Ishwar Pandey Thread

[vvvslaxman]

By unfinished article, I meant he has very little experience in FC or playing other forms of cricket, the more experience, you get to bowl at that level like BK got, you have the possibilities of learning and getting better though it is not imminent for every one. There is not one reason for slow growth of Indian fast bowlers. All those bowlers you mentioned above had different reasons for not growing. Most of them had fitness issues like Balaji, Munaf, PK; some had attitude issues like Munaf, Sreesanth, PK, and some lacked right guidance and counseling like Pathan and Ishant and then likes of Balaji and Pathan were never that great a talents that they made out to be. Same bowlers if were born in Aus and SA would have become match winners. Just wait and watch Gurinder Singh Sandhu and how he will develop in Aussie cricket culture. If he was in India, you could imagine how his career would have gone on.

Methinks there are so much incentives if you are a good cricketer (be a batsman or fast bowler) these days. There should never be lack of motivation to keep yourself fit, keep improving as a bowler. Unfortunately some of them are fit enough just for 4 overs which are perfect for their year after year IPL appearance. I just want one of our bowler to go from strength to strength and become a respectable fast bowler all over the world.

[rkt.india]

Methinks there are so much incentives if you are a good cricketer (be a batsman or fast bowler) these days. There should never be lack of motivation to keep yourself fit' date=' keep improving as a bowler. Unfortunately some of them are fit enough just for 4 overs which are perfect for their year after year IPL appearance. I just want one of our bowler to go from strength to strength and become a respectable fast bowler all over the world.[/quote'] But making IPL a scapegoat is closing your eyes from real issues because IPL is of just 5 years old. Munaf, Pathan, Balaji and Sreesanth had lost their way even before IPL had started. That is not a long lasting solution. Under performers in IPL will eventually be found out by franchisee. Fast bowling needs a lot of hard work not just in matches, outside that in the nets, in the gym to keep yourself fit and that is what most of them lacked likes of Munna, PK, Sreesanth, RP.

[Crookbond]

:clap: for People writing it off as just another IPL game Going for a one-off 20+ over in a T20 may not mean a lot but it does matter how he gave away those runs.....his over included a free hit and a noball when the batsman was going all guns blazing at him....this shows how easyily he was mentally taken apart. I have seen the likes of Steyn,Murali etc go for sme expensive overs at times but the fact is that they try something different,if the batsman comes on top,or the pitch is flat or is just plain unstoppable on that day nothing much can be done but the way a guy gets shaken up can tell you a lot. I am not completely writing him off yet but he didn't look impressive yesterday....strong focus on the word yesterday

One match can't tell you ANYTHING.

[Crookbond]

But making IPL a scapegoat is closing your eyes from real issues because IPL is of just 5 years old. Munaf' date= Pathan, Balaji and Sreesanth had lost their way even before IPL had started. That is not a long lasting solution. Under performers in IPL will eventually be found out by franchisee. Fast bowling needs a lot of hard work not just in matches, outside that in nets, in the gym to keep yourself and that is what most of them lacked likes of Munna, PK, Sreesanth, RP.

:two_thumbs_up:

[rkt.india]

All in all, we need a better player management and guidance system. Players who are unfit, not injured players, but who are overweight and don't follow the strict fitness regimen should be held responsible for their fitness.

[gakgupta]

Against Gujrat he took 2 wickets, Hyd he took 4 wickets, Rajasthan which has no good batsmen he took 7,against Bengal without Tiwari he took 10 wickets, against Railways another team without any good batsmen he took 8 wickets, Punjab with Yuvi and other guy Jiwanjot he took 4 and 0 when both Yuvi and other guy scored 100s. Against Mumbai with no Rohit he took 5 and 2 and in knockout match against Pujara in second innings he had no answers. All I see is he making merry against mediocre batsmen but not yet tested against quality batsmen.He has no pace and if only swing is his main weapon it needs to be outstanding to make a mark in international stage. In India especially where people like Ishant and Pathan are given debuts at age 17/18 years just because they are fast bowlers and fast bowling is still easiest way to get into Indian team as it has no bowlers. Guys like Dinda are getting selected ahead of him even in his IPL team so let us wait and see where he goes from here.

You considered only the opponent team which is only one parameter. But you should also consider the pitch as well. I haven't followed the matches keenly but most the pitches where mumbai played were flat and mumbai couldn't win a single match before quarters.....BTW, if Rohit would have played, he would have got one more extra wicket for sure.....poor Pandey So other pitches where he got few wickets may not be conducive to pace bowling.....Off what I have seen, he is way ahead of other domestic bowlers

[gakgupta]

If people had only seen how one does in ODI and T20s' date=' Philander would never have had played test cricket.[/quote'] Infact, philander was pathetic with bat/bowl/fielding in 2007 T20 world cup. I remember him dropping a crucial catch against India which eventually made them team knock out of the tournament.

[gakgupta]

:clap: for People writing it off as just another IPL game Going for a one-off 20+ over in a T20 may not mean a lot but it does matter how he gave away those runs.....his over included a free hit and a noball when the batsman was going all guns blazing at him....this shows how easyily he was mentally taken apart. I have seen the likes of Steyn,Murali etc go for sme expensive overs at times but the fact is that they try something different,if the batsman comes on top,or the pitch is flat or is just plain unstoppable on that day nothing much can be done but the way a guy gets shaken up can tell you a lot. I am not completely writing him off yet but he didn't look impressive yesterday....strong focus on the word yesterday

Streyn and Murali with all exp in the world are exepcted to do something. Poor pandey, first game against a huge crowd and Gayle on song batting.....you can't expect too much....Even the players with best attitude will be shaken.....Give him some time before judgeing...

[Crookbond]

Infact' date=' philander was pathetic with bat/bowl/fielding in 2007 T20 world cup. I remember him dropping a crucial catch against India which eventually made them team knock out of the tournament.[/quote'] Philander is not a batsman anyway. You are right about India's WT20 2007 match against SA. Uthappa scored 5 more runs before he was OUT for 15.

[India-KXIP fan]

Ishwar Pandey :hysterical: First smashed by Pujara and now Gayle. Well at least it puts one topic to rest, he won't make A squad ahead of Punjab's Sid Kaul :bye:

[FischerTal]

Ishwar Pandey :hysterical: First smashed by Pujara and now Gayle. Well at least it puts one topic to rest, he won't make A squad ahead of Punjab's Sid Kaul :bye:

pujara=gayle then :yay:

[India-KXIP fan]

pujara=gayle then :yay:

:whack: Gayle= greatest ever Pujara = 4 hitting singles type :haha: Kohli= can hit 6's easy due to :kxip: dum :agree:

[FischerTal]

:whack: Gayle= greatest ever Pujara = 4 hitting singles type :haha: Kohli= can hit 6's easy due to :kxip: dum :agree:

:hysterical::hysterical::hysterical: like against junaid khan

[India-KXIP fan]

:punter:

[FischerTal]

:punter:

:cantstop:

[putrevus]

How many wickets Aussie pacers took on Indian flat tracks? Even Steyn looks blunt on flat tracks. He is a prospect' date=' not a finished article. Pathan and Ishant played for India u19 that helped them debut early.[/quote'] The same Steyn looked unplayable with reverse swing on Indian pitches, all the Aussies pacers looked far better and more threatening even on docile pitches than Indians. We all saw how these same Aussies bowlers made a strong ( old in my book) Indians batting line up look like chumps in their backyards where Indian bowlers were thrashed. I don't think Pandey was bowling and getting all those wickets on flat decks,Umesh Yadav also falls in same category as Pandey as a late starter but his ascent to Indian team was very quick. There is no finished article in Indian fast bowling business Ishant even after playing 50 tests is not a finished article.All these guys are given a chance to play for India before they make a mark in first class cricket just on potential. Let us hope this guy is a real deal.If and when he gets his chance he makes most of it. Ishant is a prime example based on couple of good spells early in his career, he has parlayed that into playing 50 tests. The same thing is going on with BK he is the latest flavor.

[FischerTal]

The same Steyn looked unplayable with reverse swing on Indian pitches, all the Aussies pacers looked far better and more threatening even on docile pitches than Indians. We all saw how these same Aussies bowlers made a strong ( old in my book) Indians batting line up look like chumps in their backyards where Indian bowlers were thrashed. I don't think Pandey was bowling and getting all those wickets on flat decks,Umesh Yadav also falls in same category as Pandey as a late starter but his ascent to Indian team was very quick. There is no finished article in Indian fast bowling business Ishant even after playing 50 tests is not a finished article.All these guys are given a chance to play for India before they make a mark in first class cricket just on potential. Let us hope this guy is a real deal.If and when he gets his chance he makes most of it. Ishant is a prime example based on couple of good spells early in his career, he has parlayed that into playing 50 tests. The same thing is going on with BK he is the latest flavor.

whats ur opinion on praveen? only indian pacer to have average under 27 in tests :cantstop:

[rkt.india]

The same Steyn looked unplayable with reverse swing on Indian pitches, all the Aussies pacers looked far better and more threatening even on docile pitches than Indians. We all saw how these same Aussies bowlers made a strong ( old in my book) Indians batting line up look like chumps in their backyards where Indian bowlers were thrashed. I don't think Pandey was bowling and getting all those wickets on flat decks,Umesh Yadav also falls in same category as Pandey as a late starter but his ascent to Indian team was very quick. There is no finished article in Indian fast bowling business Ishant even after playing 50 tests is not a finished article.All these guys are given a chance to play for India before they make a mark in first class cricket just on potential. Let us hope this guy is a real deal.If and when he gets his chance he makes most of it. Ishant is a prime example based on couple of good spells early in his career, he has parlayed that into playing 50 tests. The same thing is going on with BK he is the latest flavor.

But you cannot shut your shop thinking that and need to continue to bring new blood in the team if old ones dont do. I am not saying Pandey will become world beater but what I have seen of him, he can be a good bowler in longer form, especially, where he can get help from conditions. Even reverse swing is a help due to conditions which Steyn got in Nagpur. Ishant and Zak have done well too when they got reverse swing. Dont expect these new guys to become a Steyn. We need a few bowlers who can have a record as good as Srinath and Zak first. Australia pacers looked good because they were quicker and pace can always trouble batsmen especioally Indian batsmen but still could not make a difference. Our pacers did not get to bowl that much which is the biggest issue in India. Until they dont bowl more, how will they learn to take wickets. Still they took crucial wickets whenever required. BK's opening spells bamboozled Aussies even on flat tracks.

[putrevus]

But you cannot shut your shop thinking that and need to continue to bring new blood in the team if old ones dont do. I am not saying Pandey will become world beater but what I have seen of him, he can be a good bowler in longer form, especially, where he can get help from conditions. Even reverse swing is a help due to conditions which Steyn got in Nagpur. Ishant and Zak have done well too when they got reverse swing. Dont expect these new guys to become a Steyn. We need a few bowlers who can have a record as good as Srinath and Zak first. Australia pacers looked good because they were quicker and pace can always trouble batsmen especioally Indian batsmen but still could not make a difference. Our pacers did not get to bowl that much which is the biggest issue in India. Until they dont bowl more, how will they learn to take wickets. Still they took crucial wickets whenever required. BK's opening spells bamboozled Aussies even on flat tracks.

I never said shut the shop, all I said don't hype these guys, the more hype they get the more pressure they will feel, we need guys like Dhoni who just came in and fit right into it with much less hype. Bamboozling common BK has 6 wickets in four tests and that in anyway you look at it is not that great.BK after ten or fifteen overs was not even bowled that is not that great talent. Fast bowling is more than just bowling with new ball.Pitches had something to do with it but even when going was tough BK was never in contention to even bowl because he is just too slow to be effective with old ball.So don't crown BK as something of a savior just yet.

[rkt.india]

I never said shut the shop, all I said don't hype these guys, the more hype they get the more pressure they will feel, we need guys like Dhoni who just came in and fit right into it with much less hype. Bamboozling common BK has 6 wickets in four tests and that in anyway you look at it is not that great.BK after ten or fifteen overs was not even bowled that is not that great talent. Fast bowling is more than just bowling with new ball.Pitches had something to do with it but even when going was tough BK was never in contention to even bowl because he is just too slow to be effective with old ball.So don't crown BK as something of a savior just yet.

I dont understand one thing that how this is hype if we discuss about players here. Hype is when it is discussed in media and among ex-cricketers like it happens in England and Australia. Look at how English and Aussie media and ex-players hype any of their young upcoming player. Look how Steve Finn was hyped up in U19 and he was a mediocre bowler at that time and Finn still has not yet bowled as many match winning and match turning spells as Ishant has already bowled in tests and both are of same age though Ishant has played far more tests, not because he was great but because we lacked options and he has been one of the fit bowler available. This is a discussion board and we post some articles to know about a player and discuss his potential. I dont think our discussion on ICF hypes them up. Regarding Dhoni, he had a lot more hype before he came to the team as a big hitter after his stint with India A team though his FC stats were nothing great and cyber and social media was not as prominent in those days. If he had made his debut now, he would have been all over everything.