Angry Public reactions outside Ahmedabad stadium

[rangeelaraja]

The average average of our top 5 is  50-52. 
 

It means the top 5 by themselves in every game ( except when they fail together ) are expected to score 250 all by themselves. 
 

Since our top 5 was in red hot form and our bowling was doing remarkably well - we went totally blind on the fact that after 5 - we have nothing much to follow.

 

This is precisely the reason why KL and Virat went into a a total shell at 3 down in 10 -12 overs because if we lost 1-2 more wickets trying to up the scoring rate - it would have been game over - we would not even last 50

overs.

 

If we had reliable all rounders at 6-7-8 - who could bat and score clutch runs - I think KL and Virat would have batted a little differently. 
 

That was the idea behind the original XI that had Pandya and Thakur ( that they would be able to score  a clutch 50 when needed most ) 

 

1) So the flaw in our XI composition was a blind spot that got exposed in the final 

 

2) We also paid the price for preparing wicket where toss is a lottery and batting second is a massive advantage. 
 

1) Could have been solved by having an army of quality batting  all rounders - the question is why don’t we have them despite a massive pool of players ? 
 

2) We need to be much smarter about pitch preparation. 

Edited November 20 by rangeelaraja

[Sgattick10]

7 hours ago, raki05 said:

That yellow kurta guy is spot on and connects with ICF emotions. He exposed stats padder, kohli worship, hardik pandya show off and media overhyped. Guy was absolute jam.

Who? 

[Sgattick10]

Taking nothing away from Kohli's run marathon, he played well in the finals too was going run a ball untill KL completely stopped taking singles and that put extra pressure on Kohli. 

But having said that I'd take Head's 100 in SF and F over meaningless 50 hundreds. 

[Ultimate_Game]

21 minutes ago, rangeelaraja said:

The average average of our top 5 is  50-52. 
 

It means the top 5 by themselves in every game ( except when they fail together ) are expected to score 250 all by themselves. 
 

Since our top 5 was in red hot form and our bowling was doing remarkably well - we went totally blind on the fact that after 5 - we have nothing much to follow.

 

This is precisely the reason why KL and Virat went into a a total shell at 3 down in 10 -12 overs because if we lost 1-2 more wickets trying to up the scoring rate - it would have been game over - we would not even last 50

overs.

 

If we had reliable all rounders at 6-7-8 - who could bat and score clutch runs - I think KL and Virat would have batted a little differently. 
 

That was the idea behind the original XI that had Pandya and Thakur ( that they would be able to score  a clutch 50 when needed most ) 

 

1) So the flaw in our XI composition was a blind spot that got exposed in the final 

 

2) We also paid the price for preparing wicket where toss is a lottery and batting second is a massive advantage. 
 

1) Could have been solved by having an army of quality batting  all rounders - the question is why don’t we have them despite a massive pool of players ? 
 

2) We need to be much smarter about pitch preparation. 

 

Nothing will change. We have "Impact Player" rule in IPL which has the opposite result, i.e. no need to have all-rounders as you can replace one specialist with another. And when we show up for ICC tourneys we'll be caught with our pants down as we can't rely on "Impact Player" anymore. At the very least, BCCI should ensure IPL and domestic tourneys & leagues follow ICC tourney rules.

[coffee_rules]

7 hours ago, raki05 said:

That yellow kurta guy is spot on and connects with ICF emotions. He exposed stats padder, kohli worship, hardik pandya show off and media overhyped. Guy was absolute jam.

But that guy was convinced that yeh sab satte ka khel. Everybody said India will win, Modi saraha hain, and they made Australians win. Satte wale paisa banaye

[coffee_rules]

@rangeelaraja ‘a mood today opening many RR threads

 

 

Our mood today after India lost in the World Cup finals pic.twitter.com/GqfIuK1Lp6

— Keh Ke Peheno (@coolfunnytshirt) November 20, 2023

[badmash]

Fans broke TV and protested against players after India lost World Cup Final to Australia.#INDvsAUSfinal pic.twitter.com/HaXJt8yjWj

— Himanshu Pareek (@Sports_Himanshu) November 20, 2023

[Khota]

13 hours ago, Mariyam said:

Strange post.

 

What is the point of ICF if not to celebrate Indian cricket/ Indian cricketers?

Undue celebration is the issue.

[vice]

interviewers are milking the content

 

 

[raki05]

11 hours ago, Sgattick10 said:

Who? 

In the video posted by OP.

[deathmonger]

Australia (and England) are first world countries with high per capita incomes and excellent sporting infrastructure.

 

You cannot compensate for that with population. India has a huge population, true but most of them are poor.

 

India played well and on the day, conditions got the better of them. Both are evenly matched teams (W/L ratio in all formats for the last 4-5 years will attest to that) and when two teams are even, if the balance is tipped a little bit to one side, that side will win.

 

Now the thing is to make the team even better (just like 2023 was improvement over 2019 and 2019 improvement over older Indian sides).

 

Draft in/groom more left handers and all rounders to open up the gap so much that even conditions can't compensate for it.

 

I'm very sure that in the next 10-15 years this gap will be opened up more. It already has with the mid tier teams like SL and Pak whom we can defeat in ODIs in any conditions, batting first or second.

Edited November 21 by deathmonger

[deathmonger]

21 hours ago, AuxiliA said:

Australia has plenty of advantages in cricket/sports that we don't have. 

 

Their players have to cope with far lesser pressure than what our players have to.

 

The are far far ahead of us on per Capita income and sports infrastructure available to common folks. 

 

They have much better physiques on average. 90 percent of our ancestors were illiterate and malnourished when we gained independence. They were already rich AF back then. Will take a few more generations to close this gap.

 

The only advantage we have is our huge  population. But that won't do us much good unless we improve on per capita terms, because sports is about quality not quantity.

 

It's still 11 vs 11 on the playing field and not 1.4B vs 25M.

And not just sports, arts too.

 

Sporting and artistic achievements of countries are tied to their economic level.

 

I was recently watching American movies from the 1920s (Buster Keaton's The General) and it still holds up very well. A lot of old Hollywood movies from the 20s,30s,40s etc are still timeless. A lot of old Indian movies are unwatchable.

[rangeelaraja]

11 minutes ago, deathmonger said:

Australia (and England) are first world countries with high per capita incomes and excellent sporting infrastructure.

 

You cannot compensate for that with population. India has a huge population, true but most of them are poor.

 

India played well and on the day, conditions got the better of them. Both are evenly matched teams (W/L ratio in all formats for the last 4-5 years will attest to that) and when two teams are even, if the balance is tipped a little bit to one side, that side will win.

 

Now the thing is to make the team even better (just like 2023 was improvement over 2019 and 2019 improvement over older Indian sides).

 

Draft in/groom more left handers and all rounders to open up the gap so much that even conditions can't compensate for it.

 

I'm very sure that in the next 10-15 years this gap will be opened up more. It already has with the mid tier teams like SL and Pak whom we can defeat in ODIs in any conditions, batting first or second.

 

 

Sorry, all of this is untrue.

 

Our elite national level players all have WAYYY better per capita income than England/ Australia and access to the best that money can buy.

 

BCCI imported a nearly 7 crore anti gravity treadmill to speeden Rishabh Pant's rehabilitation.

 

https://www.crictracker.com/social-tracker-cricket/rishabh-pant-uses-anti-gravity-treadmill-developed-by-nasa-during-ongoing-rehabilitation-at-nca/

 

If we were so bad - we would not be NO. 1 in rankings across all the formats...we would not make it 2 both the Test Championship finals, and win 2 back to back test series in Australia.

 

The problem is psychological. We lost even in 2017 to Pakistan in the champions trophy final.

 

Also our team selection is deeply  flawed. 

 

 

Edited November 21 by rangeelaraja

[EnterTheVoid]

Golden opportunity to avenge the 2003 WC final defeat.

Everything was going in India's favour. In form batsman, bowlers were breathing fire, crowd support. How could you win 10 on the trot and lose the most important match of them all.

 

[deathmonger]

10 minutes ago, rangeelaraja said:

 

 

Sorry, all of this is untrue.

 

Our elite national level players all have WAYYY better per capita income than England/ Australia and access to the best that money can buy.

 

BCCI imported a nearly 7 crore anti gravity treadmill to speeden Rishabh Pant's rehabilitation.

 

https://www.crictracker.com/social-tracker-cricket/rishabh-pant-uses-anti-gravity-treadmill-developed-by-nasa-during-ongoing-rehabilitation-at-nca/

 

If we were so bad - we would not be NO. 1 in rankings across all the formats...we would not make it 2 both the Test Championship finals, and win 2 back to back test series in Australia.

 

The problem is psychological. We lost even in 2017 to Pakistan in the champions trophy final.

 

Also our team selection is deeply  flawed. 

 

 

Elite national level players are after they enter the system.

 

Australian benefit is from before they even enter the system. Look at the height and physiques of the Australian players. That is purely due to 2-3 generations living in prosperity. Plus they have access to all gyms/sporting equipment growing up.

 

No one says we are bad. We are a great team and probably the best team across formats. But we are not so good that we can beat the conditions, especially against a team which is almost as good as India. Cricket is a very condition dependent game at the end of the day. Same thing with the two WTC finals. Hold them in Galle and we would have won both with a huge margin.

 

Even WI 1983 succumbed to Indian medium pacers in the final. Aus 2004 got bundled out for 93 in Mumbai.

 

Team selection is flawed because of lack of certain players - especially allrounders. Playing Shardul is the right idea, just that Shardul isn't good enough (And even a mediocre Shardul won us Gabba and Oval).

 

Right now the focus should be to have this pool of players plus backups. Basically an army of allrounders - similar to say Chris Woakes level so we can bat to 9 and have a multitude of bowling options. Make the team so strong that it can make up for conditions.

 

And I'm pretty sure it will happen over the next 10-15 years.

 

 

Edited November 21 by deathmonger

[rangeelaraja]

16 minutes ago, deathmonger said:

Elite national level players are after they enter the system.

 

Australian benefit is from before they even enter the system. Look at the height and physiques of the Australian players. That is purely due to 2-3 generations living in prosperity. Plus they have access to all gyms/sporting equipment growing up.

 

No one says we are bad. We are a great team and probably the best team across formats. But we are not so good that we can beat the conditions, especially against a team which is almost as good as India. Cricket is a very condition dependent game at the end of the day. Same thing with the two WTC finals. Hold them in Galle and we would have won both with a huge margin.

 

Even WI 1983 succumbed to Indian medium pacers in the final. Aus 2004 got bundled out for 93 in Mumbai.

 

Team selection is flawed because of lack of certain players - especially allrounders. Playing Shardul is the right idea, just that Shardul isn't good enough (And even a mediocre Shardul won us Gabba and Oval).

 

Right now the focus should be to have this pool of players plus backups. Basically an army of allrounders - similar to say Chris Woakes level so we can bat to 9 and have a multitude of bowling options. Make the team so strong that it can make up for conditions.

 

 

 

Apologies, all of your arguments are flawed in my opinion.

 

I think the problem is psychological and not as complicated or complex as you are making it out to be. 

 

Japan would make Australia look like a village in terms of the prosperity and human advancement they have made. 

 

An average Japanese would still be way shorter than an average Australian because of genetics. Caucasian genetics result in a different build than Asians.

 

Just like African Americans have a different genetic composition - if you have ever seen the NBA - it is almost entirely dominated by African Americans - very very few whites.   Ditto with heavy weight boxing, power athletics in  100, 200, 400 meters etc.

 

African Americans dominate every damn sport that requires exceptional atheletism - speed, power.

 

So it has nothing to do with prosperity but genetics.

 

And cricket is NOT such a physical sport.

 

Our problem is deeply rooted in - 1) Flawed team selection 2) Psychological issues.

 

 

 

Edited November 21 by rangeelaraja

[Sharjah-Harjah]

2 hours ago, deathmonger said:

Elite national level players are after they enter the system.

 

Australian benefit is from before they even enter the system. Look at the height and physiques of the Australian players. That is purely due to 2-3 generations living in prosperity. Plus they have access to all gyms/sporting equipment growing up.

 

No one says we are bad. We are a great team and probably the best team across formats. But we are not so good that we can beat the conditions, especially against a team which is almost as good as India. Cricket is a very condition dependent game at the end of the day. Same thing with the two WTC finals. Hold them in Galle and we would have won both with a huge margin.

 

Even WI 1983 succumbed to Indian medium pacers in the final. Aus 2004 got bundled out for 93 in Mumbai.

 

Team selection is flawed because of lack of certain players - especially allrounders. Playing Shardul is the right idea, just that Shardul isn't good enough (And even a mediocre Shardul won us Gabba and Oval).

 

Right now the focus should be to have this pool of players plus backups. Basically an army of allrounders - similar to say Chris Woakes level so we can bat to 9 and have a multitude of bowling options. Make the team so strong that it can make up for conditions.

 

And I'm pretty sure it will happen over the next 10-15 years.

 

 

This “India lost to conditions” Is the worse excuses in the history of excuses. 
The match was played in Ahmedabad not Perth. And the wicket was slow and dry even for Asian standards. This pitch would have been as alien as it gets for a SENA side. Travis Head would have had very little preparation on this type of wicket growing up in Australia. The match was lost by the time dew arrived. 
India lost because they were not brave enough. Neither in strategy/planning nor in execution. 

[deathmonger]

32 minutes ago, Sharjah-Harjah said:

This “India lost to conditions” Is the worse excuses in the history of excuses. 
The match was played in Ahmedabad not Perth. And the wicket was slow and dry even for Asian standards. This pitch would have been as alien as it gets for a SENA side. Travis Head would have had very little preparation on this type of wicket growing up in Australia. The match was lost by the time dew arrived. 
India lost because they were not brave enough. Neither in strategy/planning nor in execution. 

No it isn't.

 

The dew negated all the slowness and dryness.

 

Dew helped India in 2011 as well as Aus in the semi/final in World T20 2021.

Edited November 21 by deathmonger

[deathmonger]

3 hours ago, rangeelaraja said:

 

Apologies, all of your arguments are flawed in my opinion.

 

I think the problem is psychological and not as complicated or complex as you are making it out to be. 

 

Japan would make Australia look like a village in terms of the prosperity and human advancement they have made. 

 

An average Japanese would still be way shorter than an average Australian because of genetics. Caucasian genetics result in a different build than Asians.

 

Just like African Americans have a different genetic composition - if you have ever seen the NBA - it is almost entirely dominated by African Americans - very very few whites.   Ditto with heavy weight boxing, power athletics in  100, 200, 400 meters etc.

 

African Americans dominate every damn sport that requires exceptional atheletism - speed, power.

 

So it has nothing to do with prosperity but genetics.

 

And cricket is NOT such a physical sport.

 

Our problem is deeply rooted in - 1) Flawed team selection 2) Psychological issues.

 

 

 

It has to do with both genetics and prosperity.

 

I admit certain races are genetically gifted but you still need to maximize it with prosperity.

 

Your own example states that. African Americans dominate. Africans do not. Most Black African countries are poorer than India in sports, simply because they are poor and do not have the prosperity to maximize their genetic potential. Most African countries didn't even medal at the 2020 Olympics. Most black people who medal are all from rich western countries even though they form the minority of the black population in the world. Nigeria, the most populated black country in the world with 230 million people managed only a silver and a bronze.

 

White people by virtue of being born in rich countries have been able to maximize their genetic potential. South Asians by the virtue of being born in poorer countries haven't. As India is becoming richer, more of this potential is being maxed out.

 

Japan would make Australia look like a village in terms of the prosperity and human advancement they have made. - Untrue. Australia has both higher HDI and per capita income than Japan. Both are first world countries and have maximized their genetic potential. Both Japan and Australia are top sporting countries with Japan doing better than Australia both in 2020 and 2016 (w/o home advantage).

 

 

 

 

Edited November 21 by deathmonger

[Sharjah-Harjah]

15 minutes ago, deathmonger said:

No it isn't.

 

The dew negated all the slowness and dryness.

 

Dew helped India in 2011 as well as Aus in the semi/final in World T20 2021.

It was very, very sub-continental conditions. Dew or not, if you are gonna lose in your own den with 130k fans rooting for you, at least don’t blame “conditions” FFS when everything was scripted to favor YOU! Australia was the alien there.

india MUST hire foreign coaches because locals are too emotional to see things logically.