Pant has all the skills leveling with Tendulkar but match awareness of Arshdeep

[maniac]

On 11/24/2024 at 6:05 AM, Trichromatic said:

Skill wise I put him next to Tendulkar.

Huh? Kuch bhi.

 

 

[Bigg Brother]

With the same mindset he has smashed Lyon starting from his 1st tour to Australia. Lyon has owned us many times, Pant has played main role  humbling him since 2018 tour..

[maniac]

4 minutes ago, Bigg Brother said:

With the same mindset he has smashed Lyon starting from his 1st tour to Australia. Lyon has owned us many times, Pant has played main role  humbling him since 2018 tour..

Lyon is also a competitor. I liked the way he took on the challenge to dismiss Pant too.

 

Pant can’t have this excuse of “he only plays that way” anymore as soon he will be one of the seniors in the side.

[Ultimate_Game]

Hard disagree with OP. This is what makes Pant who he is. The reason he's such a match winner and can take away the match from opponents is due to his "devil may care" attitude. The moment he starts playing scared and afraid to lose his wkt, he'll no longer be Pant.

 

He'll lose his wkt in a braindead fashion but he'll also win you games which others can't. You can't expect him to be an X factor matchwinner and also play like a traditional/conservative batsman. You can't have it both ways, or have your cake and eat it too. I'm happy the way Pant is and willing to live with frustrating dismissals to see the highs of Gabba 2021.

[Lord]

11 minutes ago, Ultimate_Game said:

Hard disagree with OP. This is what makes Pant who he is. The reason he's such a match winner and can take away the match from opponents is due to his "devil may care" attitude. The moment he starts playing scared and afraid to lose his wkt, he'll no longer be Pant.

 

He'll lose his wkt in a braindead fashion but he'll also win you games which others can't. You can't expect him to be an X factor matchwinner and also play like a traditional/conservative batsman. You can't have it both ways, or have your cake and eat it too. I'm happy the way Pant is and willing to live with frustrating dismissals to see the highs of Gabba 2021.

Also the dismissal came at a comfortable. Its not like he did it at 30-4

[Lord]

2 hours ago, maniac said:

Lyon is also a competitor. I liked the way he took on the challenge to dismiss Pant too.

 

Pant can’t have this excuse of “he only plays that way” anymore as soon he will be one of the seniors in the side.

Can't change your game just coz of seniority. Rohit bats like this now. Baz,Gilly etc played like this till end of their careers

[maniac]

Just now, Lord said:

Can't change your game just coz of seniority. Rohit bats like this now. Baz,Gilly etc played like this till end of their careers

Can’t change your game is a stupid excuse. If you are a good cricketer and a no.11 you will look to save the game with all ability you have or if you have to slog you slog. Using brains is not alternative for “that’s how he plays”

[Lord]

Just now, maniac said:

Can’t change your game is a stupid excuse. If you are a good cricketer and a no.11 you will look to save the game with all ability you have or if you have to slog you slog. Using brains is not alternative for “that’s how he plays”

Natural game doesnt change. That's how all greats did till the end of their careers.

 

You just weigh in options better with experience and match situation awareness. 

 

This game he had the license to play the shot he did. We were like 350 ahead

[lemsip]

2 hours ago, maniac said:

Pant can’t have this excuse of “he only plays that way” anymore as soon he will be one of the seniors in the side.

He doesn't use this excuse. He has been the most consistent and adaptable Indian batsman in the last few years and has adapted to challenging conditions much better than his teammates. One test ago, he was batting on a turning track in Mumbai and looked a level above anyone else in the way he was playing spin getting a 60 in each innings. Then in the first innings here, he was one of the few batsmen who looked comfortable on a fast, bouncy and seaming pitch facing a strong Aussie attack . He does have the touch of the madcap but does tend to bat responsibly most of the time in test matches. The skip down the wicket he tried didnt come off but India were far ahead at that time and it didn't really matter, I'm perfectly comfortable allowing him that leeway.

[maniac]

Just now, Lord said:

Natural game doesnt change. That's how all greats did till the end of their careers.

 

You just weigh in options better with experience and match situation awareness. 

 

This game he had the license to play the shot he did. We were like 350 ahead

Tendulkar played an entire great knock without scoring on offside.

 

even Sehwag has played normal sedate knocks early on.

 

There is a huge gap between Afridi approach and say a Gayle or Sehwag approach even though attacking style might show similarities.

[maniac]

1 minute ago, lemsip said:

He doesn't use this excuse. He has been the most consistent and adaptable Indian batsman in the last few years and has adapted to challenging conditions much better than his teammates. One test ago, he was batting on a turning track in Mumbai and looked a level above anyone else in the way he was playing spin getting a 60 in each innings. Then in the first innings here, he was one of the few batsmen who looked comfortable on a fast, bouncy and seaming pitch facing a strong Aussie attack . He does have the touch of the madcap but does tend to bat responsibly most of the time in test matches. The skip down the wicket he tried didnt come off but India were far ahead at that time and it didn't really matter, I'm perfectly comfortable allowing him that leeway.

not criticizing Pant for this knock here but clearly you saw in Lyon’s eyes that he was going to get him and he got him and Pant did look foolish there. Sometimes need to swallow pride and ego for greater good.

[putrevus]

8 hours ago, Cricketics said:

No one can ever match Tendulkar’s skill. He played over 20 years facing all types of bowlers from the age of 16 on every kind of track in test matches, all over the world, and succeded against most of them if not all of them.

 

Some skilled players are once in a generarion in each sport. They might not win everything or hold every recoed, but skill wise they are cut above the rest. 
 

Tendulkar is that for cricket - Most complete player the game has ever seen.

 

Feder is that for Tennis  - Most complete player in Tennis.

 

People are not realizing how good Tendulkar was as a batsman technically. I have issues of him not justifying his talent but he was an amazing batsman.

 

Federer, I would not put him as most complete tennis player though.

 

Pant is great as a WK batsman ,  even Adam Gilchrist becomes ordinary if tag of WK is taken out.That allround threat makes both of them greatest wicket keeper batsmen of their generation.

Edited November 25 by putrevus

[lemsip]

1 minute ago, maniac said:

Tendulkar played an entire great knock without scoring on offside.

 

Good example but you may not be aware that Tendulkar also cost India games playing his natural game most notably the Chennai test vs Pakistan when he was batting on 136 with 4 wickets left and 16 runs to win. He then tried to run down the wicket and wildly slog Saqlain and threw his wicket away for no reason.  India proceeded to lose the remaining wickets within 4 runs to lose the match by 12 runs. Rishabh has yet to do anything remotely like that.

[maniac]

1 minute ago, lemsip said:

Good example but you may not be aware that Tendulkar also cost India games playing his natural game most notably the Chennai test vs Pakistan when he was batting on 136 with 4 wickets left and 16 runs to win. He then tried to run down the wicket and wildly slog Saqlain and threw his wicket away for no reason.  India proceeded to lose the remaining wickets within 4 runs to lose the match by 12 runs. Rishabh has yet to do anything remotely like that.

Pant also has an opportunity playing with a stronger middle order and lower order than Sachin so he can get away with a bad shot.

 

Also Sachin gave you confidence that he will be solid in most conditions, with Pant every ball is an event: for a viewer it might be entertaining and also his bravado has come off in clutch situations but I sense lack of awareness from him. Luckily he plays in a super strong team. I wouldn’t back him to be the player to build a team around. If I have a solid team then he would be an xfactor to give the team an edge. That’s the difference. That’s my assessment on his career so far. Things can change.

[lemsip]

26 minutes ago, maniac said:

Also Sachin gave you confidence that he will be solid in most conditions, with Pant every ball is an event: for a viewer it might be entertaining and also his bravado has come off in clutch situations but I sense lack of awareness from him. Luckily he plays in a super strong team. I wouldn’t back him to be the player to build a team around. If I have a solid team then he would be an xfactor to give the team an edge. That’s the difference. That’s my assessment on his career so far. Things can change.

Pant is a wicketkeeper who bats in the lower middle order and your are comparing him  with top order legend whose main job was to be the linchpin of the Indian batting. Pant has overachieved as a batsman but he is not in the team to be the main batsman in the team. He is doing the Gilchrist role where the heavy load was carried by Hayden, Langer, Waugh, ponting etc and then Gilchrist would come and launch into the opposition. I would say Pant has been a statistically more consistent than the likes of Kohli, Rohit over the last 5 years etc for a reason. There is a method behind his freewheeling style and it is a method that has worked in all conditions.

[Bigg Brother]

3 hours ago, maniac said:

Lyon is also a competitor. I liked the way he took on the challenge to dismiss Pant too.

 

Pant can’t have this excuse of “he only plays that way” anymore as soon he will be one of the seniors in the side.

He is already senior batter. 6 yrs and 40 tests is good enough. And the approach has won us more matches than any other wk batter India has ever produced. Agree about tempering his approach a bit but I doubt that it is possible now. With that We will have another Dhongi in batting line up playing on the name of responsibility and scoring soft runs. Pant scores impactful runs. 

Edited November 25 by Bigg Brother

[Ultimate_Game]

48 minutes ago, maniac said:

not criticizing Pant for this knock here but clearly you saw in Lyon’s eyes that he was going to get him and he got him and Pant did look foolish there. Sometimes need to swallow pride and ego for greater good.

 

I think Pant's thought process was to put the dagger in Australia's heart. India were effectively 370/3 when he came in to bat. The match was already done and he wanted to take a shot at Australian bowling. His dismissal was on the cards but at that moment it was well worth taking the risk. Best case scenario you totally demoralize Aussies (which Nitish and Kohli did in the end), and worst case scenario is he gets out early and then others take it easy to play out time the way Sundar did.

[Lord]

1 hour ago, maniac said:

Tendulkar played an entire great knock without scoring on offside.

 

even Sehwag has played normal sedate knocks early on.

 

There is a huge gap between Afridi approach and say a Gayle or Sehwag approach even though attacking style might show similarities.

 

Pant has Afridi approach now? c;mon

[Lord]

42 minutes ago, Ultimate_Game said:

 

I think Pant's thought process was to put the dagger in Australia's heart. India were effectively 370/3 when he came in to bat. The match was already done and he wanted to take a shot at Australian bowling. His dismissal was on the cards but at that moment it was well worth taking the risk. Best case scenario you totally demoralize Aussies (which Nitish and Kohli did in the end), and worst case scenario is he gets out early and then others take it easy to play out time the way Sundar did.

 

Exactly. Not a big deal as its made to be. He did not play while were trying to save the game

[Lord]

1 hour ago, lemsip said:

Good example but you may not be aware that Tendulkar also cost India games playing his natural game most notably the Chennai test vs Pakistan when he was batting on 136 with 4 wickets left and 16 runs to win. He then tried to run down the wicket and wildly slog Saqlain and threw his wicket away for no reason.  India proceeded to lose the remaining wickets within 4 runs to lose the match by 12 runs. Rishabh has yet to do anything remotely like that.

 

that is much tighter situation than 370/4