rtmohanlal Posted September 9, 2018 Share Posted September 9, 2018 Before the series started ,there was a topic to select the eleven for the series. I included all the 4 all rounders(that includes Kuldeep) in the eleven.Though that is stretching it a bit too much, based on the matters that turned out to be in the series, I think it would not at all be a bad idea to play all 4 in subcontinent & 3 of them else where(Kuldeep too if conditions favours spin a lot) with Jadeja at no:6. And why Jadeja at no:6 ?? With today's inns , he proved that he can put valuable runs in SENA.He avg:s almost 50 in first class.3 300s means, if conditions favours him , he can play mammoth inns too.Though this avg: cannot at all be a measure of his world class ability like say Kohli or even Pujara or even a Karun nair, him being a world class bowler for the team can make up for his slightly lower avg: if he is to bat at no:6. More over, in the last 2 years he averages 46.29 in tests with 8 of his 9 50+ scores coming in this period.Yes it is highly inflated by 11 not outs in 28 inns, but still if we assume it to be 3 not outs by adding (11-3)*20 = 160 more runs, then also his record of 28 inns ,3 not outs , 787+160 = 947 runs, 947/25 = 37.88 avg: is fairly good for a genuine no:6 batsman. To add to that he is a left hander too which provide much needed variety.And for a spinner, he has about 8 years left too. And this provide the cushion of playing Ashwin & Pandya too to come after him.Yes I know both Ashwin & Pandya could have been a bit more better in the on going series, especially Ashwin with his experience. But still if we take the 'sum of parts ', both of them combined have a batting avg: of around 41.5 & a bowling avg: of around 28.5 .That is equivalent to a specialist batsman + a specialist bowler.This despite the fact of such bad luck with the toss, which other wise could have been convincingly better. Quite sure not all important series can't be this much unlucky w.r.t toss. That means 5 genuine batsmen(ofcourse hacks like Dhawan get kicked out) + Jadeja + WK + 2 all rounders + 2 seam bowlers provide the much needed all round balance for any condition.And in sub continent 1 seam bowler can be replaced by another spinner, probably Kuldeep.Thoughts... coffee_rules 1 Link to comment
express bowling Posted September 9, 2018 Share Posted September 9, 2018 2 specialist pace bowlers not good enough for test matches in SENA. Ideally, we need 3 specialist pacers + a batsman who can bowl seam up, in most venues in SENA countries. Temujin Khaghan and Mosher 1 1 Link to comment
Temujin Khaghan Posted September 9, 2018 Share Posted September 9, 2018 It's our badluck that none of our batsmen are competent fifth bowlers like Sachin, sehwag, yuvraj etc... Bhuvi + jaddu + Ashwin + 2 Pacers Is anyday a potent combination than Pandya + jaddu + Ashwin. + 2 Pacers... Also the wk needs to step up. Total runs scored by our wkeepers in this series is 67 in 9 innings so far. Pisspoor... Rightarmfast 1 Link to comment
Temujin Khaghan Posted September 9, 2018 Share Posted September 9, 2018 We can forget about pandya in test cricket and happily play bhuvi at 8, after keeper and spinner in Australia. Rightarmfast 1 Link to comment
rtmohanlal Posted September 9, 2018 Author Share Posted September 9, 2018 1 minute ago, Temujin Khaghan said: We can forget about pandya in test cricket and happily play bhuvi at 8, after keeper and spinner in Australia. can't Bhuvi being one among the 2 lone pacers i specified enough?? he can contribute useful runs too. I think Bhuvi,Bumrah/Ishant,Pandya,Ashwin,Jadeja can form a potent all condition bowling unit. Link to comment
zen Posted September 9, 2018 Share Posted September 9, 2018 horses have left the stables diehardpacer and rkt.india 2 Link to comment
Nikola Posted September 9, 2018 Share Posted September 9, 2018 (edited) Well idk if bhuvi will be useful on Australian pitches but i will give him one or two tests and if he can't do anything he don't deserve to play just to enjoy green tops. His odi performance is always ignored by posters and his fans which might cost us worldcup. Edited September 9, 2018 by Nikola express bowling 1 Link to comment
express bowling Posted September 9, 2018 Share Posted September 9, 2018 31 minutes ago, rtmohanlal said: Bhuvi,Bumrah/Ishant,Pandya,Ashwin,Jadeja can form a potent all condition bowling unit. No. Pandya not ready to be 3rd pacer yet in SENA. Bumrah is a must in all challenging test matches. Bhuvi cannot be a regular on flat tracks. Need to introduce Siraj. 2 spinners rarely needed in SENA. Link to comment
Temujin Khaghan Posted September 9, 2018 Share Posted September 9, 2018 11 minutes ago, express bowling said: No. Pandya not ready to be 3rd pacer yet in SENA. Bumrah is a must in all challenging test matches. Bhuvi cannot be a regular on flat tracks. Need to introduce Siraj. 2 spinners rarely needed in SENA. How shardul thaakur got picked ahead of Siraj seriously ?? lol @ our squad management express bowling 1 Link to comment
Ankit_sharma03 Posted September 9, 2018 Share Posted September 9, 2018 The meer fact that u wanna bat jadeja at no.6 overseas based on one innings makes me wanna ignore this whole post. I mean ye aadmi 10 saal se batting below avg raha hia, thoda to wait krlo opinion bnane men Link to comment
SecondSlip Posted September 9, 2018 Share Posted September 9, 2018 Team India is badly missing someone like Shakib Al Hasan in its test side. We need a batting allrounder that will bat at #6 and can give us 10-15 overs of tight spin bowling which will allow Team India to play 4 specialist fast bowlers in SENA. rkt.india and express bowling 2 Link to comment
rtmohanlal Posted September 9, 2018 Author Share Posted September 9, 2018 24 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said: The meer fact that u wanna bat jadeja at no.6 overseas based on one innings makes me wanna ignore this whole post. I mean ye aadmi 10 saal se batting below avg raha hia, thoda to wait krlo opinion bnane men did i point out that only as the reason????? Link to comment
rtmohanlal Posted September 9, 2018 Author Share Posted September 9, 2018 18 minutes ago, SecondSlip said: Team India is badly missing someone like Shakib Al Hasan in its test side. We need a batting allrounder that will bat at #6 and can give us 10-15 overs of tight spin bowling which will allow Team India to play 4 specialist fast bowlers in SENA. if any thing to go by the last 2 years test stats of Jadeja, he can be that man. Link to comment
Ankit_sharma03 Posted September 9, 2018 Share Posted September 9, 2018 10 minutes ago, rtmohanlal said: did i point out that only as the reason????? rest of reasons are of no use his runs in last 2 yr which came at home where his batting wasnt a much of issue or domestic records which again is played at home. He was very poor overseas so lets wait ...... Link to comment
express bowling Posted September 9, 2018 Share Posted September 9, 2018 (edited) 38 minutes ago, SecondSlip said: Team India is badly missing someone like Shakib Al Hasan in its test side. We need a batting allrounder that will bat at #6 and can give us 10-15 overs of tight spin bowling which will allow Team India to play 4 specialist fast bowlers in SENA. That would be ideal. Jadeja averages almost 53 in domestic FC cricket, so there is some batting talent present ... and should have been that guy. His knock yesterday in testing conditions against quality pacers, does give some hope. Played the ball under his eyes, left impeccably, displayed good idea of where his off stump is, displayed grit and batted with the tail. Amazing transformation really. If Jadeja can continue to bat this way in the next 2 tests and in the 2nd innings of this match, there is a case for batting him at 6 ... then the WK ... then 4 pacers out of whom one can bat somewhat. Edited September 9, 2018 by express bowling Link to comment
Charlie_ Posted September 9, 2018 Share Posted September 9, 2018 Jadeja at 6? ICF jumping the gun again. 3 tests ago some wanted Ashwin to be the captain of the test side. zen and diehardpacer 2 Link to comment
zen Posted September 9, 2018 Share Posted September 9, 2018 (edited) After a few games, if Jadeja does not live up to the high standards, many fans would be asking to replace Jadeja Disappointing. Strategically we are weak. Ind fans overrate their team and the players. They want the team to win everything. The players, including ATGs, usually don't live up to fan's high standards. Anyone who does well is automatically seen as a solution in the short term till he becomes inconsistent .... the cycle continues To improve selection in test cricket, first we have to acknowledge that Ashwin, Jadeja (though he has potential), Bhuvi, etc. are not test all-rounders. They are bowlers who can bat well. In the past, Kumble, Srinath, etc. had shown batting potential as well and perceived as players who can be all-rounders. We cannot imagine that the talent displayed in an occasional good inning will be continued by them consistently Being an All-rounder is a responsibility. Unless you are a natural talent, you have to devote time to develop both aspect of your game. These guys are not even consistent in their primary area of strength. Coming out and playing a few good knocks here and there is different than becoming accountable as an all-rounder. A bad performance in your primary area can make your stock fall sharply like what happened to Ashwin in the last game. A good batting performance by him probably would not have saved him from criticism for the failure to deliver with the ball, his primary area Edited September 9, 2018 by zen Link to comment
Khota Posted September 9, 2018 Share Posted September 9, 2018 After Pandya experiment we still want allrounders? Link to comment
zen Posted September 9, 2018 Share Posted September 9, 2018 11 minutes ago, Khota said: After Pandya experiment we still want allrounders? Unlike what you would like to believe, ARs have come up with impact performances to help Ind win: View overall figures [change view] Primary team India Opposition team England Home or away away (home of opposition) Start of match date between 9 Sep 2017 and 9 Sep 2018 Ordered by batting - bowling average (descending) Page 1 of 1 Showing 1 - 17 of 17 First Previous Next Last Return to query menu Cleared query menu Overall figures Player Mat Runs HS Bat Av 100 Wkts BBI Bowl Av 5 Ct St Ave Diff RA Jadeja 1 86 86* - 0 5 4/79 23.00 0 0 0 - HH Pandya 4 164 52* 23.42 0 10 5/28 24.70 1 0 0 -1.27 R Ashwin 4 126 33* 21.00 0 11 4/62 32.72 0 1 0 -11.72 I Sharma 5 37 14 5.28 0 18 5/51 24.16 1 0 0 -18.88 JJ Bumrah 3 6 6 2.00 0 14 5/85 23.42 1 1 0 -21.42 UT Yadav 1 1 1* - 0 3 2/20 25.33 0 0 0 - Mohammed Shami 5 27 10* 3.37 0 15 4/57 36.26 0 1 0 -32.89 S Dhawan 4 161 44 23.00 0 - - - - 2 0 - KD Karthik 2 21 20 5.25 0 - - - - 5 0 - V Kohli 5 593 149 65.88 2 - - - - 4 0 - Kuldeep Yadav 1 0 0 0.00 0 0 - - 0 0 0 - RR Pant 3 48 24 9.60 0 - - - - 13 0 - CA Pujara 4 278 132* 46.33 1 - - - - 0 0 - AM Rahane 5 220 81 24.44 0 - - - - 4 0 - KL Rahul 5 150 37 16.66 0 - - - - 13 0 - GH Vihari 1 56 56 56.00 0 0 - - 0 0 0 - M Vijay 2 26 20 6.50 0 - - - - 0 0 - Link to comment
SecondSlip Posted September 9, 2018 Share Posted September 9, 2018 1 hour ago, express bowling said: That would be ideal. Jadeja averages almost 53 in domestic FC cricket, so there is some batting talent present ... and should have been that guy. His knock yesterday in testing conditions against quality pacers, does give some hope. Played the ball under his eyes, left impeccably, displayed good idea of where his off stump is, displayed grit and batted with the tail. Amazing transformation really. If Jadeja can continue to bat this way in the next 2 tests and in the 2nd innings of this match, there is a case for batting him at 6 ... then the WK ... then 4 pacers out of whom one can bat somewhat. We need the batting allrounder to average at least 40 minimum. I am not sure if Jadeja can achieve that so I won't say too much on him. Is there anyone in Ranji trophy who is a batsman that will give us 10-15 overs of tight spin bowling? He doesn't even have to be a wickettaker. Just a 5th bowler who comes onto bowl when the 4 fast bowlers need a bit of a break. Link to comment
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