New guy Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 (edited) On 7/7/2024 at 6:58 PM, Adamant said: kohli bullied you into submission and has retired as the GOAT of t20s with two MOTT and a Mom in finals. Thats not the topic. The point I raised is these youngsters weren’t ready at that time and even Yuvi said the same thing. Look at my posts We all know why kohli got man of the jnatch despite one of the worst t20 knocks ever in history. SA epic choked when 30 ball 30 was required, kohli played one of the worst knocks ever. And deep down you also know it and know the man of the match was only and only because of PR, the same reason the people who choose the award sing praised of kohli every innings when he edges to slips in tests. Kohli didn't deserve that man of the match that final and even his chamcas know it. Edited February 2 by New guy Ultimate_Game and tapandrun 1 1 Link to comment
tapandrun Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Ultimate_Game said: And more chances to Harshit. Ramandeep should've played instead of Sundar, and Harshit ahead of Shami. Sundar should not have been int20i plans, he does not make into his IPL side how come they are getting him intnl side, lacks power hitting and off-spinner has be to proper batter as teams are only going to use them in +ive match-ups when LH are batting or wkt is offering too much spin which is not going to happen unless playing bilateral in sl/bd. Not sure what they are doing with rana, he debut in Aus one of the toughest tour when your batter are nt giving anything, this t20i debut from nowhere and then not to play him next game. There is something wrong with planning for fast bowlers Edited February 2 by tapandrun Ultimate_Game 1 Link to comment
Ultimate_Game Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 1 minute ago, tapandrun said: Sundar should not have been int20i plans, he does not make into his IPL side how come they are getting him intnl side, lack power hitting and off-spinner has be to proper batter as teams are only going to use them in +ive match-ups when LH are batting or wkt is offering too much spin which is not going to happen unless playing bilateral in sl/bd. Our selectors don't have a clue to differentiate across formats. Sundar is good in Tests but not a short format player. tapandrun 1 Link to comment
Adamant Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 On 2/2/2025 at 11:57 PM, New guy said: We all know why kohli got man of the jnatch despite one of the worst t20 knocks ever in history. SA epic choked when 30 ball 30 was required, kohli played one of the worst knocks ever. And deep down you also know it and know the man of the match was only and only because of PR, the same reason the people who choose the award sing praised of kohli every innings when he edges to slips in tests. Kohli didn't deserve that man of the match that final and even his chamcas know it. Ifs and buts dont matter, he retired with two MOTT in t20 world cups and a man of the match in finals with great knocks in knockouts. A cockroach like you jumping up and down on a forum won’t reduce his legacy as the GOAT T20 batter. He hasn’t done well in tests and you can criticise him there, his legacy as Goat t20 batsman is set in stone. Link to comment
Chamsi Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 (edited) On 2/3/2025 at 12:02 AM, Ultimate_Game said: Our selectors don't have a clue to differentiate across formats. Sundar is good in Tests but not a short format player. They have to groom him to become good na, he didn't just become a great Test player. He will have to work on his powergame a bit, but they should play him. There are no tall-offspinners like him after Ashwin. Him and Axar are a given. Edited February 4 by Chamsi Link to comment
New guy Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 (edited) 1 hour ago, Adamant said: Ifs and buts dont matter, he retired with two MOTT in t20 world cups and a man of the match in finals with great knocks in knockouts. A cockroach like you jumping up and down on a forum won’t reduce his legacy as the GOAT T20 batter. He hasn’t done well in tests and you can criticise him there, his legacy as Goat t20 batsman is set in stone. Call me all the names you want, but you know why he got that award and I know why he got that award. He was a complete passenger entire series and played one of the worst innings in the final. We won despite him I don't understand why you are stopping short of calling him goat test batsmen too. The same commentators/ex players who voted for his MoM also call him a test goat even now and glaze him every innings he plays even now calling him the biggest wicket Using the same criteria he is the greatest ever for tests and greatest even now in tests. Babar azam was nominated for icc T20 player of the year which shows how ridiculous the criteria is. It's the easiest thing in the world to stat pad and have big averages and total runs without actual impact. The true t20 goats are those who have high strike rate and impact, which icc still doesn't consider Edited February 4 by New guy Link to comment
Ultimate_Game Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 1 hour ago, Chamsi said: They have to groom him to become good na, he didn't just become a great Test player. He will have to work on his powergame a bit, but they should play him. There are no tall-offspinners like him after Ashwin. Him and Axar are a given. Nope, there're skills you can learn and there're some you can't. Power game is one of the non-teachable skills. Look at Jadeja. He has been playing since 2008 and he never had a power game and sucks in T20s. Sundar is like that. You can't convert Sundar into a Ramandeep Singh. That's why they went with Axar as he had the skills to hit. Same with likes of Riyan Parag who can hit. But Sundar isn't it no matter how long you try. cowboysfan 1 Link to comment
Chamsi Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 22 minutes ago, Ultimate_Game said: Nope, there're skills you can learn and there're some you can't. Power game is one of the non-teachable skills. Look at Jadeja. He has been playing since 2008 and he never had a power game and sucks in T20s. Sundar is like that. You can't convert Sundar into a Ramandeep Singh. That's why they went with Axar as he had the skills to hit. Same with likes of Riyan Parag who can hit. But Sundar isn't it no matter how long you try. Even if he is played as a pure bowler, it is worth it. There are no tall off-spinners like him and at his accurate best he is super economical. He still needs to improve his fielding though. The main question is the third bowling option. In the upcoming T20 WC, Bumrah and Arshdeep will be there. Will the third bowling option go to Varun, Bishnoi, or Rana? If it goes to Rana, they will have only one spin bowling option, Axar Patel. Then, they will need an additional spin bowling all-rounder, which is Sundar. Link to comment
Ultimate_Game Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 50 minutes ago, Chamsi said: Even if he is played as a pure bowler, it is worth it. There are no tall off-spinners like him and at his accurate best he is super economical. He still needs to improve his fielding though. The main question is the third bowling option. In the upcoming T20 WC, Bumrah and Arshdeep will be there. Will the third bowling option go to Varun, Bishnoi, or Rana? If it goes to Rana, they will have only one spin bowling option, Axar Patel. Then, they will need an additional spin bowling all-rounder, which is Sundar. We can only carry 3 specialist bowlers to have depth till 8. If he can be ne of the top 3 bowlers then he should get in. But at the moment Bumrah, Arshdeep, and Varun C are the top 3 bowlers in T20s. Rest of the bowlers will need to be good T20 batters such as Axar, Pandya, Abhishek, Riyan, Dube, Nitish Reddy etc. so they can bowl a few overs. All they need to do is combine to get through 8 overs and IMO they can do so. That's what the template should be. In fact even SKY's position needs to be questioned as well coz I would rather have someone like Riyan Parag who can bowl a couple than a pure batter in SKY. Link to comment
Chamsi Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 1 hour ago, Ultimate_Game said: We can only carry 3 specialist bowlers to have depth till 8. If he can be ne of the top 3 bowlers then he should get in. But at the moment Bumrah, Arshdeep, and Varun C are the top 3 bowlers in T20s. Rest of the bowlers will need to be good T20 batters such as Axar, Pandya, Abhishek, Riyan, Dube, Nitish Reddy etc. so they can bowl a few overs. All they need to do is combine to get through 8 overs and IMO they can do so. That's what the template should be. In fact even SKY's position needs to be questioned as well coz I would rather have someone like Riyan Parag who can bowl a couple than a pure batter in SKY. But Riyan Parag is a pervert. Link to comment
Nikhil_cric Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 3 hours ago, Chamsi said: Even if he is played as a pure bowler, it is worth it. There are no tall off-spinners like him and at his accurate best he is super economical. He still needs to improve his fielding though. The main question is the third bowling option. In the upcoming T20 WC, Bumrah and Arshdeep will be there. Will the third bowling option go to Varun, Bishnoi, or Rana? If it goes to Rana, they will have only one spin bowling option, Axar Patel. Then, they will need an additional spin bowling all-rounder, which is Sundar. There's no need for offspinners in white ball cricket. Link to comment
Adamant Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 8 hours ago, New guy said: Call me all the names you want, but you know why he got that award and I know why he got that award. He was a complete passenger entire series and played one of the worst innings in the final. We won despite him I don't understand why you are stopping short of calling him goat test batsmen too. The same commentators/ex players who voted for his MoM also call him a test goat even now and glaze him every innings he plays even now calling him the biggest wicket Using the same criteria he is the greatest ever for tests and greatest even now in tests. Babar azam was nominated for icc T20 player of the year which shows how ridiculous the criteria is. It's the easiest thing in the world to stat pad and have big averages and total runs without actual impact. The true t20 goats are those who have high strike rate and impact, which icc still doesn't consider Go watch icc t20 world cup 2014 and 2016 and see if he created any impact or not. Also before telling me that we didn't win those tourneys, your God Sachin won nothing in his career apart from that 2011 world cup, does that invalidate all his Golden Bat performances before 2011? Link to comment
singhvivek141 Posted February 5 Share Posted February 5 6 hours ago, Adamant said: Go watch icc t20 world cup 2014 and 2016 and see if he created any impact or not. Also before telling me that we didn't win those tourneys, your God Sachin won nothing in his career apart from that 2011 world cup, does that invalidate all his Golden Bat performances before 2011? How does Sachin came in the discussion ? Are you not able tl defend Virat without hiding behind the grand stature of Sachin. Also, FYI, in Sachin's era ICC tournaments were happening once in four years. Unlike now where in every 6 months to an year, some mumbo jumbo greatest ICC event ever is scheduled. Ultimate_Game 1 Link to comment
Chamsi Posted February 5 Share Posted February 5 (edited) 10 hours ago, Nikhil_cric said: There's no need for offspinners in white ball cricket. Left-handers have a tough time getting away off-spinners. Varun Chakravarthy is a glorified off-spinner as well. Might as well have a tall one. Sundar is a underrated bowler if used properly. His batting is anyways negligible. Edited February 5 by Chamsi Link to comment
Ultimate_Game Posted February 5 Share Posted February 5 21 hours ago, Chamsi said: But Riyan Parag is a pervert. Don't care what he is as long as he performs on the field. He's a far better shorter format player than Sundar, and with a much higher ceiling. Link to comment
tapandrun Posted February 5 Share Posted February 5 (edited) 10 hours ago, Chamsi said: Left-handers have a tough time getting away off-spinners. Varun Chakravarthy is a glorified off-spinner as well. Might as well have a tall one. Sundar is a underrated bowler if used properly. His batting is anyways negligible. And who are bowling those off-spinners ??? most of them are specialized batters and rolling their arms overs as off-spin and only bowl when there is +ive match up and hardly bowl 2+ overs per match. Only specialized off-spinners are nabi (afg) and miraj (bd) who are contributing with bat as well. and miraj plays on some of best wkts fr spinners in white-ball consistently. ball can turn in and out to a batter , you can name anything -- in the words of murlithran. every mystery bowler is either off-spinning it or leg-spinning as their stock ball. the mystery is batter does not get time to line-up or pre-empt the bowler and his line taking out that extra time where batter can not get under the ball. this is the reason these bowler are good only in t20is as batter is under pressure to score quickly Edited February 5 by tapandrun Link to comment
Chamsi Posted February 5 Share Posted February 5 1 hour ago, Ultimate_Game said: Don't care what he is as long as he performs on the field. He's a far better shorter format player than Sundar, and with a much higher ceiling. 47 minutes ago, tapandrun said: And who are bowling those off-spinners ??? most of them are specialized batters and rolling their arms overs as off-spin and only bowl when there is +ive match up and hardly bowl 2+ overs per match. Only specialized off-spinners are nabi (afg) and miraj (bd) who are contributing with bat as well. and miraj plays on some of best wkts fr spinners in white-ball consistently. ball can turn in and out to a batter , you can name anything -- in the words of murlithran. every mystery bowler is either off-spinning it or leg-spinning as their stock ball. the mystery is batter does not get time to line-up or pre-empt the bowler and his line taking out that extra time where batter can not get under the ball. this is the reason these bowler are good only in t20is as batter is under pressure to score quickly Nabi, Miraz, and Parag are not comparable to Sundar in T20Is. He's taller, his T20I economy is below 7, and a regular offpspinner experienced. He's limited on the batting, which India already has a lot of. Link to comment
tapandrun Posted February 5 Share Posted February 5 (edited) 3 hours ago, Chamsi said: Nabi, Miraz, and Parag are not comparable to Sundar in T20Is. He's taller, his T20I economy is below 7, and a regular offpspinner experienced. He's limited on the batting, which India already has a lot of. Ashwin was more capable bowler and batter than Sundar if he cannot make it to the team, do not think Sundar can. And as posted previously any well minded t20 set-up will pick anything over a specialist off-spinner. Parag still needs to prove himself in intnl level against better team, but will have some1 like him who can hit 4/6 batting 5/6/7 and can contribute with ball and is a v.safe fielder in the deep. Its not about the personal but the skill-set needed for t20s Edited February 5 by tapandrun tweaker 1 Link to comment
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now