We are Indians, Not South Asians

[Real McCoy]

7 hours ago, MechEng said:

I've tried the original sambusa which has chicken filling and not beef. It was way blander than the Indian version.

We might have made it better but I don't think Samosa has its origins in India. Some guys argue it originated in Turkey and others Iran. The same way how chess originated in India but the persians and arabains took credit and now they know it was Indian all along. But modern chess was an European improvement. So Europeans made it better but it originated in India same like samosa is better Indian style but wasn't started here

[Real McCoy]

On 8/9/2020 at 3:14 AM, zen said:

I guess, it is good to own the "South Asian" brand too and tie it with India's. 

 

Also overseas, there is generally a community feeling among South Asians. When it comes to classifications, it is easier to manage categories - for e.g. West European (or European) vs. French, British, German, etc. 

 

 

I have a different take on this. We as Indians are just as diverse as the Europeans. The same way Norwegians relate to Italians is how Punjabis relate to Tamils. That's why this is called a subcontinent. Indians don't need a separate brand as South Asians. I have a question for all these non-Indian south Asians. Do they also partake in the South Asian brand when someone points to the negatives of this culture. Then everyone becomes Pakistani, Sri Lankan, Bangladeshi

[zen]

8 minutes ago, Real McCoy said:

I have a different take on this. We as Indians are just as diverse as the Europeans. The same way Norwegians relate to Italians is how Punjabis relate to Tamils. That's why this is called a subcontinent. Indians don't need a separate brand as South Asians. I have a question for all these non-Indian south Asians. Do they also partake in the South Asian brand when someone points to the negatives of this culture. Then everyone becomes Pakistani, Sri Lankan, Bangladeshi

Yes, there are differences. But they are still from South Asia, Western Europe, etc. 
 

For a Spanish and French, there is a difference b/w them, but someone in Japan or Australia can categories them as Europeans. Or if Spanish, French, and Italians for e.g. can form a West European/European group in Japan/Australia. 

Rather than be like oh we are French, not Europeans (and that too to those who do not even care) can turn into a low margin game. It can make sense for a French or Spanish to own the European brand by aligning it more with French or Spanish culture, so when the term European is mentioned people think more of Spanish or French or etc. 
 

Edited August 10, 2020 by zen

[Real McCoy]

3 minutes ago, zen said:

Yes, there are differences. But they are still from South Asia, Western Europe, etc. 
 

For a Spanish and French, there is a difference b/w them, but someone in Japan or Australia can categories them as Europeans. Or if Spanish, French, and Italians for e.g. can for a West European/European group in Japan/Australia. 
 

Then it would only follow that all Punjabis, Gujaratis, Bengalis, Tamils are called Indians not as South Asians

[zen]

13 minutes ago, Real McCoy said:

Then it would only follow that all Punjabis, Gujaratis, Bengalis, Tamils are called Indians not as South Asians

There can be a difference b/w what we want to call ourselves and how we are categorized in our community and by others 

 

Gujarati/Pujnabi/Tamil/Bengali can be Indians as well as South Asians

 

Among Gujaratis/Punjabis/Tamils, we can be Gujaratis/Punjabis/Tamils .... With Gujaratis and Punjabis/Tamils, we can be Indians .... With Indians, Sri Lankans, etc., we can be South Asians 

 

Conversely, we can be Gujaratis/Punjabis/Tamils among Indians, and Indians among South Asians 

 

Therefore, it can make sense to own various brands so it can align more with you 

[sandeep]

On 8/7/2020 at 1:14 AM, someone said:

Yes, Pakistanis often disguise themselves as Indians in overseas, and thus, want to grouped as South Asians.

 

Have seen it so many times.  Personal favorite was when I was buying a falafel from Bangladeshi vendor in NYC, and a Pakistani comes up to do the same, Bangla guy cordially asked her where she was from, and she said she was Indian, but I could see the hesitation flicker on her face, and I started instinctively laughing and then stopped myself, just an aborted snicker, nothing overly loud.  She went on to say something like 'In these modern times, we should not be looking to divide 'our people''.

[sandeep]

12 hours ago, First class said:

I never heard  a Pakistani disguise him/herself as Indian ??? 

Have seen it dozens of times.  

[someone]

1 hour ago, Real McCoy said:

I've heard of atleast one. he was an american born pakistani who used to say he was Indian American. I've heard of several bangladeshis who start "Indo-Pak" restaurants and one Pakistani who owned "indus" restaurant. Technically speaking Indus maybe in present day Pakistan but when Americans see Indus they think Indian. Why doesn't that guy start a restaurant marketing it as authentic pakistani cuisine I know some Afghans who don't do that and start promoting their own style

Exactly. I have also seen  people particular labors from Pakistani/Bangladesh falsely calling themselves as Indians. You just have to question them in details. And then businesses like restaurant workers, ticket agents falsely call themselves as Indians.

 

There is a "same same" concept in overseas as they want to be part of general goodwill enjoyed by Indian diaspora. Yet "different different" when it comes to regional politics. It's up to Indians to make their own identity.

 

There is no Chinese, or Japanese who calls themselves East Asians. But we are so confused, and gullible that we foolishly use South Asians or "desi" term.

Edited August 10, 2020 by someone

[Real McCoy]

1 hour ago, zen said:

There can be a difference b/w what we want to call ourselves and how we are categorized in our community and by others 

 

Gujarati/Pujnabi/Tamil/Bengali can be Indians as well as South Asians

 

Among Gujaratis/Punjabis/Tamils, we can be Gujaratis/Punjabis/Tamils .... With Gujaratis and Punjabis/Tamils, we can be Indians .... With Indians, Sri Lankans, etc., we can be South Asians 

 

Conversely, we can be Gujaratis/Punjabis/Tamils among Indians, and Indians among South Asians 

 

Therefore, it can make sense to own various brands so it can align more with you 

All of this is jibbi jabba. When calling ourselves Indian is a decent enough brand, why call yourself South Asian. When questioned about uncomfortable parts of Indian culture such as street defecation, all these non-Indian South Asians will be like "that is Indian so yucky we are not Indian". It is part of our generosity as someone mentioned that we allow ourselves to be termed as a collective group with the other nationalities. Indians are easy going and all these other countries want to be aligned with us because we are the biggest nation and popular among the lot.

I met one SL guy who doesn't want to be called Indian. Fair enough for him. Some of them feel it as misrepresenting their culture when called Indian. There are some Pakistanis, Bangladeshis and Nepalese like that too. Afghans somehow don't get called SA but somewhat get into Middle eastern or central asian group. Possibly because they kinda look different than the others. Same with "asian" featured Nepalese, Bangladdeshis, etc

[zen]

2 minutes ago, Real McCoy said:

All of this is jibbi jabba. When calling ourselves Indian is a decent enough brand, why call yourself South Asian. When questioned about uncomfortable parts of Indian culture such as street defecation, all these non-Indian South Asians will be like "that is Indian so yucky we are not Indian". It is part of our generosity as someone mentioned that we allow ourselves to be termed as a collective group with the other nationalities. Indians are easy going and all these other countries want to be aligned with us because we are the biggest nation and popular among the lot.

I met one SL guy who doesn't want to be called Indian. Fair enough for him. Some of them feel it as misrepresenting their culture when called Indian. There are some Pakistanis, Bangladeshis and Nepalese like that too. Afghans somehow don't get called SA but somewhat get into Middle eastern or central asian group. Possibly because they kinda look different than the others. Same with "asian" featured Nepalese, Bangladdeshis, etc

There is no this or that. As mentioned before, we can be both Indians (nation) and South Asians (region) 

 

Sri Lankan is not an Indian. He is Sri Lankan and a South Asian

[Real McCoy]

On a side note, most westerners think of Indians as those who party with Bhangra music, wear kurtas for wedding and other North Indian stuff. Watch this very funny guy called Hari Kondabolu. @maniac he is telugu fyi

 

 

[Real McCoy]

6 minutes ago, zen said:

There is no this or that. As mentioned before, we can be both Indians (nation) and South Asians (region) 

 

Sri Lankan is not an Indian. He is Sri Lankan and a South Asian

Ok let me break this down to you. I choose to represent MYSELF as Indian even though I'm also South Asian. Its your prerogative as to how you choose to represent yourself.

[zen]

Just now, Real McCoy said:

Ok let me break this down to you. I choose to represent MYSELF as Indian even though I'm also South Asian. Its your prerogative as to how you choose to represent yourself.

I agree, which is one of my points - we can be Gujaratis/Tamils/.... among Indians, Indian among nationalities, South Asian among regions 

 

Much like how an Emirati can be of an Arab Tribe in UAE, Emirati as well as Middle Eastern  

 

We can call ourselves Indians. We can be a part of the South Asian community. Others may see us as South Asians 

[coffee_rules]

19 hours ago, zen said:

I agree, which is one of my points - we can be Gujaratis/Tamils/.... among Indians, Indian among nationalities, South Asian among regions 

 

Much like how an Emirati can be of an Arab Tribe in UAE, Emirati as well as Middle Eastern  

 

We can call ourselves Indians. We can be a part of the South Asian community. Others may see us as South Asians 

There is no “South Asian” brand or community as you are making out to be. It is manufactured by those who look to be from Indian SC but don’t want to be clubbed under them. I have come across many people, organizations which call south Asian to mean Pakistani. Of course. There are many self loathing Indians who think there is a community that will unite them as South Asians and we have each other’s backs. No, when it comes to politics and religion , Sab kachara baahar aajeyaga . 

[zen]

6 minutes ago, coffee_rules said:

There is no “South Asian” brand or community as you are making out to be. It is manufactured by those who look to be from Indian SC but don’t want to be clubbed under them. I have come across many people, organizations which call south Asian to mean Pakistani. Of course. There are many self loathing Indians who think there is a community that will unite them as South Asians and we have each other’s backs. No, when it comes to politics and religion , Sab kachara baahar aajeyaga . 

Pakistanis (or Sri Lankans, Nepalese, etc., for that matter) are South Asians too so can tag themselves that if they prefer. 
 

Many do not even have a strong connection with subcon. At times, people can even feel more connected through religion. 
 

 

[Mariyam]

On 8/10/2020 at 8:53 AM, First class said:

I never heard  a Pakistani disguise him/herself as Indian ??? 

Well, among many others, there was this certain Ajmal Kasab. He tried to guise himself as an Indian with some religious threads. No one fell for that.

[coffee_rules]

Those who tag themselves as South Asian activists are Ambedkarite Dalits, Anti-Hindu Muslims like Rana Ayyub crypto converts and Pakistanis who support Kashmir Anti-CAA etc. It is a cesspool of anti-India and Hinduphobic people. @zen Do you want Indians to be part of this South Asian brand?

 

https://southasiantoday.com.au/article-8092-the-bosslist-5-incredible-south-asian-activists-you-must-know-details.aspx#

Edited August 11, 2020 by coffee_rules

[zen]

5 minutes ago, coffee_rules said:

Those who tag themselves as South Asian activists are Ambedkarite Dalits, Anti-Hindu Muslims like Rana Ayyub crypto converts and Pakistanis who support Kashmir Anti-CAA etc. It is a cesspool of anti-India and Hinduphobic people. @zen Do you want Indians to be part of this South Asian brand?

 

https://southasiantoday.com.au/article-8092-the-bosslist-5-incredible-south-asian-activists-you-must-know-details.aspx#

But they can do they same as “Indians” 

 

[coffee_rules]

10 minutes ago, zen said:

But they can do they same as “Indians” 

 

That is the filter, if you call yourself south Asian despite being Indian, you want to be identified and accepted more among the west. I use the same filter to view their intentions as against India. In general. 

[zen]

8 minutes ago, coffee_rules said:

That is the filter, if you call yourself south Asian despite being Indian, you want to be identified and accepted more among the west. I use the same filter to view their intentions as against India. In general. 

For a western POV, why would it matter if someone is a South Asian or an Indian? Nothing should change unless you are implying that South Asian brand is better than Indian. 
 

They could simply be using South Asian to target a larger audience including among Asian community for whatever they do. 

Edited August 11, 2020 by zen