England Tour of South Africa

[nitinbwj]

Archer has returned to form as he single handedly prevents SA from 3-0 victory. 6 wickets from 9 overs and 40 runs. Took the important wicket of Klaasen when he was smashing everyone for fun. Moeen unkil got smashee, curran, topley, woakes everyone. A very good performance from Eng after 15-3.

[sage]

Hardik does not even have 1 century!

[rollingstoned]

2 hours ago, sage said:

Hardik does not even have 1 century!

He took 14 balls to get off the mark which has never happened before and still helped them score 350 odd. 

[LordPrabhzy]

3 hours ago, sage said:

Hardik does not even have 1 century!

he doesnt have a clue how to smash pacers-- all he does are cross bat shots

[putrevus]

3 hours ago, sage said:

Hardik does not even have 1 century!

It would be interesting to see if Hardik will ever score a 100 in odis

[spiritb2]

22 hours ago, putrevus said:

It would be interesting to see if Hardik will ever score a 100 in odis

 

Hardik is ready to play Maahi's role in ODI's too. Rohit needs to be careful. There's your answer. 

[sandeep]

On 2/2/2023 at 4:23 AM, sage said:

Hardik does not even have 1 century!

How many ODI innings has he batted at #4 or higher? or gotten to the crease before the 30th over?  Does anybody have these stats?   The first few years of his career he was kept down the order at #7 because he was the one guy who could help the stodgy Indian batting unit "catch up" at the death with some boundaries....

 

Edit:

 

Pandu has batted a grand total of 7 innings at #4 - and his stats at #4 are an average of 32 with a strike rate of 120.  The last time he got a chance to bat # 4 was 2019.  

 

wHy hE nO sCoRe CenTurY.  He nO guUd bAAtsmAn.

Edited February 6, 2023 by sandeep
added stats

[sandeep]

On 2/2/2023 at 8:05 AM, putrevus said:

It would be interesting to see if Hardik will ever score a 100 in odis

Only a matter of time - He's hardly gotten the chance to bat in the top 5 batting slots barely 10 times if that.  Yuvraj Singh - the apparent gold standard for the type of middle order batsman that is considered "good enough" - he took 70 ODIs, and close to 30 opportunities batting at #4 or 5, to finally score his first ODI century, against 2003 version of Bangladesh.   Given that Hardik's stats at #4 are average of 32 with SR of 120, in about 5-6 chances, it compares incredibly well to Yuvi.  

 

But the yardsticks are different when it comes to evaluating Hardik Pandya's batting in white ball cricket - especially for you.  That is abundantly clear.

[sandeep]

On 2/2/2023 at 7:47 AM, LordPrabhzy said:

he doesnt have a clue how to smash pacers-- all he does are cross bat shots

That is completely inaccurate.  There are plenty of highlights where he has hit straigh drives and cover drives for 4 and 6 against international pace attacks.  Australia both home and away in ODIs.  But hey, let's just make silly stuff up and pretend its true, why not.  

 

Edit: added a link to an example. 

 

He "only" scored 90 here, both times so what if they came in an ODI in Australian conditions, no century @putrevus - what a useless batsman.

 

 

 

Edited February 6, 2023 by sandeep

[speedracer]

11 minutes ago, sandeep said:

Only a matter of time - He's hardly gotten the chance to bat in the top 5 batting slots barely 10 times if that.  Yuvraj Singh - the apparent gold standard for the type of middle order batsman that is considered "good enough" - he took 70 ODIs, and close to 30 opportunities batting at #4 or 5, to finally score his first ODI century, against 2003 version of Bangladesh.   Given that Hardik's stats at #4 are average of 32 with SR of 120, in about 5-6 chances, it compares incredibly well to Yuvi.  

 

But the yardsticks are different when it comes to evaluating Hardik Pandya's batting in white ball cricket - especially for you.  That is abundantly clear.

Indian fans will never change. For me what's important is impact. Can he impact the game and help us win. If that means he scores 30 off 15 then I would take that over scoring a 100 in a losing or lost cause. 

 

Edited February 6, 2023 by speedracer

[sage]

32 minutes ago, sandeep said:

How many ODI innings has he batted at #4 or higher? or gotten to the crease before the 30th over?  Does anybody have these stats?   The first few years of his career he was kept down the order at #7 because he was the one guy who could help the stodgy Indian batting unit "catch up" at the death with some boundaries....

 

Edit:

 

Pandu has batted a grand total of 7 innings at #4 - and his stats at #4 are an average of 32 with a strike rate of 120.  The last time he got a chance to bat # 4 was 2019.  

 

wHy hE nO sCoRe CenTurY.  He nO guUd bAAtsmAn.

Why are you so obsessed with batting at #4? The stat was for #5 and BELOW. 

[sandeep]

4 minutes ago, speedracer said:

Indian fans will never change. For me what's important is impact. Can he impact the game and help us win. If that means he scores 30 off 15 then I would take that over scoring a 100 in a losing or lost cause. 

 

Its the wrong mindset - and its got nothing to do with Pandya.  I mean, Pandu is what he is - a player that's a value-add to the team, with his own set of strengths and weaknesses.  But blokes like this guy just keep harping on imaginary issues - "why doesn't he have ODI century" - its just so stupid.   

[sandeep]

4 minutes ago, sage said:

Why are you so obsessed with batting at #4? The stat was for #5 and BELOW. 

Because its relevant.  Scoring ODI centuries is a function of how early in the innings batsmen get the opportunity to bat, and how frequently they get that opportunity.  I don't really care about batting position in white ball cricket - its increasingly about which over of the game you walk in at - but thats not a stat that's searchable on the internet.

 

 Let's take Jos Buttler - do we agree on his quality? I mean, I'm not saying Pandu is as good as Jos Buttler.  He's not.  But even Jos, in the first 4 years of his career -across 52 games batting at #6 or lower, had just one century in a failed chase at home against Sri Lanka.   So if in 52 chances Buttler has one garbage time century in a lost chase against SL, and Pandu has a couple of 90s, is that really that much worse?  And If you compare his average and strike rate to Pandu, they compare just fine.  https://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/player/308967.html?batting_positionmin1=6;batting_positionval1=batting_position;class=2;filter=advanced;orderby=default;spanmax1=13+mar+2015;spanval1=span;template=results;type=batting

 

And Buttler btw, is a contender for the best ODI batsman on the circuit right now - I am by no means saying Pandu is anywhere near as good enough.   But the guy has barely played 70 innings, barely 10 games where he's had the chance to come in at #4 or #5.  And has already put up a fistful of 70 plus cores, a couple of 90s - in clutch situations.  I'm asserting that he has the ability to put up ODI centuries given a large enough sample set. 

 

But India does not need ODI "centuries" from Pandu - what we want is a consistent run producer with a high Strike rate.  And there's absolutely no denying that his batting output has tailed off a bit in the last year or so.  Its also clear he's consciously changing his approach of being more "solid" instead of being aggressive - an approach that I don't necessarily agree with, but I also don't think its some sort of terrible choice.  Let's see how it plays out.  

[speedracer]

1 hour ago, sandeep said:

Its the wrong mindset - and its got nothing to do with Pandya.  I mean, Pandu is what he is - a player that's a value-add to the team, with his own set of strengths and weaknesses.  But blokes like this guy just keep harping on imaginary issues - "why doesn't he have ODI century" - its just so stupid.   

Same logic some use to assess ashwin as well. He doesn't have a single 5fer in sena for example. So what? He helped us win in bgt. He helped us draw in England although with lesser impact. Sure he bowled filth and stunk in s.africa and we can ridicule him for that but impact will always matter more. 

 

Freaking ajaz useless Patel got a 10fer in a match losing cause. Does it mean anything ? 

[sandeep]

30 minutes ago, speedracer said:

Same logic some use to assess ashwin as well. He doesn't have a single 5fer in sena for example. So what? He helped us win in bgt. He helped us draw in England although with lesser impact. Sure he bowled filth and stunk in s.africa and we can ridicule him for that but impact will always matter more. 

 

Freaking ajaz useless Patel got a 10fer in a match losing cause. Does it mean anything ? 

The way Ashwin clean bowled Alistair Cook in England showed his class - a lot of things have to line up for bowlers to "win" games for their team, especially spinners.  Ash also struggled with a badly timed injury in England.  The guy is a brilliant spinner who prepares to dismantle batsmen the way Tendy used to prepare against certain bowlers.  Indian fans don't value Ashwin's craft and commitment to the art of spin bowling.  He's awesome.   

 

At the same time, as much as bowlers don't get their due in India,  I don't think Ashwin is team leadership material as captain or whatever, he's a savant when it comes to spin, but team leadership is not his bag. 

[speedracer]

1 hour ago, sandeep said:

The way Ashwin clean bowled Alistair Cook in England showed his class - a lot of things have to line up for bowlers to "win" games for their team, especially spinners.  Ash also struggled with a badly timed injury in England.  The guy is a brilliant spinner who prepares to dismantle batsmen the way Tendy used to prepare against certain bowlers.  Indian fans don't value Ashwin's craft and commitment to the art of spin bowling.  He's awesome.   

 

At the same time, as much as bowlers don't get their due in India,  I don't think Ashwin is team leadership material as captain or whatever, he's a savant when it comes to spin, but team leadership is not his bag. 

More importantly. Ash and jaddu are bonfire fighters. There is a reason why we were so dominant in Asia.  It's those 2 and our brilliant pacers ofcourse barring ishu who sucks in Asia. Good for sena however. 

Wonder who will be our future Ash and jaddu. Sundar is a batsman who can bowl. 

 

[putrevus]

12 hours ago, sandeep said:

Only a matter of time - He's hardly gotten the chance to bat in the top 5 batting slots barely 10 times if that.  Yuvraj Singh - the apparent gold standard for the type of middle order batsman that is considered "good enough" - he took 70 ODIs, and close to 30 opportunities batting at #4 or 5, to finally score his first ODI century, against 2003 version of Bangladesh.   Given that Hardik's stats at #4 are average of 32 with SR of 120, in about 5-6 chances, it compares incredibly well to Yuvi.  

 

But the yardsticks are different when it comes to evaluating Hardik Pandya's batting in white ball cricket - especially for you.  That is abundantly clear.

Yusuf Pathan scored 100 batting from number 7 that too in SA in 60 odd balls when whole batting lineup failed back in 2011.How many times Pandya has faced more than 60 deliveries.

 

Stop living in delusions that Pandya is being measured in different yardstick and stop defending him in every post, it is becoming irritating.

 

Yuvraj scored 86 in first innings with bat against Aussies. Pandya is not even fit to tie his shoelaces. No one is asking Pandya to score 100 everytime he bats but does he have ability to to score 100 ? I am not sure about it .

 

Kohli debuted after Raina and Rohit but he became core batsman in all formats while other two remained on fringes? Why ?

 

I know you have trouble in understanding all things about Pandya, Pandya is not some great player who is being denied opportunities.