Indian Hockey

[Vijy]

@Gollum --> anything that stands out to you in last few months vis-a-vis hockey?

[Gollum]

6 minutes ago, Vijy said:

@Gollum --> anything that stands out to you in last few months vis-a-vis hockey?

The thing that stands out most is improvement in French team. They kinda remind me of 2007-08 Belgium, and we know how that turned out in the end.

 

Even in the junior WC French team impressed me the most. 

 

Watch out for them, don't be misguided by their place in the FIH Pro League table. Watch their games, even their junior team's games/playing style, their colts play modern hockey the way it is supposed to be played. Even in seniors they have scalps of Ind, Arg recently, and have run other top European sides close just missing out in shootouts a couple of times. 

 

More confused about Asia, till last month I genuinely thought Japan was the most improved side in the world. But they didn't fare well in Asia Cup, suddenly South Korea who I thought was finished took home gold. Malaysia a force to reckon with as usual, inconvenient opponent for India as is tradition.

 

Can't say much about India since we play different teams every tournament. Depth is decent (way behind Bel/Aus sadly) but I wish we play close to our best team more often, we are experimenting too much even in Pro League. Beyond a point too much chopping/changing isn't beneficial in a team sport.

 

Disappointed in our junior team, not because of the results but because they were playing outdated hockey, like our 90s/00s batches. Quite concerning. 

[Stuge]

Beats Mighty Aussies after 2016 . Indian hockey team.is definitely improving.

 

https://youtu.be/ryuqE1AmDDw

Edited November 30, 2022 by Stuge

[VikasKashyap]

Saw the matches. French worked out of their skin to beat else India were better. delighted to see these young men have arrived at SF.

I think Hockey League is a working effectively.

 

 

 

The Sports Giant

https://thesportsgiant.com/hockey/

[LordPrabhzy]

Just read an article about various State associations for Hockey lamenting that there is no interest in hockey to justify them spending crores to upgrade hockey infrastructure and stadiums- at the back of Odisha monopolising all tournaments.

 

I mean what's the reason a stadium cant be built in Punjab to match Odisha? its the hub of Indian hockey where majority of the players come from so the audience will match that of Odisha. @Gollum

[Vijy]

20 hours ago, LordPrabhzy said:

Just read an article about various State associations for Hockey lamenting that there is no interest in hockey to justify them spending crores to upgrade hockey infrastructure and stadiums- at the back of Odisha monopolising all tournaments.

 

I mean what's the reason a stadium cant be built in Punjab to match Odisha? its the hub of Indian hockey where majority of the players come from so the audience will match that of Odisha. @Gollum

hockey requires more investment of resources. I am hopeful that our olympic run will have some knock-on effects down the line even if not immediately.

[Vijy]

On 6/18/2022 at 7:50 AM, Gollum said:

The thing that stands out most is improvement in French team. They kinda remind me of 2007-08 Belgium, and we know how that turned out in the end.

 

Even in the junior WC French team impressed me the most. 

 

Watch out for them, don't be misguided by their place in the FIH Pro League table. Watch their games, even their junior team's games/playing style, their colts play modern hockey the way it is supposed to be played. Even in seniors they have scalps of Ind, Arg recently, and have run other top European sides close just missing out in shootouts a couple of times. 

 

More confused about Asia, till last month I genuinely thought Japan was the most improved side in the world. But they didn't fare well in Asia Cup, suddenly South Korea who I thought was finished took home gold. Malaysia a force to reckon with as usual, inconvenient opponent for India as is tradition.

 

Can't say much about India since we play different teams every tournament. Depth is decent (way behind Bel/Aus sadly) but I wish we play close to our best team more often, we are experimenting too much even in Pro League. Beyond a point too much chopping/changing isn't beneficial in a team sport.

 

Disappointed in our junior team, not because of the results but because they were playing outdated hockey, like our 90s/00s batches. Quite concerning. 

france is the type of country to go about preparing for sports systematically. the overhaul of french footer from 80s is what led to them making 4 WC finals in last 25 years and winning 2 of them - perhaps the most "consistent" team in footer in last 25 years.

 

a similar path may arise for hockey

[Gollum]

On 12/23/2022 at 5:18 AM, LordPrabhzy said:

Just read an article about various State associations for Hockey lamenting that there is no interest in hockey to justify them spending crores to upgrade hockey infrastructure and stadiums- at the back of Odisha monopolising all tournaments.

 

I mean what's the reason a stadium cant be built in Punjab to match Odisha? its the hub of Indian hockey where majority of the players come from so the audience will match that of Odisha. @Gollum

Yeah Punjab is one of the nerve centres of Indian hockey, though must be said Odisha too has been churning out world class players especially in the last 20-25 years. Few other areas as well.

 

Credit must go to the Odisha government who have invested heavily in hockey recently, the state government has also been sponsoring both our men's and women's teams for a while (contract till late 2020s), for such a poor state they were in news for constructing some 20 astroturfs in a backward district.....I am not sure if Bengaluru, Chennai, Mumbai, Kolkata, Pune etc. have 20 astro turfs. Also investing in Naxal hit areas, involving the tribals, ex-Naxals etc in growing the game. Naveen Patnaik was a hockey player in his younger days, hence his personal involvement I guess. What stops the Punjab govt from investing in the sport?

 

Credit must be given to Odisha govt and its people. Look at the fans filling up stadiums in Kalinga even in non-India matches, look at he buzz, passion, excitement there any time it hosts India games, even Delhi CWG hockey games saw many sparse crowds. Most experts believe that the hockey infrastructure in Odisha is the best in the country, and with them launching successful bids to host so many international events, even junior level ones, they must be doing something right. Other state govts, hockey federations, tycoons can do similar work, but they aren't. If every state adopts one sport each like how Odisha has done for Indian hockey, imagine what level we can scale in a decade's time!!!

 

If other state federations are lamenting that there isn't enough interest what the hell are they doing? Imagine getting outpaced by a poor state with 1000 other more pressing problems...rural/tribal areas in Odisha see hockey tournaments with 100s of participating teams, Patnaik has involved surrender Naxals, hosted events in red corridor districts. What steps have Punjab, Karnataka, TN taken to build interest in the sport?

 

 

Edited December 25, 2022 by Gollum

[Vijy]

7 hours ago, Gollum said:

Yeah Punjab is one of the nerve centres of Indian hockey, though must be said Odisha too has been churning out world class players especially in the last 20-25 years. Few other areas as well.

 

Credit must go to the Odisha government who have invested heavily in hockey recently, the state government has also been sponsoring both our men's and women's teams for a while (contract till late 2020s), for such a poor state they were in news for constructing some 20 astroturfs in a backward district.....I am not sure if Bengaluru, Chennai, Mumbai, Kolkata, Pune etc. have 20 astro turfs. Also investing in Naxal hit areas, involving the tribals, ex-Naxals etc in growing the game. Naveen Patnaik was a hockey player in his younger days, hence his personal involvement I guess. What stops the Punjab govt from investing in the sport?

 

Credit must be given to Odisha govt and its people. Look at the fans filling up stadiums in Kalinga even in non-India matches, look at he buzz, passion, excitement there any time it hosts India games, even Delhi CWG hockey games saw many sparse crowds. Most experts believe that the hockey infrastructure in Odisha is the best in the country, and with them launching successful bids to host so many international events, even junior level ones, they must be doing something right. Other state govts, hockey federations, tycoons can do similar work, but they aren't. If every state adopts one sport each like how Odisha has done for Indian hockey, imagine what level we can scale in a decade's time!!!

 

If other state federations are lamenting that there isn't enough interest what the hell are they doing? Imagine getting outpaced by a poor state with 1000 other more pressing problems...rural/tribal areas in Odisha see hockey tournaments with 100s of participating teams, Patnaik has involved surrender Naxals, hosted events in red corridor districts. What steps have Punjab, Karnataka, TN taken to build interest in the sport?

 

 

odisha has shown the way how indian hockey could become a serious force in world hockey IMO if other states scale accordingly

[Khota]

On 12/25/2022 at 10:37 AM, Vijy said:

odisha has shown the way how indian hockey could become a serious force in world hockey IMO if other states scale accordingly

Indian hockey is alive because of Odisha, Punjab is behind.

[LordPrabhzy]

Apparentley 800cr was spent by the Odisha gov to renovate stadiums for the world cup and a total of 1000 cr was spent on getting ready for this World Cup.

 

Lets hope India wins the world cup so if the result is massive fan following for Hockey and support, this can translate into funding to improve infrastructure in the rest of the country so Hockey can become a country wide sport to rival cricket in terms of TV money and sponsors. 

[LordPrabhzy]

https://www.republicworld.com/sports-news/hockey-news/fih-confirms-birsa-munda-stadium-is-worlds-largest-all-seater-hockey-specific-arena-calls-it-a-work-of-art-articleshow.html

 

Praise from FIH about the new stadium in Rourkela... when money is spent, the result is there for everyone to see. We can literally replicate what we did in cricket with hockey- make world class stadiums, get billion dollar sponsor deals, tv rights and watch the rest of the european hockey powerhouses fall in line as they did in cricket. We literally have a 1 billion+ audience to tap into for Hockey.

[LordPrabhzy]

@Gollum are there any instances of Indian hockey players playing for clubs in Belgium/Netherlands?

 

If not, is it that Indians dont want to go play abroad or the European clubs dont want Indian players?

[LordPrabhzy]

Even despite Hockey being an amateur sport in Europe and players having to study/work while playing for National Team and Clubs they are still better than Indian hockey players

 

The German team arrived in Bhubaneswar only three days before the Champions Trophy began. They had had a five-day camp back home before coming here, hardly enough for a major tournament.  “The club indoor league finished on November 23; it's a commitment we can't afford to miss,” explained German captain Moritz Furste.

Hockey is an amateur sport. Unlike in India, where it's generally a means to get jobs, the life of an average hockey player in Europe doesn't revolve around the game alone. When one isn't playing, he's studying... to get a job because hockey doesn't Pay enough.

“Most hockey players study or work, sometimes both, alongside playing,” says Christopher Ruhr of Germany. The 20-year-old adds that sometimes they even have to study during tournaments. “Sometimes we go back from a tournament and write exams within days.” In India, hockey players can get jobs in banks or Railways. Not in Germany, though. “Hockey helps in building contacts which helps in getting jobs,” said the 2013 FIH young player of the year. Germany has a strong national league and most of these players play for different clubs. Do the clubs pay enough? “For somebody my age, when you are studying — yes. But it's not enough to support a family.” Doesn't the work and studies affect training? “Yes, we don't get as much time for training as the players in India.”

 

Laurent Toussaint, a hockey journalist from Belgium where the situation is similar, explains further. “In Belgium, players train with the national team on Mondays and Tuesdays. On the other weekdays they train with their clubs and play the league during the weekends,” says Toussaint, who works for the French language newspaper Le Soir. “In a year they have two training camps during the off season - around three weeks in winters and around a month or more after the season ends in April. Before major events, World Cup or Olympics, they have a two-month camp. ”Toussaint adds that along with salaries from the clubs, players also get money from Belgium's hockey federation. But it is not enough. “Most players in Belgium quit playing around the age of 26-28, so the team is usually very young. Very few players make a living from hockey.”

 

Tom Boon is one such example. The 24-year-old plays for Bloemendaal, one of the most successful Dutch clubs. He recently became the costliest player in Hockey India League, bought by Dabang Mumbai for a whopping price of $103,000. Initially the federation denied him the permission but he told the officials he needed the money. Other players have to study and find work. Jerome Truyens, 27, who captained Belgium at the 2012 Olympics and has missed the Champions Trophy due to an injury, works for a financial group back home. The current captain, John-John Dohmen, 26, is in his final year of studying Osteopathy at University of Brussels. The players who can get into the bigger clubs in Netherlands or Germany do well for themselves. “Belgium doesn't have very big clubs. In Netherlands, it's a bit better. There is scope for endorsement for the more famous players. Some are hired as brand ambassadors by big companies,” adds Toussaint. So what is the inspiration to play hockey? “To win the Olympics gold,” pat comes the answer from a smiling Ruhr. 

[Gollum]

2 hours ago, LordPrabhzy said:

@Gollum are there any instances of Indian hockey players playing for clubs in Belgium/Netherlands?

 

If not, is it that Indians dont want to go play abroad or the European clubs dont want Indian players?

Yes several Indian players have links with Euro clubs. Don't know exact situation post pandemic but before that even some of our uncapped players were there in Dutch and Belgium leagues.

[Vijy]

On 1/16/2023 at 7:56 AM, Gollum said:

Yes several Indian players have links with Euro clubs. Don't know exact situation post pandemic but before that even some of our uncapped players were there in Dutch and Belgium leagues.

a pity that this thread is so dead, barring the above bot

[deathmonger]

FIH Pro League going on now. India 1-0 up vs Netherlands

 

India has 8 matches this month, 2 each against top teams.

 

Winner gets automatic WC qualification.

[Gollum]

First two quarters good, big drop in level after that. 

[Gollum]

Missing Sreejesh big time. Huge boots to fill there. Both Olympic bronzes owe a lot to him, and I say this without undermining the other players or coaches. ATG keeper can make a good side a legit trophy contender, such is the impact. 

[deathmonger]

2 hours ago, Gollum said:

Missing Sreejesh big time. Huge boots to fill there. Both Olympic bronzes owe a lot to him, and I say this without undermining the other players or coaches. ATG keeper can make a good side a legit trophy contender, such is the impact. 

Yeah. He was a wall.

 

Let's see how the rest of the matches go.