Would you trade consistency with trophies for the Indian team?

[Ultimate_Game]

27 minutes ago, Lord said:

 

That was on KL squarely. Partly Kohli too. but mostly KL.

 

On both of them. None of them tried to be pro-active. India was 80/2 off 10. All they had to do was bat at 5 an over and you get to 280. No matter what but the pitch wasn't that bad that you couldn't bat at 5 an over. A total of 280 would have been slightly below par and would've given our bowlers something to defend. 240 was a gimme on that pitch.

[R!TTER]

What are you talking about? Did you forget "pace basher" Iyer got out before KL & 360° player was hidden in plain sight for the last 10 overs 

 

That loss is squarely on fat arse, he was the biggest culprit!

[putrevus]

2 hours ago, singhvivek141 said:

They bowled well initially.
When chasing scores like that..you need a bit of luck. Shami and Bumrah were just missing the edges of the Head.
Then that "dew" came in to Ahmedabad (not sure why Dravid or Rohit didn't thought of that). Spinners became ineffective, which was one of our primary reasons where we actually let go of the game, plus Siraj was a bit letdown.

NZ showed , how to put up fight even after 100/0.  

 

I don't think Indian bowlers believed that they could win, once Shami had bad day it was curtains for India,

[vvvslaxman]

4 hours ago, Ultimate_Game said:

 

On both of them. None of them tried to be pro-active. India was 80/2 off 10. All they had to do was bat at 5 an over and you get to 280. No matter what but the pitch wasn't that bad that you couldn't bat at 5 an over. A total of 280 would have been slightly below par and would've given our bowlers something to defend. 240 was a gimme on that pitch.

 

The same old disease of going in with 4 tailenders with Jadeja at 7.  That is almost like 5 tailenders. Once you lose 3 wickets these bozos by default would shut shop. These guys don't have the ability to maintain the tempo without losing the wicket. You need courage, guts, jazba to play like that under pressure. Neither Kohli nor Rahul have that. THey just let poor bowlers like Travis head get away. Cummins, Starc none of them bowled that well. We made them look like some great bowlers.  They were hoping bowlers would bail us out like they did against England. But Ahmedabad under lights is christmas for batsmen. You are supposed to score above par.  Combination of terrible field placement and unimaginative field set of Rohit made sure we couldn't even fight. There is a statistics on  Travis head vs India under Rohit    vs Travis head vs India and others.  There is a significant different. 

Edited March 15, 2025 by vvvslaxman

[singhvivek141]

8 hours ago, putrevus said:

NZ showed , how to put up fight even after 100/0.  

 

I don't think Indian bowlers believed that they could win, once Shami had bad day it was curtains for India,

Along with bowlers, even fielders stopped showing any urgency once Australia crossed 100.

Anyway, we can blame as per our convenience. But in totality it was a game where at every moment we made a bad choice.

Dew made the matters worse.

[Suhaan]

Arey batsmen toh hamare doodh ke dhule hain

 

Edited March 16, 2025 by Suhaan

[Lord]

16 hours ago, putrevus said:

NZ showed , how to put up fight even after 100/0.  

 

I don't think Indian bowlers believed that they could win, once Shami had bad day it was curtains for India,

 

Chalk and cheese. NZ put up a fight vs same batting which put 240 in WC finals. 

 

Biggest thing is there spinners were in contention all throughout. We had to deal with dew which flattened the pitch. Even 300 would not have been easy to defend

[putrevus]

8 hours ago, singhvivek141 said:

Along with bowlers, even fielders stopped showing any urgency once Australia crossed 100.

Anyway, we can blame as per our convenience. But in totality it was a game where at every moment we made a bad choice.

Dew made the matters worse.

That falls on bowlers and captains.They just gave up fight.

 

That was pathetic display.

 

 

[putrevus]

25 minutes ago, Lord said:

 

Chalk and cheese. NZ put up a fight vs same batting which put 240 in WC finals. 

 

Biggest thing is there spinners were in contention all throughout. We had to deal with dew which flattened the pitch. Even 300 would not have been easy to defend

I don't think so, putting up fight has got everything to do with attitude.That start with main bowlers and captain.

 

140 to win with 10 wickets remaining, it is all about putting up fight. That was lacking on Nov 23.

 

It is not for the first time Indian bowlers have pulled up that feat.22 t20 semifinals, 21 against Pakistan.Don't have to win, make it as hard as possible.Who know whats happen once you fight.

 

 

[Lord]

Just now, putrevus said:

I don't think so, putting up fight has got everything to do with attitude.That start with main bowlers and captain.

 

140 to win with 10 wickets remaining, it is all about putting up fight. That was lacking on Nov 23.

 

It is not for the first time Indian bowlers have pulled up that feat.22 t20 semifinals, 21 against Pakistan.Don't have to win, make it as hard as possible.Who know whats happen once you fight.

 

 

 

Attitude is just a big word. It won't make the ball spin on a dewy surface.

 

All those you listed were under par scores. Bowlers can be blamed only for not defending par or above par score,not clean up after batsmen.

[putrevus]

On 3/16/2025 at 8:26 AM, Lord said:

 

Attitude is just a big word. It won't make the ball spin on a dewy surface.

 

All those you listed were under par scores. Bowlers can be blamed only for not defending par or above par score,not clean up after batsmen.

they were not pitches either where they could not take single wicket.So it is all about attitude.

 

Indian no name bowlers defended a below par score in 2011 that too in full dewy conditions.Ashwin and jadeja defended 126 to win CT.

 

When you had so called better bowlers they could do any such thing.

Edited March 17, 2025 by putrevus

[crictime]

50 minutes ago, Lord said:

 

Attitude is just a big word. It won't make the ball spin on a dewy surface.

 

All those you listed were under par scores. Bowlers can be blamed only for not defending par or above par score,not clean up after batsmen.

Not getting enough spin is not the only aspect of spin bowling which gets tough, even it's very difficult to get the line and length correct due to lack of proper grip in dew conditions.

 

Overall having 5 spinners (Kuldeep, Varun, Jadeja, Axar and Sundar) in the squad was a strategic master stroke by the management.

 

Other teams neglected the conditions in Asia by selecting just 2 spinners in squad and made a blunder before the matches even started.

[R!TTER]

20 minutes ago, putrevus said:

they were not pitches either where they could not take single wicket.So it is all about attitude.

 

Indian no name bowlers defended a below par score in 2011 that too in full dewy conditions.Ashwin and jadeja defended 126 to CT.

 

When you had so called better bowlers they could do any such thing.

For every such "attitude" wicket we have Lahore 1996 where the greatest magician our gen also failed 

[deepdynamo]

0-2 vs Aus in a meanigless ODI series.

If we are going to perform well in tournamenets, losing these usless matches is fine provided they give us some good new players or clarity of roles. Unfortuanerly, we are yet to find positives from these two maches.

a) Ro-Ko is finished. We knew that before.
b) Axar, Washington or Nitish hasn't set things on fire. They ae useful crickters but not match winners.
c) Rana is going nowhere in his career.

Overall, haven't found anything from this series, as yet.
 

[Gollum]

1 minute ago, deepdynamo said:

0-2 vs Aus in a meanigless ODI series.

If we are going to perform well in tournamenets, losing these usless matches is fine provided they give us some good new players or clarity of roles. Unfortuanerly, we are yet to find positives from these two maches.

a) Ro-Ko is finished. We knew that before.
b) Axar, Washington or Nitish hasn't set things on fire. They ae useful crickters but not match winners.
c) Rana is going nowhere in his career.

Overall, haven't found anything from this series, as yet.
 

Exactly, losing is fine but unearth something in the process. Had we lost after playing Jaiswal, Sai, Tilak, Parag, Jurel etc., there would have been some direction for our ODI team. 

[deathmonger]

1 hour ago, deepdynamo said:

0-2 vs Aus in a meanigless ODI series.

If we are going to perform well in tournamenets, losing these usless matches is fine provided they give us some good new players or clarity of roles. Unfortuanerly, we are yet to find positives from these two maches.

a) Ro-Ko is finished. We knew that before.
b) Axar, Washington or Nitish hasn't set things on fire. They ae useful crickters but not match winners.
c) Rana is going nowhere in his career.

Overall, haven't found anything from this series, as yet.
 

Nitish and Rana are quite important though (or atleast players like them)

 

Pace bowling batting AR

Tall fast bowler who can bat a bit

 

So can see why they are invested in

[deathmonger]

1 hour ago, Gollum said:

Exactly, losing is fine but unearth something in the process. Had we lost after playing Jaiswal, Sai, Tilak, Parag, Jurel etc., there would have been some direction for our ODI team. 

Think RoKo will get the entire year including SA/NZ series. If they don't do well, will be asked to retire and won't go to England next year.

[tapandrun]

Ind fast bowling is in v.bad shape rt.now and there is no hope. 

For WC 27 Ind will need 3 pacers in the playing 11 and 2 more on the bench in 15.

 

Who are those 5 pacers  ??? 

The realistic scenario is :: Bhumrah's availability is unknow, Siraj is declining :yes he had 1 good eng series that's it but has been declining> then who is next in line ????

 

Do not think Pandaya has 10 overs on consistent basis currently and he will decline further in 2 yrs time. Plus he can break-down in tournament itself . Happened in wc-23 and Asa cup-25

 

 

[Ultimate_Game]

1 hour ago, deepdynamo said:

0-2 vs Aus in a meanigless ODI series.

If we are going to perform well in tournamenets, losing these usless matches is fine provided they give us some good new players or clarity of roles. Unfortuanerly, we are yet to find positives from these two maches.

a) Ro-Ko is finished. We knew that before.
b) Axar, Washington or Nitish hasn't set things on fire. They ae useful crickters but not match winners.
c) Rana is going nowhere in his career.

Overall, haven't found anything from this series, as yet.
 

 

1 hour ago, Gollum said:

Exactly, losing is fine but unearth something in the process. Had we lost after playing Jaiswal, Sai, Tilak, Parag, Jurel etc., there would have been some direction for our ODI team. 

 

This could've been such a great opportunity to give chances to Jaiswal and Sai and for us to start building for WC 2027. But here we are with no clarity. We'll continue to waste time on has beens and then throw in the youngsters at the last minute. Give them some time to be part of the team. But all we're doing is setting them up for failure and then bozos like @putrevus will bag the youngsters who were never set up for success in the first place.

[deepdynamo]

16 minutes ago, tapandrun said:

Ind fast bowling is in v.bad shape rt.now and there is no hope. 

For WC 27 Ind will need 3 pacers in the playing 11 and 2 more on the bench in 15.

 

Who are those 5 pacers  ??? 

The realistic scenario is :: Bhumrah's availability is unknow, Siraj is declining :yes he had 1 good eng series that's it but has been declining> then who is next in line ????

 

Do not think Pandaya has 10 overs on consistent basis currently and he will decline further in 2 yrs time. Plus he can break-down in tournament itself . Happened in wc-23 and Asa cup-25

 

 

 

We should look for 4 fast bowlers for ODI WC 2027. Bumrah is one and maybe Siraj another. Two spots are still open with Rana, Arshdeep and Prasidh in contention as of now. Pandya is your fast bowler allrounder with 6-8 overs per match. Nitish is being tried out but no success as yet.

 

Also, Gambhir is overdoing the allrounder formula in ODI. There is no need of 3 allrounders in an ODI XI. The perfect combination is

6 batsman (each of them should be a match winner with bat) and atleast one of them have an ability to bowl 4-6 overs per match.
2 All rounders who can bowl 6-8 over per match.
3 Pure bowlers (match winners)

 

Considering current availability and also assuming Roko won't be there, this is my XI as of today.

Jaiswal
Gill

Tilak 
Iyer
Rahul
Pandya
Parag
Axar
Kuldeep
Siraj
Bumrah

If you need a third fast bowler, drop Axar and play him. Don't compromise on bowling by playing another allrounder.