urbestfriend Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 LOL' date=' and you presume that this issue will be solved by some civil moment led by a few middle class maharathis and a baburao? :giggle::giggle:[/quote'] LOL, and you think one who do not contest in election do not have any rights for protest against Governmental Policies. Either stand and win in election or stfu, is it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Gunner Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 LOL' date=' and you think one who do not contest in election do not have any rights for protest against Governmental Policies. Either stand and win in election or stfu, is it?[/quote'] For the 50000th time on this thread let me reiterate, please do prtest peacefully but don't pretend to be my representative and don't draft law. I can't support that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ravishingravi Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 I am not sure if you watched it live or you are commenting only after seeing the Peepli Live reporting the media is making today. :giggle: I was watching it live on TV and so can say for sure that it was not as harsh and one sided as media is making out today for the sake of their Peepli Live TRPs. At first it was not his home but it was supposedly a permit taken for a yoga camp which turned into a so called people movement and then into a political gain movement. I have always been one of strongest critics of Delhi Police but from what I saw yesterday live on TV' date= Delhi Police simply went politely to Baba Ramdev and told him about the update about the yoga camp permission cancellation. Then he acted like a real thug and escapist and fled and jumped on somebody's soldiers and got his security guards around him. Then he kept on fleeing on the person's shoulders surrounded by his illiterate followers and guards. But Police did not do anything to him. After that his followers started throwing bricks on the police who were just doing their duty and following orders. Cut the crap. That is hooliganism for sure. I hate these so called security forces but throwing bricks on them when they were just doing their duty is more than ridiculous and when those guys were not using any violence at all. It was only after this violence that police used tear gas to the mob which was turning violent. After that some of his so called supporters started pushing and fighting with the police and it was only then that police lathi charged and that too very restrictively. And women police were used to remove the women and children and not male police. No offense but media is projecting the whole act as so called "Barbaric" whereas police took utmost control and used as less force as possible. I heard on camera "Aap humare maa jaise hain, please chale jaye" etc. It was hardly by force. Media's reporting today is not actual reflection of the way in which it was dealt. It was with a lot of caution and very less force for sure. And they did not use any force at all till the so called Ramdev supporters started throwing stones. Ramdev is lying today and it was not the case yesterday and nor are media channels telling the truth. My family especially mom and dad were one of the biggest fans of Ramdev when he was a yoga guru but he is now turning out into a thug. His movement is NOT apolitical and many of his demands do not make an iota of sense except to his illiterate gullible followers. At least Anna makes sense in most of his demands and he does not bring political or controversial people in his protests. I am not a huge fan of Anna too but he is a thousand times better than this dhongi thug and another player of dirty politics viz. Baba Ramdev. The issue of corruption is very important and such movement should be headed by the progressive unbiased youth of this nation who are shaping up the nation instead of these babas and mullahs who are screwing up the nation more than building it. Media is taking some TRPs from this issue but the nation hardly cares. I said I wasnt awake. I didnt say you were the only one awake last night. However, yours is the only distinct perspective talking about violent crowds. Yes ofcourse I would also be violent if I was unfairly hit. A "policeman dragging a woman by her hair". Now you can use 10 of these :giggle::giggle:, but no matter how "peepli live" you get on that footage it is brutal by an definition. As for the rest of it, I can only take it as your perspective and leave it there since the folks I have spoken who saw it live both in India and from elsewhere present something else. As for the last, thanks for speaking for the nation. I am not a fan of Ramdev, but I would loooove for you to present a case against what you call "dhongi thug" using paragraphs. Explain to me what is his political motive ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Gunner Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 I said I wasnt awake. I didnt say you were the only one awake last night. However, yours is the only distinct perspective talking about violent crowds. Yes ofcourse I would also be violent if I was unfairly hit. A "policeman dragging a woman by her hair". Now you can use 10 of these :giggle::giggle:, but no matter how "peepli live" you get on that footage it is brutal by an definition. As for the rest of it, I can only take it as your perspective and leave it there since the folks I have spoken who saw it live both in India and from elsewhere present something else. As for the last, thanks for speaking for the nation. I am not a fan of Ramdev, but I would loooove for you to present a case against what you call "dhongi thug" using paragraphs. Explain to me what is his political motive ? I don't understand you. How is the mismanagement of the situation by the police force ordered by the government? DO you think that the Home Minister PC, called the IG and ordered him to be brutal to the demonstrators? The point is that there were many people and the police with its usual clumsiness mismanaged the situation. Arre there is no process of educating our policemen on human rights etc they behave like thugs and there lies your problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Tendulkar Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 Congress lost it. Peaceful protest and they go in as if its a riot. Shocking. Seems congress and all other parties dont wont to stop corruption. They want the gravy train to continue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
urbestfriend Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 For the 50000th time on this thread let me reiterate' date=' please do prtest peacefully but don't pretend to be my representative and don't draft law. I can't support that.[/quote'] Do you understand that what Anna and civil society's protest was to have a joint drafting committee wherein elected representative are also part of and ultimately the law has to go through due process in Parliament before it get legislated? You are being naive to say people shouldn't participate in drafting of the law? In an ideal world, peoples representative should be responsible for drafting and legislating the law, but when there is a strong perception that Govt doesn't listen to the people, it is not an ideal condition and extreme problem requires extreme solutions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ravishingravi Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 I don't understand you. How is the mismanagement of the situation by the police force ordered by the government? DO you think that the Home Minister PC, called the IG and ordered him to be brutal to the demonstrators? The point is that there were many people and the police with its usual clumsiness mismanaged the situation. Arre there is no process of educating our policemen on human rights etc they behave like thugs and there lies your problem. I ll answer this later Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ViruRulez Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 All I can tell you is you have got absolutely no idea what went on there. Media was forced out of the tents and then the gathering was dispered by the police. 100s are injured, some of them seriously with head injuries and broken bones lying in hospitals in Delhi. Just go to Ram manohar Lohia Hospital or Safdarjang Hospital and you will meet many of those who were there last night and who have got relatives in the hospital admitted for injuries. The administration is not even allowing the media to go near Ramlila Ground today to report from there and show how the gathering dispersed and the commotion it caused.. You don't like the man, it's fine. But what happened last evening was disastrous for a democracy. is this the way all elected govts are going to deal with processions and protests? Sorry that just not on. :WTF: Who told you that. :cantstop: Were you ACTUALLY WATCHING it yesterday live or were you sleeping. Dont tell me that you were watching because you infact do not have any idea. :--D Media was never forced out. They were covering each and every moment of it. Even after the whole gathering was cleared by 5-6 in the morning and the tent was empty even then media was filming the empty tent. WTH told you media was sent out. Even Baba supporters were removed but media was not. Media were the so called last man standing. And police did not use force. It was only after the hooligans started throwing bricks at the police that they used tear gas. Then some of them again came back and started fighting with police and it was only then police used lathis and that too very restrictively. Media is blowing the matter over the proportion and only showing part of it. I am not sure if anybody has got the recording of the live happenings yesterday but if you find it then watch it carefully. It was nowhere as bad as it is being made out to be. I am not supporting the govt. but I am against this trend of hijacking the nation again and again. Anna's protest was at least apolitical but the dhongi baba has taken it to a new level and starting politics in the name of yoga. If by protest in a democracy if you say that every Indian should be allowed to dance nude in the streets and do some other nonsense then sorry it is not allowed. None of these thugs be it Kangress, BJP, Ramdev, Mayawati, Amma, DMK or Malayam or anybody else cares about the nation. It is the youth who should lead it. And democracy should not mean "chalta hai" attitude. It should not be allowed in corruption and neither should it be allowed in protests or hijacking of democracy. They used as less force as humanely possible from what I saw live on TV and so for me that was on. Police never reacted or used forced voluntarily but even our security forces are allowed to react when they are attacked by hooligans while they are doing their duty. And I still repeat that they were taking utmost precaution and as less use of force as possible. >At first it was not his home but it was supposedly a permit taken for a yoga camp which turned into a so called people movement Goverment already knew there wil be peaceful protest. So for entire day they allowed them to protest. But at midnight when everyone is sleeping they suddenly thought its illegal? How does that work Virubhai? Kabira he was never arrested or attacked or done anything. I watched it live. They just went to him and told him that the license was cancelled. It was Baba Ramdev who started the incidents and not police. And his follower threw bricks at the police inciting them when they were not using any force. I agree that the position the govt. took in the last 2 days was ridiculous to say the least. They should have declared his reasons unreasonable upfront and never allowed it. But Ramdev also changed his tactics and made it into a political protest whereas he told it was just going to be a normal protest. Even Swami Agnivesh and Anna Hazare were irritated with Ramdev yesterday due to turning it into political movement. And cut the crap. How can some of the demands even be humanely possible. Can "Rs.500" and "Rs.1000" notes be banned in reality. ATM machines would then take out only Rs. 4000 at one time (40 notes are the maxim in all machines) and to take out the daily limit of minimum of say Rs.20000-25000 you would need to use the ATM seven times and your line in the ATM would be pissed off. Purses would also need to be abolished as for carrying a few thousand rupees you would need to carry a bag as 40-60 notes cannot be inserted easily in a purse. :blink: And he demanded that Indian Rupee must be made equal to US Dollar. Nobody except a massive fool would make such a demand as that is not possible. And imagine if that was possible then outsourcing to India and thereby India's development would have been stalled too. WTF will US companies outsource work to India then and setup office if a dollar equals a rupee. Saala padai to kar leta dhongi baba. MC viru have you heard of concept of paragraphs ? :wall: Hardly use it especially in informal conversations. :giggle: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Gunner Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 Do you understand that what Anna and civil society's protest was to have a joint drafting committee wherein elected representative are also part of and ultimately the law has to go through due process in Parliament before it get legislated? You are being naive to say people shouldn't participate in drafting of the law? You elected a government to do that, didn't you? That is the representation of the people. You are making a mockery out of the constitution if you say unelected people should start drafting laws. I don't care what Anna Hazare did or will do. My discussion is purely on how democracy is being undermined by these kind of actions. In an ideal world' date=' peoples representative should be responsible for drafting and legislating the law, but when there is a strong perception that Govt doesn't listen to the people, it is not an ideal condition and [b']extreme problem requires extreme solutions. That's it. This is what I wanted to hear, this is the next step in a long journey to civil war and a dictatorship. If you read the history of some of the dictatorships around the world, this is how it all started. I am just preempting it a long way in advance. If you still don't understand what I am saying I have nothing to say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
urbestfriend Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 You elected a government to do that, didn't you? That is the representation of the people. You are making a mockery out of the constitution if you say unelected people should start drafting laws. I don't care what Anna Hazare did or will do. My discussion is purely on how democracy is being undermined by these kind of actions. That's it. This is what I wanted to hear, this is the next step in a long journey to civil war and a dictatorship. If you read the history of some of the dictatorships around the world, this is how it all started. I am just preempting it a long way in advance. If you still don't understand what I am saying I have nothing to say. LOL, if you think extreme solution is all about civil wars and dictatorship. First step is peaceful protest against the government and groups asking for what majority of the common people aspire for. Failure of democracy to address peoples aspirations happens, such movements will get started , if Democratic leaders do not respond in time to set this right this might lead to civil war as you fear. This is very natural , you'd be naive if you think people has no right to expect anything except voting in democracy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bulbul Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 For the 50000th time on this thread let me reiterate' date=' please do prtest peacefully but don't pretend to be my representative and don't draft law. I can't support that.[/quote'] When u r reps in govt failed to uphold democracy...people has to come to streets... If u don't like others to be u r reps u can also start a peaceful protest against these people..who bars that... Democracy doesn't means the u are elected and can do whatever and people has to be silent..I don't think that's the true meaning of a democracy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ViruRulez Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 a new party will emerge only if some movements started..otherwise u have to wait till thousands of yesrs.. If Baba is a thug congress should have already had put him in jail.. Only solution is tom Middle class to wake up..so far we only concntrated on our works and try to come up in life without bothering about corruption..may be the time is coming now to put up fight atleast.. We dont need more SRK type people...who dont do any good themselves but ready to take cheap publicity by uttering some nonsense.. Absolutely. More specifically the youth who are shaping this nation. To be frank I want these movements to led by youth and if needed completely unbiased and atheists to be frank. We need people who holds the nation important and works for its development rather than anyone else. The educated youth of today can understand the balance and can make reasonable demands too. I am all for anti-corruption and am one of the biggest haters of corruption but when I see people hijacking the nation in its name and start playing politics then I dislike it. Also these publicity seekers like the actors etc. are demons for the nation and they were a big NO. Only the youth who are well educated and are shaping the economy and development should take the lead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
urbestfriend Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 As usual Congress spokesperson giving a communal twist to Ram dev's protest, his reason is they were shouting Vande Mataram and Bharat Mata ki Jai :wall: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuge Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 Govt of India aka UPA aka Congress + allies did a great job yesterday plus Kudos to Delhi Police I wish they had killed all the Men , woman and children including that dhongi baba.Finish everyone once for all .Anyone who does so called peaceful protest should be killed ,but those break public property ,stop trains ,buses like Gujjars did few months back should be welcomed . Secondly, I want congress to implement Prevention of Communal and Targeted Violence 2011 bill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bulbul Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 As usual Congress spokesperson giving a communal twist to Ram dev's protest' date=' his reason is they were shouting Vande Mataram and Bharat Mata ki Jai :wall:[/quote'] The day our Muslim people stop voting congress blindly we will see real secularism in this country... Until then congress will find communal angle in everything..I don't know how much more these guys going to stoop low.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Gunner Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 LOL' date=' if you think extreme solution is all about civil wars and dictatorship. First step is peaceful protest against the government and groups asking for what majority of the common people aspire for. Failure of democracy to address peoples aspirations happens, such movements will get started , if Democratic leaders do not respond in time to set this right this might lead to civil war as you fear. This is very natural , you'd be naive if you think people has no right to expect anything except voting in democracy.[/quote'] I said it leads to dictatorship in the long run when you start disregarding the systems in place. If you think that this will result in anything positive, you are the one being naive my friend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Gunner Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 Govt of India aka UPA aka Congress + allies did a great job yesterday plus Kudos to Delhi Police I wish they had killed all the Men , woman and children including that dhongi baba.Finish everyone once for all .Anyone who does so called peaceful protest should be killed ,but those break public properly ,stop trains ,buses like Gujjars did few months back should be welcomed . Secondly, I want congress to implement Prevention of Communal and Targeted Violence 2011 bill is passed in lok sabha . Is this your opinion or are you quoting something? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bulbul Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 I said it leads to dictatorship in the long run when you start disregarding the systems in place. If you think that this will result in anything positive' date=' you are the one being naive my friend.[/quote'] I think u didn't grasp the issue yet the system which is in place currently itself is wrong.. What you will do when system itself wrong ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuge Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 Is this your opinion or are you quoting something? yes . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ViruRulez Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 I said I wasnt awake. I didnt say you were the only one awake last night. However' date= yours is the only distinct perspective talking about violent crowds. Yes ofcourse I would also be violent if I was unfairly hit. A "policeman dragging a woman by her hair". Now you can use 10 of these :giggle::giggle:, but no matter how "peepli live" you get on that footage it is brutal by an definition. As for the rest of it, I can only take it as your perspective and leave it there since the folks I have spoken who saw it live both in India and from elsewhere present something else. As for the last, thanks for speaking for the nation. I am not a fan of Ramdev, but I would loooove for you to present a case against what you call "dhongi thug" using paragraphs. Explain to me what is his political motive ? The brick and other objects throwing was even shown on news channels today but they were not highlighted as they would not have given TRPs. In some of the clips, watch Ramdev looking towards his right side of stage where his supporters start throwing bricks and objects. Watch carefully. Even CNN IBN showed that clip right now when in the debate. Show me one recording where police used force before the brick throwing incident. And women constables were called for the women in the camp. I will take your point if you show me recording as I was watching several news channels including CNN IBN, Times Now and NDTV live and all were showing the same thing and all their reporters were as close as a few feets away from Baba Ramdev. I am not sure which incident your friends are referring to and it cannot be different if they were watching the same events of yesterday night. :blink: If possible please tell your friends to upload the sequence of events if they had watched it and maybe recorded it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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