Bumrah is becoming a blunt spearhead and needs a break

[Jay]

1 hour ago, Adamant said:

I don't know why Indians take pride in the fact that IPL is the richest league, dude they ain't filling your pockets. 

 

I watch cricket for enjoying the game, not to see how much some guy is earning. 

I mean the likes of Ishan Koshan are getting 14 crores, the guy has so many technical issues that he is a tragedy waiting to happen at the big stage. 

 

Pandya's stats are way worse than Yusuf Pathan, I never saw Pathan being hyped so much. We basically are producing a lot of average cricketers amd that has given us some false sense of superiority, if you have 140 cr population then definitely you are gonna produce a lot of cricketers, the problem is quality not quantity. 

 

I mean Pandya does not have a 50 in t20is (behas mat karna, bahut mauke milein hain). 

Zero hundreds in odis and somehow he is the second coming of Lance Klusener. 

No doubt about it. IpL is secondary but non test players may often choose to play IPL over bilaterals. 

 

Tests1)

Odi world cup2)

Then ipl/T20 world cup more or less same

Bilaterals. 

 

Seriously t20 WC is a joke. The last t20 WC in u.a.e had the lowest viewership.

Edited April 23, 2022 by Jay

[Adamant]

42 minutes ago, Jay said:

 

 

Seriously t20 WC is a joke. The last t20 WC in u.a.e had the lowest viewership.

That's bcoz India crashed out. 

Ind vs Pak viewership was excellent. 

Honestly people watch IPL for sure, but you would be lying if you said winning t20 world cup doesn't matter way more than any IPL. 

Edited April 23, 2022 by Adamant

[rollingstoned]

3 minutes ago, Adamant said:

That's bcoz India crashed out. 

Ind vs Pak viewership was excellent. 

IND v pak games will get eyeballs regardless of tournament or format. 

[rkt.india]

4 hours ago, Adamant said:

Looks like my friend abive forgot to mention Dale Steyn's views - 

 

Dale Steyn - Ipl is a paid vacation. 

 

Ipl is nowhere near international quality, this is evident by the fact that our IPL superstars get regularly embarrassed at the grand stage. 

Including some so called allrounders who haven't yet scored a  single half century in t20is. 

Steyn said that in 2008 and read his full statement and you will know what he actually. Taking it out of context.

 

https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/i-was-an-idiot-steyn-apologises-for-ipl-comments-355549

[Jay]

38 minutes ago, Adamant said:

That's bcoz India crashed out. 

Ind vs Pak viewership was excellent. 

Honestly people watch IPL for sure, but you would be lying if you said winning t20 world cup doesn't matter way more than any IPL. 

For me I don't give 2 shits about IPl. But players care about it. Indian players were burnt out after IPl. Sure some foreigners played like hazlewood. But he miss3d half the season iirc. India also played test series before that too. 

 

As for t20 WC vs IPL. That's questionable tbh. Did we even care about 2007 WC win? It's a joke format. 

It's a total lottery. Like toss drama based WC last time. 

[Mariyam]

5 hours ago, Adamant said:

Ab devilliers is a serial failure in t20i cricket and world cup, so definitely he is gonna rate IPL. 

 

The problem is that IPL is a tournament where 10 Indian teams fight to win a cup, now whoever wins the trophy is gonna stay in India lol. Where's the loyalty aspect?  Where's the pride? 

 

 

 

That is profound.

 

I finally understood what the problem with the IPL is.

What do you suggest we do? Keep the trophy in Madagascar?

Send it with Space X to inculcate a sense of loyalty. Pride through fomo!

[Mariyam]

1 hour ago, Jay said:

For me I don't give 2 shits about IPl. But players care about it. Indian players were burnt out after IPl. Sure some foreigners played like hazlewood. But he miss3d half the season iirc. India also played test series before that too. 

 

As for t20 WC vs IPL. That's questionable tbh. Did we even care about 2007 WC win? It's a joke format. 

It's a total lottery. Like toss drama based WC last time. 

And who does?

 

The happenings in the Indian Plastics Institute are hardly what one would call enthralling. 

[Adamant]

3 hours ago, rkt.india said:

Steyn said that in 2008 and read his full statement and you will know what he actually. Taking it out of context.

 

https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/i-was-an-idiot-steyn-apologises-for-ipl-comments-355549

If I don't take it out of context then I won't be able to prove my point. 

[vvvslaxman]

8 hours ago, Jay said:

For me I don't give 2 shits about IPl. But players care about it. Indian players were burnt out after IPl. Sure some foreigners played like hazlewood. But he miss3d half the season iirc. India also played test series before that too. 

 

As for t20 WC vs IPL. That's questionable tbh. Did we even care about 2007 WC win? It's a joke format. 

It's a total lottery. Like toss drama based WC last time. 

 

It is better they restrict T20 to leagues. International T20 is not taken seriously outside world T20.  Watson was asked about performance of Austrlaia after they were "buttlered" in the first round.  He said "Australians very rarely play as a team, so they don't gel well in the world T20 matches".  guess what they ended up winning the world T20 after that statement.   

 

Your performances matters at the auction table. Difference between a millionaire and 25000$. It is comical to suggest players don't take it seriously.  No different from EPL.  Warner one bad season .Let go. 

[zen]

6 hours ago, Mariyam said:

That is profound.

 

I finally understood what the problem with the IPL is.

What do you suggest we do? Keep the trophy in Madagascar?

Send it with Space X to inculcate a sense of loyalty. Pride through fomo!

Don’t puncture the ballon of these folks - it is fun to read such post (if they lose confidence they will not post such things) 

Edited April 23, 2022 by zen

[Vijy]

11 hours ago, Mariyam said:

That is profound.

 

I finally understood what the problem with the IPL is.

What do you suggest we do? Keep the trophy in Madagascar?

Send it with Space X to inculcate a sense of loyalty. Pride through fomo!

bury it in antarctica and have a scavenger hunt. whichever team unearths the trophy first gets to keep it.

[Adamant]

13 hours ago, zen said:

Don’t puncture the ballon of these folks - it is fun to read such post (if they lose confidence they will not post such things) 

Good to know that it's fun to read my post. 

[R!TTER]

23 hours ago, Jay said:

Tests1)

Only if we are beating Oz/SA away, Eng are crap & NZ total home track bullies!

 

  

13 hours ago, vvvslaxman said:

guess what they ended up winning the world T20 after that statement.   

Did he forget to mention the tosses won by Oz? Even Finch acknowledged the crucial toss factor!

 

Edited April 24, 2022 by R!TTER

[sandeep]

On 4/23/2022 at 12:35 AM, zen said:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Wonder what a per game, or per game minute chart would show.  NFL, NBA have so many 'regular season' games - Baseball has more than 150 games per team!! 

[sandeep]

On 4/23/2022 at 1:48 AM, Adamant said:

I mean the likes of Ishan Koshan are getting 14 crores, the guy has so many technical issues that he is a tragedy waiting to happen at the big stage. 

 

Pandya's stats are way worse than Yusuf Pathan, I never saw Pathan being hyped so much. We basically are producing a lot of average cricketers amd that has given us some false sense of superiority, if you have 140 cr population then definitely you are gonna produce a lot of cricketers, the problem is quality not quantity. 

 

 

utter dross. 

 

Kishan's technical issues in your subjective eyes are as relevant to his performance as the color of my underwear.   Since you are hyping INTNL (sic) cricket as some sort of gold standard, here are Kishan's "INTNL" numbers in T20 cricket - Average of 32, SR of 120 - quite respectable.  Compare that to say, a Matthew Wade - who has played "INTNL" T20 cricket for a reasonably strong Australian team and considered good enough to have been selected 60 times, his stats are average of 21.9 and SR of 129.   Is Australia a shyte team for selecting such a "technically limited" player? 

 

Wade is not a good comparison? Let's take Johnny Bairstow - "INTNL" T20 average of 26.44, SR 135.   This guy is getting what 7 8 crores in IPL?  Of course an Indian alternative to him, one that doesn't use up an overseas slot would command a higher price.

 

And IPL prices are not some sort of accurate reflector of player value anyway.  Auction markets will occasionally overprice a certain skillset at a given point in time - so many examples like Krishnappa Goutham,  or a Pawan Negi.  Guys like these getting big $ doesn't automatically mean that the IPL rates them as top shelf cricketers.  Its a speculative market that is going to overvalue players at times. But thats a great thing for the game. Having a salary structure that errs on the side of playing players more, rather than undervaluing them - like other structures do, is a very progressive and intrinsically more "fair" than any other system. 
 

And that salary structure is a function of the IPL's market size, and 'disposable' budget for players - not some sort of marker of player quality.  You have primary cricket stats for that purpose - the right kind though - analytical, dispassionate, objective - ones that 'make sense' from a math/stat perspective, and also a cricket specific perspective.

 

On 4/23/2022 at 1:48 AM, Adamant said:

I mean Pandya does not have a 50 in t20is (behas mat karna, bahut mauke milein hain). 

Zero hundreds in odis and somehow he is the second coming of Lance Klusener

 

So batsmen who haven't scored a century in ODIs are not considered good enough - even if they are batting in the lower order?  The arbitrary yardstick of wanting "50" in T20I is in the same vein.  A great demonstration of a singular lack of understanding of white ball cricket.

 

By the way, the great Lance Klusener never scored an ODI 100 against Australia, England, India, Pakistan, West Indies or even Sri Lanka.  That's over a span of 121 ODIs.  Does scoring a century against Zimbabwe in Kenya somehow make him a great player?   

 

Oh and btw, Klusener NEVER scored an ODI 100 unless he was batting in the 6th over of an ODI or earlier.  

 

And if he hadn't scored that 100, does it mean he wasn't a good ODI player?

 

Coming up with infantile litmus tests for rating a player's value doesn't get more asinine than these arbitrary individual score milestones.  They are fabricated.  A score of 99 is equally important in intrinsic value to a team as a score of a 100.  The latter becomes a talking point only due to tradition and a recognition marker of a player's performance.  Doesn't somehow turn into an objective value-marker of a player.  

 

But hey, some fans are overly fixated on such individual arbitrary markers - it only demonstrates their 'below average' ability to understand the sport objectively!

 

;P

 

But again, thats ok! In a country of "140 cr", you are "definitely gonna produce" a lot of cricket 'fans', problem is quality not quantity!.

 

Edited May 15, 2022 by sandeep

[Vijy]

13 hours ago, sandeep said:

 

utter dross. 

 

Kishan's technical issues in your subjective eyes are as relevant to his performance as the color of my underwear.   Since you are hyping INTNL (sic) cricket as some sort of gold standard, here are Kishan's "INTNL" numbers in T20 cricket - Average of 32, SR of 120 - quite respectable.  Compare that to say, a Matthew Wade - who has played "INTNL" T20 cricket for a reasonably strong Australian team and considered good enough to have been selected 60 times, his stats are average of 21.9 and SR of 129.   Is Australia a shyte team for selecting such a "technically limited" player? 

 

Wade is not a good comparison? Let's take Johnny Bairstow - "INTNL" T20 average of 26.44, SR 135.   This guy is getting what 7 8 crores in IPL?  Of course an Indian alternative to him, one that doesn't use up an overseas slot would command a higher price.

 

And IPL prices are not some sort of accurate reflector of player value anyway.  Auction markets will occasionally overprice a certain skillset at a given point in time - so many examples like Krishnappa Goutham,  or a Pawan Negi.  Guys like these getting big $ doesn't automatically mean that the IPL rates them as top shelf cricketers.  Its a speculative market that is going to overvalue players at times. But thats a great thing for the game. Having a salary structure that errs on the side of playing players more, rather than undervaluing them - like other structures do, is a very progressive and intrinsically more "fair" than any other system. 
 

And that salary structure is a function of the IPL's market size, and 'disposable' budget for players - not some sort of marker of player quality.  You have primary cricket stats for that purpose - the right kind though - analytical, dispassionate, objective - ones that 'make sense' from a math/stat perspective, and also a cricket specific perspective.

 

 

So batsmen who haven't scored a century in ODIs are not considered good enough - even if they are batting in the lower order?  The arbitrary yardstick of wanting "50" in T20I is in the same vein.  A great demonstration of a singular lack of understanding of white ball cricket.

 

By the way, the great Lance Klusener never scored an ODI 100 against Australia, England, India, Pakistan, West Indies or even Sri Lanka.  That's over a span of 121 ODIs.  Does scoring a century against Zimbabwe in Kenya somehow make him a great player?   

 

Oh and btw, Klusener NEVER scored an ODI 100 unless he was batting in the 6th over of an ODI or earlier.  

 

And if he hadn't scored that 100, does it mean he wasn't a good ODI player?

 

Coming up with infantile litmus tests for rating a player's value doesn't get more asinine than these arbitrary individual score milestones.  They are fabricated.  A score of 99 is equally important in intrinsic value to a team as a score of a 100.  The latter becomes a talking point only due to tradition and a recognition marker of a player's performance.  Doesn't somehow turn into an objective value-marker of a player.  

 

But hey, some fans are overly fixated on such individual arbitrary markers - it only demonstrates their 'below average' ability to understand the sport objectively!

 

;P

 

But again, thats ok! In a country of "140 cr", you are "definitely gonna produce" a lot of cricket 'fans', problem is quality not quantity!.

 

this fixation on personal milestones is partly what leads many posters to overrate certain players and underrate others.

 

In Tests, milestones are still quasi-meaningful because a 5-fer or 100 can serve as a reasonable proxy for which team won, etc. however, in T20s, a 28(10) could very well be the diff between winning and losing, and yet it would not register as a 50+ score (let alone 100+). it's amusing to see people judge T20s with the same old-fogey mindset that they judge tests with.

[asterix]

This guy shouldn’t play any LOIs. Can play test matches. He’s a BIG LOSER in LOIs. He’ll be one of the main culprits when India crashes out of T20WC.

 

Not a single MI losers be selected in upcoming key tournaments. Most of them don’t LOSERS and have ZERO pride in winning for India. 
 

Tine to groom young bowlers like Umran in place of this loser.

[Adamant]

On 5/15/2022 at 10:43 PM, sandeep said:

 

utter dross. 

 

Kishan's technical issues in your subjective eyes are as relevant to his performance as the color of my underwear.   Since you are hyping INTNL (sic) cricket as some sort of gold standard, here are Kishan's "INTNL" numbers in T20 cricket - Average of 32, SR of 120 - quite respectable.  Compare that to say, a Matthew Wade - who has played "INTNL" T20 cricket for a reasonably strong Australian team and considered good enough to have been selected 60 times, his stats are average of 21.9 and SR of 129.   Is Australia a shyte team for selecting such a "technically limited" player? 

 

Wade is not a good comparison? Let's take Johnny Bairstow - "INTNL" T20 average of 26.44, SR 135.   This guy is getting what 7 8 crores in IPL?  Of course an Indian alternative to him, one that doesn't use up an overseas slot would command a higher price.

 

And IPL prices are not some sort of accurate reflector of player value anyway.  Auction markets will occasionally overprice a certain skillset at a given point in time - so many examples like Krishnappa Goutham,  or a Pawan Negi.  Guys like these getting big $ doesn't automatically mean that the IPL rates them as top shelf cricketers.  Its a speculative market that is going to overvalue players at times. But thats a great thing for the game. Having a salary structure that errs on the side of playing players more, rather than undervaluing them - like other structures do, is a very progressive and intrinsically more "fair" than any other system. 
 

And that salary structure is a function of the IPL's market size, and 'disposable' budget for players - not some sort of marker of player quality.  You have primary cricket stats for that purpose - the right kind though - analytical, dispassionate, objective - ones that 'make sense' from a math/stat perspective, and also a cricket specific perspective.

 

 

So batsmen who haven't scored a century in ODIs are not considered good enough - even if they are batting in the lower order?  The arbitrary yardstick of wanting "50" in T20I is in the same vein.  A great demonstration of a singular lack of understanding of white ball cricket.

 

By the way, the great Lance Klusener never scored an ODI 100 against Australia, England, India, Pakistan, West Indies or even Sri Lanka.  That's over a span of 121 ODIs.  Does scoring a century against Zimbabwe in Kenya somehow make him a great player?   

 

Oh and btw, Klusener NEVER scored an ODI 100 unless he was batting in the 6th over of an ODI or earlier.

And if he hadn't scored that 100, does it mean he wasn't a good ODI player?

 

Coming up with infantile litmus tests for rating a player's value doesn't get more asinine than these arbitrary individual score milestones.  They are fabricated.  A score of 99 is equally important in intrinsic value to a team as a score of a 100.  The latter becomes a talking point only due to tradition and a recognition marker of a player's performance.  Doesn't somehow turn into an objective value-marker of a player.  

 

But hey, some fans are overly fixated on such individual arbitrary markers - it only demonstrates their 'below average' ability to understand the sport objectively!

 

;P

 

But again, thats ok! In a country of "140 cr", you are "definitely gonna produce" a lot of cricket 'fans', problem is quality not quantity!.

 

Oh here comes another one pf those "STATS DON'T MATTER FANS, ONE OFF PERFORMANCES DO" fans

Let's not even talk about Lance Klusener, your boy is'nt even at Yusuf Pathan level as of now.

Just tell me at which position did Pandya play for MI where he got multiple 50s ? Why can't he do the same in international cricket? Kya hua flat 60m boundary nahi mili, Indian trundlers nahi mile? 

As for ODIS- lance Klusener's stats read - 
Batting average 41 str rate 90(and that is in the 90s) - when your Pandu comes close to these stats in ODIS , quote me again, I won't even care if he gets a hundred or not.
Now combine this with the fact that klusener was a great bowler too who averaged 29 in ODIS and had 6 5 wicket hauls, lol at even thinking of mentioning Klusener, do these things with other pandya fans who don't have an iq above 100, don't try this with me.
The greats of the game win matches consistently for their countries as a result of which they have great stats too unlike your Pandya who has already given up on the toughest format of the game.

In t20is Pandya has done nothing apart from a couple of 50s against Daniel Sams, Sean Abbott level pace attack of Aus. I challenge you to tell us about the great t20I performances of Pandya, Lets not even get into stats, show me the perfromances. His stats are bad (helped by C grade aussie bowling) and so are his performances.
You are prjecting Pandya as some sort of mythical match winner, in reality he has done zilch .


Lets not even talk about kishan, the guy is the ultimate FTB, will do zilch in internationals until he completely revamps his batting style.

Some of us have the eyes to spot talent , it comes naturally, sadly you are not one of those.
 

[Adamant]

On 5/16/2022 at 12:44 PM, Vijy said:

this fixation on personal milestones is partly what leads many posters to overrate certain players and underrate others.

 

In Tests, milestones are still quasi-meaningful because a 5-fer or 100 can serve as a reasonable proxy for which team won, etc. however, in T20s, a 28(10) could very well be the diff between winning and losing, and yet it would not register as a 50+ score (let alone 100+). it's amusing to see people judge T20s with the same old-fogey mindset that they judge tests with.

How many 28(10) has Pandya made in t20is. 

Please don't try to deflect the topic, it's not just about lack of 50 but also lack of impact and performance. 

[Jay]

6 hours ago, asterix said:

This guy shouldn’t play any LOIs. Can play test matches. He’s a BIG LOSER in LOIs. He’ll be one of the main culprits when India crashes out of T20WC.

 

Not a single MI losers be selected in upcoming key tournaments. Most of them don’t LOSERS and have ZERO pride in winning for India. 
 

Tine to groom young bowlers like Umran in place of this loser.

Absolutely. If he plays LOI it should only be In death and middle phase. He is not needed honestly for LOI. Let him focus on tests like Cummins. Both are **** in LOI.