Gollum Posted February 3 Author Share Posted February 3 (edited) Prefer rapid TBs first and then blitz. Rapid is still cool(25+5 is closest to classical whilst also being manageable with time constraints), blitz can be more random. SB is the best alternative but again luck dependent as other results will decide your position, sometimes those other games continue well past the games of title contenders, and can't rule out foul play (with Russians earlier, it was a problem). I remember once in an Olympiad, two teams finished joint first in points (also equal in first 3 TB criteria) and had to wait for results of lower ranked teams who they faced in previous rounds, to see who had the better SB. It was a farce. Edited February 3 by Gollum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gollum Posted February 3 Author Share Posted February 3 Praggnanandhaa R is your 2025 Tata Steel Chess Masters Champion! Repost: @tatasteelchess pic.twitter.com/6cocFfTDzd — International Chess Federation (@FIDE_chess) February 3, 2025 Adani is sponsoring him Congratulations Pragg for becoming Tata Steel Masters Champion. The last few seconds were too heartbreaking to watch for Gukesh. Chess is Brutal pic.twitter.com/HnqelEtUPP — Johns (@JohnyBravo183) February 2, 2025 Gukesh could have taken the repetition in the decider. No need to push there with that kind of time pressure situation. Vickydev 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gollum Posted February 3 Author Share Posted February 3 Arjun is an enigma. Was losing, losing and losing whole tournament and then out of nowhere crushed leaders Nodirbek and Gukesh in final two rounds. Ivanchuk like as rangeela bhai said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gollum Posted February 3 Author Share Posted February 3 Everyone is roasting Carlsen these days It's late in Chennai.. co-champions maybe? — Anish Giri (@anishgiri) February 2, 2025 Mariyam 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vickydev Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 Gukesh seemed fatigued all tournament IMO, especially the last couple of rounds. He had a few lucky breaks too earlier against Nodirbek and Giri iirc Pragg was definitely the superior player in Wijk aan Zee. About Arjun there were rumours he had the caught the flu that some of the contestants had. Good to see his recovery both on and off the board Mariyam and Gollum 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muloghonto Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 5 hours ago, Gollum said: How else do you break a deadlock? In football, hockey we have shootouts. You can have wins with black, more wins (Candidates 2013) etc. as TBs, but again people can make similar arguments. Personally prefer the SB system. Continous tie breaker with classical itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gollum Posted February 3 Author Share Posted February 3 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Muloghonto said: Continous tie breaker with classical itself. Who has the time for that? Need to be practical as well. Edited February 3 by Gollum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gollum Posted February 3 Author Share Posted February 3 (edited) 4 hours ago, Vickydev said: About Arjun there were rumours he had the caught the flu that some of the contestants had. Very common in this tournament. Beach town in January, rains, cold plus damp. Edited February 3 by Gollum Vickydev 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muloghonto Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 32 minutes ago, Gollum said: Who has the time for that? Need to be practical as well. Would take 1 extra day... . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rangeelaraja Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 On 2/1/2025 at 12:58 PM, Muloghonto said: Everyone with a brain knows this, this is also why Vishy is playing it cool, because he knows that magnus has to be placated for ~ 3-4 years max and let this coiterie of Indian teenage stars age a bit and get more accustomed to the grind. Then Chess can unceremoniously give him the dump and forget him like it forgot Fischer. That is why i think FIDE is playing a love-hate game with Magnus but the hammer will drop on him soon. More than a anytime particular timeframe 3-4 years....it will come down to his # 1 ranking. For 15+ years uninterrupted MC has been an 2800+ player in classical chess. For almost 13 years uninterrupted he has been the No.1 ranked player in the world in classical chess. These are phenomenal numbers ( there has been ratings inflation and deflation over the last 15 years ) ...but it impacts all players. FIDE No.1 ranked player in classical chess has an aura on its own..always has had...World Champion or not. And unless he is dislodged from the No.1 spot in FIDE rankings for classical , he will continue to act like an entitled ass. For that to happen, one of the young guns needs to have a consistent run of dominant perfomances. Mariyam 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rangeelaraja Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 21 hours ago, Muloghonto said: I will say this again: classical chess cannot have non classical tiebreaker. That ruins the achievement. I dunno what it should be, but classical with speed tiebreaker is like breaking a test draw with T20 and calling the best T20 batter in your test team as the best test batter coz he wins all the T20 tiebreaker. Like a real world example would be imagine Yuvraj Singh being the best test batter in Indian team coz he is good enough to get into Indian test team but is the babbar sher of T20 for India back then and every single draw test becomes wins coz yuvy bats like crazy in the T20 tiebreaker. Therefore he is highest Indian rated test batter. That's the bullshit we are dealing with here. If you want to bring in cricket...the correct analogy would be the super over for "tiebreaks" in knockouts. Super over is the bigger farce. Look how the result of the 2019 CWC Final between NZ and Eng was decided ( England won by superior boundary count ) Even soccer and field hockey games are decided by penalty strokes after sometime. In this case the tiebreaks should have been in rapid first instead of blitz. Nobody is going to play a routine game for to decide a "tiebreak" , dont know any major sport that does it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rangeelaraja Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 17 hours ago, Gollum said: Everyone is roasting Carlsen these days Hans Niemann is taking Magnooos to the cleaners directly on X. randomGuy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kepler37b Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 Congrats to Pragg. The bigger congrats to Sambar boy's for creation of great chess eco system. Was a bit sad to see our local boy Arjun not making it. I hope no one used the term "Anand's children" this time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muloghonto Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 2 hours ago, rangeelaraja said: If you want to bring in cricket...the correct analogy would be the super over for "tiebreaks" in knockouts. Super over is the bigger farce. Look how the result of the 2019 CWC Final between NZ and Eng was decided ( England won by superior boundary count ) Even soccer and field hockey games are decided by penalty strokes after sometime. In this case the tiebreaks should have been in rapid first instead of blitz. Nobody is going to play a routine game for to decide a "tiebreak" , dont know any major sport that does it. Well it doesn't have to be the way of other sports. For eg in cricket and football, tie break being in very short time to give release to the final result of hours long contest is the main driving element. Chess on the other hand is already a multi day round Robin event. Like, why can't the two tied players play repeated sets of classical ( one set being each of us taking turns as white) and the moment u have 1-0 or 1-0.5, we have a winner. It should just take an extra day- the classical games run max 2 hrs usually. So that's 3 sets possible in a day and most likely players will tire to yeild result. I don't see why that's a huge no no Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gollum Posted February 4 Author Share Posted February 4 30 minutes ago, Muloghonto said: Well it doesn't have to be the way of other sports. For eg in cricket and football, tie break being in very short time to give release to the final result of hours long contest is the main driving element. Chess on the other hand is already a multi day round Robin event. Like, why can't the two tied players play repeated sets of classical ( one set being each of us taking turns as white) and the moment u have 1-0 or 1-0.5, we have a winner. It should just take an extra day- the classical games run max 2 hrs usually. So that's 3 sets possible in a day and most likely players will tire to yeild result. I don't see why that's a huge no no Classical almost never gets over in 2 hours. Ranges between 4 to 7 hours in 90% cases. And pretty tiring, even 2 classical games per day is pushing the limits of what a human can do. Draws very common in classical, especially when two top, in form guys play. The tie breaker can easily extend the length of a tournament if played in sets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muloghonto Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 (edited) 1 hour ago, Gollum said: Classical almost never gets over in 2 hours. Ranges between 4 to 7 hours in 90% cases. And pretty tiring, even 2 classical games per day is pushing the limits of what a human can do. Draws very common in classical, especially when two top, in form guys play. The tie breaker can easily extend the length of a tournament if played in sets. Well what was the deal before this tie-breker format bullshit came in ? i mean i know classicals can go for that long, but 4-7 hrs for 90% cases ? really its that high ?? Strange as it seems that move 40 seems to be the average for classical chess duration for pros and thats what u need to make to time control, so the average classical should be 3 hrs long, given that its 1.5 hrs at start for each, no ? How did world champions become world champions before this tie-break ? or tourney winners ? I took a shot but i did say i dunno the solution, all i know i that THIS is not the solution - i dont like the penalties/super over shootout format and in fact i WOULD prefer one of those type of bullshit - like make chess puzzle on the fly and present to both players and he who solves chess puzzle first wins tourney.Or some other bullshit. But playing rapids to win classical to me is quite literally playing a T20 game to decide drawn test in an extra night session on the 5th day and then best test batter being the T20 dude who is T20 tiebreak god but also good enough to be barely just in test team like a Yuvraj Singh- wot de foc. i hateeeeeeeeeeeeeez this. Fine, add 2 more days. Whats 2 more days to a 14 day event anyways ? play 2 sets in 2 days,ie, 2 games per day for 2 more days . thats in your numbers, 16-28 hrs of chess in a 48 hr period. Someone will crack in 99% case. We have classical winaar in classical deathmatch. I prefer that. If thats too brutal on players, fine, i prefer my 'make weird chess puzzle, gib chess puzzle, he who solves chess puzzle first wins, thats our super over bullshit'. I prefer that even more than this bullshit. Edited February 4 by Muloghonto Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gollum Posted February 4 Author Share Posted February 4 (edited) 23 minutes ago, Muloghonto said: Well what was the deal before this tie-breker format bullshit came in ? i mean i know classicals can go for that long, but 4-7 hrs for 90% cases ? really its that high ?? Strange as it seems that move 40 seems to be the average for classical chess duration for pros and thats what u need to make to time control, so the average classical should be 3 hrs long, given that its 1.5 hrs at start for each, no ? How did world champions become world champions before this tie-break ? or tourney winners ? Earlier also there would be some way to break ties in tourneys, like number of total wins (eg. 5 wins, 1 loss gets an edge over 4 wins, no loss...that's how Carlsen edged past Kramnik in 2013 London Candidates), or number of wins with black, or Sonneborn Berger (SB) score. In tourneys (like this one) where players played odd number of games, they would decide based on whether a player had extra black in his games (eg. 13 rounds, 6 white, 7 black vs 7 white, 6 black...former wins on TB). For classical world championship matches, world champion had draw odds. That is, if the match ended in tie, world champion would retain the crown. 1987 Kasparov-Karpov match (Seville) ended 12-12, Kaspy retained the crown. Similarly Kramnik retained the crown against Leko in 2004 despite match ending 7-7. More such examples, these two just off the top of my head. Then public outcry was that champion had too many privileges and rapid playoffs started from 2006 Elista. Edited February 4 by Gollum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gollum Posted February 4 Author Share Posted February 4 (edited) Blitz playoffs more of a recent thing, because of Carlsen's pressure. I remember he had a long drought in Norway chess classic, so to help him out the organizers (also his business partners) introduced armageddon (in case classical was draw) and he won many of those tournaments just by winning all the armageddons. Purely on the basis of classical scores he wouldn't have won most of those trophies (remember Anand, Ding, Aronian, Naka all hard done by). Fischer and Carlsen have been the most pampered chess players in history, everyone else had to adjust to accommodate their fits. Glad FIDE is taking a stance now. Edited February 4 by Gollum Muloghonto 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gollum Posted February 4 Author Share Posted February 4 Viswanathan Anand's sudden wildcard U-turn dubbed 'not wise' by Freestyle Chess owner Look at the nerve of this guy. As if he did a favor to Anand and now won't invite him again. Also seems to have a problem with India because no investor from here is stepping up to host the Delhi leg of this stupid tour. Threatens that it will be awarded to some other country. Chal nikal bhsdke, nahi chahiye tera circus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gollum Posted February 4 Author Share Posted February 4 I know Gukesh wants to challenge Magnus on his turf but wiser if he breaks away from this tour after the first event. Stick with FIDE and not these snake oil merchants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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