Batting depth was differentiating factor

[deepdynamo]

2027 World Cup SA - four spinners won't work there. So need to invest in fast bowling allrounders.

 

Considering Rohit won't be there ( too old), I can see this team shaping up (aligning with GG vision of 6 bowlers and batting till 8 template)

Gill
Jaiswal
Kohli
Iyer
Axar  -- bowling option
Rahul
Reddy-- bowling option
Pandya -- bowling option
Kuldeep
Bumrah
Rana

 

Backups
Tilak
Pant or Samson
Parag
Mayank or Arshdeep
 

[Nikhil_cric]

Been screaming about this since 2023.

 

It's always been batting depth that has been a differentiating factor in white ball cricket. Just allows you to go that bit harder and not looking to preserve wickets all the time. 

 

 

There was a time when we were a very Top heavy side and relied on one of the Top 3 scoring or we were toast .

 

Even in bilaterals they were so slow between 2014-2021 that the #4 and #5 didn't get to bat enough .

 

In crunch games, that middle order's lack of game time meant we could never recover. 

 

Rohit's aggression 2022 onwards meant that Iyer, KL and Pandya had time in the middle and we became a Top 5/6 side rather than a Top 3 side 

 

Group stage match against NZ was a good example of recovery from 37/3.

 

You need at least one opener to be outlandishly aggressive and keep at it.

 

The great Aussie sides had Gilchrist, Warner and Travis Head .

 

Even we underestimate the impact of peak Sehwag (average 50, strike rate 125) 

https://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/player/35263.html?class=2;spanmax1=08+Dec+2011;spanmin1=10+Jun+2008;spanval1=span;template=results;type=batting

 

which was crucial to our 2011 World Cup fortunes. 

 

Once Rohit goes, Abhishek should probably take that role. 

Edited March 10 by Nikhil_cric

[deathmonger]

15 minutes ago, Nikhil_cric said:

Been screaming about this since 2023.

 

It's always been batting depth that has been a differentiating factor in white ball cricket. Just allows you to go that bit harder and not looking to preserve wickets all the time. 

 

 

There was a time when we were a very Top heavy side and relied on one of the Top 3 scoring or we were toast .

 

Even in bilaterals they were so slow between 2014-2021 that the #4 and #5 didn't get to bat enough .

 

In crunch games, that middle order's lack of game time meant we could never recover. 

 

Rohit's aggression 2022 onwards meant that Iyer, KL and Pandya had time in the middle and we became a Top 5/6 side rather than a Top 3 side 

 

Group stage match against NZ was a good example of recovery from 37/3.

 

You need at least one opener to be outlandishly aggressive and keep at it.

 

The great Aussie sides had Gilchrist, Warner and Travis Head .

 

Even we underestimate the impact of peak Sehwag (average 50, strike rate 125) 

https://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/player/35263.html?class=2;spanmax1=08+Dec+2011;spanmin1=10+Jun+2008;spanval1=span;template=results;type=batting

 

which was crucial to our 2011 World Cup fortunes. 

 

Once Rohit goes, Abhishek should probably take that role. 

yup.

 

when i was a kid, i hated sehwag being so reckless but in hindsight it was a good thing.

 

scored runs quickly (eg saved us in mohali cause scoring became tough later on)

 

helped lower middle order of dhoni/yuvi to evolve who were pivotal in 07/11

 

dhawan/rohit/kohli in their peak scored so many runs the middle order never evolved

[Nikhil_cric]

6 minutes ago, deathmonger said:

yup.

 

when i was a kid, i hated sehwag being so reckless but in hindsight it was a good thing.

 

scored runs quickly (eg saved us in mohali cause scoring became tough later on)

 

helped lower middle order of dhoni/yuvi to evolve who were pivotal in 07/11

 

dhawan/rohit/kohli in their peak scored so many runs the middle order never evolved

Yep. That Mohali 38 is the greatest 38 in the history of ODI cricket . 

 

Post Sehwag , the ODI team stagnated with Dhawan and Rohit to play for 40-0 even on the flattest of pitches. 

[prudent_kreeda]

5 hours ago, Lord said:

Even in WC 2019, Jadeja batted at 8 and it almost worked for us despite being 92/6

 

The main reason for imbalance is non bowling of superstar bats. We fixed it a bit now with playing Axar and giving gloves to KL

 

But its not a long term solution. Axar is not a no. 5. We need someone like Parag/Reddy there

Agree re: Axar's position.

We will not get WI /Dubai kind of slow pitches in SA . Hence Axar may not be permanent member in playing eleven in SA .A possible combo to replace Axar can be Tilak & Riyan in playing eleven.  

For SA patta pitches, hope Riyan improves his bowling  so that he can be a replacement of Axar (Not very sure how effective Axar on SA pitches for full 10 overs on those pattas ?). Riyan is a better bat and good fit at 5/6 position.

 

[prudent_kreeda]

4 hours ago, cowboysfan said:

playing 4 spinners for me,i dont think any team has tried that in a major competition and it worked.

It has more to do with pitch at Dubai. Will it work in SA pitches - is the question.

[Sooda]

Rohit made it clear it was why he could go hard at the top, that makes so much difference 

 

The issues that have plagued India historically have been eliminated over the last 2 or 3 years thanks to the form/ emergence of Iyer, Axar, and a fit Hardik and KL keeping wickets - no 4 batsman, 6 bowling options and batting depth 

[Sooda]

52 minutes ago, Nikhil_cric said:

. 

 

Rohit's aggression 2022 onwards meant that Iyer, KL and Pandya had time in the middle and we became a Top 5/6 side rather than a Top 3 side 

 

 

Agree, but it is a bit chicken and egg

 

Iyer KL and Pandya and of course the two SLA ARs means Rohit knows he can go hard at the top with that batting depth to come 

[Nikhil_cric]

Just now, Sooda said:

 

Agree, but it is a bit chicken and egg

 

Iyer KL and Pandya and of course the two SLA ARs means Rohit knows he can go hard at the top with that batting depth to come 

Agreed. 

[goose]

axar in the middle is a masterstroke. successful indian teams have always needed a method to conquer their fears around batting depth. axar breaks the order up and basically a bonus when he comes off.

[Trichromatic]

1 hour ago, goose said:

axar in the middle is a masterstroke. successful indian teams have always needed a method to conquer their fears around batting depth. axar breaks the order up and basically a bonus when he comes off.

 

Axar as a batsman just passes middle 15 overs of game.

 

No one expected it and whoever bet on him was bold to make that move.

[putrevus]

10 hours ago, Trichromatic said:

Both in WT20 and CT

Injuries played a role for lack of batting depth in other tournaments.Pandya's injury proved fatal in 23, Dhawan's injury in 2019.

 

Axar is the unsung hero in both wins. While Rahul admitted he was Shitting himself which everyone knew he would, Axar made sure he rebuilt the partnership with Iyer.

 

Without Axar India was not winning either cup.You need gritty players like him in every team.

Edited March 10 by putrevus

[BacktoCricaddict]

6 hours ago, cowboysfan said:

playing 4 spinners for me,i dont think any team has tried that in a major competition and it worked.

May not have worked in any other venue, even in India itself. Dubai was perfect.

[BacktoCricaddict]

Axar Patel is an unsung hero. He and Pandya add balance and clutch-value that we never had.

 

Oops, didn't see @putrevus post above. Great minds ... :-))!!

Edited March 10 by BacktoCricaddict

[BacktoCricaddict]

Remember the #4 nightmares from a few years ago? 2019 WC I think. 

 

DK? Rayudu? Who else was in contention for that spot?

[diga]

5 minutes ago, BacktoCricaddict said:

Remember the #4 nightmares from a few years ago? 2019 WC I think. 

 

DK? Rayudu? Who else was in contention for that spot?

3D player 

[Lord]

1 hour ago, BacktoCricaddict said:

Remember the #4 nightmares from a few years ago? 2019 WC I think. 

 

DK? Rayudu? Who else was in contention for that spot?

 

Vijay Shankar lol

[BacktoCricaddict]

17 minutes ago, Lord said:

 

Vijay Shankar lol

OMG! Was he the 3D player that @diga was referring to? It had come to a point when I was posting here that our batting line up should just be 1,2,3,5,6 .... 11. To hell with #4

Edited March 10 by BacktoCricaddict

[vvvslaxman]

Today Sundar in place of Kully kinda won the match for us. Is it a fair assessment?  Batting depth more often than not helps than bowling depth.

[Ultimate_Game]

54 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

Today Sundar in place of Kully kinda won the match for us. Is it a fair assessment?  Batting depth more often than not helps than bowling depth.

 

Batting depth wins you tournies. You should be able to bat till 8 or 9 else one batting collapse and you're done.