WHO failure - has to bear some responsibility

[chewy]

It's open knowledge current leader of WHO and previous leader are pretty close to China communist government. 

 

Taiwan warned WHO about human to human transmission back December, Japan has called WHO, a Chinese Health Organisation, and now Trump has been critical of them.

 

After SARs and then Ebola, wasn't one of top priorities of WHO to have early warning notice of possible pandemic disease. How the hell did they state a flu like virus, Coronavirus, was not a human to human transmission, they discouraged lockdowns, discouraged stopping of international flights...

 

It feels so many of these UN bodies are packed with 'experts' on jollies, a toothless and useless body 

[chewy]

Nowadays, everytime a WHO spokesman comes on telly providing tips on what to do to prevent.the wuhan virus spresding it effing pisses me off...if only they had done their job properly in the first place and not contradicting  the advise they were giving before

[sandeep]

19 minutes ago, chewy said:

It's open knowledge current leader of WHO and previous leader are pretty close to China communist government. 

 

Taiwan warned WHO about human to human transmission back December, Japan has called WHO, a Chinese Health Organisation, and now Trump has been critical of them.

 

After SARs and then Ebola, wasn't one of top priorities of WHO to have early warning notice of possible pandemic disease. How the hell did they state a flu like virus, Coronavirus, was not a human to human transmission, they discouraged lockdowns, discouraged stopping of international flights...

 

It feels so many of these UN bodies are packed with 'experts' on jollies, a toothless and useless body 

UN can be 'gamed' very easily, especially by the veto holding powers.  That's the reality of it.  India has a reasonably decent amount of skill and success with it, within the constraint of not having that veto.  Nehru's tactic was to avoid that seat to increase the chances of avoiding being sucked into the cold war power politics tug of war.  Not only did that not work, it also gave away a geopolitical advantage that we are still investing resources in getting back.  And if/when we get it, it will be watered down anyway.  

[FischerTal]

WHO let the bats out WHO WHO WHO WHO

Edited April 8, 2020 by FischerTal

[Gollum]

9 minutes ago, sandeep said:

Nehru's tactic was to avoid that seat to increase the chances of avoiding being sucked into the cold war power politics tug of war.  

We weren't offered it anyway, it is just Andhbhakt WhatsApp GK, Nehru had many faults but UNSC permanent seat rejection was not one of them. We weren't even independent when that happened. A lot more, I researched UN's history and invested a lot of time to try and put some blame on Nehru, I failed. And you know how much I hate Congress. 

Edited April 8, 2020 by Gollum

[sandeep]

10 minutes ago, Gollum said:

We weren't offered it anyway, it is just Andhbhakt WhatsApp GK, Nehru had many faults but UNSC permanent seat rejection was not one of them. We weren't even independent when that happened. A lot more, I researched UN's history and invested a lot of time to try and put some blame on Nehru, I failed. And you know how much I hate Congress. 

I'm aware of that history, but feel that it was quite gettable if Nehru had pushed for it. 

[Gollum]

2 minutes ago, sandeep said:

I'm aware of that history, but feel that it was quite gettable if Nehru had pushed for it. 

Would have opened a Pandora's Box, and many other countries were in line, we were a lightweight despite our democratic credentials. Also would have needed the approval of all 5 original members (ROC representing China), forget bringing the bitter Cold War rivals on the same page (impossible to please both today, we are talking about the 50s) all those countries have always wanted to keep that exclusive privilege. As you said no one is joing the club until it is watered down. I am glad Nehru didn't waste time/resources chasing that pipe dream. NAM was the correct route irrespective of how it has floundered over the years. 

[coffee_rules]

27 minutes ago, Gollum said:

We weren't offered it anyway, it is just Andhbhakt WhatsApp GK, Nehru had many faults but UNSC permanent seat rejection was not one of them. We weren't even independent when that happened. A lot more, I researched UN's history and invested a lot of time to try and put some blame on Nehru, I failed. And you know how much I hate Congress. 

It is not just from WAU as you claim. UN GA under-Secretary (a wife killing pidi now) in 2004 ignited that debate in 2004 when he said  USSR had offered to help India get a seat there in the 50s. 
 

https://www.wilsoncenter.org/publication/not-the-cost-china-india-and-the-united-nations-security-council-1950

 

As per the above report, The rumors are not quelled yet. Nehru FP had always tried at lengths to bring international legitimacy to China in the 50s. He ignored China’s invasion of Tibet and also made USSR to get closer to China get a seat before India. If he had chosen or pushed hard, with either USA or USSR’s support, we could have gotten. INC leaders were all educated in socialist UK or Europe, were not closer to USA’s capitalism and hence we moved closer to Russia and also to China to build a regional power, but China screwed us in 62.. We don’t need WAU to confirm this part of history. We only need WAU to supply news like Nehru and Abdullah Sr were half-bros.

[Gollum]

4 minutes ago, coffee_rules said:

It is not just from WAU as you claim. UN GA under-Secretary (a wife killing pidi now) in 2004 ignited that debate in 2004 when he said  USSR had offered to help India get a seat there in the 50s. 
 

https://www.wilsoncenter.org/publication/not-the-cost-china-india-and-the-united-nations-security-council-1950

 

As per the above report, The rumors are not quelled yet. Nehru FP had always tried at lengths to bring international legitimacy to China in the 50s. He ignored China’s invasion of Tibet and also made USSR to get closer to China get a seat before India. If he had chosen or pushed hard, with either USA or USSR’s support, we could have gotten. INC leaders were all educated in socialist UK or Europe, were not closer to USA’s capitalism and hence we moved closer to Russia and also to China to build a regional power, but China screwed us in 62.. We don’t need WAU to confirm this part of history. We only need WAU to supply news like Nehru and Abdullah Sr were half-bros.

I think some of us discussed this in an old thread. UNSC permanant membership requires all 5 major powers agreeing to support a country's claim. And it was impossible to please both opposing camps, we offered them nothing. special Everything was set in stone in 1945, there was never going to be an addition to that exclusive club. There is a reason Australia isn't member, mind you Aussies have been by the side of US in every single war since the great wars. The only point of contention was who represented China, ROC or PRC....Nehru supported PRC 10 years before others but that was always going to be China's seat, was never coming to India or Canada or Australia or elsewhere. @Stradlater was part of that discussion and I think he was of the same view. 

[Gollum]

@coffee_rules I hate WA Uni because of the stupid claims, aversion to facts and conspiracy theories. Dharmic  RW must be more refined, make its place in academia and rely on factual dissection of opponents rather than gossip or far-fetched theories. We must evolve, be sophisticated, form a credible intellectual base to take on the might of LW intelligentsia which dominates not just India but most of the civilized world. We must put forth our vision and pov rather than trying to play childish games. While these may annoy LW crybabies and provide some short term (electoral) benefits we need to be more ambitious and tenable. 

Edited April 8, 2020 by Gollum

[maniac]

Yes what a useless organization. What is the point of this when they Can’t  prevent such pandemics. Heads need to roll.

[Autonomous]

Management of WHO should be jailed. 

[Texy]

 

[Clarke]

Can the US under Dr Trump block it's funds or force reform ?

[Stradlater]

6 hours ago, Gollum said:

I think some of us discussed this in an old thread. UNSC permanant membership requires all 5 major powers agreeing to support a country's claim. And it was impossible to please both opposing camps, we offered them nothing. special Everything was set in stone in 1945, there was never going to be an addition to that exclusive club. There is a reason Australia isn't member, mind you Aussies have been by the side of US in every single war since the great wars. The only point of contention was who represented China, ROC or PRC....Nehru supported PRC 10 years before others but that was always going to be China's seat, was never coming to India or Canada or Australia or elsewhere. @Stradlater was part of that discussion and I think he was of the same view. 

India never had the chance to sneak their way in the P5. It's just another one of those made up BS by sanghis for perennial Nehru bashing. 

[someone]

7 hours ago, Gollum said:

@coffee_rules I hate WA Uni because of the stupid claims, aversion to facts and conspiracy theories. Dharmic  RW must be more refined, make its place in academia and rely on factual dissection of opponents rather than gossip or far-fetched theories. We must evolve, be sophisticated, form a credible intellectual base to take on the might of LW intelligentsia which dominates not just India but most of the civilized world. We must put forth our vision and pov rather than trying to play childish games. While these may annoy LW crybabies and provide some short term (electoral) benefits we need to be more ambitious and tenable. 

That’s already the first and big mistake. You are readyly accepting the tag “RW” given by the opponent, and thus they have the power to define and assign meanings to our side.

 

We need our own terms, and vocab. Words play a big role in narrative and you have already lost the battle when one assigns you RW in India. Also question the other side, why are the Muslims tagged with LW, given their questionable positioning on women, LGBT, and other religions. 

[Gollum]

1 hour ago, someone said:

That’s already the first and big mistake. You are readyly accepting the tag “RW” given by the opponent, and thus they have the power to define and assign meanings to our side.

 

We need our own terms, and vocab. Words play a big role in narrative and you have already lost the battle when one assigns you RW in India. Also question the other side, why are the Muslims tagged with LW, given their questionable positioning on women, LGBT, and other religions. 

Proud of the RW tag, I choose it not them. We will define and assign meanings to our side, not them. In India at least I associate LW with rigid, illiberal positioning, if they wanna sink with Islamists I don't mind. Their space is shrinking, if we are clever and mature enough with long term vision we can wipe them out of the public sphere. Our energies must be focussed on key issues and not optics, we are yet to take decisive steps towards unshackling our academia from their death grip. 

Edited April 9, 2020 by Gollum

[mishra]

^ You cant be Right Wing unless you are Right. I believe Right Wing world over are more correct then lefties

[mishra]

@OP. . Anyone with basic common sense can say that there are mainly 3 ways to spread a disease. Blood to Blood or aerosol. Saliva to Salive. If Chinese don't kiss each other when they were greeting, how else was the virus spreading apart from sneezes and aerosol

Edited April 9, 2020 by mishra

[someone]

1 hour ago, Gollum said:

Proud of the RW tag, I choose it not them. We will define and assign meanings to our side, not them. In India at least I associate LW with rigid, illiberal positioning, if they wanna sink with Islamists I don't mind. Their space is shrinking, if we are clever and mature enough with long term vision we can wipe them out of the public sphere. Our energies must be focussed on key issues and not optics, we are yet to take decisive steps towards unshackling our academia from their death grip. 

Thats some stupidity. RW is a western term with connotations related to their history, western universalism. Its not apt with Indian context and our unique history, and thus, our own words and narrative are necessary.
 

And RW has derogatory reference like facist, bigots. Thus, by default,  you start already on defensive mode. That results in most energy spend on defending ourselves than actually raising the right questions or publishing actual substance.

 

BJP do understand this game and has responded with the same tactics through nationalists/anti-nationals. But the opponent have 30 years headstart, whereas our side is less than 10 years.

Edited April 9, 2020 by someone