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Malcolm Merlyn

Saha 0 Pant 7, who should play?

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Saha any day of the week, and Sundays to spare.

 

He's by far the better keeper, in fact by an order of magnitude.

 

And given how the ball seems (as read on cricinfo) to be moving, I don't see Pant scoring enough over Saha to make a difference. 

 

Whereas I do see Pant dropping or missing a few, where Saha may even take a few blinders to even out the game. 

 

That's the call I'd take.

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16 minutes ago, NameGoesHere said:

Saha any day of the week, and Sundays to spare.

 

He's by far the better keeper, in fact by an order of magnitude.

 

And given how the ball seems (as read on cricinfo) to be moving, I don't see Pant scoring enough over Saha to make a difference. 

 

Whereas I do see Pant dropping or missing a few, where Saha may even take a few blinders to even out the game. 

 

That's the call I'd take.

it just seams on day -1 after that pitches become pancake also it doesnt seam that late like in england so keeping wont be as big an issue, pant kept well in england

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Against relatively strong test teams:

 

View overall figures [change view]
Primary team India remove India from query
Opposition team Australia remove Australia from query or England remove England from query or New Zealand remove New Zealand from query or Pakistan remove Pakistan from query or South Africa remove South Africa from query
Start of match date greater than or equal to 1 Jan 2000 remove greater than or equal to 1 Jan 2000 from query
Wicketkeeper as designated wicketkeeper remove as designated wicketkeeper from query
Qualifications runs scored greater than or equal to 200 remove runs scored greater than or equal to 200 from query
Ordered by batting average (descending)
Page 1 of 1 Showing 1 - 6 of 6   First pageFirst Previous pagePrevious Next Next page Last Last page dblBakArwB.gifReturn to query menu
dblBakArwW.gifCleared query menu
Overall figures
Player Span Mat Inns NO Runs HS AveDescending BF SR 100 50 0 4s 6s  
RR Pant 2018-2019 7 13 1 512 159* 42.66 725 70.62 2 0 1 51 11 investigate this query
MS Dhoni 2006-2014 66 109 11 3716 224 37.91 6494 57.22 3 27 8 442 48 investigate this query
D Dasgupta 2001-2001 5 9 1 291 100 36.37 961 30.28 1 2 1 34 0 investigate this query
PA Patel 2002-2018 21 32 7 802 71 32.08 1572 51.01 0 6 4 112 1 investigate this query
KD Karthik 2004-2018 11 18 1 411 93 24.17 925 44.43 0 3 2 56 1 investigate this query
WP Saha 2012-2019 20 29 4 582 117 23.28 1346 43.23 1 2 5 57 7

 

 

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Pant should play because of his much better  batting.

 

Pant is good at catching the ball while keeping to pacers ... and that is what we will primarily need in tests in NZ.

 

So, his keeping won't be a compromise in tests in NZ and other SENA countries.

 

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1 hour ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

it just seams on day -1 after that pitches become pancake also it doesnt seam that late like in england so keeping wont be as big an issue, pant kept well in england

I'm not sure if that's enough of an advantage. 

 

I'd prefer the better wicketkeeper, which Saha is by far, and I'm not sure Pant brings enough in his batting to make up for the lack.

 

What we'll probably see is Saha in the first Test, and then a relook in the second basis what happens in that first one.

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14 minutes ago, NameGoesHere said:

I'm not sure if that's enough of an advantage. 

 

I'd prefer the better wicketkeeper, which Saha is by far, and I'm not sure Pant brings enough in his batting to make up for the lack.

 

What we'll probably see is Saha in the first Test, and then a relook in the second basis what happens in that first one.

the guy has 2 100s overseas that someone like dhoni also cudnt manage so there is a diff and in overseas u need extra batting as well

About keeping pant is not parthiv patel, he has kept well 

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7 minutes ago, SUMO said:

Pant obviously. I hate mediocres

Saha is one of, if not the best, pure wicketkeepers in the world right now.  Whatever he is, it isn't mediocre.  

 

And if we're using his batting ability to call Saha mediocre, well one could very well call Pant a mediocre keeper. 

 

There's no way either of them is mediocre IMO.

Edited by NameGoesHere

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16 minutes ago, NameGoesHere said:

I'm not sure if that's enough of an advantage. 

I'm not sure Pant brings enough in his batting to make up for the lack.

 

 

u can see the diff

52 minutes ago, zen said:

Against relatively strong test teams:

 

View overall figures [change view]
Primary team India remove India from query
Opposition team Australia remove Australia from query or England remove England from query or New Zealand remove New Zealand from query or Pakistan remove Pakistan from query or South Africa remove South Africa from query
Start of match date greater than or equal to 1 Jan 2000 remove greater than or equal to 1 Jan 2000 from query
Wicketkeeper as designated wicketkeeper remove as designated wicketkeeper from query
Qualifications runs scored greater than or equal to 200 remove runs scored greater than or equal to 200 from query
Ordered by batting average (descending)
Page 1 of 1 Showing 1 - 6 of 6   First pageFirst Previous pagePrevious Next Next page Last Last page dblBakArwB.gifReturn to query menu
dblBakArwW.gifCleared query menu
Overall figures
Player Span Mat Inns NO Runs HS AveDescending BF SR 100 50 0 4s 6s  
RR Pant 2018-2019 7 13 1 512 159* 42.66 725 70.62 2 0 1 51 11 investigate this query
MS Dhoni 2006-2014 66 109 11 3716 224 37.91 6494 57.22 3 27 8 442 48 investigate this query
D Dasgupta 2001-2001 5 9 1 291 100 36.37 961 30.28 1 2 1 34 0 investigate this query
PA Patel 2002-2018 21 32 7 802 71 32.08 1572 51.01 0 6 4 112 1 investigate this query
KD Karthik 2004-2018 11 18 1 411 93 24.17 925 44.43 0 3 2 56 1 investigate this query
WP Saha 2012-2019 20 29 4 582 117 23.28 1346 43.23 1 2 5 57 7

 

 

 

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2 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

u can see the diff

 

Yes very fair point.  However, is that 20 average difference between Saha and Pant enough to justify a dropped catch or missed stumping?  

 

I want t make it clear that Pant is the future and for my money I'd give him a long run in the shorter formats.  But not in Tests as of now.  

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4 minutes ago, NameGoesHere said:

Yes very fair point.  However, is that 20 average difference between Saha and Pant enough to justify a dropped catch or missed stumping?  

as if saha cant drop or miss stumping , he can n he has to

 

we are assuming that pant will miss a lot which is not the case.....the logic works if the keeper was parthiv or conditions were india(where bounce become invariable) or england (where ball swings late) neither is the case here

4 minutes ago, NameGoesHere said:

I want t make it clear that Pant is the future and for my money I'd give him a long run in the shorter formats.  But not in Tests as of now.  

he has been best in test only

 

I dnt get this future talk.....u keep a younger player on bench in name of future when a pressure game comes after years then ull say oh he has no experience....what is this conservative approach. Pant has already played in international test and done really well, he might fail but so does other. Pant is not the future but he is the present 

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Performances in SENA: 

 

View overall figures [change view]
Primary team India  remove India from query
Opposition team Australia  remove Australia from query or England  remove England from query or New Zealand  remove New Zealand from query or South Africaremove South Africa from query
Home or away away (home of opposition)  remove away (home of opposition) from query
Start of match date greater than or equal to 1 Jan 2000  remove greater than or equal to 1 Jan 2000 from query
Wicketkeeper as designated wicketkeeper  remove as designated wicketkeeper from query
Qualifications runs scored greater than or equal to 100  remove runs scored greater than or equal to 100 from query
Ordered by batting average (descending)
Page 1 of 1 Showing 1 - 6 of 6   First pageFirst Previous pagePrevious Next Next page Last Last page dblBakArwB.gifReturn to query menu
dblBakArwW.gifCleared query menu
Overall figures
Player Span Mat Inns NO Runs HS AveDescending BF SR 100 50 0 4s 6s  
RR Pant 2018-2019 7 13 1 512 159* 42.66 725 70.62 2 0 1 51 11 investigate this query
MS Dhoni 2006-2014 32 60 5 1731 92 31.47 3138 55.16 0 13 6 231 17 investigate this query
D Dasgupta 2001-2001 2 4 0 114 63 28.50 443 25.73 0 1 0 12 0 investigate this query
KD Karthik 2007-2018 4 7 1 128 63 21.33 307 41.69 0 1 2 16 0 investigate this query
PA Patel 2002-2018 10 17 3 268 62 19.14 595 45.04 0 1 3 37 0 investigate this query
WP Saha 2012-2018 4 8 0 119 35 14.87 321 37.07 0 0 2 9 2 investigate this query
 

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7 hours ago, NameGoesHere said:

Saha is one of, if not the best, pure wicketkeepers in the world right now.  Whatever he is, it isn't mediocre.  

 

And if we're using his batting ability to call Saha mediocre, well one could very well call Pant a mediocre keeper. 

 

There's no way either of them is mediocre IMO.

Batting like tailender irrespective of keeping ability is mediocre in today's times. May be not in pre-gilchrist era.

Pant's keeping was good enough during last overseas tours and he can improve. But saha cant improve his batting, its going downhill.

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1 hour ago, zen said:

Performances in SENA: 

 

View overall figures [change view]
Primary team India  remove India from query
Opposition team Australia  remove Australia from query or England  remove England from query or New Zealand  remove New Zealand from query or South Africaremove South Africa from query
Home or away away (home of opposition)  remove away (home of opposition) from query
Start of match date greater than or equal to 1 Jan 2000  remove greater than or equal to 1 Jan 2000 from query
Wicketkeeper as designated wicketkeeper  remove as designated wicketkeeper from query
Qualifications runs scored greater than or equal to 100  remove runs scored greater than or equal to 100 from query
Ordered by batting average (descending)
Page 1 of 1 Showing 1 - 6 of 6   First pageFirst Previous pagePrevious Next Next page Last Last page dblBakArwB.gifReturn to query menu
dblBakArwW.gifCleared query menu
Overall figures
Player Span Mat Inns NO Runs HS AveDescending BF SR 100 50 0 4s 6s  
RR Pant 2018-2019 7 13 1 512 159* 42.66 725 70.62 2 0 1 51 11 investigate this query
MS Dhoni 2006-2014 32 60 5 1731 92 31.47 3138 55.16 0 13 6 231 17 investigate this query
D Dasgupta 2001-2001 2 4 0 114 63 28.50 443 25.73 0 1 0 12 0 investigate this query
KD Karthik 2007-2018 4 7 1 128 63 21.33 307 41.69 0 1 2 16 0 investigate this query
PA Patel 2002-2018 10 17 3 268 62 19.14 595 45.04 0 1 3 37 0 investigate this query
WP Saha 2012-2018 4 8 0 119 35 14.87 321 37.07 0 0 2 9 2 investigate this query
 

Man played on Pattas lol such a deceiving stat

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2 hours ago, Rasgulla said:

Saha drops 0 catches 

 

Pant drops 7 

 

 

hence Saha should play 

How many catches did pant drop in australia.? I cant remember even a single one. 

Similarly he was quite good in windies. 

He holds the record for most catches taken in a single match. 

For heavens sake he is pant not kamran akmal. 

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13 hours ago, NameGoesHere said:

Saha any day of the week, and Sundays to spare.

 

He's by far the better keeper, in fact by an order of magnitude.

 

And given how the ball seems (as read on cricinfo) to be moving, I don't see Pant scoring enough over Saha to make a difference. 

 

Whereas I do see Pant dropping or missing a few, where Saha may even take a few blinders to even out the game. 

 

That's the call I'd take.

I agree.

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3 hours ago, Adamant said:

How many catches did pant drop in australia.? I cant remember even a single one. 

Similarly he was quite good in windies. 

He holds the record for most catches taken in a single match. 

For heavens sake he is pant not kamran akmal. 

The fact that you are comparing him to Akmal shows his standards in first place. Afridi once holds fastest 100 record. Does that mean he is a best batsmen ? lol  That record doesn't mean anything other than full credits to the bowlers. 

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19 hours ago, NameGoesHere said:

Saha any day of the week, and Sundays to spare.

 

He's by far the better keeper, in fact by an order of magnitude.

 

And given how the ball seems (as read on cricinfo) to be moving, I don't see Pant scoring enough over Saha to make a difference. 

 

Whereas I do see Pant dropping or missing a few, where Saha may even take a few blinders to even out the game. 

 

That's the call I'd take.

Pant was amazing in the overseas tours, particularly against pace. He took some amazing impossible takes during that time. I love how team management has convinced gullible people he is a poor keeper just because his confidence has dropped. Mission accomplished I guess 

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5 hours ago, Vilander said:

guys as long as Saha can keep he should play. The guy attempts catches and reaches those that other international level keepers just look at slips attempting, its not even a contest. 

Pant was doing the same in his initial international tours. 

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11 hours ago, Rasgulla said:

Man played on Pattas lol such a deceiving stat

Laxman has 0 100s in his entire career in england. Sehwag, dravid hhave 1 100 in Australia in their entire career. Of course they never played on pattas in SENA despite playing for so long

 

The excuses seem more and more pathetic 

Edited by New guy

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2 hours ago, New guy said:

Pant was amazing in the overseas tours, particularly against pace. He took some amazing impossible takes during that time. I love how team management has convinced gullible people he is a poor keeper just because his confidence has dropped. Mission accomplished I guess 

I'm not saying Pant's a poor keeper, just that Saha is far better based on what we can see as recent form.  

 

Pant's confidence is something that ultimately only Pant can handle.  My comparison isn't based on whatever TM thinks of him.  It's what I have seen. 

 

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14 minutes ago, NameGoesHere said:

I'm not saying Pant's a poor keeper, just that Saha is far better based on what we can see as recent form.  

 

Pant's confidence is something that ultimately only Pant can handle.  My comparison isn't based on whatever TM thinks of him.  It's what I have seen. 

 

Yes Saha is maybe our best all time keeper. Yet we preferred MSD over him in tests. In SENA we need the extra batting help, particularly because they often prefer to play with 5 bowlers 

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Saha hasn't played since BD series, that is reason enough to play Pant ahead. 

 

Pant isn't a poor keeper like is being portrayed by some. Sure he can and must improve but some are giving the impression that he is Parthiv 2.0. Not at all the case, just because Saha is a wonderful glovesman, that shouldn't cloud our judgement about the southpaw. 

Edited by Gollum

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2 hours ago, New guy said:

Yes Saha is maybe our best all time keeper. Yet we preferred MSD over him in tests. In SENA we need the extra batting help, particularly because they often prefer to play with 5 bowlers 

Not exactly. Aussies preferred Pain over Wade even though he was an inferior batsman but better keeper.In Tests, you need a specialist keeper.

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Saha has been immense behind the stumps so I wouldn't begrudge if the team goes with him. But I'd rather the team preferred Pant keeping in mind the tour to Australia 9 months from now.

 

It's pretty much the same with Gill and Shaw to partner Mayank at the top. Either of them works. Both of them together, even better.

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17 minutes ago, Cricket_Fan said:

Not exactly. Aussies preferred Pain over Wade even though he was an inferior batsman but better keeper.In Tests, you need a specialist keeper.

Wasn't the same with Paine. He was entrusted with captaincy after that Cape Town debacle. CA trusted him as the man who could rebuild the faith of the fans in the team. Plus, Wade was pretty dire himself with the bat till last season when he cashed it big time. It wasn't his keeping skills alone that kept him ahead of Wade.

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11 hours ago, Vilander said:

guys as long as Saha can keep he should play. The guy attempts catches and reaches those that other international level keepers just look at slips attempting, its not even a contest. 

yep Saha is definitely a way better keeper than MSD too..and lets be true , though we expect rishabh to be a game changer in batting and all that big talk..but his performance hardly backs him. secondly i think even samson is a better keeper than rishabh and may be bharat could also keep better.

 

only keeper who is as good as rishabh is KL RAHUL where as KL is a much better batsman. I dont see bright days for Rishabh unless he improves his BATTING and Keeping. 

he goes for his shots , some times from the first ball, which is not a wise thing to do.

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27 minutes ago, sarchasm said:

Wasn't the same with Paine. He was entrusted with captaincy after that Cape Town debacle. CA trusted him as the man who could rebuild the faith of the fans in the team. Plus, Wade was pretty dire himself with the bat till last season when he cashed it big time. It wasn't his keeping skills alone that kept him ahead of Wade.

Pain was selected the keeper even before the ball tampering incident happened. And his batting stats were worse than the worst of Wade. His keeping skills is what kept him in the team.

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Pant isnt parthiv patel as ppl are making out to be. 

Dhoni wasnt great with stumps when he started , pant is a lil better then dhoni was at start as keeper 

 

And in the end most importantly if u wanna win the games u need match winners and pant is a match winner on his day . If u worry about dropping catches lets start with the captain himself who drops a lot fo em 

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6 hours ago, New guy said:

Laxman has 0 100s in his entire career in england. Sehwag, dravid hhave 1 100 in Australia in their entire career. Of course they never played on pattas in SENA despite playing for so long

 

The excuses seem more and more pathetic 

Sachin has 0 at lords. Your excuses seems even more pathetic 

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