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Playing 2 spinners “overseas” a concern


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This win will mask the fact, India are playing an imbalanced bowling attack under the guise of template. Jadeja should not play as a lone spinner. This is 5 match series & with all 20 wickets expected from seamers only, they will be ground to dust by the time next test finishes.

This gimmick of template has to be binned & get back your best spinner in the XI.

Pujara ka tou pata nahi but Rahane will not score again till the 5th test match, so he should be benched ideally.

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3 hours ago, SK_IH said:

This win will mask the fact, India are playing an imbalanced bowling attack under the guise of template. Jadeja should not play as a lone spinner. This is 5 match series & with all 20 wickets expected from seamers only, they will be ground to dust by the time next test finishes.

This gimmick of template has to be binned & get back your best spinner in the XI.

Pujara ka tou pata nahi but Rahane will not score again till the 5th test match, so he should be benched ideally.

I don't even want a spinner in these conditions. Four seamers are a must. The way people overrate Ashwin here is just amazing. Guy could not catch a break on a slightly flatter surface in Chennai in the first test and people think he can win us games in England on these unhelpful pitches.

Edited by rkt.india
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53 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

I don't even want a spinner in these conditions. Four seamers are a must. The way people overrate Ashwin here is just amazing. Guy could not catch a break on a slightly flatter surface in Chennai in the first think and people think he can win us games in England on these unhelpful pitches.

It's about adding variety in the attack as well as sharing work load. Jadeja is playing as a defacto batsman, play him as a full fledged batsman.

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On 8/16/2021 at 10:43 PM, rkt.india said:

I don't even want a spinner in these conditions. Four seamers are a must. The way people overrate Ashwin here is just amazing. Guy could not catch a break on a slightly flatter surface in Chennai in the first test and people think he can win us games in England on these unhelpful pitches.

He was coming back post-injury (had played 1 test perhaps?) if I remember correctly. A better indicator of his form was the WTC, where he bowled well. No need to over hype ashwin as some do, but no need to downplay him that much either. There are quite a few lefties in Eng team and their techniques against spin are very iffy. having 1 spinner and 4 pacers is the best option here, and ashwin could take more wickets than jaddu.

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On 8/17/2021 at 8:13 AM, rkt.india said:

I don't even want a spinner in these conditions. Four seamers are a must. The way people overrate Ashwin here is just amazing. Guy could not catch a break on a slightly flatter surface in Chennai in the first test and people think he can win us games in England on these unhelpful pitches.

 

Bumrah couldnt catch a break on WTC greentop.It happens.Ashwin picked 9 wickets in that Chennai Test btw,

 

Even in WTC he picked 4 and was arguably our best bowler for number of overs bowled.Shami was pathetic 2nd innings too.And that was most spin unfriendly pitch

 

Any other pitch will actually suit him more.And NZ batting is far better than Stokes less England.

 

 

 

 

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5 hours ago, Lord said:

 

Bumrah couldnt catch a break on WTC greentop.It happens.Ashwin picked 9 wickets in that Chennai Test btw,

 

Even in WTC he picked 4 and was arguably our best bowler for number of overs bowled.Shami was pathetic 2nd innings too.And that was most spin unfriendly pitch

 

Any other pitch will actually suit him more.And NZ batting is far better than Stokes less England.

 

 

 

 

I was talking about first innings. Pitches get worse later in India, helpful for spinners. WTC was a fluke.

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No concern when the spinner is of the calibre of Ashwin and quick being Ishant.

 

Jaddu makes it to the XI just for his batting. 

 

WTC F wasn't lost because of 2 spinners. It was lost because of third class batting unit (we collapsed under the blazing sun on day 6, remember?), brain-dead captaincy, lack of new ball bowling skills, misfiring Bumrah and one of the 3 quicks being an out of sorts, unfit Ishant.

 

Heck I'll say Ashwin was underbowled in the final for no reason. Had he opened the bowling in both innings, match could have been different. The 2 Kiwi opening partnerships were so vital in that low scoring contest. 2 LHBs, Latham being a lifelong bunny of Ashwin, Conway never having faced that level of spin in his short career, our quicks not particularly good with new ball, Dukes not having much lateral movement in first 10 odd overs....a surprise why people aren't talking about Kohli's absurd decision making there. Also this...

r/Cricket - MOST WICKETS WITH THE NEW BALL IN TEST CRICKET (since R Ashwin's debut)

 

Edited by Gollum
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1 hour ago, Gollum said:

No concern when the spinner is of the calibre of Ashwin and quick being Ishant.

 

Jaddu makes it to the XI just for his batting. 

 

WTC F wasn't lost because of 2 spinners. It was lost because of third class batting unit (we collapsed under the blazing sun on day 6, remember?), brain-dead captaincy, lack of new ball bowling skills, misfiring Bumrah and one of the 3 quicks being an out of sorts, unfit Ishant.

 

Heck I'll say Ashwin was underbowled in the final for no reason. Had he opened the bowling in both innings, match could have been different. The 2 Kiwi opening partnerships were so vital in that low scoring contest. 2 LHBs, Latham being a lifelong bunny of Ashwin, Conway never having faced that level of spin in his short career, our quicks not particularly good with new ball, Dukes not having much lateral movement in first 10 odd overs....a surprise why people aren't talking about Kohli's absurd decision making there. Also this...

r/Cricket - MOST WICKETS WITH THE NEW BALL IN TEST CRICKET (since R Ashwin's debut)

 

 

their was a further breakdown of this stat which im not finding that showed it in overseas condition since ppl said it was mostly going to be on indian pitches but it turned out he was better then all indian fast bowlers to overseas with new ball or may be 2nd

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6 minutes ago, MultiB48 said:

If he is so good how come his avg abroad is so high ,he is good when there is turn on the first day due to moisture ,as the pitch hardens he struggles.Having said that with the Duke ball he should be in with a chance.

 

Since 2019 his SENA average is 25.78

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Just now, MultiB48 said:

statistically they are better lol,anyway we have seen them bowl and know their strengths and weakness , ratings becomes important if we are picking guys without watching them play.

 

watching them play its clear Ishant isn't fit enough and Jaddu gets no help while Ashwin got turn even in WTC final on a seamer friendly track

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5 hours ago, Gollum said:

No concern when the spinner is of the calibre of Ashwin and quick being Ishant.

 

Jaddu makes it to the XI just for his batting. 

 

WTC F wasn't lost because of 2 spinners. It was lost because of third class batting unit (we collapsed under the blazing sun on day 6, remember?), brain-dead captaincy, lack of new ball bowling skills, misfiring Bumrah and one of the 3 quicks being an out of sorts, unfit Ishant.

 

Heck I'll say Ashwin was underbowled in the final for no reason. Had he opened the bowling in both innings, match could have been different. The 2 Kiwi opening partnerships were so vital in that low scoring contest. 2 LHBs, Latham being a lifelong bunny of Ashwin, Conway never having faced that level of spin in his short career, our quicks not particularly good with new ball, Dukes not having much lateral movement in first 10 odd overs....a surprise why people aren't talking about Kohli's absurd decision making there. Also this...

r/Cricket - MOST WICKETS WITH THE NEW BALL IN TEST CRICKET (since R Ashwin's debut)

 

agree with what you wrote. lots of brain-dead captaincy - big surprise.

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4 hours ago, MultiB48 said:

If he is so good how come his avg abroad is so high ,he is good when there is turn on the first day due to moisture ,as the pitch hardens he struggles.Having said that with the Duke ball he should be in with a chance.

Everybody peaks or matures at a different time. Present Ashwin is what Kumble was in 2003-04. 

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Just now, Gollum said:

Missed you during Olympics man, we could have had fun discussions/analysis about our hockey teams. 

yeah, sorry mate. busy times in that period. but I was watching all the matches. no hyperbole when I say that this was probably THE highlight of my sports watching career, more so than all the cricket WC wins, etc.

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7 hours ago, MultiB48 said:

If he is so good how come his avg abroad is so high ,he is good when there is turn on the first day due to moisture ,as the pitch hardens he struggles.Having said that with the Duke ball he should be in with a chance.

  • coz spinners take time to get adapted to foreign conditions. Kumble became a force overseas after 2003 tour down under which like after 10 yrs of of him playing
  • They have to adapt to 2 diff balls kookabura n duke which does help them unlike it helps seamers
  • during his 1st cycle mostly even our batsman were struggling to put runs on board so dhoni a defensive captain even became more defensive
  • our seamers also were struggling so he mostly got set batsman
  • not to forget the amount catches we have dropped in last decade or so , he wud have had a 7fer in Sa if not for dropped catches
  • He did bowl well in Aus this tour and its no place for finger spinners
  • He was also rotated with jaddu a lot which never let him settle
  • his own fitness didnt help

 

Its easy to make conclusion that he failed but their are several factors involved and every bowler will have struggles somewhere. Someone like a lyon has struggled in UAE out of all places.

 

We kept playing Ishant who basically struggled everywhere for the longest time and take Pujara who also have struggled overseas apart from Aus , yet we kept playing them. If that kind of consistency was given to Ashwin overseas he wud hve had better numbers but understandable coz spinners role becomes secondary overseas

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On 8/26/2021 at 7:47 PM, Gollum said:

No concern when the spinner is of the calibre of Ashwin and quick being Ishant.

 

Jaddu makes it to the XI just for his batting. 

 

WTC F wasn't lost because of 2 spinners. It was lost because of third class batting unit (we collapsed under the blazing sun on day 6, remember?), brain-dead captaincy, lack of new ball bowling skills, misfiring Bumrah and one of the 3 quicks being an out of sorts, unfit Ishant.

 

Heck I'll say Ashwin was underbowled in the final for no reason. Had he opened the bowling in both innings, match could have been different. The 2 Kiwi opening partnerships were so vital in that low scoring contest. 2 LHBs, Latham being a lifelong bunny of Ashwin, Conway never having faced that level of spin in his short career, our quicks not particularly good with new ball, Dukes not having much lateral movement in first 10 odd overs....a surprise why people aren't talking about Kohli's absurd decision making there. Also this...

r/Cricket - MOST WICKETS WITH THE NEW BALL IN TEST CRICKET (since R Ashwin's debut)

 

 

 

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