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Gollum Grand Master

Gollum

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, Lord said:

Noob question : Why do they have seperate categories for men/women in chess.  There are no different physical requirements :dontknow:

Generally at the top level, men are much better. Ju Wenjun from China is the current women's world champion (5 time champ that too, so kind of a big deal) but she is not in the top 200 

 

https://ratings.fide.com/profile/8603006

 

In fact among active players, Ju's current ranking is 250. Judit Polgar is retired, Hou Yifan isn't active these days in classical, both breached top 100, in fact Judit was once world number 8 overall and consistently top 20-30 for over a decade, she has scalps of Kasparov, Karpov, Anand, Kramnik, Ivanchuk, Topalov etc. in classical, even beat Carlsen in blitz few years back when he was world champion, mind you she is 15 years elder to him and was retired at that time!!!! She is an exception, no other woman in history has come close to her feats/strength.

 

Separate categories for men/women precisely because of that. If women improve in coming years, we can do away with this separation, but long way to go IMO. At junior levels gap in strength between boy and girl prodigies isn't that huge but gap widens a lot once they become adults. I don't know why, maybe a neuroscientist or @Mariyam can give better insights. 

 

Women are still allowed to play in open (there is nothing like men's category, it is open for all) with men, but converse not allowed. You may see 1-2 women (out of 200+ total players) in the upcoming FIDE WC in Goa. Why women don't participate in open/men's events is prize money.....they are similarly ranked to men players ranked 200 onwards and 200th ranked men's player doesn't earn enough to have chess as his sole career, in fact outside top 50 it is common for players to have some side job. But women players if they win world championship can pocket half a million USD, Divya won 50k USD yesterday and more prizes (cash awards by govts), sponsorships will be announced in coming days I am sure. This kind of money can never be made by them if they compete in open category.....Divya's overall ranking in the world is 908, nobody can possibly even name the 900th ranked male player.  

Edited by Gollum
Gollum Grand Master

Gollum

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Judit competed only in open category, with men. Even led Hungary in Olympiad in top board (open category) for few editions, before Peter Leko broke through and became undisputed Hungarian #1.....mind you, Hungary is a very accomplished chess nation, so board 1 there is a big thing. Switzerland also had Alexandra Kosteniuk (ex-world champ from Russia) as board 1 in a recent edition but they are a minnow chess nation. Common to see women playing with men in Olympiad open category, especially from weaker nations. 

 

Anyway Judit was never women's world champion because she never tried, her big sister Susan OTOH did win that title.....there are 3 Polgar sisters and all very accomplished players, of course Judit is on a different level. Their father, Lazlo Polgar was a psychologist who wanted to prove that geniuses are made, not born.....used his daughters as his experimental specimens. 

Gollum Grand Master

Gollum

Posted
  • Author
Posted (edited)

In golf, Annika Sorenstam (GOAT among women) decided to take the plunge in PGA tour (20 odd years back) but went back to LPGA within few months. Financially it wasn't worth it, she would finish near the bottom everytime and not much $$$$......in LPGA she was the biggest earner, money that could never have been made otherwise. 

 

Similar story in snooker/pool/billiards.....Reanna Evans is a legend and has competed even in men's world championships (went to 2nd round once beating a man, got lots of media coverage for that), but she herself says she prefers playing men in exhibitions, trick shot events etc., and not in real competition. 

 

Golf still has a power component, especially the tee shot. But snooker/pool is closer to chess in terms of athletic requirements. 

Edited by Gollum
Lord Grand Master

Lord

Posted
Posted
3 hours ago, Gollum said:

Generally at the top level, men are much better. Ju Wenjun from China is the current women's world champion (5 time champ that too, so kind of a big deal) but she is not in the top 200 

 

https://ratings.fide.com/profile/8603006

 

In fact among active players, Ju's current ranking is 250. Judit Polgar is retired, Hou Yifan isn't active these days in classical, both breached top 100, in fact Judit was once world number 8 overall and consistently top 20-30 for over a decade, she has scalps of Kasparov, Karpov, Anand, Kramnik, Ivanchuk, Topalov etc. in classical, even beat Carlsen in blitz few years back when he was world champion, mind you she is 15 years elder to him and was retired at that time!!!! She is an exception, no other woman in history has come close to her feats/strength.

 

Separate categories for men/women precisely because of that. If women improve in coming years, we can do away with this separation, but long way to go IMO. At junior levels gap in strength between boy and girl prodigies isn't that huge but gap widens a lot once they become adults. I don't know why, maybe a neuroscientist or @Mariyam can give better insights. 

 

Women are still allowed to play in open (there is nothing like men's category, it is open for all) with men, but converse not allowed. You may see 1-2 women (out of 200+ total players) in the upcoming FIDE WC in Goa. Why women don't participate in open/men's events is prize money.....they are similarly ranked to men players ranked 200 onwards and 200th ranked men's player doesn't earn enough to have chess as his sole career, in fact outside top 50 it is common for players to have some side job. But women players if they win world championship can pocket half a million USD, Divya won 50k USD yesterday and more prizes (cash awards by govts), sponsorships will be announced in coming days I am sure. This kind of money can never be made by them if they compete in open category.....Divya's overall ranking in the world is 908, nobody can possibly even name the 900th ranked male player.  

So men are just smarter? @Mariyam :vroam:

Gollum Grand Master

Gollum

Posted
  • Author
Posted (edited)
10 minutes ago, Lord said:

So men are just smarter? @Mariyam :vroam:

I know you are kidding. But honestly, women have closed the gap in academics especially STEM which was totally male dominated 50 years back. Now look at the graduate student applications in top departments, you see almost equal number of women. They can do the same in chess, but should be willing to compete with men more often, like Judit. Only if you compete with those stronger than you, there will be improvement. 

 

@Mariyam anyway is the smartest and wittiest ICFer. 

Edited by Gollum
Gollum Grand Master

Gollum

Posted
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Posted

Btw there were a couple of women who became GMs (not WGMs, that is different) before Anand (he was India's first in 1987).

 

Nona Gaprindashvilli, Maia Chiburdanidze, then Soviets, later Georgians. Georgia is P4P the greatest nation when it comes to women's chess.

 

Nona was the first, and Queen's Gambit got it wrong, got sued as well because Nona played the men even in 70s, that show got many facts wrong. 

 

Btw winner of Olympiad (men+women) is given the Nona Gaprindashvilli trophy, we won it in 2022 and '24. Been there since 1997, apart from us, only Russia, Ukraine, China have ever won it.

rangeelaraja Grand Master

rangeelaraja

Posted
Posted (edited)

@Gollum @Mariyam

 

What is with these kids talking with a fake unnatural accent ? I’ve seen Divya speak with vastly different accents depending on whether she is interviewing with an Indian channel or Western / Foreign channel. 
 

The last time I heard someone in the Indian chess scene  ( before Divya ) speak with a fake accent was listening to Parimarjan Negi, who was once considered the next big thing but was unable to reach the super GM league. 
 

 

Below is a sample. Have also seen this guy trying to speak with a thick Russian / Slavic accent in some other conversations “. 

 

 

 


 

Here he tries to speak like Ivanchuk, beginning his statements with “ Ok “ …

 

lol.

 

Makes me appreciate the likes of Gukesh and Pragg more. Stay desi. Stay Original. 

Edited by rangeelaraja
kepler37b Grand Master

kepler37b

Posted
Posted
10 hours ago, Lord said:

So men are just smarter? @Mariyam :vroam:

The answer to this question often loaded with ideology. 

 

Ideology aside. There is not much difference in mean IQ.

 

Men dominate women in high and low IQ.  You find more dumb fools and unequalled geniuses among men.  Go to any autism clinic, you find 5x more boys than girls. 

 

rish Veteran

rish

Posted
Posted

Its more because there are more men in chess than women and they start earlier.Been following Divya for a while and knew she had it in her.

 

She is very calm under pressure, aggressive as a player and fearless.

 

I detected some arrogance from Humpy after the first match where she mentioned Divya probably was seeing her openings and in the last match she probably felt that as she had a better rating and white pieces , she should push for the win. that rook to e5 ( I think?) Was a blunder.

Mariyam Grand Master

Mariyam

Posted
Posted
28 minutes ago, rish said:

Its more because there are more men in chess than women and they start earlier.Been following Divya for a while and knew she had it in her.

 

She is very calm under pressure, aggressive as a player and fearless.

 

I detected some arrogance from Humpy after the first match where she mentioned Divya probably was seeing her openings and in the last match she probably felt that as she had a better rating and white pieces , she should push for the win. that rook to e5 ( I think?) Was a blunder.

Which game are you referring to?

 

Game 2 classical? Or the tie breaks?

rish Veteran

rish

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, Mariyam said:

Which game are you referring to?

 

Game 2 classical? Or the tie breaks?

The game that Humpy lost. i think her rook moved from a4 to e4

velu Grand Master

velu

Posted
Posted
On 7/29/2025 at 2:25 AM, Lord said:

Noob question : Why do they have seperate categories for men/women in chess.  There are no different physical requirements :dontknow:


women think , reason differently :p: 

If my wifey is playing chess , she will most probably argue that if bishop  can move diagonally , it can move vertically as well :p: 

 

Gollum Grand Master

Gollum

Posted
  • Author
Posted
On 7/29/2025 at 2:25 AM, Lord said:

Noob question : Why do they have seperate categories for men/women in chess.  There are no different physical requirements :dontknow:

See, this is why. 900th ranked man won't get such rewards right? If Divya becomes world champion one day (high probability), imagine the perks and awards. 

 

There is no incentive for women to compete in open categories. Maybe in the future someone as ambitious as Judit Polgar will emerge. 

 

 

 

 

 

Lord Grand Master

Lord

Posted
Posted
8 hours ago, Gollum said:

See, this is why. 900th ranked man won't get such rewards right? If Divya becomes world champion one day (high probability), imagine the perks and awards. 

 

There is no incentive for women to compete in open categories. Maybe in the future someone as ambitious as Judit Polgar will emerge. 

 

 

 

 

 

You are looking at it from women's pov. Obviously more people will get rewarded with more categories. You can further divide it by age, religion etc.. 

 

However categories are normally marked to represent different requirements of abilities of that category mostly physically. No such distinction is there in chess 

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