The chip of ignorance that Hindus carry

[Guest dada_rocks]

Re: The chip of ignorance that Hindus carry

The problem' date=' in my opinion, in being ignorant(you are quite correct about Hindus not being too religious by the way) is that one does not know much about the world outside his own circle.[/quote'] I wouldn't have thought of you as an apologist, Lurker, but sometimes you certainly come across as one. Ignorance? How much do Muslims know about Hinduism? How much do Christians know about Islam? To each his own, I say. This is 2007. Are we still taking about the spread of civilizations? In case you haven't noticed, there's only one civilization that matters- the Western civilization. It's secular, areligious and capitalistic. We all live in it. Happily. And those who don't, aspire to be a part of it. There are those who live in that civilization and knock it. They talk about imposing their own way of life, their own code of conduct. They are in denial of course. Their way of life lost out because it was inefficient, violent, subjugative and economically unproductive. I'm sorry, I have neither the time, nor the inclination to understand their way.

even reading geeta is haram .. their knowledge about hindus starts and ends at "idolatrous dirty kafir ".. the very word by which they beckon us is full of scornful negativity. kafir meaning unbeliever.. I ask why unbeliever we have our own beliefs and yet they chose to call us kafir tells all u need to know about how much resect or even toerance they have for the rest........ Apologist like lurker an weave imaginary web of hunky dory world ut they wil have to cross the test of naked facts and tht's where they get prickly.. Everytime u mention aurnagjeb these folks will mention Thackrey this is subterfuge.. thackrey came because of the prevalence of aurngjeb like ideology so to castigate him means u expect pepople to take $hit bwihtout doing anything in return U mntion Muslim leage they will hindu mahasabha.. totally ignoring the fact that once again hindu mahsabaha cam into frutiont in reaction.. muslim league establishement in 1905 hindu mahasabah in 1937.. aoother fact they will ignore is that muslim league won 97% of the seats among muslim majority reason (incidentally 50% out of those could nto move to the land they voted for one or another reason) when jinnah saheb asked vote on the basis of creation of pakistan to me this looks like resounding overwhelming majority endorsing his views and otoh hindu mahsabha at best remained a fringe player hardly ever won any seat but the mere existance of such organization was too much for likes of jinnah.. ocne again expecataions is same we can do whatever we want but u must not raise a finger in response.. Emotional outburst asidebut lurker doesn't have fact on his side.. fact paints totally opposite picture and is more in line with ambedkar's view which says " there is hardly anything in history which hindu and muslim could celebrate together other than sufi/bhakti whihc is equated to kafirsm among believers and there u go u end up with nothing litrally " All these things could be overlooked if and only if present scenario painted any better picture ...... I have never seen a state where majority pines for the acceptnce of minority and minoroity acts like a spoilt child... u may find a hindu saying ishwar-alalh tero naam sabko sadmat de bhagwaan but a muslim singing that tune either will be hard to find or if u find one he will be branded kafir by the mainstream ummah....... A RSS can come up wiht words like muhamamd is the new avtaar in the spirit or reconciliation only to be spurned by ummah.. A togadia can come up wiht words like let us purge our respectice texts from problematic texts but not even a liberal ummah will come ever close to that sentiment..

[veer]

Re: The chip of ignorance that Hindus carry dada rocks you are brilliant thinker..

[Guest dada_rocks]

Re: The chip of ignorance that Hindus carry

That was just my observation . If you don't like it , that is fine with me. BTW, Tipu sultan was far from being a fanatic islamist. I don't know where you got this from. Are you refering to his escapades in Kerala ?.His Prime Minister was a hindu and go to Srirangputnam and you will see temples untouched by him. And he did fight against British for our freedom. Are you going to deny even that ??? Friendly advise for you , no need to go ballistic in every thread. You need a crash course in anger management.

it's not about what i like it's about u being ill informed.. i don't debate on basis of my lieks or dislikes.. if sthg is consistent with facts I am fine with it my like can go down the drain.. pal there are places in mysore region which till today doesn't celebrate Dipawali reason TIpu sultan's army used to choose those auspicious days for his program of swod in own hand and quran in another.. Yeah it was not his mahamantri.. actually purnaiya was the great scholar visionary and he was in the court since the days when tipu's father was general under hindu king well that king died and this general usruped the throne from the son who was till a kid ) of that king.. so it;s not like tiu recruited him.. In fact tipu's father Hyder ali was better he never tried to convert purnaiya mahamantri but tipu flirted with this thought only to be exhrted against by his mother... This purnaiya when bitish attacked put his arms down without fight and welcomed them with words " how can i fight against the people who are keeping us safe from islamic persecution" british were bad on many counts but religious persecution was not one of them.. You won't find these things in romila thapar books. Lurker: I don't know which hindu home u entered into anyway let us say they dont put the book in home but point is they do learn the stories form childhood from word of mouth or otherwise.. Regarding anger management: agan u won't be much ill informed here i won't accuse u because u don't know me ....... :lmao:

[Lurker]

Re: The chip of ignorance that Hindus carry

Lurker: I don't know which hindu home u entered into anyway let us say they dont put the book in home but point is they do learn the stories form childhood from word of mouth or otherwise..

What a cop out! First you say this - "again every hindu home has mahabharta even those who turned muslim majority under sword and monetary inducement and few under sufi influence were hindus before so that tradition is there.. " and then when you are exposed you go all semantic with "we have all been told stories and all". The truth is this, Mahabharta is NOT, I repeat, NOT in houses. Not even in Hindu household and your assertions about people liking Mahabharta becase of similarity to setting doesnt not hold any water.

Regarding anger management: agan u won't be much ill informed here i won't accuse u because u don't know me ....... :lmao:

Not sure where that came from. Puts on the Robert De Niro hat from Taxi Driver. "You talking to me? " xxx

[Guest dada_rocks]

Re: The chip of ignorance that Hindus carry

Lurker: I don't know which hindu home u entered into anyway let us say they dont put the book in home but point is they do learn the stories form childhood from word of mouth or otherwise..

What a cop out! First you say this - "again every hindu home has mahabharta even those who turned muslim majority under sword and monetary inducement and few under sufi influence were hindus before so that tradition is there.. " and then when you are exposed you go all semantic with "we have all been told stories and all". The truth is this, Mahabharta is NOT, I repeat, NOT in houses. Not even in Hindu household and your assertions about people liking Mahabharta becase of similarity to setting doesnt not hold any water.

Regarding anger management: agan u won't be much ill informed here i won't accuse u because u don't know me ....... :lmao:

Not sure where that came from. Puts on the Robert De Niro hat from Taxi Driver. "You talking to me? " xxx

U took every home phrase little too litrally obviously i have not checked every home, it's no rocket science and is easy to figure out.. but ur story of people don't keep it because it bring kalah honestly i heard it for the first time... in my home there are at least 10 copy each of my uncle has got one and i still remmeber as a kid i used to go through thse stories of war episode used to fun... anyway point is people know the story book or no book by word of mouth or otherwise hence the interest can u say the same about alif laila stories even among muslims........ so ur expectataions of both being equally popular is flawed to start with.. I consider myself omnivorous i matetrs of cultural religion social text video documentaries and have tried watching that so many times.. it's poorly made to say the least doesn;t come close to B R chopra's creation mahabharata.. i alredy mentioend tipu sultan one was famous so had people been prejudiced it won't have happened.. u are reading some ill-will where there is none.. . cop out :lmao: pal that's what I am not known for unlike u will not hide no matter what.... PS: I have shiraz diamond label high quality australian wine glass in my hand right now so let me enjoy my own time of the week : banki ki kahani baad mein :wtg: ignore the anger managemnt part it was for KR..

[ViVeriUniversumVivusVici]

Re: The chip of ignorance that Hindus carry Yawn... I have just hardly scratched the surface of my own spiritual and religious texts and i am being accused of ignorance... i think lethargy would be a more accurate accusation. but then again, this sweeping generalization can be extended to all religions in particular christian and muslims who have often addressed hindus as the proverbial "idol worshipers", or "cow lovers", or "grass eaters"... must i carry on? someone posted previously that we just wish to be left alone. i think that summarizes us as a religion. we don't subscribe to proselytism, nor do we undermine other beliefs... let us do our thing and you can do yours...

[Guest dada_rocks]

Re: The chip of ignorance that Hindus carry

Yawn... I have just hardly scratched the surface of my own spiritual and religious texts and i am being accused of ignorance... i think lethargy would be a more accurate accusation. but then again, this sweeping generalization can be extended to all religions in particular christian and muslims who have often addressed hindus as the proverbial "idol worshipers", or "cow lovers", or "grass eaters"... must i carry on? someone posted previously that we just wish to be left alone. i think that summarizes us as a religion. we don't subscribe to proselytism, nor do we undermine other beliefs... let us do our thing and you can do yours...

never mind man lurker saheb got emotional.. btw I otoh know more about islam than hinduism so am good i guess :lmao:

[Predator_05]

Re: The chip of ignorance that Hindus carry

Not sure where that came from. Puts on the Robert De Niro hat from Taxi Driver. "You talking to me? " xxx

That is a f*cking awesome film !! "You talkin' to me ? Are ya ? Well I am the only one here aren't I ?" De Niro is god. ...and that is enough random off-topic bakwaas from me. Carry on kids...:wtg:

[yoda]

Re: The chip of ignorance that Hindus carry Robert De Niro is one of my fav actors. Donno if I have ever seen him in a crappy movie.

[ViVeriUniversumVivusVici]

Re: The chip of ignorance that Hindus carry

Yes Hindus, specially the right-wing kind, are quick to get all uncomfotable when they see a Muslim fall to the ground and do a sajda. Or if they walk around with that typical cap and short pajamas. And it would be the same lot who would be more than willing to thrusting the Prasad from Shirdi/Tirupati etc in everyone's face - from an athiest to a non-Hindu. And when someone refuses he automatically becomes anti-Hindu!

what on earth are you talking about? Prasad is offered to everyone as a token of universal goodwill. We believe that Maha Prasadam as it is appropriately addressed is food that has been blessed by the Gods and hence if anyone, irrespective of their religion, belief accept it, they assimilate within themselves a fragment of those blessings. "thrusting prasad into everyone's face" now that is a most unique and inflammatory allegation. it is offered with respect and with affection. if you feel that by accepting a small amount of sugar will dilute your faith or religion, then do refuse it, but apart from a surprised gesture i doubt you will see anything else. and please, right wing hindus as you so address them are actually a minuscule minority that preach the message that they do out of political ambitions. they have little following and prior to the gujurat riots, their most egregious act was desecrating the ferozshah kotla pitch. these nut jobs are few and far in between and save for some isolated pockets of support they hardly appeal to the majority of hindus who quite simply could not give a cheap frack about them.

[Predator_05]

Re: The chip of ignorance that Hindus carry

Donno if I have ever seen him in a crappy movie.

Cape Fear was sh*t. Don't ever watch it.

[ViVeriUniversumVivusVici]

Re: The chip of ignorance that Hindus carry

Yawn... I have just hardly scratched the surface of my own spiritual and religious texts and i am being accused of ignorance... i think lethargy would be a more accurate accusation. but then again, this sweeping generalization can be extended to all religions in particular christian and muslims who have often addressed hindus as the proverbial "idol worshipers", or "cow lovers", or "grass eaters"... must i carry on? someone posted previously that we just wish to be left alone. i think that summarizes us as a religion. we don't subscribe to proselytism, nor do we undermine other beliefs... let us do our thing and you can do yours...

never mind man lurker saheb got emotional.. btw I otoh know more about islam than hinduism so am good i guess :lmao:

easy now... lurker is alone and surrounded by people who differ from his opinions but that is hardly reason to be condescending. he makes a valid point that we are unaware of other religions, but then again who is not. while ignorance is hardly an excuse for being guilty (unless you are mohamed asif and shoaib akhtar and are being adjudicated by the PCB), i feel that accusations cannot be made by those guilty of the same crime.

[yoda]

Re: The chip of ignorance that Hindus carry

Donno if I have ever seen him in a crappy movie.

Cape Fear was sh*t. Don't ever watch it.

You kidding me? That was one awesome creepy movie. The guy was a monster in it. What didn't you like about cape fear?

[ViVeriUniversumVivusVici]

Re: The chip of ignorance that Hindus carry

Donno if I have ever seen him in a crappy movie.

Cape Fear was sh*t. Don't ever watch it.

Frack you man! dont say shit about DeNiro or it will be all out war! Cape Fear is worth watching for that erotic yet incredibly creepy scene in the school auditorium between DeNiro and Juliette Lewis... btw did you know that it was a remake of an original which is considered to be a classic?

[Predator_05]

Re: The chip of ignorance that Hindus carry

You kidding me? That was one awesome creepy movie. The guy was a monster in it. What didn't you like about cape fear?

De Niro's performance was good, but the film was a poor story with a mediocre supporting cast. He has done far better films in the past. I guess i am prejudiced by his other gangster/troubled city guy characters.

[ViVeriUniversumVivusVici]

Re: The chip of ignorance that Hindus carry

You kidding me? That was one awesome creepy movie. The guy was a monster in it. What didn't you like about cape fear?

De Niro's performance was good, but the film was a poor story with a mediocre supporting cast. He has done far better films in the past. I guess i am prejudiced by his other gangster/troubled city guy characters.

julliete lewis received an oscar nomination for best supporting actress for cape fear mate!

[Guest dada_rocks]

Re: The chip of ignorance that Hindus carry

Yes Hindus, specially the right-wing kind, are quick to get all uncomfotable when they see a Muslim fall to the ground and do a sajda. Or if they walk around with that typical cap and short pajamas. And it would be the same lot who would be more than willing to thrusting the Prasad from Shirdi/Tirupati etc in everyone's face - from an athiest to a non-Hindu. And when someone refuses he automatically becomes anti-Hindu!

what on earth are you talking about? Prasad is offered to everyone as a token of universal goodwill. We believe that Maha Prasadam as it is appropriately addressed is food that has been blessed by the Gods and hence if anyone, irrespective of their religion, belief accept it, they assimilate within themselves a fragment of those blessings. "thrusting prasad into everyone's face" now that is a most unique and inflammatory allegation. it is offered with respect and with affection. if you feel that by accepting a small amount of sugar will dilute your faith or religion, then do refuse it, but apart from a surprised gesture i doubt you will see anything else. and please, right wing hindus as you so address them are actually a minuscule minority that preach the message that they do out of political ambitions. they have little following and prior to the gujurat riots, their most egregious act was desecrating the ferozshah kotla pitch. these nut jobs are few and far in between and save for some isolated pockets of support they hardly appeal to the majority of hindus who quite simply could not give a cheap frack about them.

nobody thrusts those prasad in my face though, wonder where these samples hide when i am around :lmao:

[ViVeriUniversumVivusVici]

Re: The chip of ignorance that Hindus carry

Yes Hindus, specially the right-wing kind, are quick to get all uncomfotable when they see a Muslim fall to the ground and do a sajda. Or if they walk around with that typical cap and short pajamas. And it would be the same lot who would be more than willing to thrusting the Prasad from Shirdi/Tirupati etc in everyone's face - from an athiest to a non-Hindu. And when someone refuses he automatically becomes anti-Hindu!

what on earth are you talking about? Prasad is offered to everyone as a token of universal goodwill. We believe that Maha Prasadam as it is appropriately addressed is food that has been blessed by the Gods and hence if anyone, irrespective of their religion, belief accept it, they assimilate within themselves a fragment of those blessings. "thrusting prasad into everyone's face" now that is a most unique and inflammatory allegation. it is offered with respect and with affection. if you feel that by accepting a small amount of sugar will dilute your faith or religion, then do refuse it, but apart from a surprised gesture i doubt you will see anything else. and please, right wing hindus as you so address them are actually a minuscule minority that preach the message that they do out of political ambitions. they have little following and prior to the gujurat riots, their most egregious act was desecrating the ferozshah kotla pitch. these nut jobs are few and far in between and save for some isolated pockets of support they hardly appeal to the majority of hindus who quite simply could not give a cheap frack about them.

nobody thrusts those prasad in my face though, wonder where these samples hide when i am around :lmao:

thats just what i dont get!! some of the allegations are unfounded!

[Guest dada_rocks]

Re: The chip of ignorance that Hindus carry

dada rocks you are brilliant thinker..

i am merely reproducing data available in public domain waise hausala afzaai ( see lurker i have no problem with using urdu words rather love it :-) .. u may like to think otherwise but have no problme with islamic symbolism).... ke liye shukriya jannab :wtg:

[Lurker]

Re: The chip of ignorance that Hindus carry

U took every home phrase little too litrally obviously i have not checked every home, it's no rocket science and is easy to figure out.. but ur story of people don't keep it because it bring kalah honestly i heard it for the first time...

Hahaha. So basically you were talking from your you-know-where when you suggested that EVERY house has it. That EVERY part is indeed important since you used that as an argument for Hindus, Muslims and everyone else.

in my home there are at least 10 copy each of my uncle has got one and i still remmeber as a kid i used to go through thse stories of war episode used to fun... anyway point is people know the story book or no book by word of mouth or otherwise hence the interest can u say the same about alif laila stories even among muslims........

This is interesting point. You are suggesting that you heard the stories because the book were at home. Well guess what? I grew up reading Arabian Nights as well as I did about reading Mahabharta. So your argument of household books and all your argument about people not being exposed to "Muslim literature" is unfounded. In fact in India you can easily go to a book store and buy Arabian Nights. So why dont Indians buy them then?

So ur expectataions of both being equally popular is flawed to start with..

This is where you obviously have problems of comprehension. I am not arguing that you should know Muslim culture, history inside out. I am not suggesting that your knowledge of Muslim heroes should be as good as a Islamic hero. I am not suggesting in any way that your knowledge of Alif Laila should be as good as MAhabharta. What I am suggesting is it would be wonderful if Indian Hindus know more about Muslim history and figures. And I stand by that.

I consider myself omnivorous i matetrs of cultural religion social text video documentaries and have tried watching that so many times..

:lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao: Thanks for the laughs! You and omnivorous!! Yeah sure! Excuse me but I can not, repeat can not, remember the last time you had to say something, anything really, good about non-Hinduism. I am willing to stand corrected but can you please point me to where you have last mentioned anything positive about say Islam. Since you are omnivorous in matters of religion and social text, documentaries etc surely there has to be some positivety coming from that? Or do you only look for negatives in your omnivorous search DR?

. cop out :lmao: pal that's what I am not known for unlike u will not hide no matter what....

Hahaha. Ready to jump the bandwagon and all. You know DR in your part of the state you may have heard a muhawara, "Suar ke gawahi heeran bhel aur donon parai ke jungle gail" Ab decide kar lo who is what and proceed :lmao: [Note to others: Thats a muhawara used in state of Bihar. Nothing demeaning or anything. I am sure DR understands it since it is particularly used in his part of the state.]

ignore the anger managemnt part it was for KR..

Ah thought so. No worries, enjoy your drink. xxx