#StopHindiImposition Protests [ Only for Tammys ] !!!

[velu]

35 minutes ago, coffee_rules said:

@velu or @Vilander what is funny in the second part . is kalacharum same as culture?

 

 

 

 

Yeah .. kalacharam mean culture 

Kamals old view about culture is exactly opposite of what he said yesterday 

 

Few years back Kamal said that culture changes every 5 years but yesterday he said Tamil culture is age old and we should preserve it at any cost 

 

[Vilander]

45 minutes ago, coffee_rules said:

@velu or @Vilander what is funny in the second part . is kalacharum same as culture?

 

 

 

yes Kalacharam means culture...man this is gold. that second gif ...deposit deposit irrukadhu..next election.

[randomGuy]

2 minutes ago, coffee_rules said:

Why? If you make it official national language a lot of fence sitters will get energized. India was multilingual for 1000s of years. We have had travellers going to pilgrimages to Kashi, Mathura Ayodhya without knowing mutual local languages. Just promote all languages in their regions, use Hindi or English for connect. No need to impose. But if you are working for a living in a different state, why do they hate to learn the local language? Why dont Naarthies talk in Kannada to local vendors, maids. They have lived in Karnataka for years, but still insist others to speak in  Hindi. It is utterly foolosh.

Northies should be open to learning Kannada etc. But also Hindi= 25% humanity; Kannada = 0.6% humanity. People when they come to Karnataka, do not initially know that they are going to stay for so long...I guess if they knew that they will stay 5-10-20 yrs or life long, more people will learn Kannada...but when I was there I saw many northies speak Kannada.

 

 

 

[Gollum]

From personal experience found Mallus to be most averse to Hindi. Bengaluru, Hyderabad are almost Kolkata level when it comes to being able to manage with Hindi, personally prefer Bengali when I visit Kolkata. Don't want to lose touch with the language, moved out of the state 10 years back and am already weak, in school (ICSE) Bengali was my 3rd language while Hindi was 2nd. Spoken Bengali is fine but not being able to read as fluently as I used to and feel very guilty about it . Thinking of subscribing to some Bengali e-paper to brush up my skills. 

Edited September 17, 2019 by Gollum

[Vilander]

@coffee_rules

 

dude i will spend some time and give full translation.. 

 

basically.

 

In first part of the gif , Kamal appears like savior of Tamil/ south Indian cultures and talks in a serious godly tone. the later part is basically Ajith (as tamil people ) saying this guy does not talk like this normally ? how does he talk ?

 

then the second video of Kamal from his hand man, in which Kamal talks **** about people crying about culture and disses tamil culture calls it crap in a very chennai low class accent.. (its probably out of context) but brings out the absolute falseness of left.

[Gollum]

@Tibarn thoughts on English as national language? I think 3 language formula in education is fine provided English and MT are the compulsory ones, 3rd being personal choice. 

Edited September 17, 2019 by Gollum

[cowboysfan]

1 hour ago, Gollum said:

@cowboysfan no need to abuse any language or culture, we must be equally proud of all of them, they are all rich and beautiful in their own way. I have problems with many Muslims and their religion, but always maintain that Urdu is a rich Indian language and we must preserve it...if someone tells me Urdu is a Pakistani language, I will be pissed off. What certain people/groups do, how govts act etc mustn't cloud our judgement about the languages. Which other country has these many languages, all with rich history, beauty, grammar, semantics, phonetics and wonderful literature?

I have no problem with any culture,even if i have some misgivings i would to each his own.This Hindi push from BJP is too blatant to ignore though,i dont  even think its politically advantageous for them .

[coffee_rules]

4 minutes ago, cowboysfan said:

I have no problem with any culture,even if i have some misgivings i would to each his own.This Hindi push from BJP is too blatant to ignore though,i dont  even think its politically advantageous for them .

Why do you blame BJP? I just showed Chiddu impising Hindi as Rajya Bhasha, while Shah says talk and give importance to in MT but also learn Hindi. Practical. 

[Vilander]

1 hour ago, cowboysfan said:

I have no problem with any culture,even if i have some misgivings i would to each his own.This Hindi push from BJP is too blatant to ignore though,i dont  even think its politically advantageous for them .

its a politically stupid move, or may be they want to consolidate more in places where they are in power. Hindi chauvinists will vote more for BJP if they push for this. 

[Muloghonto]

11 hours ago, cowboysfan said:

You dont see this as a direct threat? do you know how many people in England speak Cornish now? .do you know what happened to the languages of france when they made french the official language?do you know the term" gradual language death" and how it works?.the world is losing languages at an astonishing rate(some think 1 every 2 weeks),when you lose a language you also lose a major part of its culture and frankly hindi and the hindi belt culture is nothing  to write home about.

This again brings me back to the whole ‘ why are southie Hindi haters being such pu$$ies ?’ Question. Gradual death of a language is not at risk so long as there are millions of native speakers and it’s also taught. This is why ALL Hindi belt bordering languages are doing okay. Bengali, Gujarati, Marathi are all going great guns, along with much significantly smaller ( and similar to Hindi) Punjabi. Yes, Punjabi is being eroded. It’s a factor of its small population in conjunction with much more commonality with Hindi than other languages. But it’s not due to Punjabi’s learning Hindi per se. Just like how Bengali, Marathi and Gujju bhasha are thriving, so will the south ones continue to if they learnt Hindi. So top being anti national and making nonsense excuses, learn Hindi and be happy having your own MT thriving along with a desi language being pan national one, chosen by the democratic basis of its popularity. The end. 

[Tibarn]

 

11 hours ago, Gollum said:

@Tibarn thoughts on English as national language? I think 3 language formula in education is fine provided English and MT are the compulsory ones, 3rd being personal choice. 

The way I see it:

 

The point of a national language is to facilitate national unity/show the unity of the country and increase national pride in one's history/culture. Post-independence, we were supposed to have English as the language of government/administration for the first 15 years, after which, in the eyes of prominent Freedom movement figures an "Indian" language would have been adopted. I can list who supported what, but the main contenders among these people were: Sanskrit, "Hindi", and Hindustani.  Not a single of the main national figures of the time was pushing for English (I'm talking about the Gandhi, Bose, Patel, Ambedkar types, ie people everyone has heard of).

 

Historically, the three language policy was part of a somewhat reasonable compromise  to make both Hindi and English official languages and say that there is no national language, to placate any fears some people from some of the states had, while also allowing education in MT. Most people in India, IMO, are not averse, to this compromise.  Even I am against it. 

 

If one were to really make English the national language, then there would be no need for the 3 language policy to exist anymore, as that policy exists only to provide space to both the official languages of government: Hindi and English. At that point a 2 language policy would exist: MT + English. This would be the case even if Punjabi was made into the national language, if there's only 1 national language, there is no reason for students to, by mandate, learn a 3rd. It is better any additional languages are learned latter in one's education as an elective in this case.  

 

However, I personally don't support English as a sole national language, as, just from an optics standpoint, it looks bad, IMO: our government was so incompetent that it was unable to establish a national language after 70+ years; if we adopt English exclusively we lend credence to the Leftest interpretation that India is a creation of the British Empire; it shows India's policy is subservient to a handful of anti-social elements(Lemurs), a hallmark of a weak state; and so-called "Indians" would rather elevate a foreign language instead of an Indian one( sometimes this extends to tearing down an Indian language or even insulting people/states, which some of these lemurs on this forum have done numerous times before). 

 

If the status quo remains as is, Hindi will anyway become more and more the de facto lingua franca of India and English will become the default medium of education .  Regarding Hindi, the central government doesn't have to do anything to make it happen either. My mother's family is from Surat; that city is less than 55% native Gujarati speakers. One can go there and see what language is the de facto lingua franca of India and is spoken by "South Indians", Marathis, Odiyas, Rajasthanis, et al.   The space for anti-Hindi politics is shrinking IMO, and much of opposition to the issue is falling on deaf ears.  A party like DMK or other regional parties can rake up the issue as often as they want, but, unless they are part of the ruling coalition in the center, they won't really have any leverage to hold anyone hostage anymore. They can hold TN hostage should they get elected, but, even there, for how long? Likewise, English is pretty ingrained as part of India, specifically in the education sector. Students aren't going to stop learning it, not until the benefits of learning it decline/availability decreases, both of which are unlikely in the near future, IMO. 

 

I have always supported Sanskrit, as that has always made the most sense to me in filling what I consider to be the role of a national language. It won't win an economic argument(at the moment) vs say a Hindi or English, but, IMO, that isn't the role of a national language. 

12 hours ago, randomGuy said:

Yeah bro, moving on from the haters...i strongly support English in education... English is very important, Ideally ndians should be proficient in English, hindi and regional lang...all subjects- natural science, social science, math, should be in English as that's the best for compatibility with the world.

 

Also, for those who studied in English it will be extremely hard to switch to Hindi..for ex... isosceles triangle is sam-dwibahu tribhuj in Hindi.

 

Personally speaking, I speak in English in those settings. Otherwise, Hindi by default wherever English is not necessary...

 

One thing which has got to be ingrained in every indian is that you don't have to use fancy words or show emotions while speaking English....Fancy words/phrases, people use whether they fit or not fit....also, English is our second/third language you will look lame whenever you try to be funny, show anger or any other emotion while speaking English...those things are suited for mother tongue.

 

IMO, there isn't a problem with English itself as an optional language of education at any level, but there is a major problem with the Indian higher education system currently, where English is the sole medium of education. Effectively, this undercuts all Indian-language education, right from the primary school days, as any parent with an option would logically choose English over any other language ,"Indhi imposition," or otherwise. De facto, a student who grows up learning in an English-medium school has a leg-up on admissions to IT/Medicine/Engineering/MBA, etc programs over a student who grows up learning in his/her MT. 

 

IMO, that is the truth of the so-called "English-language advantage," which we have been sold for several decades now, as being some major competitive advantage for India economically. Never-mind that India lags behind in research whether in Science or Medicine or Engineering. Meanwhile, higher education in actual wealthy countries follows the pattern of having native languages as options of education, with English requirements often non-existent for admissions.  This has led to the throttling of the Indian talent pipeline, IMO.

 

Lemurs can curse and abuse Hindi as much as they want and fling tatti at "BIMARU" or "North Indians" or whatever, but they have facilitated this result and the subsequent feeling among many:

 

 

So while I am not against English as one medium of education in India, or an optional subject for people to learn, that is up to them, I am against the continuation of English as the sole medium of higher education in India.   

 

 

Edited September 18, 2019 by Tibarn

[The Dark Horse]

17 minutes ago, Tibarn said:

So while I am not against English as one medium of education in India, or an optional subject for people to learn, that is up to them, I am against the continuation of English as the sole medium of higher education in India.   

There are local language medium schools in each state...noone is forcing people to take up English medium schools.

By the way, may I know which medium of education you studied in...

There was quality education even in local language run schools during my parents' generation but frankly it's not a possibility nowadays.

[Tibarn]

52 minutes ago, The Dark Horse said:

There are local language medium schools in each state...noone is forcing people to take up English medium schools.

 

1 hour ago, Tibarn said:

higher education in India. 

Higher education. There are no major programs in any Indian language for IT/Engineering/Medicine/Business, anything really.

 

When the only real language of Higher education is English, then why exactly would a parent put their kid in some other medium of education at lower levels? .

 

52 minutes ago, The Dark Horse said:

By the way, may I know which medium of education you studied in...

Gujarati.

Now you: why is that relevant?  

 

Edited September 18, 2019 by Tibarn

[The Dark Horse]

46 minutes ago, Tibarn said:

 

Higher education. There are no major programs in any Indian language for IT/Engineering/Medicine/Business, anything really.

I don't have problems with it, but is it practically feasible? Studying in a local language at school and then going to IIT or AIMS or even regional colleges, these students face a lot of struggles to suddenly switch to English. Even if it's local languages are the medium in graduation, they will struggle communicating between states' people. Added to this, soft skills are required in English for a decent paying job.

When the only real language of Higher education is English, then why exactly would a parent put their kid in some other medium of education at lower levels? .

 

Gujarati.

Now you: why is that relevant?  

People who vouch for local language education themselves educate themselves or their children in convent schools or even abroad.

For me, mother tongue should be compulsory, only then people will remember their roots and culture. English is a need and Hindi or any other language can be optional according to their preference.

 

[cowboysfan]

5 hours ago, Muloghonto said:

This again brings me back to the whole ‘ why are southie Hindi haters being such pu$$ies ?’ Question. Gradual death of a language is not at risk so long as there are millions of native speakers and it’s also taught. This is why ALL Hindi belt bordering languages are doing okay. Bengali, Gujarati, Marathi are all going great guns, along with much significantly smaller ( and similar to Hindi) Punjabi. Yes, Punjabi is being eroded. It’s a factor of its small population in conjunction with much more commonality with Hindi than other languages. But it’s not due to Punjabi’s learning Hindi per se. Just like how Bengali, Marathi and Gujju bhasha are thriving, so will the south ones continue to if they learnt Hindi. So top being anti national and making nonsense excuses, learn Hindi and be happy having your own MT thriving along with a desi language being pan national one, chosen by the democratic basis of its popularity. The end. 

I do know hindi and speak it quite well,it is taught in schools after allmy point remains that it should not forced on people who dont want to learn it,it is their right.

[Muloghonto]

49 minutes ago, cowboysfan said:

I do know hindi and speak it quite well,it is taught in schools after allmy point remains that it should not forced on people who dont want to learn it,it is their right.

That’s like saying don’t force math on kids who don’t want to learn it,it’s their right .

[Moochad]

10 hours ago, Tibarn said:

IMO, there isn't a problem with English itself as an optional language of education at any level, but there is a major problem with the Indian higher education system currently, where English is the sole medium of education. Effectively, this undercuts all Indian-language education, right from the primary school days, as any parent with an option would logically choose English over any other language ,"Indhi imposition," or otherwise. De facto, a student who grows up learning in an English-medium school has a leg-up on admissions to IT/Medicine/Engineering/MBA, etc programs over a student who grows up learning in his/her MT. 

I shared this before

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4117137/

Quote

The medium of instruction

Before contemplating paradigm shift, one is driven by a need to review the medium of instruction which forms the basic and vital backbone of any curriculum. The medium of instruction for most of the professional courses in India is English. Unlike a few other disciplines like Law and Civil Services, which enjoy substitutes for the medium of instruction, Medicine is taught in English alone. An Indian demographic scan reflects the basic medium of instruction until high school being dominated by regional or vernacular languages in majority of Indian States. A few southern and north eastern states make an exception, with a reasonable exposure to English language. The foundations of logic reasoning and memory in basic subjects are founded in the regional languages, with minimal exposure to English. At entrance exam and at college level, a sudden and vast expanse of the curriculum in a near-to-alien language leaves the students crippled and challenged, widening the rift between the two. The students keep fiddling between understanding the terms, which they otherwise understand very well; and are unable to establish an impressive academic record. This dual work load not only proves fatal but also stalls innovation and creativity thus impairing the overall academic performance. Keeping these facts in mind, it is time when the curriculum along with existing periodic revisions, is urgently translated into immediate regional needs. This could bring a revolution in India, generating talented physicians from the neglected rural backgrounds with little reluctance to serve in their villages.

Encouragement for the backward and other backward classes already exists in India but has not adequately impacted the socio economic academic demography of India. But, can the current system deliver in the long run until the language barriers are truly overcome? The language barriers have to be addressed and resolved promptly in the field of Medical Education and should be carried forthwith without further ado. It is well known that Russia, China, Japan, Mexico and other countries, with their education system in native languages other than English, have produced excellent human resources trained in medicine as well as biomedical research to the extent that many Indian learn their languages to undergo medical training in these countries. Is it not better to learn Tamil, Telgu or Malyalam in order to get trained in proposedregional language centric medical schools than learning foreign languages to get into those medical schools.

We in the medical community have been pointing this out for going on a decade. Because certain morons are slaves to English, we continuously have a low supply of doctors and produce lower quality doctors. 

22 hours ago, Tibarn said:

 These guys don't actually care about their MTs or the nation in general. They seem to be from the gungadeen class  who only care about English. 

It's time for the rest India to stop being held hostage by these useless buggers,' IMO 

What's ironic, these tools have no shame in demanding the RoI being forced to learn English and English being the only medium of higher education in India, all the while selectively targeting actions being taken to "privilege" Hindi. Clown-world 

 

Agree, notice they never actually advocate for people from their state getting a full education or at least having that option in their mother tongues from primary to tertiary education. They basically think English has some economic advantage, so they want that language English, dressing it as a mother tongue issue.  

 

 

Edited September 18, 2019 by Moochad

[Vilander]

8 hours ago, Muloghonto said:

That’s like saying don’t force math on kids who don’t want to learn it,it’s their right .

no its not

[Vilander]

for Hindi speaking states if there is benefit in making Hindi as medium of instruction in higher education ( if it allows better scientists/scholars to be produced) it should be done. For non hindi speaking states its better to let English be the medium for higher education as changing it to Hindi is not making it a 'local' language. Hindi is more alien to many in non Hindi speaking states than English, so there is no value in it. 

[Vilander]

11 hours ago, Tibarn said:

If the status quo remains as is, Hindi will anyway become more and more the de facto lingua franca of India and English will become the default medium of education .  Regarding Hindi, the central government doesn't have to do anything to make it happen either. My mother's family is from Surat; that city is less than 55% native Gujarati speakers. One can go there and see what language is the de facto lingua franca of India and is spoken by "South Indians", Marathis, Odiyas, Rajasthanis, et al.   The space for anti-Hindi politics is shrinking IMO, and much of opposition to the issue is falling on deaf ears.  A party like DMK or other regional parties can rake up the issue as often as they want, but, unless they are part of the ruling coalition in the center, they won't really have any leverage to hold anyone hostage anymore. They can hold TN hostage should they get elected, but, even there, for how long? Likewise, English is pretty ingrained as part of India, specifically in the education sector. Students aren't going to stop learning it, not until the benefits of learning it decline/availability decreases, both of which are unlikely in the near future, IMO. 

just curious what do you see Hindis role to  be ? in future.

 

Be sole language used in Indian government communications ? What is it  - its not preferred language of instruction in education from the looks of it.