Dhoni should be sacked as captain in all 3 formats!

[ganeshran]

Yes Dhoni should not be captain in tests, but should still play tests. He scored most runs for India after Kohli and Pujara against NZ, played some crucial innings, scored more runs than both openers and the greatest batsman of all time, and I doubt there is any better WK/batsman than him at least when we play tests in India. Now, what are the options for test captaincy? Bring them on.

How can he play tests if he is not the captain? Outside of India he is poor. In India he might score a few runs here and there, but will still fail more often than not. Dhoni is not a test calibre batsman nor is he a good enough keeper to ignore the shortfall in his batting.

[Sidhoni]

Yes Dhoni should not be captain in tests, but should still play tests. He scored most runs for India after Kohli and Pujara against NZ, played some crucial innings, scored more runs than both openers and the greatest batsman of all time, and I doubt there is any better WK/batsman than him at least when we play tests in India. Now, what are the options for test captaincy? Bring them on.

Agreed. But the problem is other options include Gambhir who is not even a certainty in the eleven. Sehwag will be the most probable successor , followed by Virat in 2 years time.

[rkt.india]

How can he play tests if he is not the captain? Outside of India he is poor. In India he might score a few runs here and there' date=' but will still fail more often than not. Dhoni is not a test calibre batsman nor is he a good enough keeper to ignore the shortfall in his batting.[/quote'] I guess you did not watch NZ series. Only 3 batsmen scored runs Pujara, Kohli, and Dhoni. You forgot his partnership with Kohli in second innings to win the match. Find one other Wk/bat who can score even that many runs first.

[Lord]

I dont see why it is seen as an insult to ask for his removal?he was wonderful before 2011 WC.2 WCs,CB series,tied series in SA n two home series wins v Aus are magnificent achievements.those who r denying it are absolute idiots n should switch to football or something. having said that,everyone has a shelf life,wen he was appointed,we always feared it was too much of a workload,but since he was delivering it was okay,but now wen it isnt happening,n now its a fair period for which its not happening,why is it wrong to ask for him to be relieved of some of his duties?it'll only help him n his hair about options,who knew Dhoni would be so good,wen he was appointed,he was also young n more importantly had ZERO captaincy experience.Virat,Sehwag,Gauti atleast have captaincy experience at IPL n U-19 in Virats case. another reason why I want Virat is because I sense there r groupings in the team n that environments its best to appoint someone who is liked by everyone.if we r about Virat's batting I dont think thats an issue,he seems the man to enjoy big responsibility.again,we had similar fearswith Dhoni because we couldnt afford to lose our only decent WK batsman but still took the risk.so why not?

[The Outsider]

Yes - So my question still remains. Which was the last captain to be dropped for losing a home series? CG says that that is what happens usually in India - I want some explanation as to why he said that.

Azhar - Dropped for Match Fixing Tendulkar - Stepped Away Ganguly - Dropped after drawing series with Pakistan Dravid - Stepped Away Kumble - Retired When was the last time a captain was changed after we lose a home series? :hmmm:

Azhar was removed after losing the Asian Test Championship, which though technically was not a home series was pretty close considering we lost the test against Pakistan at Calcutta. Ganguly was on his last legs not for losing, but just failing to win the series against Pakistan. He captained the Zimbabwe series after that, but things with Chappell and his form went southwards there. And LOL! at people calling Mohali some patta just to make their argument. Over the past few years, the test wicket has offered excellent conditions for reverse swing and spin. Except for the weather effected test against England in 2008 all the recent tests against England in 2006 and against Australia in 2008 and 2010 have been excellent tests with bowlers getting a fair share of help.

[rkt.india]

I dont see why it is seen as an insult to ask for his removal?he was wonderful before 2011 WC.2 WCs,CB series,tied series in SA n two home series wins v Aus are magnificent achievements.those who r denying it are absolute idiots n should switch to football or something. having said that,everyone has a shelf life,wen he was appointed,we always feared it was too much of a workload,but since he was delivering it was okay,but now wen it isnt happening,n now its a fair period for which its not happening,why is it wrong to ask for him to be relieved of some of his duties?it'll only help him n his hair about options,who knew Dhoni would be so good,wen he was appointed,he was also young n more importantly had ZERO captaincy experience.Virat,Sehwag,Gauti atleast have captaincy experience at IPL n U-19 in Virats case. another reason why I want Virat is because I sense there r groupings in the team n that environments its best to appoint someone who is liked by everyone.if we r about Virat's batting I dont think thats an issue,he seems the man to enjoy big responsibility.again,we had similar fearswith Dhoni because we couldnt afford to lose our only decent WK batsman but still took the risk.so why not?

It is not an insult to anyone, but what is the option we have to replace him. I cannot find any at this time. Let Kohli prepare himself for that in the next 1 year or so.

[saneindian]

How can he play tests if he is not the captain? Outside of India he is poor. In India he might score a few runs here and there' date= but will still fail more often than not.Dhoni is not a test calibre batsman nor is he a good enough keeper to ignore the shortfall in his batting.

Yeah right. Better to have a More or Mongia ver 2.0 :--D

[rkt.india]

Azhar was removed after losing the Asian Test Championship, which though technically was not a home series was pretty close considering we lost the test against Pakistan at Calcutta. Ganguly was on his last legs not for losing, but just failing to win the series against Pakistan. He captained the Zimbabwe series after that, but things with Chappell and his form went southwards there. And LOL! at people calling Mohali some patta just to make their argument. Over the past few years, the test wicket has offered excellent conditions for reverse swing and spin. Except for the weather effected test against England in 2008 all the recent tests against England in 2006 and against Australia in 2008 and 2010 have been excellent tests with bowlers getting a fair share of help.

If Delhi can be patta then Mohali is as patta as anyone can get. Reverse swing does not happen because pitch offers assistance but because of the open stadium in Mohali which lets the wind blowing to help reverse.

[The Outsider]

I guess you did not watch NZ series. Only 3 batsmen scored runs Pujara' date= Kohli, and Dhoni. You forgot his partnership with Kohli in second innings to win the match. Find one other Wk/bat who can score even that many runs first.

Sehwag? :hmmm:

[The Outsider]

If Delhi can be patta then Mohali is as patta as anyone can get. Reverse swing does not happen because pitch offers assistance but because of the open stadium in Mohali which lets the wind blowing to help reverse.

Yeah, the wind scuffs up the ball for reverse swing? Stop talking BS. In general, Kotla offers more for bowlers and in particular spinners than Mohali but if you are talking about the 2008 series then go and watch the matches again and get back as to which pitch was flatter that year.

[kubrickian]

Very few people can handle captaincy in India. Its a very high pressure, high stress job. There will be criticism for each and every thing a captain does and after every defeat, media and rabid fans will ask for his head. The shelf life of being India's captain is very low and everyone from Sachin, Dravid, Kumble have experienced it. It usually has a big impact on how the player plays, so if Kohli becomes captain, you can be rest assured his batting will go down. Is this what we want to happen to our best batsmen ? Dhoni despite his mistakes has done reasonably well and has been the most successful of India's captains. India has won a 50 over World Cup and World T20 under his captaincy, took India to No.1 in test rankings and has been very consistent in ODIs and tests at home. He has learnt how to handle the pressure from fans and media and also continues to be an excellent batsman and finisher in ODIs and a decent enough batsman in Tests for a wicket keeper. So I think he should continue.

[ganeshran]

Yeah right. Better to have a More or Mongia ver 2.0 :--D

That fact that Dhoni bhakth samaj has to constantly allude to Mongia to deflect any criticism of his test batting shows how much confidence they have on him. Its like bringing up Akash Chopra everytime you criticize Sehwag's batting Saha should be given a chance. Wont do any worse than Dhoni in batting and is a much better keeper

[rkt.india]

Yeah, the wind scuffs up the ball for reverse swing? Stop talking BS. In general, Kotla offers more for bowlers and in particular spinners than Mohali but if you are talking about the 2008 series then go and watch the matches again and get back as to which pitch was flatter that year.

I watched the series and there was not much difference between the two pitches. Other than that, Mohali pitch mostly consist of dry grass and ball scruffs up because of the ground and with wind it reverses more than on any other ground.

[Lord]

It is not an insult to anyone' date=' but what is the option we have to replace him. I cannot find any at this time. Let Kohli prepare himself for that in the next 1 year or so.[/quote'] how does one prepare tio be captain? I say give him T20 or even ODI captaincy n atleast vice captaincy for tests

[rkt.india]

Sehwag? :hmmm:

Sehwag scored 128 in 3 innings with highest 47, never clicked on.

[rkt.india]

how does one prepare tio be captain? I say give him T20 or even ODI captaincy n atleast vice captaincy for tests

He is VC in tests and ODIs already and should get T20 captaincy.

[The Outsider]

I watched the series and there was not much difference between the two pitches.

You are just making up things. Kotla that year was an absolute road. All you need to do is to watch day 4 of both tests when Australia were well on their way to 600 runs after replying to India's 600 with Clarke, Haddin, White all batting comfortably and then watch the turn and reverse swing the entire Indian team got at Mohali on day 4. You've got to be blind to say there was not much difference.

Other than that, Mohali pitch mostly consist of dry grass and ball scruffs up because of the ground and with wind it reverses more than on any other ground.

But you were saying Mohali is the flattest pitch. Now it's the ground where you get most reverse.

[rkt.india]

You are just making up things. Kotla that year was an absolute road. All you need to do is to watch day 4 of both tests when Australia were well on their way to 600 runs after replying to India's 600 with Clarke, Haddin, White all batting comfortably and then watch the turn and reverse swing the entire Indian team got at Mohali on day 4. You've got to be blind to say there was not much difference. But you were saying Mohali is the flattest pitch. Now it's the ground where you get most reverse.

I said ground conditions help the ball reverse, not just pitch. I did watch the match, yes there was reverse swing and there was some turn too but slow and not exaggerated. It was reverse swing that helped our pacers in that match mostly.

[saneindian]

That fact that Dhoni bhakth samaj has to constantly allude to Mongia to deflect any criticism of his test batting shows how much confidence they have on him. Its like bringing up Akash Chopra everytime you criticize Sehwag's batting Saha should be given a chance. Wont do any worse than Dhoni in batting and is a much better keeper

Tumne to dil pe le liya yaar. "Non Test calibre" players should be compared to the available benchmarks and in one of the threads, it had already been established by you that both Mongia and More were better than Dhoni, hence the comparison.

[The Outsider]

I said ground conditions help the ball reverse' date=' not just pitch. I did watch the match, yes there was reverse swing and there was some turn too but slow and not exaggerated. It was reverse swing that helped our pacers in that match mostly.[/quote'] So, you agree that the Mohali pitch suited bowlers more than Kotla in that series - that was all the initial point being made was. For the purpose of this discussion I don't see how it's relevant whether the ground or pitch helps reverse swing. The only point being made was that in 2008 Mohali offered more to the bowlers than Kotla. And you just need to watch day 4 of each test to see the difference.