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Speed and performance of pacers and spinners in important matches

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Shami has looked unfit and heavier. This is the slowest I have seen him bowl. He had bowled 135 to 143 / 146 k in his 6 earlier tests. This test he has bowled 132 to 139 k in his earlier spells. Mostly bowled 128 to 136 k later on. Not impressive because this maybe linked to fitness.
I'm scared that Shami has been promoted himself to our trundler legends club

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Shami has looked unfit and heavier. This is the slowest I have seen him bowl. He had bowled 135 to 143 / 146 k in his 6 earlier tests. This test he has bowled 132 to 139 k in his earlier spells. Mostly bowled 128 to 136 k later on. Not impressive because this maybe linked to fitness.
Shami is a kind of guy who adds on weight quickly if rested for a while. Thats why in one the interview he stated that he wanted to play as much matches as possible. He even featured in vijay hazare trophy despite the tight schedule, because he wanted to remain Fit. He got married recently, and i don't think he had practiced much in this gap, so he is now out of shape and quite bulky. I feared this can really hurt our chances in this series. We really want a fitter shami ASAP :pray:

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BK,Shami,Aaron,Ishant+Jadeja for Lord's.....our batting is good enough.Need to have a fast bowler in the line up.Playing with 10 man in this test,Binny is a poor cricketer,not a batsman who can bat even at 7,nor a test level bowler.Get Aaron in for him in lord's.

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This pitch is suddenly responding more to hit the deck bowling , especially due to uneven bounce and ball rearing up from length. It would be nice if we had atleast one good quality ,quick , hit the deck bowler.
Would be ideal for someone like Pankaj.

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Last time at lords ishant sharma did bowled a great spell in the second innings. I still remember 'that snorter' to pietersen. He almost ran through a strong english batting lineup. The pitch was similar to this one with the odd one bouncing out of no where. If he could produce something similar to that in this tricky pitch., otherwise we have no hope. Although to expect something frm ishant is futile but still :pray:

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138-139 was his average speed in SA and NZ and was bowling rather well too. Here he was nowhere close to that.
138 k was average speed for shammi in iPl. .now he bowls between 127 to 129k. ..average cud 134. ..that's disappointing

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This pitch is suddenly responding more to hit the deck bowling , especially due to uneven bounce and ball rearing up from length. It would be nice if we had atleast one good quality ,quick , hit the deck bowler.
Ishant is supposed to be that guy being tall but that idiot does nothing

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Punjabies can't own anything apart from haleem' date=' These punjabies can't do **** on the ground, there f-16 are doing everything you really thnk punjab army can beat pushtuns in a guerilla warfare when we beat much superior soviet/nato attempts.[/quote'] Maharaja Ranjit Singh, Hindus of the bombay presidency armies and bengal presidency armies say hello. neither the soviets, nor the Americans went to afghanistan with the intent to conquer and stay. They went there to help set up their puppets and you outlasted them. But if you really are knowledgable, you should know that every single time an Indian, Iranian or Turki has come to stay in Afghanistan, you Pushtuns have been crushed and bent your knee to these overlords. Your people had just two kings in the last 2000 years who was a pathan and not bowing to someone his superior : Mirwais khan and Ahmed Shah Abdali. And even your pyaare Ahmed Shah Abdali dur-e-durrani was a errand-boy for nader shah and bent his knee to nader when nader was alive. Every dog has its day though and you had yours. For now, as usual, you can create a whole bunch of tamaasha and insurgency but you still bend your knee to the greater powers from India...aka Punjabis (for now). You lot are not a lot of proud rich history of warrior kings and independence like the Rajputs or the Uzbeks or iranians, you lot are not warriors, you lot are historically highway robber bands camping out the Khyber, bolan and golan passes, launching hit and run tactics on kabul and then running away. If i were a pashtun, i would not appeal to history to prove a rich and high accomplishing track record in warfare, self rule or independence. You guys are historically just a bunch of robber tribes caught in the middle.

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Bhuvi proving its all about line and length than about pace which fetches more wickets.
its all about movement whether at high pace or low pace. Philander also bowled line and length against SL, didnt get a wicket. BK too bowled line and length in India didnt get many wickets.

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its all about movement whether at high pace or low pace. Philander also bowled line and length against SL' date=' didnt get a wicket. BK too bowled line and length in India didnt get many wickets.[/quote'] It's not just about length for bowler, the line is also a key factor for pace bowlers. One needs to have control over both and thats what Bhuv did so well. He has proved many wrong who were harping about pace is everything.

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It's not just about length for bowler' date=' the line is also a key factor for pace bowlers. One needs to have control over both and thats what Bhuv did so well. He has proved many wrong who were harping about pace is everything.[/quote'] No one harps about pace is everything. pace is an added advantage. its about movement. Line and length is good but if there is no movement, you wont be successful. Ishant bowled very similar line and length as BK but was ineffective because he didnt get the movement BK got. Thing is if you can do what BK did at higher pace, you can be successful in all conditions, likes of Steyn, Marshal, Hadlee, Donald, Wasim, Waqar are great examples of that.

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Bhuvi proving its all about line and length than about pace which fetches more wickets.
Bhuvi got wickets because he combined movement with line and length. Problem is, in most conditions, the ball does not move with any consistency. It happens only in most venues in England and a few other venues. That is when pace and / or bounce is required combined with control. If someone combines everything, like a Steyn, he becomes unplayable. Almost all pace bowlers in test matches with over 200 wickets and average of 26 or less have had either pace or steep bounce. There must be some reason. What do you think that is ?

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Shami pace up today lots of 140 balls...he also bowled the quickest delivery from both teams in this game a 149k.
That is good. Shami's forte is movement at pace. I hope he does this more consistently. I think this 149 k is is fastest I have seen/ heard him bowl. Previous quickest was 148 k. Were there other 142 k and 145 k + deliveries ?

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Are the fastest speeds in Hawkeye reliable ? Did not see Stokes or Plunkett bowl 91 mph. Or Broad hit 90 mph. Their fastest deliveries were around 141 to 143 k which would be 88 to 89 mph.
I think speeds are more indicative...Shami marginally quicker than the English quicks. Ishant marginally slower than Anderson and same as Broad.

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aaron might have pace but he is not ready for test cricket n these conditions he would have been very poor man's plunkett
ACtually I have seen Aaron generating movement in the air in Nzl towards the end of the ODI series.....I always thought he was quick and straight ODI bowler but there might be something here

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ACtually I have seen Aaron generating movement in the air in Nzl towards the end of the ODI series.....I always thought he was quick and straight ODI bowler but there might be something here
that movement was nothing special and from the hand which is very easy to play

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that movement was nothing special and from the hand which is very easy to play
How can movement in the air at 140-145 not be special? yeah I will agree with you if it was a oneoff thing but he was really good with pace and movement towards the end of NZL tour......Cannot write him off as a ODI bowler....Has pace,shown ability to move the ball definetely deserves atleast one shot. In his debut test game against WI,he clearly looked inferior to Umesh and looked better than him in LOI's but he has shown to have the potential...I think he is not a long term test prospect but I think he is worth the gamble for his extra pace

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How can movement in the air at 140-145 not be special? yeah I will agree with you if it was a oneoff thing but he was really good with pace and movement towards the end of NZL tour......Cannot write him off as a ODI bowler....Has pace,shown ability to move the ball definetely deserves atleast one shot. In his debut game against WI,he clearly looked inferior to Umesh and looked better than him in LOI's but he has shown to have the potential...I think he is not a long term test prospect but I think he is worth the gamble for his extra pace
that is hwy i said for now he is not ready ...movement alone is not enough there should be proper control over it to take wickets and movement should be late not from hand even at pace its important . also i would not have wrote it if this match was in australia where he can actually bowl better than some one like pandey but in england pandey or pankaj who are little slower but taller will out bowl him 9/10

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that is hwy i said for now he is not ready ...movement alone is not enough there should be proper control over it to take wickets and movement should be late not from hand even at pace its important . also i would not have wrote it if this match was in australia where he can actually bowl better than some one like pandey but in england pandey or pankaj who are little slower but taller will out bowl him 9/10
Nzl conditions are more or less similar to Eng not Aus....Guys like Pankaj/Panadey will not bring in anything different from what we are already getting with Ishant,Shami or Bhuvi. We need someone to be worth a gamble,Atleast experimenting with him will make more sense than Binny

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Nzl conditions are more or less similar to Eng not Aus....Guys like Pankaj/Panadey will not bring in anything different from what we are already getting with Ishant,Shami or Bhuvi. We need someone to be worth a gamble,Atleast experimenting with him will make more sense than Binny
how do you know they wont bring anything different ? pankaj is giant at 6.6 i think who can swing the ball unlike ishant who does not gets much swing in these conditions 135 k bowler with movement and control is much better than 140 k bowler with no control over movement and bad control and its not like our main bowlers are doing badly that you need different kind of bowler ..if anything we are missing yadav badly who has lot more pace than others and moves the ball late

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Yadav would have been a definite assest here, other than him Pankaj will do well, he has better control than Ishant , Pace not sure. Aaron nevre saw him in a test, not sure. he certainly has pace probably 5 ks quicker than Yadav so definitely in fast bracket but would he have done well ..not as sure as about Yadav...but hey there has to be a first time. But seeing how Ishant is bowling i dont think he will get a chance.

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A fast bowler should replace Binny. I would prefer Aaron only if he is used as an intimidating fast bowler by Dhoni. Told by him to bowl fast and at the batsmen's body in short spells. If Dhoni is looking for line and length bowling then Pankaj is a far better option. Much less of a gamble. Plus, he will bring steep bounce as well as movement at 135 to 140 k. Has the ability to take wickets.

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Yadav would have been a definite assest here' date=' other than him Pankaj will do well, he has better control than Ishant , Pace not sure. Aaron nevre saw him in a test, not sure. he certainly has pace probably 5 ks quicker than Yadav so definitely in fast bracket but would he have done well ..not as sure as about Yadav...but hey there has to be a first time. But seeing how Ishant is bowling i dont think he will get a chance.[/quote'] if next track is flat and dry i think they will drop binny and play 2 spinners so yeah i dont think they will get chance unless someone gets injured (which has high chance in long series )

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