Impressions about Ishan Kishen

[Majestic]

On 2/23/2022 at 7:29 AM, Vijy said:

none are truly all-format now. Ro and Ko are a bit too tuk-tuk for T20. KL has not yet mastered Tests. Pant is the closest at the moment.

Rohit has been doing fine in T20s off late, scoring at a very good rate and consistent also.

 

Kohli has also been consistent and although not as quick run scorer but still fine enough anchor.

 

KL may not have mastered tests but he is still the second best opener in the country in tests and to be honest he will do better if he bats at 4-5 in Tests. 

 

These three are integral part of all formats and not going anywhere.

[Ankit_sharma03]

11 minutes ago, ShoonyaSifar said:

Sorry, go back to your OP and look at your own smileys. The intention clearly is to mock a young player by cherry picking stats. I'm countering that. You're free to disagree and continue to mock him.

 

I see that you've covered your tracks by saying SL is a weak side.

smiley at ppl who think he with so many limitation is better then pant or can replace dhawan in ODI 

so im not mocking the player but the ppl with such genius ideas

 

SL is a strong side ??? 

[Lord]

hes fine

[Pollack]

5 hours ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

smiley at ppl who think he with so many limitation is better then pant or can replace dhawan in ODI 

so im not mocking the player but the ppl with such genius ideas

 

SL is a strong side ??? 

Tbh I haven't read anyone here saying Ishan is better than Pant. He may/may not replace Dhawan in ODIs.He deserves chances.

Edited February 24, 2022 by Pollack

[Ankit_sharma03]

4 minutes ago, Pollack said:

Tbh I haven't read anyone here saying Ishan is better than Pant. He may/may not replace Dhawan in ODIs.He deserves chances.

 

 

the one i found but many have said when pant fails that ishan is better then him (as grass is greener another side syndrome)

 

Yes he deserves a chance n getting one, im talking about his limitation n how he cant replace guys like dhawan or pant . Give him chance but dnt talk about replacing guys who have much better and are frankly better 

[Adamant]

In Australian conditions he isn't the ideal candidates. 

He can surely improve but as of now he isn't good enough. 

 

[rkt.india]

47 minutes ago, Adamant said:

In Australian conditions he isn't the ideal candidates. 

He can surely improve but as of now he isn't good enough. 

 

He will be fine at places where ball comes on to the bat like Australia. Doesn't swing or spin. Just good pitches to bat on.

[Adamant]

16 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

He will be fine at places where ball comes on to the bat like Australia. Doesn't swing or spin. Just good pitches to bat on.

I don't think he has a good game against bounce. 

But let's see how he goes. 

[ShoonyaSifar]

8 hours ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

smiley at ppl who think he with so many limitation is better then pant or can replace dhawan in ODI 

so im not mocking the player but the ppl with such genius ideas

 

SL is a strong side ??? 

Give the same level of guaranteed spot with a defined role (non-risky start irrespective of match situation) that Dhawan has to any promising youngster. I'm willing to bet they'll outperform him.

 

In fact, do that for the top 3 positions and youngsters will outperform these guys. 

 

Pant is a special talent (always was) and has repeatedly forced his way back into the team through his grit and determination but even he needed a supportive captain to turn around his almost derailed career. That's what assurance about spot and role clarity can do to youngsters.

 

About SL being a strong side, no they are not but it was funny to see you hedge your beta by saying Kishan might do well vs SL. If he is weak vs SLA and off-spin as you wrote, SL should be a team he should struggle against.

Edited February 24, 2022 by ShoonyaSifar

[maniac]

1 hour ago, ShoonyaSifar said:

Give the same level of guaranteed spot with a defined role (non-risky start irrespective of match situation) that Dhawan has to any promising youngster. I'm willing to bet they'll outperform him.

 

 

Why are we even comparing a guy on his last legs to a youngster starting  out?

 

having said that against quality bowling I can still see Dhawan having better returns than Kishen based on a very small sample size.

 

That doesn’t translate to play Dhawan but

 

since it is Kishen vs Dhawan, I would like to beleive a peak Dhawan can play quality bowling better than Kishen.

 

However against a mediocre side maybe Kishen will win you the game in 12 overs and Dhawan might get the job done in 16-18.

 

I like Ishan right from u-19 days but he hasn’t increased his range of strokeplay on the flip side Pant seems to have too much range which is not required at times.

 

 

[ShoonyaSifar]

8 minutes ago, maniac said:

Why are we even comparing a guy on his last legs to a youngster starting  out?

 

having said that against quality bowling I can still see Dhawan having better returns than Kishen based on a very small sample size.

 

That doesn’t translate to play Dhawan but

 

since it is Kishen vs Dhawan, I would like to beleive a peak Dhawan can play quality bowling better than Kishen.

Sometimes posts answer themselves.

 

In any case, your question on Kishan vs Dhawan be directed to the OP. My point is give these youngsters the same security and the role of tuk tuk, they'll outperform these seniors. In fact take out even the tuk tuk part, just give them secure places and a proper run.

[Ankit_sharma03]

16 minutes ago, maniac said:

Why are we even comparing a guy on his last legs to a youngster starting  out?

 

having said that against quality bowling I can still see Dhawan having better returns than Kishen based on a very small sample size.

 

That doesn’t translate to play Dhawan but

 

since it is Kishen vs Dhawan, I would like to beleive a peak Dhawan can play quality bowling better than Kishen.

 

However against a mediocre side maybe Kishen will win you the game in 12 overs and Dhawan might get the job done in 16-18.

 

I like Ishan right from u-19 days but he hasn’t increased his range of strokeplay on the flip side Pant seems to have too much range which is not required at times.

 

 

 

3 minutes ago, ShoonyaSifar said:

Sometimes posts answer themselves.

 

In any case, your question on Kishan vs Dhawan be directed to the OP. My point is give these youngsters the same security and the role of tuk tuk, they'll outperform these seniors. In fact take out even the tuk tuk part, just give them secure places and a proper run.

Dhawan vs kishen cant be a blank comparison

 

• in t20 obv kishen coz dhawan was never a good t20 player - kishen has all the right qualities
• in odi (which is why i added dhawan coz he plays only ODI ) - obv dhawan , kishen lacks adaptability and in a 50 over game u cant be so one dimensional. Even today he was struggling against new ball when chameera n kumara bowled 2 overs but then got a breather when karunaratne bowled pies at low pace. Diff in ODI cricket is bowlers wnt be taken of after 2 overs they ll keep coming at till 5 over spell sometimes even more. Ishan just tries to hit the ball hard and doesnt try adjust on any kind of challenge.  

 

@ShoonyaSifar- role security will be given but at the end players need to work on their areas on their own. Dhawan has lived half his career on edge 

 

[Ankit_sharma03]

22 minutes ago, maniac said:

I like Ishan right from u-19 days but he hasn’t increased his range of strokeplay on the flip side Pant seems to have too much range which is not required at times.

he has enough range but u need to adjust acc to pitches, conditions n better bowlers .

His current range is more then peak dhawan but no point if u just wanna hit everything so hard be the pitch is chennai or basin reserve 

[coffee_rules]

Useless after 6 overs or PP

[Ankit_sharma03]

1 hour ago, ShoonyaSifar said:

About SL being a strong side, no they are not but it was funny to see you hedge your beta by saying Kishan might do well vs SL. If he is weak vs SLA and off-spin as you wrote, SL should be a team he should struggle against.

yea it was comman sense , that why he was my fanatsy captain today 

 

• SL just had 2 good bowlers so for sure they wud have maintained the pressure (for 2 overs he looked troubled)
• Even those under pressure will crumble which happened at death n they got blasted by even iyer 
• SL had no spinner to trouble him

 

 

[vvvslaxman]

Rohit's idea is to develop him as a pinch hitters probably. If his selection means and Dhawan being out of T20 i am all for it. KL Rahul at 5 is more valuable. 

[Ankit_sharma03]

 

1 hour ago, ShoonyaSifar said:

About SL being a strong side, no they are not but it was funny to see you hedge your beta by saying Kishan might do well vs SL. If he is weak vs SLA and off-spin as you wrote, SL should be a team he should struggle against.

 

May be u need to read properly , this is what annoys...adhe post padh ke reply krna . Also im not saying he is weak ...his numbers are screaming that he is weak 

Also what good spinner did lanka have

11 hours ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

he has s/r of

Against off spin - 

67 in international 

99 in non international t20

 

against SLA

70 in international

129 in IPL

 

Clear struggle , he has only bashed leggies in which Someone like Tahir not at his peak has troubled him a lot. Noticed if you bowl fast n flat to him he has issues, but if u flight in air then only he hits ...t20 will be fast n flat mostly like chase did

jayawickramsingha is a test bowler mostly who flights 

Chase bowls fast n flat and so does stahir 

Edited February 24, 2022 by Ankit_sharma03

[Ankit_sharma03]

Just now, vvvslaxman said:

Rohit's idea is to develop him as a pinch hitters probably. If his selection means and Dhawan being out of T20 i am all for it. KL Rahul at 5 is more valuable. 

dhawan is already out of t20 , why are u bringing him

He wasnt even part of last t20 WC

[Ankit_sharma03]

1 hour ago, Adamant said:

I don't think he has a good game against bounce. 

But let's see how he goes. 

pace bounce seedha aayega to koi problem nhin but agar fass ke aayega ya extra kick or movement hoga pitch men tab problem hogi usi

Like MCG has been spongy , dnt know currently whats the scene in t20 if they use drop in ...in case it is spongy then he can be in problem 

[ShoonyaSifar]

18 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

 

Dhawan vs kishen cant be a blank comparison

 

• in t20 obv kishen coz dhawan was never a good t20 player - kishen has all the right qualities
• in odi (which is why i added dhawan coz he plays only ODI ) - obv dhawan , kishen lacks adaptability and in a 50 over game u cant be so one dimensional. Even today he was struggling against new ball when chameera n kumara bowled 2 overs but then got a breather when karunaratne bowled pies at low pace. Diff in ODI cricket is bowlers wnt be taken of after 2 overs they ll keep coming at till 5 over spell sometimes even more. Ishan just tries to hit the ball hard and doesnt try adjust on any kind of challenge.  

 

@ShoonyaSifar- role security will be given but at the end players need to work on their areas on their own. Dhawan has lived half his career on edge 

 

Dhawan has lived half his career on edge? LOL The guy played 50 68 T20Is for India despite sucking at it except for a 15 month period. In ODIs, he has had a free run since 2013 not having to bat outside the top 2 a single time. Plus the very fact that his own career SR in last 3-4 years is a good 7-8 points below how he was doing prior to that while the ODI games has moved forward is the reason why we need to move on from him. Interestingly the average in the same period is 8-9 points above the earlier average. Lower SR and higher average, I don't want to say much.

 

As for Kishan's adaptability in 50 over game, he's hardly played for India. I wouldn't judge him yet. Has a good enough List A average,so nothing wrong in giving him opportunities. If he does well in T20Is, he will cary the same confidence to ODIs too.

Edited February 24, 2022 by ShoonyaSifar