The Outsider Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 I have seen support LTTE posters & Prabakaran photos in shops owned by many Tamil business men in Bangalore' date=' Canada doesn't care much about India, it is a true democracy...not like a fake one in India where corruption is so rampamt & there is no value or security for common person, especially if it's a minority.[/quote'] I've lived in Chandigarh for 3 years and never met a Sikh who wants Khalistan, but in the US I've met several. My response to them has been you are living in the US - ask America to provide you with a separate country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranvir Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 The Indian army is huge, it could easily surround the Golden Temple for a few days. Once you're surrounded it's pretty much game over. There would be plenty of troops spare to deal with any Pakistan invasion, which was never gonna happen anyway. So she got the backing of the generals but not the President? The elections were coming up and she wanted to show what a strong 'leader' she was. I'm not a fan of her or her communist family. I don't know if Bhindranwale was a terrorist, I think of him as a militant. He never carried atrocities like in Mumbai or Delhi government attack. Most of the really bad stuff happened AFTER Operation Bluestar. What about Rajiv Gandhi, was he terrorist for allowing 1000s of Sikhs to be killed in Delhi and who can forget his famous 'When a big tree falls the Earth shakes' speech which justified the killings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Outsider Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 There is a reason for that' date=' BBC covered some raw footage during 84 riots & aired it on TV in Canada & England, that made many Sikhs living abroad feel that having a separate home state would be more security, I know Khalistan can never be formed now, some people here still hope... only chance was during partition.[/quote'] TV footage is still much more removed from people who have actually lived through the militancy. It's not about whether Khalistan can be formed or not. I would happily support a movement in which the population wants self governance as long as the movement is non violent. It's about the fact that people who actually live where Khalistan is supposed to be don't want it and people living thousands of miles away support it. Well Guru Nanakji did not specify that only Punjab is to be the homeland of Sikhs - if Sikhs in US and Canada want a separate country why not struggle for it in the jurisdiction they live under? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
surajmal Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 Someone (objective) needs to do a profile on Indira Gandhi detailing why the major highlights of her life include use of force (Emergency, Punjab Insurgency, Naxalite Movement). Hell, her shining moments like 1971 conflict and the bomb (although much of the ground work was done under Shastri) are also instances of violence (or pertaining to conflict). Clearly she wasn't much of an administrator. Was she dealt a bad hand? Or was she just too god damn incompetent to deal with problems in a manner suitable for a democracy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Outsider Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 The Indian army is huge, it could easily surround the Golden Temple for a few days. Once you're surrounded it's pretty much game over. There would be plenty of troops spare to deal with any Pakistan invasion, which was never gonna happen anyway. Are you kidding? 10 people with assault rifles inflicted so much damage on Bombay. 1000+ terrorists with state of the art weapons? Take your wild guess. So she got the backing of the generals but not the President? The elections were coming up and she wanted to show what a strong 'leader' she was. I'm not a fan of her or her communist family. I have vehemently opposed a lot of what she did, but Blue Star was not a blunder from her. I don't know if Bhindranwale was a terrorist, I think of him as a militant. He never carried atrocities like in Mumbai or Delhi government attack. Most of the really bad stuff happened AFTER Operation Bluestar. So, Bhindrwale was not a terrorist? Or was he? Give me an answer, yaar! What about Rajiv Gandhi, was he terrorist for allowing 1000s of Sikhs to be killed in Delhi and who can forget his famous 'When a big tree falls the Earth shakes' speech which justified the killings. From a personal standpoint I don't think Rajiv Gandhi was in the frame of mind to bother or control what the likes of Tytler and Sajjan Kumar were doing. But yeah, he was the head of the state and should have resigned after what happened in '84 and volunteered himself to face a trial. The statement you quoted was despicable as was his "Jab meri maa mari, mujhe laga saare desh ki maa mar gayi" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Outsider Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 Bcoz they don't need to' date=' they feel more secure here just living in the gr8 country, but they still have to visit India when it comes to meeting their relatives & friends who live in Punjab.[/quote'] And you really believe that Sikhs in Punjab are living under any kind of discrimination for them to demand a homeland for their relatives? From my experience, Punjab is one of the most harmonious states in the country today - it wasn't so 20 years back and all credit to all residents of Punjab for making this turnaround in such a short time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranvir Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 TV footage is still much more removed from people who have actually lived through the militancy. It's not about whether Khalistan can be formed or not. I would happily support a movement in which the population wants self governance as long as the movement is non violent. It's about the fact that people who actually live where Khalistan is supposed to be don't want it and people living thousands of miles away support it. Well Guru Nanakji did not specify that only Punjab is to be the homeland of Sikhs - if Sikhs in US and Canada want a separate country why not struggle for it in the jurisdiction they live under? I agree with this. And it does irk me when I see blind followers of Khalistan in the west. They can do the talk when they're 1000s of miles away in their safe haven but wouldn't actually do anything in India, would they give up their western comforts and go back to live in Punjab? I don't think so. They don't have to live with the consequences of forming Khalistan. It's a bit like the IRA support in America, the actual Irish people want to move on because they actually live where the stuff is going down. Whereas the Irish Americans don't know what it's like living in fear of bombings, killings and police brutality because they're so far away from the action. The points of my posts have not been pro Khalistan but to say that Operation Bluestar was wrong and should not be repeated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Outsider Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 It's more to do with a permanent hate some people have after what happened back then' date=' even here not all support Khalistan but don't condemn either.[/quote'] And it's wrong and such morons who want Khalistan sitting 10,000 miles away from where it is supposed to be should be given the chaar chhittar paao aur paase ho treatment. What happened in '84 after Indira Gandhi's death was despicable and it's a blot on our democracy and judiciary that the guilty people have not been punished. But the only solution is to move on, as harsh as it sounds to people who have actually suffered personal losses. And people in Punjab have moved on, but it's these 20 year olds I keep encountering every now and then I visit a Gurudwara who talk about bringing down the Indian government and creating Khalistan - those are the people I was referring to, not you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranvir Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 Are you kidding? 10 people with assault rifles inflicted so much damage on Bombay. 1000+ terrorists with state of the art weapons? Take your wild guess. I have vehemently opposed a lot of what she did, but Blue Star was not a blunder from her. So, Bhindrwale was not a terrorist? Or was he? Give me an answer, yaar! From a personal standpoint I don't think Rajiv Gandhi was in the frame of mind to bother or control what the likes of Tytler and Sajjan Kumar were doing. But yeah, he was the head of the state and should have resigned after what happened in '84 and volunteered himself tEo face a trial. The statement you quoted was despicable as was his "Jab meri maa mari, mujhe laga saare desh ki maa mar gayi" These '1000' militants were already surrounded by the army how could they have done what happened in Mumbai. When you're surrounded by a bigger force you usually lose. As for Bhindranwale he wasn't a fully fledged terrorist that bombed places far away like Delhi, Mumbai or Calcutta, a true terrorist carries out an attack and then claims responsibility for it, i never saw him do that. People like Gerry Adams of Ireland are more of a 'terrorist' than he ever was. And Gerry Adams is now seen as a political leader. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
punjabi_khota Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 The khalistanis in kaneda are the relics from the past. They moved to kaneda when things were getting hot in punjab (KPS gill ka danda ghus raha tha), ab vo naare lagate phirte hain. Someone should tell them bhai aapka time nikal gaya. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranvir Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 The khalistanis in kaneda are the relics from the past. They moved to kaneda when things were getting hot in punjab (KPS gill ka danda ghus raha tha)' date=' ab vo naare lagate phirte hain. Someone should tell them bhai aapka time nikal gaya.[/quote'] Well by prosecuting KPS Gill, Tytler and Kumar the 'movement' would not exist. It's like if someone from your family is murdered, you cannot forget easily and you want justice. Like I said, it will take at least another 50 - 100 years for all wounds to heal, pro using nothing happens again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 The khalistanis in kaneda are the relics from the past. They moved to kaneda when things were getting hot in punjab (KPS gill ka danda ghus raha tha)' date= ab vo naare lagate phirte hain. Someone should tell them bhai aapka time nikal gaya. :hysterical::hysterical: Instead of celebrating chewtiyas like Jagjit Singh Chauhan and "Sant" Bhindrawale, and "claiming" Canada to be a true democracy ( :haha: ) maybe it is time some of these closet supporters look at Julius Ribero, KPS Gill, Brar and Sunderjis of this world who put the terrorist in their place. By the way I dont approve of KPS Gill's womanizing :secret: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranvir Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 :hysterical::hysterical: Instead of celebrating chewtiyas like Jagjit Singh Chauhan and "Sant" Bhindrawale, and "claiming" Canada to be a true democracy ( :haha: ) maybe it is time some of these closet supporters look at Julius Ribero, KPS Gill, Brar and Sunderjis of this world who put the terrorist in their place. By the way I dont approve of KPS Gill's womanizing :secret: Yeah they really put them in their place, that's why they're *****ing themselves everyday under police protection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Outsider Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 These '1000' militants were already surrounded by the army how could they have done what happened in Mumbai. When you're surrounded by a bigger force you usually lose. How long can the army sit there when there is an attack on the border? Moving troops from other parts of the country takes time. What is those 1000+ militants armed with state of the art weapons went on a rampage along with an attack on Punjab by Pakistan? Low probability, yeah but when it comes to such decisions you cannot be calculating exact probabilities. As for Bhindranwale he wasn't a fully fledged terrorist that bombed places far away like Delhi, Mumbai or Calcutta, a true terrorist carries out an attack and then claims responsibility for it, i never saw him do that. People like Gerry Adams of Ireland are more of a 'terrorist' than he ever was. And Gerry Adams is now seen as a political leader. You still haven't answered my question - was he a terrorist or not. From you posts I seem to be getting the feeling that he wasn't but I'll wait your confirmation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 And you really believe that Sikhs in Punjab are living under any kind of discrimination for them to demand a homeland for their relatives? From my experience' date=' [b']Punjab is one of the most harmonious states in the country today - it wasn't so 20 years back and all credit to all residents of Punjab for making this turnaround in such a short time. That is where I give a lot of credit to Punjab. It suffered through the worst phase of militancy in Indian history, worse than Kashmir I maintain, and managed a fantastic and prosperous turnaround. Kudos to all the Punjabis, Sikh or otherwise for that. Today it is a model state of India in most ways. But get the eff off supporting militant, or claiming 2% supremacy nautanki. Or how US/Canada is great so Punjabis moved there. Wah!!! :finger: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 Nothing wrong with what I said' date=' been living here for a while now...but you are used to some corrupt babu shyite in India..you'll never understand..just like a fellow poster mentioned...you like to stir shyt...and you post your unwanted fabricated stupidity :finger: please die.[/quote'] Absolutely. Hows the dream of Khalistan coming along? I read how you claimed it should have happened during Partition :cantstop: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 Yeah they really put them in their place' date=' that's why they're *****ing themselves everyday under police protection.[/quote'] Khalistan is dead. Punjab is prosperous. The chewtiyas militants are either dead or have ran away to Canada or Britain. Which is why folks like Brars are considered a hero by Indians. He has paid the penalty of being a great soldier for India. We celebrate him. Not your fault you do not understand this :haha: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Outsider Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 Bcoz they don't need to' date=' they feel more secure here just living in the gr8 country, but they still have to visit India when it comes to meeting their relatives & friends who live in Punjab.[/quote'] They feel that their relatives in India are living under an oppressive regime? Why don't they go there and change things? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 I said it was the only time it was possible? not that I wish....the brits could've done it if there was a need...don't try to prove you dumbness by making some assumptions. You need Brits to give you Khalistan now? Whatever happened to pulling more weight than numbers (2%)? As always jab jaroorat pari to bhaage US/UK/Canada. :hysterical: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranvir Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 Absolutely. Hows the dream of Khalistan coming along? I read how you claimed it should have happened during Partition :cantstop: I think you're missing the point. Most Sikhs want justice, give them justice and the support for Khalistan will stop. Prosecute Tytler, Kumar and KPS Gill for the human rights attrocities and then it will go away and also amend Article 25 of the Indian constitution which states Sikhs are Hindus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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