarat regions. Being a trader community many Sindhis moved to Mumbai.

 

Actually Hindu Sindhis are among the most dynamic business community in India like the Gujarati Jains.

 

They have emigrated far in wide to Hong Kong, East Africa and the Gulf region through the 60s and 70s in large numbers 

 

Look they are some of the most industrious and smart business minded folk. no doubt about that.However I highly doubt the Indian govt took concrete steps to settle them in.

 

They seem more like Jewish people who built their own destiny by controlling Trade ,Banking and Media. Maybe not at that level but to some extent.

 

Anyway what I find is they are right up there when it comes to communities who have lost the most due to partition, however they don’t seem to have the same amount of animosity and the constant remembering of history that say the Jewish people have.

 

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1 hour ago, Stradlater said:

Government did take steps to rehabilitate the Sindhi Refugees. A lot of them got settled in Rajasthan. 

 

Heck the main bus depot of Jaipur is colloquially known as Sindhi camp since the site before was a massive rehab camp for the fleeing Sindhis. 

There is a Sindhi colony in most places like o said in Mumbai and Hyderabad, 2 places in India I am familiar with. I will he really surprised if our central govt did take the measures to rehabilitate them. I mean it’s obvious that they have made it on their own business acumen and work ethic but I will be really surprised if Congress govt. took steps to help them out 

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many urban hindus assume that being or behaving secular makes them member of indian intellectual society headed by the likes of shekar gupta , arundhati roy , prannoy roy and few of the street dogs that stays near BTM upupi park.. 

 

sindhis are more urban than others  , so probability of them being a libtard is extremely  high..

anyway hindu sindhis are economically  well off .. as far as i know they worship ONLY goddess "laxmi" and nobody else

 

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2 hours ago, velu said:

many urban hindus assume that being or behaving secular makes them member of indian intellectual society headed by the likes of shekar gupta , arundhati roy , prannoy roy and few of the street dogs that stays near BTM upupi park.. 

 

sindhis are more urban than others  , so probability of them being a libtard is extremely  high..

anyway hindu sindhis are economically  well off .. as far as i know they worship ONLY goddess "laxmi" and nobody else

 

Not sure if serious.  Ever heard of Julelaal ?  

 

Sindhis worship Julelaal and Guru Nanak.  Most of the Gurudwaras in Mumbai ( South ) are run and attended by the Sindhis. Traditionally,  they are not your typical Ram Seeta or Ganesh or Durga worshipping Hindus, maybe they do worship to  a small extent but not in the same zeal as  they celebrate Gurpurab ( Guru Nanaks Birthday).  Everytime i went to a Gurudwara,  i realized that the large crowd was 99% Sindhis who have their own Gurudwara Managements  and trusts. In some places,  they had their own Sindhi translated versions of Guru Granth Sahib and Sindhi Bhajans for Guru Nanak. 

 

 

 " Guru Nanak " Bhajan in Sindhi.

 Guru Nanak Celebrations at Sindhi Society. 

Edited by javier26

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2 hours ago, javier26 said:

Not sure if serious.  Ever heard of Julelaal ?  

 

Sindhis worship Julelaal and Guru Nanak.  Most of the Gurudwaras in Mumbai ( South ) are run and attended by the Sindhis. Traditionally,  they are not your typical Ram Seeta or Ganesh or Durga worshipping Hindus, maybe they do worship to  a small extent but not in the same zeal as  they celebrate Gurpurab ( Guru Nanaks Birthday).  Everytime i went to a Gurudwara,  i realized that the large crowd was 99% Sindhis who have their own Gurudwara Managements  and trusts. In some places,  they had their own Sindhi translated versions of Guru Granth Sahib and Sindhi Bhajans for Guru Nanak. 

 

 

 " Guru Nanak " Bhajan in Sindhi.

 Guru Nanak Celebrations at Sindhi Society. 

A Sindhi myself, was surprised to find that a gurdwara being 'run' by sindhis in Pune even....

 

In Delhi(where I am from), a Sindhi person would be as religious or as non-religious as an avg. urban Hindu....we n all my relatives do Laxmi pujan on Diwali day, aartis of Ganesh, n like an average Hindu all-year, prayers, hanuman chaalisa, shiv chaalisa, gayatri , Mahamritujaya mantra  etc.  Hawans etc. on occasions... couple of weeks back my uncle also did sukhmani sahib paath in a gurdwara...

 

Voting pattern : probably 70-80% pro-bjp.. Bollywood sindhis  different in that respect, just as any other Hindu.

 

Good thing about Sindhi is no caste practiced within sindhis... there aren't many(40 lac Hindu sindhis in India iirc) which is probably why we don't practice it but it's a good thing...

 

We didn't ever ask for reservations etc. Afaik... We were just happy to be in India...my grandparents moved in from nawabshah, Sindh in '47...

 

Today's Sindhi youngsters barely even talk in sindhi, so I don't know what makes them Sindhi...btw ranveer Singh is a Sindhi (bhavnani , I don't think he would have gotten roles with that surname) and so was asaram bapu :p

Edited by randomGuy

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33 minutes ago, randomGuy said:

A Sindhi myself, was surprised to find that a gurdwara being 'run' by sindhis in Pune even....

 

In Delhi(where I am from), a Sindhi person would be as religious or as non-religious as an avg. urban Hindu....we n all my relatives do Laxmi pujan on Diwali day, aartis of Ganesh, n like an average Hindu all-year, prayers, hanuman chaalisa, shiv chaalisa, gayatri , Mahamritujaya mantra  etc.  Hawans etc. on occasions... couple of weeks back my uncle also did sukhmani sahib paath in a gurdwara...

 

Voting pattern : probably 70-80% pro-bjp.. Bollywood sindhis  different in that respect, just as any other Hindu.

 

Good thing about Sindhi is no caste practiced within sindhis... there aren't many(40 lac Hindu sindhis in India iirc) which is probably why we don't practice it but it's a good thing...

 

We didn't ever ask for reservations etc. Afaik... We were just happy to be in India...my grandparents moved in from nawabshah, Sindh in '47...

 

Today's Sindhi youngsters barely even talk in sindhi, so I don't know what makes them Sindhi...btw ranveer Singh is a Sindhi (bhavnani , I don't think he would have gotten roles with that surname) and so was asaram bapu :p

 

@randomGuy

 

Why do Hindu SIndhis worship 'Jhulelal' , who was actually a Muslim sufi saint Lal Shahbaz Qalandar ?

 

 

 

 

 

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2 minutes ago, rangeelaraja said:

 

@randomGuy

 

Why do Hindu SIndhis worship 'Jhulelal' , who was actually a Muslim sufi saint Lal Shahbaz Qalandar ?

 

 

 

 

 

 

1. 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jhulelal_(Hinduism)

Jhulelal is a name that refers to the Ishta Dev (most-revered deity) of Sindhi Hindus, who regard him to be an incarnation of the Hindu deity Varuna.[1][2] The chant Jhule Lal Jhule Lal is considered the "clarion call" of Sindhi Hindus.[3]His birth name was Uderolal (colloquially called Oderolal).It is said that the when Uderolal was a child ,his cradle(swing ) rocked itself to lull him to sleep,earning him the name Jhulelal-The Lord of the Swing

 

2. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.livehistoryindia.com/amp/story/snapshort-histories%2F2017%2F07%2F14%2Fjhulelal-the-god-of-the-indus

 

Jhulelal is a Hindu name Afaik.

 

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2 minutes ago, randomGuy said:

 

1. 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jhulelal_(Hinduism)

Jhulelal is a name that refers to the Ishta Dev (most-revered deity) of Sindhi Hindus, who regard him to be an incarnation of the Hindu deity Varuna.[1][2] The chant Jhule Lal Jhule Lal is considered the "clarion call" of Sindhi Hindus.[3]His birth name was Uderolal (colloquially called Oderolal).It is said that the when Uderolal was a child ,his cradle(swing ) rocked itself to lull him to sleep,earning him the name Jhulelal-The Lord of the Swing

 

2. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.livehistoryindia.com/amp/story/snapshort-histories%2F2017%2F07%2F14%2Fjhulelal-the-god-of-the-indus

 

Jhulelal is a Hindu name Afaik.

 

 

@randomGuy

 

Thats interesting. 

 

I saw the below and have seen my Sindhi friends celebrate with the ever green Duma Dum Mast Qalander Song

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jhulelal_(Sufism)

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Jhulelal , the Water Diety worshipped by Sindhi Hindus is this,  

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jhulelal_(Hinduism)

 

Jhulelal, Shahbaz Qalandar,  the Sufi Saint is different.  

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jhulelal_(Sufism)

 

This Duma Dum Mast Kalandar is mainly revered by the Muslims in Pakistan.

 

Though some sources mention that the Sufi Saint is believed to be reincarnation of the original Water Diety.  

 

I believe the Hindu Sindhus worship the Water Diety Jhulelal and not the Sufi Saint. 

 

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Off-topic : all this discussion about the mass exodus of Hindus from Pakistan is very disheartening and goes to show how many beautiful,  indigenous cultures of the past have been swamped over by the intolerant cult of Islam.  Forget about Sindh,  once upon a time there were peaceful, prosperous Hindu commmunities in Balochistan and KPK . Where have all these people and their culture disappeared?  Offcourse they were either killed, raped,  converted in name of Islam or forced to flee from their traditional homeland because when Islam becomes dominant there is no room for compromise,  no Secularism,  no equal rights  no co-existence its only subjugation of Non-muslims and complete domination of Islam where other religions and their ways of living shall cease to exist. All this secularism,  equality,  co-existence are mainly Hindu concepts where Hindus must give and Muslims shall receive .

 

We have not witnessed the events of migration but if anyone wants to get an idea of what might have happened then look no further from present day Kashmir. Its a Shining example of Muslim hospitality towards Minority Hindus.  Dont know how many more territories will fall to Islam before Hindus finally wake up,  that is if they wake up at all.  Today we are talking about Sindhi Hindus,  Kashmiri Pandits and in the future we might discuss about the Assamese Hindus,  Bengali Hindus and so on.  Offcourse all this is just  Hindutva fear mongering because nothing of this sort has ever happened in the past and thus will not happen in the future either. So till the time we have sword hanging over our heads,  lets remain complacent and remain staunch supporters  of Indian Secularism to fund Mosques,  Madrassas,  the Jihadi Infrastructure lets empower them so that they are strong enough to repeat history. 

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@javier26 If there is some concept like Ghar vapsi starting, some opposition parties led by Hindus only start protesting...I think if Ghar vapsi is allowed to become culturely, socially acceptable by these political parties, many Muslims will start to come back to Hinduism at least in North India....in a democracy, that's the way for now...else we need army rule led by Hindu nationalists...

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Some of the posts on this topic provide good info about Sindhis. Growing up in B'lore....my personal experience with Sindhis was that they are a very quiet & knowledgeable community, don't get involved in unwanted hassles in a society  and majority of them I have come across were very successful businessmen. :two_thumbs_up:

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35 minutes ago, Mariyam said:

Why would the Sindhis, who are seemingly well off and not afflicted by caste choose to convert?

 

Honestly, I don't know. Ftr, the vast majority of Sindhis in Ulhasnagar are still Hindu. But the conversions are on the rise and have been for the past decade.

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24 minutes ago, Jimmy Cliff said:

More sources:

 

DNA

 

Indian Express

 

Open Magazine

Thanks for sharing.looks like 7000 figure is a rough count, no authentic source..some say it's Arnd 800. I hope that early detection of the issue would lead to the reversal..from your link:

 

Out of four lakh Sindhi-speaking Hindus in Ulhasnagar, around 7,000 (1.75%) have changed their faith in the last two years, according to a rough count. 

 

But Ram Budhwani, a resident who follows Christianity, rubbishes the argument. “I started visiting the chapel to get peace of mind. I lost my wife in an accident two years ago. I became an alcoholic. I suffered heavy losses in my business and had to close down my shop. But since I am visiting the prayer house (known as Prarthana Ghar in Ulhasnagar) I am making progress in my business. I set up my shop again and am doing well. I have changed my faith, not the religion,” he said.

 

"Conway’s church is down the road from Pappu Kalani’s walled residence. He feels unprotected, even if Kalani comes by only during election time. Conway is uneasy. How did they come up with this number? He reckons that no more than 800 conversions have occurred. The rest are people who like to come by for peace of mind. But he admits that there are some Sindhis who have not told anyone about their conversion to Christianity. They have kept their last names. They are afraid of being ostracised."

 

 

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23 hours ago, LordPrabhzy said:

Mate I know a Kashmiri pandit girl living in New Delhi. Her parents who were doctors in Kashmir Valley fled in the middle of the night when the genocide was happening and now she herself is posting anti CAA and NRC posts on social media. Forget bitter this is the height of irony. So let’s not even talk about Sindhis. The youth in India is a lost cause.

There are many Hindus. Its not their fault, as from birth, we are told to be neutral and this neutrality is now confused with secularism when both are very different.

 

So instead of fighting, and challenging the root causes, such Hindus prefer the neutrality route of making sure the status quo is prevailed. They are very afraid of change so they are reacting very aggressive to this government’s move. 

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13 hours ago, SecondSlip said:

@randomGuy @rahulrulezz 

 

What played a bigger role in Sindh becoming Muslim-majority? 
 

Was it Muhammad Bin Qasim’s invasion or was it the various Sufi saints? 

Sorry, I couldn’t reply in detail as more I wrote, more angrier I got.

 

I am  just write basic key points

 

-close proximity to Iran and Arab world. Compare to other states, sadly Sindhis had to bear the brunt as they are closest location wise

-Sindh region and Sindhis in general were very well off, which meant more money to Be looted by invaders and meant more forced conversion

- Qasim played a key role in the start. He basically converted thousands of Sindhis to Islam forcefully and this is documented, and how proud he was of converting thousands of Sindhis

- Qasim killed Raja Dahir, took away his daughters, initially had backing off caliphate, and basically might of sword to convert everyone

- again, future invaders from Persia and Arab choose Sindh as their gateway to India And converted locals with might of their force

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, rahulrulezz said:

Sorry, I couldn’t reply in detail as more I wrote, more angrier I got.

 

I am  just write basic key points

 

-close proximity to Iran and Arab world. Compare to other states, sadly Sindhis had to bear the brunt as they are closest location wise

-Sindh region and Sindhis in general were very well off, which meant more money to Be looted by invaders and meant more forced conversion

- Qasim played a key role in the start. He basically converted thousands of Sindhis to Islam forcefully and this is documented, and how proud he was of converting thousands of Sindhis

- Qasim killed Raja Dahir, took away his daughters, initially had backing off caliphate, and basically might of sword to convert everyone

- again, future invaders from Persia and Arab choose Sindh as their gateway to India And converted locals with might of their force

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It seems more emotional to you. But why couldn’t they resist like Punjab did against aurangzeb ?  Rich state also means more resources they can buy to protect ? May be planning was bad by the king. 

Edited by gattaca

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Raja Dahir was hesitant to ask for help according to few articles from Hindu kingdom and didn’t even send his family away. Oh boy doesn’t seem like bravery to me. So many Hindu kings were stupid at that time. The caliphate at that was quite big. He was stupid to think he can hold them off. 

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