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Sachin Tendulkar v Virat Kohli - who is better ODI batsman?

Who is better ODI batsman?  

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  1. 1. Who is better ODI batsman?



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4 hours ago, mani sha said:

Kohli the better test batter

sachin the better odi batter as he has more dynamic shots 

kohli will outlast Tendulkar due to emphasis on fitness 

 

in short 

 

Tendulkar - test match choker

kohli - odi choker 

SRT was far superior to Kohli in Tests as far as his technical abilities are concerned. In the very long period of 1992-2011 (apart from a few bad yrs), Tendu was arguably the only player in the world who could play in swinging, pacy & bouncy, and spinning conditions with consistency and with reasonable ease. Kohli fails miserably in quite a few series: Eng in 2014 and the home tests against Oz are two examples. He usually works very hard to counter his limitations, but the fact is that his game has many more chinks than Tendu.

 

To be sure, Tendu choked in several Test matches but Kohli is not blameless. If Chennai '98 counts as a choke then Kohli in Adelaide also "choked". Besides, in the only series win in SENA during his career (Oz tour), Kohli did very little of note - in the Tests we won or drew, Chepu and Pant-man did a lot more.

 

In my book, Sachin > Kohli in Tests, Kohli > Sachin in ODI bilaterals, Sachin >> Kohli in multi-nation tourneys, and Kohli > Sachin in T20s [the last, however, is not a fair comparison since we are comparing an old and career-end SRT].

 

So basically, apart from ODI bilaterals, Sachin is better than Kohli in my opinion. also have to factor in fielding (SRT better in close-in positions and kohli in ground fielding) and bowling (SRT light yrs ahead) to evaluate their total cricketing abilities.

Edited by Vijy
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2 hours ago, Cricspin said:

 Kohli better than Sachin in Tests.. Cant believe this sentiment.

 

Sachin faced the whos who of bowling greatness other than a few early ones .. Washim Akram, Waqar Yunis, Allan Donald, Shaun Pollock, Glen Mcgrath, Ambrose, Walsh, Murali, Warne .. Even the likes of Ntini, Vettori, Sohaib Akthar, Bret Lee, Mitchell Johnson, Jimmy Anderson, Vaas, Gillespie.. The list is too long. The grounds were different, Lot of Swing and Seam bowling, More hostile conditions.. All that along with handling the insane amount of expectations, media coverage, adulation with grace and dignity.. 

 

Sachin is a different level to Kohli .. more so in tests than ODI.

 

Sachin was extremely strong and fit too.. Played 23 years of International cricket.. Even to his retirement ran well between wickets, had a good arm from the boundary, good at slips or anywhere else on the field.. Not one to dive much like present guys but was solid all round fielder.. 

 

Kohli on the other hand sucks in the slips.. Agree he is probably one of the fittest to ever play the game but Sachin was fit enough..

 

If we do a poll about one guy to pick in a test team out of Sachin and kohli with both at their peak.. not sure how many around the world will pick Kohli...

Exaclty. Sachin at his prime massacred Shane Warne whereas Kohli gets out to lallus like Moeen Ai. As far as Batting skills, Peak Sachin was in another planet compared to Peak Kohli.

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Trolling aside, reason why Kohli gets into no man's land in certain conditions against certain lengths is it because his average backfoot game through off side. Kohli's trigger movement is very different from say Tendulkar, Dravid. When a left armer bowls he pitches on the middle general. Ball might come back or go away. But Kohli is not open-minded about this line of attack. Regardless of the line and length his tendency to walk across. If you look at Tendulkar in his prime, he would sit back and thrash through the point. How often you have seen Kohli smashing through point off the backfoot? Very rare.  He taps the ball to third man. But he is not a fierce cutter like Tendulkar. This is not a blemish. Why is he not considering the option of playing left hand seamers through off side or straight. He is fixated on playing through on side. 

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2 hours ago, vvvslaxman said:

Trolling aside, reason why Kohli gets into no man's land in certain conditions against certain lengths is it because his average backfoot game through off side. Kohli's trigger movement is very different from say Tendulkar, Dravid. When a left armer bowls he pitches on the middle general. Ball might come back or go away. But Kohli is not open-minded about this line of attack. Regardless of the line and length his tendency to walk across. If you look at Tendulkar in his prime, he would sit back and thrash through the point. How often you have seen Kohli smashing through point off the backfoot? Very rare.  He taps the ball to third man. But he is not a fierce cutter like Tendulkar. This is not a blemish. Why is he not considering the option of playing left hand seamers through off side or straight. He is fixated on playing through on side. 

Kohli does not have a backfoot game.

Edited by rkt.india
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7 hours ago, mani sha said:

Kohli the better test batter

sachin the better odi batter as he has more dynamic shots 

kohli will outlast Tendulkar due to emphasis on fitness 

 

in short 

 

Tendulkar - test match choker

kohli - odi choker 

Bhaai kohli choked many times in run chases in test too

2 chases in SA

2 chases in England

1 chase against Srilanka

This is on my top of my mind

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4 hours ago, Vijy said:

SRT was far superior to Kohli in Tests as far as his technical abilities are concerned. In the very long period of 1992-2011 (apart from a few bad yrs), Tendu was arguably the only player in the world who could play in swinging, pacy & bouncy, and spinning conditions with consistency and with reasonable ease. Kohli fails miserably in quite a few series: Eng in 2014 and the home tests against Oz are two examples. He usually works very hard to counter his limitations, but the fact is that his game has many more chinks than Tendu.

 

To be sure, Tendu choked in several Test matches but Kohli is not blameless. If Chennai '98 counts as a choke then Kohli in Adelaide also "choked". Besides, in the only series win in SENA during his career (Oz tour), Kohli did very little of note - in the Tests we won or drew, Chepu and Pant-man did a lot more.

 

In my book, Sachin > Kohli in Tests, Kohli > Sachin in ODI bilaterals, Sachin >> Kohli in multi-nation tourneys, and Kohli > Sachin in T20s [the last, however, is not a fair comparison since we are comparing an old and career-end SRT].

 

So basically, apart from ODI bilaterals, Sachin is better than Kohli in my opinion. also have to factor in fielding (SRT better in close-in positions and kohli in ground fielding) and bowling (SRT light yrs ahead) to evaluate their total cricketing abilities.

Adelaide was not a choke. How can you scoring 100 chasing 360 in second innings a choke. 360 are not chased ever day. Choke is when target is easy and you lose from a winning position. We were never in winning position at Adelaide.  It was Kohli's innings that brought us close but that too daunting a task on a wearing pitch as they had to score quickly.

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2 minutes ago, sergio04 said:

Bhaai kohli choked many times in run chases in test too

2 chases in SA

2 chases in England

1 chase against Srilanka

This is on my top of my mind

Test chases are different. Cannot term failing to chase in test a choke. Choke is when you lose from a winning position. 

Edited by rkt.india
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9 hours ago, mani sha said:

Kohli the better test batter

sachin the better odi batter as he has more dynamic shots 

kohli will outlast Tendulkar due to emphasis on fitness 

 

in short 

 

Tendulkar - test match choker

kohli - odi choker 

yeah ...Sachin with   13534 runs(still a larger sample size than 2nd placed Ponting)   @59.35 avg:   in a phase  between 29 jan 1993 and 14 apr 2011  was an inferior  test batsman  than Kohli with a mere almost  6000 runs @53.75  avg:. That too facing lots of bowlers in <25 avg: category and with  more rounded avg:s in all countries he played in !!!! Hope you are in your normal senses.

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8 hours ago, Cricspin said:

 Kohli better than Sachin in Tests.. Cant believe this sentiment.

 

Sachin faced the whos who of bowling greatness other than a few early ones .. Washim Akram, Waqar Yunis, Allan Donald, Shaun Pollock, Glen Mcgrath, Ambrose, Walsh, Murali, Warne .. Even the likes of Ntini, Vettori, Sohaib Akthar, Bret Lee, Mitchell Johnson, Jimmy Anderson, Vaas, Gillespie.. The list is too long. The grounds were different, Lot of Swing and Seam bowling, More hostile conditions.. All that along with handling the insane amount of expectations, media coverage, adulation with grace and dignity.. 

 

Sachin is a different level to Kohli .. more so in tests than ODI.

 

Sachin was extremely strong and fit too.. Played 23 years of International cricket.. Even to his retirement ran well between wickets, had a good arm from the boundary, good at slips or anywhere else on the field.. Not one to dive much like present guys but was solid all round fielder.. 

 

Kohli on the other hand sucks in the slips.. Agree he is probably one of the fittest to ever play the game but Sachin was fit enough..

 

If we do a poll about one guy to pick in a test team out of Sachin and kohli with both at their peak.. not sure how many around the world will pick Kohli...

Kohli performance versus England and Australia in those countries is something I didn’t see much from Sachin

 

i am 39 years old and watched Sachin in his first tour of england till his last tour - Sachin was never at ease against inswing and forget last innings - he couldn’t be counted on to chase 

 

he was best at home and outside home he was good in Australia , avg in South Africa and ok in England in tests 

 

Kohli has evolved into a very good percentage run machine -  to give u an example , he would play out saqlain while scoring off Rest of pak bowlers if he were in place of Sachin in the Chennai test .

 

regarding the quality of opposition - yes Sachin faced those and india lost - we started winning when a vvs and Dravid combined together to thwart the Aussie juggernaut . Sachin performance prior to that was ok - his stats are inflated due to the 100s he scored at home when the hapless England etc toured india in the Azar era . 

 

I recall the Barbados test ( Kuruvilla got 5 wickets ) , I recall the first series against South Africa . I recall the 1992 tour of Australia ( his 100 was fabulous but Sehwag showed later you could get a 196 - and then Kohli almost chased down an impossible total in Aussie in his first tour ) 

i can say that sachins best innings actually came towards the end of his career against South Africa when he scored 150 something on a crazy pitch - he killed his ego and left everything outside off ) 

 

kohli has learnt to kill his ego in tests pretty early on and hence he scores in every condition and pitch now . The quality of bowling is perhaps better now - all teams have 3-4 140 k bowlers who are fit . Sachin faced decent attacks but didn’t score match winning knocks abroad but kohli - although the lesser batsman has played more Match winning knocks in tests . Remember he doesn’t have a dravid or a Laxman on the other end - when pujara rose in Aussie - we won but kohli contributed very well in Aussie 

 

regarding the one day - I will take Sachin over kohli anyday as you need an ego in odi to outscore . Percentage cricket only gets u to the semis but you have to take chances - u will remember Tendulkar reverse sweeping , going down the pitch and wanting to open - kohli is happy to play percentage cricket but gets knocked out either due to his poor captaincy or due to some opposition player like West Indies 6 hitters or  fakhar who will grab the game and knock u out - a tendulkar had a seventh gear but kohli stops at 4 th gear 

 

 

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40 minutes ago, rtmohanlal said:

yeah ...Sachin with   13534 runs(still a larger sample size than 2nd placed Ponting)   @59.35 avg:   in a phase  between 29 jan 1993 and 14 apr 2011  was an inferior  test batsman  than Kohli with a mere almost  6000 runs @53.75  avg:. That too facing lots of bowlers in <25 avg: category and with  more rounded avg:s in all countries he played in !!!! Hope you are in your normal senses.

Yupp kohli kills his ego in tests , scores runs in 4 th innings and in general has played on bowler friendly tracks then Sachin played in his first 8 years - no more flat decks , no more 130 k bowlers like Dominic cork around . All teams right now have strong to very strong bowling attacks at home - South Africa , Australia even West Indies has very good attacks . 

 

Finally , I say it again - Sachin was more talented and gifted . Kohli is more calculated and can swallow his ego - hence he has scored against all countries while Sachin would always fall in tests - note that in top 50 great test innings , none of Sachin’s hundreds came ! 

 

In tests , Kohli is the champion , but one dayers sachin was and will remain god 

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12 minutes ago, mani sha said:

Kohli performance versus England and Australia in those countries is something I didn’t see much from Sachin

 

i am 39 years old and watched Sachin in his first tour of england till his last tour - Sachin was never at ease against inswing and forget last innings - he couldn’t be counted on to chase 

 

he was best at home and outside home he was good in Australia , avg in South Africa and ok in England in tests 

 

Kohli has evolved into a very good percentage run machine -  to give u an example , he would play out saqlain while scoring off Rest of pak bowlers if he were in place of Sachin in the Chennai test .

 

regarding the quality of opposition - yes Sachin faced those and india lost - we started winning when a vvs and Dravid combined together to thwart the Aussie juggernaut . Sachin performance prior to that was ok - his stats are inflated due to the 100s he scored at home when the hapless England etc toured india in the Azar era . 

 

I recall the Barbados test ( Kuruvilla got 5 wickets ) , I recall the first series against South Africa . I recall the 1992 tour of Australia ( his 100 was fabulous but Sehwag showed later you could get a 196 - and then Kohli almost chased down an impossible total in Aussie in his first tour ) 

i can say that sachins best innings actually came towards the end of his career against South Africa when he scored 150 something on a crazy pitch - he killed his ego and left everything outside off ) 

 

kohli has learnt to kill his ego in tests pretty early on and hence he scores in every condition and pitch now . The quality of bowling is perhaps better now - all teams have 3-4 140 k bowlers who are fit . Sachin faced decent attacks but didn’t score match winning knocks abroad but kohli - although the lesser batsman has played more Match winning knocks in tests . Remember he doesn’t have a dravid or a Laxman on the other end - when pujara rose in Aussie - we won but kohli contributed very well in Aussie 

 

regarding the one day - I will take Sachin over kohli anyday as you need an ego in odi to outscore . Percentage cricket only gets u to the semis but you have to take chances - u will remember Tendulkar reverse sweeping , going down the pitch and wanting to open - kohli is happy to play percentage cricket but gets knocked out either due to his poor captaincy or due to some opposition player like West Indies 6 hitters or  fakhar who will grab the game and knock u out - a tendulkar had a seventh gear but kohli stops at 4 th gear 

 

 

Bhaai when did kohli perform in India's Test win in SENA.

 

Edited by sergio04
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13 hours ago, Cricspin said:

This comparison will end nowhere.  While Kohli overtakes Sachin in stats, Just doesn't match the aura of Sachin. Also opposition Quality, Rules, Playing conditions, Team India situation have all changed from the time Tendulkar played bulk of his matches in.

 

I See so many players with 45+ (Even 50+) average today as if 45 is nothing. In those days (90's) 35+ was a good average and 40 was excellent. Anything close to 45 or above was exceptional and rare. Also Tendulkar was widely considered a dominating batsman with a strike rate higher than most of his peers.

 

Players like Shikhar Dhawan, faf du Plessis, Quinton De Kock have better average and strike rate than Sachin in ODI. While these are good players, they re no legends.

That's because batsmanship has become better many folds in LOIs with the advent of T20s. Sachin was great in his era. Regarding comparing with Dhawan, dekock etc. Compare them to best players of current era.

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3 hours ago, sergio04 said:

Bhaai kohli choked many times in run chases in test too

2 chases in SA

2 chases in England

1 chase against Srilanka

This is on my top of my mind

He didn’t choke in those games - games were almost lost but he fought and fought 

 

its because of Kohli we won in Australia as he has brought this never say die attitude . Tendulkar used to be out when u needed him to make a 100 - like a 4 th innings chase . 

 

Tendulkar was was also lucky to have dravid lax man ganguly and sehwag gambhir combo towards the latter half of his career - Kohli doesn’t have any of those in tests . Pujara is decent but not as close to dravid . And our no 6 is Bihari! 

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1 minute ago, mani sha said:

He didn’t choke in those games - games were almost lost but he fought and fought 

 

its because of Kohli we won in Australia as he has brought this never say die attitude . Tendulkar used to be out when u needed him to make a 100 - like a 4 th innings chase . 

 

Tendulkar was was also lucky to have dravid lax man ganguly and sehwag gambhir combo towards the latter half of his career - Kohli doesn’t have any of those in tests . Pujara is decent but not as close to dravid . And our no 6 is Bihari! 

Where did he fight and fight in these matches?

 

 

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9 minutes ago, mani sha said:

He didn’t choke in those games - games were almost lost but he fought and fought 

 

its because of Kohli we won in Australia as he has brought this never say die attitude . Tendulkar used to be out when u needed him to make a 100 - like a 4 th innings chase . 

 

Tendulkar was was also lucky to have dravid lax man ganguly and sehwag gambhir combo towards the latter half of his career - Kohli doesn’t have any of those in tests . Pujara is decent but not as close to dravid . And our no 6 is Bihari! 

You can say kohli is lucky to have such a fantastic fast bowling line up in our history

that if our Batsman perform they will lead India to victory.

So there are more chance that runs made by kohli will end up in winning cause due to our best bowling line up in history.

If we had this kind of bowling line up in 2000, we would have won many overseas test series in 2000.

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