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speed and performance of indian pacers in ipl


vishalvirsingh

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Just read this part if you do not want to read everything Also please explain me the physics here how does hitting seam makes track hit harder ?this is some wonky science ...hitting the seam does not make ball hit deck harder it still hits at same force it just behaves differently since it's not smooth surface ,,got it ? It deviates after pitching and if it was smooth ball it won't move and since it has seam it moves ...hence it's called seam movement !

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Everything you said is true but none of those skills is hitting the track hard .
Arey yaar, I have already said plenty of times that if you have a tight grip it means you are hitting the deck and now how hard you can hit depends on what power you can put in behind the ball. If you are strong body wise, it does not mean you will be quick too. Pace of a pacer has very less to do with power or strength of a pacer. For pace, you need, fast twitch fibers, not power or strength. Power just helps you to hit the deck hard and Philander is a very strong lad. His batting alone tells you how strong a lad he is. Jacob Oram was a strong lad but he was not quick but he used to hit the deck hard at 125-130KPH.
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Arey yaar' date=' I have already said plenty of times that if you have a tight grip it means you are hitting the deck and now how hard you can hit depends on what power you can put in behind the ball. If you are strong body wise, it does not mean you will be quick too. Pace of a pacer has very less to do with power or strength of a pacer. For pace, you need, fast twitch fibers, not power or strength. Power just helps you to hit the deck hard and Philander is a very strong lad. His batting alone tells you how strong a lad he is. Jacob Oram was a strong lad but he was not quick but he used to hit the deck hard at 125-130KPH.[/quote'] abey yar use some common sense more force you will put in ball will make it travel faster its not just magic which will only effect while hitting the pitch while speed of ball in air remains same with tighter grip more of your force will go into ball and it will be bowled quicker please try to clear your pre conceived notions and think about it . jacob oram btw was very tall and his angle of impact was different ,dexter morgan actually posted information about same for mcgrath once
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abey yar use some common sense more force you will put in ball will make it travel faster its not just magic which will only effect while hitting the pitch while speed of ball in air remains same with tighter grip more of your force will go into ball and it will be bowled quicker please try to clear your pre conceived notions and think about it . jacob oram btw was very tall and his angle of impact was different ,dexter morgan actually posted information about same for mcgrath once
Bowling in cricket is not that simple as you making here. More force does not mean, more pace at all who has told this to you. There have been several strong pacers who were not quick but they used to bowl heavy ball. You can bowl as quick with loose grip like Dale Steyn, Mitchell Starc, and Hilfenhaus do to get swing. Once Manoj Prabhakar was talking about Ishant that he is gripping the ball too tight and as a result ball is not swinging for him. He said he will have to loosen the grip to get swing. Swing can happen at pace too, but for that you need a light grip, not tight.
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Bowling in cricket is not that simple as you making here. More force does not mean, more pace at all who has told this to you. There have been several strong pacers who were not quick but they used to bowl heavy ball. You can bowl as quick with loose grip like Dale Steyn, Mitchell Starc, and Hilfenhaus do to get swing. Once Manoj Prabhakar was talking about Ishant that he is gripping the ball too tight and as a result ball is not swinging for him. He said he will have to loosen the grip to get swing. Swing can happen at pace too, but for that you need a light grip, not tight.
Again you are mixing things I said more force not more strong Also physics gets applied to cricket ball cannot be slow in air but have more force at impact and lose grip or tight grip are different methods and I am just talking about end result This is exactly my point actually that it does not matter if you bowl with lose grip or tight grip in the end if you are putting more force in ball it will travel quicker and hit the pitch harder and if ere is less force it will travel slower and hit track less harder
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You must listen to commentary from Pollock carefully during SA tests. He several times talks about Philander not being quick but hitting the seam hard to get bounce and seam movement.
That does not makes it true I do not believe hard part I already said he hits the seam and gets bounce and movement is that even in dispute ? But he does not hits it any harder than guy bowling at same pace from same release height that's what I am saying from start
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Again you are mixing things I said more force not more strong Also physics gets applied to cricket ball cannot be slow in air but have more force at impact and lose grip or tight grip are different methods and I am just talking about end result This is exactly my point actually that it does not matter if you bowl with lose grip or tight grip in the end if you are putting more force in ball it will travel quicker and hit the pitch harder and if ere is less force it will travel slower and hit track less harder
Yes. Tight grip will have more force behind the ball, so it will hit the deck harder, but this force does not always mean quick in pace. Difference of trajectory too between two types of delivery for a swing bowler and for a hit the seam bowler. Right term for hit the deck bowler is hit the seam. Hit the deck is a loose term used. Take an example, my younger brother who is taller than me but thinner barely weight 60 kg for height 5'11" can throw the ball far and quicker than me while I am far stronger than him in physique, have done gym work too, I am more powerful in any way than him but he can still throw the ball quicker and farther than me. Does it mean he is more stronger than me? no, because being strong has very little to do with bowling fast but being strong means, you can hit the pitch hard using shoulders like Kallis do who is shorter than Ishant but has better bouncer than him even at a slower pace.
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That does not makes it true I do not believe hard part I already said he hits the seam and gets bounce and movement is that even in dispute ? But he does not hits it any harder than guy bowling at same pace from same release height that's what I am saying from start
BK also hits the seam, PK also hits the seam, Sandeep also hits the seam. So, what's the difference? What makes Philander different?
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Yes. Tight grip will have more force behind the ball, so it will hit the deck harder, but this force does not always mean quick in pace. Difference of trajectory too between two types of delivery for a swing bowler and for a hit the seam bowler. Right term for hit the deck bowler is hit the seam. Hit the deck is a loose term used. Take an example, my younger brother who is taller than me but thinner barely weight 60 kg for height 5'11" can throw the ball far and quicker than me while I am far stronger than him in physique, have done gym work too, I am more powerful in any way than him but he can still throw the ball quicker and farther than me. Does it mean he is more stronger than me? no, because being strong has very little to do with bowling fast but being strong means, you can hit the pitch hard using shoulders like Kallis do who is shorter than Ishant but has better bouncer than him even at a slower pace.
Abet yar you are on completely different page right now I do not even care about strong I am talking about force being transferred and you are talking about how different people can be more strong but can throw ball less quick Your brother despite being less powerful than you is able to transfer more force into ball hence bowl quicker ..you power does not matter it's amount of force you transfer into ball which does . Brett lee is not strongest man in world but he is probably much quicker than strongest man it is irrelevant but don't tell me tht you think that your ball with less pace will hit track harder than your brother because you are stronger ? :cantstop:
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BK also hits the seam' date=' PK also hits the seam, Sandeep also hits the seam. So, what's the difference? What makes Philander different?[/quote'] Seam position ,wrist position,angle of arm ,,I already gave you reasons but you did not replied Bk does not even has straight seam ....and let's not even talk about action because you know better tandem I have already posted it in this thread alone :winky: Bk has seam pointed towards either slip or fine leg and his arm is also slanting he is never going to be out and out seam bowler it's not his thing
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BK also hits the seam' date=' PK also hits the seam, Sandeep also hits the seam. So, what's the difference? What makes Philander different?[/quote'] The difference is bowlers like pk,bk, clouderson will be top notch in eng but will be fecked in aus which is grave yard for genune swing bowlers while seam bowlers like harris, philander, barbie etc will get bucketloads of wickets
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Seam position ,wrist position,angle of arm ,,I already gave you reasons but you did not replied Bk does not even has straight seam ....and let's not even talk about action because you know better tandem I have already posted it in this thread alone :winky: Bk has seam pointed towards either slip or fine leg and his arm is also slanting he is never going to be out and out seam bowler it's not his thing
what seam position? Phlander does not even have a great seam position like Shami or Sreesanth. He has a wobbly seam.
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Also since you added lat part later the difference of air on ball at distance of 10 yards will be negligible Majority if pace of ball is lost at time when it's pitched not in air it de accelerates but release speed which is calculated actually counts this :winky: Rest of difference in air will be negligible not enough to have so much force that you can call it's reason ball is hitting deck hard I do not know how to calculate but after bowling even one over you can tell this much
Comparative reduction in speed in the air , due to the factors I mentioned, is not negligible.
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Abet yar you are on completely different page right now I do not even care about strong I am talking about force being transferred and you are talking about how different people can be more strong but can throw ball less quick Your brother despite being less powerful than you is able to transfer more force into ball hence bowl quicker ..you power does not matter it's amount of force you transfer into ball which does . Brett lee is not strongest man in world but he is probably much quicker than strongest man it is irrelevant but don't tell me tht you think that your ball with less pace will hit track harder than your brother because you are stronger ? :cantstop:
You said right Brett Lee was one of the quickest bowler but it does not mean he was hitting the deck harder than a Flintoff or Harmison who were 10K slower than him.
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Both captains felt the Seddon Park was flat at the start of the game, but Philander was able to get something out of the surface by continuing to hit the deck hard and refusing to veer from his lines. After three seasons of doing it the first-class competition at home, which yielded 94 wickets in total in the two seasons preceding this one, there's no reason to stop. "It's something that I obviously practised and trained for these last three years and I've enhanced those skills and got to understand my body, how my action works, so it's something that I've got used to," he said.
http://www.espncricinfo.com/new-zealand-v-south-africa-2012/content/story/557661.html
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@ sabby You are confusing cricket terms with their literal meanings in English. They are not necessarily the same. Literally -- You can hit the deck hard whether you are hitting the seam or not. In cricket -- Hitting the deck hard means - bowling a ball straight at the pitch without trying to swing it. - using as much shoulder behind the delivery as possible and bowl with more effort. - trying to land it on the seam - with the objective of getting extra bounce and seam movement. The cricket term has nothing to do with the relative speeds of pacers of different release speeds at the point of hitting the pitch. Literally it should have been hitting the deck harder , that is harder than normal deliveries of the bowler bowling.... not harder than the fastest bowlers in the world "Hitting the deck " , " Kissing the surface" etc. are cricketing terms which exist and are used by the cricket fraternity. These are not my terms. Ask Rkt. Whether you agree with their usage or not does not really matter.

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